I feel like where missing some of the other really nice things about a AA
class i love specials, Hail of arrows is wonderful as well as phase arrow
so if your doing a guide take more this in to thought like what you have so far but you need to say oh and as a AA you can also do (xxxx) so everyone can get something out of it.
I think it would be a decent idea to do some caster ratings, go through and rate every Sorcerer bloodline, Wizard Specialist, and do archetypes as well with the standard 4 color rating system. (Although adding stars for the colorblind is nice too). Also, checking out the various types of casting styles, like blaster vs controller spells would also be useful.
Also, you might want to look through all of the feats, combat and casting feats and rate them as well, or give a list of suggested feats, ignoring all of the lowest rated ones. The spell focus feats for instance: are they cool, or do you want to stay away from spells with saving throws?
A more comprehensive spell list would be cool. It would be better to have more than 10 spells that are considered awesome. Do all that and you should have something that people will really enjoy.
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WOOO! Oterisk is here, now we can get to chugging along
Really I see the AA as generally falling into one of three camps: THe Rocket, THe Railgun, and the Aussult Rifle.
THe Rocket is a powerful explosive ordinance with a long range i.e. A caster who takes the class to increase range and blast radius. The Rocket is least likely to multiclass into a melee class and least likely to follow the AA past 2nd level.
THe Railgun augments a standerd projectile beyond normal capabilities i.e. Is someone who takes the class for its boons to Ranged attacks in general. THese tend to be more combat oriented classes who take a minor dip into a caster and are more likely to follow the AA from start to finish in order to augment thier combat abilities to the optimum
The Assult Rifle is a versitile weapon able to switch from single to mutifire and from sniping to close quarters weapon i.e. Just about anyone else who takes the class for versitility. This may be a magus who dips for that extra magical ability at range, The inquisitor who wants to slay his foes from a distance, or any other hybrid who tries to mix it up such as a Wizard5/Fighter5 who wants to mix this up.
Perhaps this can be our template for making the guide?
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WOOO! Oterisk is here, now we can get to chugging along
Really I see the AA as generally falling into one of three camps: THe Rocket, THe Railgun, and the Aussult Rifle.
THe Rocket is a powerful explosive ordinance with a long range i.e. A caster who takes the class to increase range and blast radius. The Rocket is least likely to multiclass into a melee class and least likely to follow the AA past 2nd level.
THe Railgun augments a standerd projectile beyond normal capabilities i.e. Is someone who takes the class for its boons to Ranged attacks in general. THese tend to be more combat oriented classes who take a minor dip into a caster and are more likely to follow the AA from start to finish in order to augment thier combat abilities to the optimum
The Assult Rifle is a versitile weapon able to switch from single to mutifire and from sniping to close quarters weapon i.e. Just about anyone else who takes the class for versitility. This may be a magus who dips for that extra magical ability at range, The inquisitor who wants to slay his foes from a distance, or any other hybrid who tries to mix it up such as a Wizard5/Fighter5 who wants to mix this up.
Perhaps this can be our template for making the guide?
I like those descriptions. Those give good frameworks as to what the AA class can be. Maybe expand this into an overall AA guide by pointing out other builds (even though it's not the greatest prestige class)
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HEre is the alphabetical list of classess and thier uses (if any) for the class and what Gun-type they would follow
Alchemist: Assault Rifle, but usually only as a dip. Can be ok dip for mutagen and ability to mix poisons. Usually 2/5 stars.
Archetype Spotlight:
Grenadier: makes for a rather decent Railgun character as thier abilities are already useful for buffing ammunition and actually gives incentive for the Infuse Projectile discovery and directed blast combined with it is rather useful. 3/5
Vivisectionist: is "Okay", but just stick with the rogue if you want Sneak Attacks in your Assault Rifle. 2/5
THe Bramble Brewer (Half-elf): this archetype is only slightly better that its vanilla friend in terms of its Mutagen. 2.5/5
More comming soon
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THeres more to playing a class than pure damage capabilities. You ask what other uses the Rocket has aside from antimagic field? For one the imbue arrow ability works on All Area spells, and that includes Cones,bursts,lines and even abilities that effect any number of creatures within a certain distance from eachother. Why is this important? because that also includes the incredibly short range/touch attack spells, thus insuring that even your low-level spells have some oomf.
Example: Say yur part has to attack the fort/citidel of a large military orginization like Talon Co from Fallout or some other PMC. You are just at the front parapet area where the baddies have built a tall wooden archery tower, or two, and are plinking away at your party. Now, you wanna save your higher spells and ammo, so you decide to instead shoot an arrow imbued with Burning grasp (which in the Desc. states it burns anything flammable) and watch as the baddies scramble trying to not be killed by the Towering Inferno their stuck in and probably end up either burning to death first, or jumping off thier tower and having the fall or your buddies kill them
THe job of the Rocket is not to be a Ranged Beatstick. It is to control the field from a distance while also being able to provide support for the party. Plus The rules just state that the spell happens where the arrow lies, meaning you dont even have to hit someone for it to take effect, meaning if your enemie's AC is ridiculous, instead shoot it at thier feet and watch as they flee from terror.
This isn't even with Offensive spells only, This also works for your Mass Cure spells as well, or say your chasing an enemy who's trying to get into a castle you just shoot and embued Wards And Guards spell or even just a Stone Wall or other misc-spell and watch as they try to claw in while your team bears down on him.
Now onto your problem with the Railgun. In real life a Railgun is not uses for pure damage either, rather its meant to be precice and surgical, much like a scalpel. You are thier to simply plink your enemy to death, you are there to peal your enemie's defences away like an Onion! THis works well thanks to Seeker Arrow, Phase Arrow, and to top it off you can even smack everyone in the room with Hail of Arrows. Plus your enhancement bonus is Free, works allday-everyday, the abilities applied from it all stack together And,better yet, Affect you Arrows and not your bow, meaning you can still enhance your bow for more pain and never have to spend coin on magic arrows (automatic Distance is pretty seet you have to admit).
While it may not have the same raw power as such many levels in a particular class it all stacks decently together and gives you more use/per day from it. Plus say you chose that beautiful Palidan's mount instead of the weapon bond, now your an official Magical Abhrams Tank with a Mounted Railgun.
Assualt Rifle is everything else as well as using the class as a little bit of both. the Magus is pretty much High Lord Assault Rifle since his Arcana effects all weapons and takeing AA is finally giving you the Ranged Equivilent to Spellstrike that The Myrmidarch class Failed Miserably to give you...plus it works beautifully well with Hexcrafter or SpellDancer.
While I admit its not the most imple or optimal PrC in existance I feel that people give it far too much hate than it deserves and that the Arcane Archer can earn its place in any group if given the chance and allowed to be played smartly.
Afterall, a true warior can achieve victory through even the most bizarre ways and with the most unconventional methods.
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I'm hoping that the fireburst and greater fireburst spells make a comeback - those were fantastic when I played the "rocket" build in LG. They were 2nd and 4th level, respectively, and had D8's and D10's. Since their main drawback was they were an area burst centered on you, they were perfect.
I vaguely remember doing 200+ points of damage with a greater fireburst imbued arrow, and that was with not even rolling very high.
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Soupturtle you are misinterpretting my statements.
As I said a Rocket's job isn't Damage, its manipulating and controlling the field to your liking by using previously suckish Self-centered area attacks in order to not only send them at long distance, but also changing the direction of both Cone and Line attacks in order to keep reaching around the field AS WELL AS Sending mass buffs or heals (in case of Witch) to far away allies. Plus ild like to mention that metamagics still work on said spells. Also it allows you to use your cheeper spell slots first before being forced to spend your big ones. Also I said that with the rocket you don't need more than 2 Levels in AA, so you can continue with your Caster class
Also I said that Plinking is what you wanna avoid as a Railgun (Why You No Listen!!). You job as the railgun is to bust through enemies with heavy defences/concelement as well as using it to increase your range and stacking your enchanted arrows on top of whatever fancy bow you have. THis way you can save on gold and never need to spend on elemental, alignment, burst, or distance enchantments. Just imagine your in this dragon fight:
Dragon: "Hah, foolsh groundwalkers, your puny arrows and spell can never touch me! and even if so, they'll never pierce through my scales and wards!!
AARailgun: Fires an arrow *BOOM*
Dragon: GRAH!!! You Blew Off My Frikkin Wing You @$$-Monkey!!!!
You problam is you can your PrCs to be as rediculous as they where in 3E and 3.5 and just be "Base-Class+" deals. THat is not how Pathfinder Works. You not supposed to think like your Base Class and doing so while Prestiging will always get you killed everytime. Respect your spestige and Think like the Prestige character would. Your niether a Full-Caster nor an Archer, Your an Arcane Archer. you have to change your play style and find the happy medium of the class
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I have a level 13 AA in PFS right now, and I love it. I fly around on a broom and rain arrowy death on opponents. The Seeker/Phase Arrow is fantastic for finding running or hiding enemies. I use the Seeker Arrow with a smoke arrow to have a trail to follow. It might not be the most broken class in existence, but AA has some really great flavor and some fun abilities.
I'm not sure how I feel about a caster-focused AA, though. The abilities simply aren't built for it. I could see doing something like Wiz 4/Fighter 4, or even Wiz 6/Fighter 3, but going wizard all the way seems excessive to me. Arcane Archer is built under the assumption that you'll multiclass to get in. Trying to avoid that is just going to slow you down.
And as to Imbue Arrow, it's a great ability with some interesting uses. But there aren't that many spells that work well with it (with a few notable exceptions), and I would say that it's barely worth the dip for a full caster.
The basic problem is that casters can already do everything they need to. The purpose of an Arcane Archer is to supplement the archer's fairly narrow (if powerful) set of options. In other words, give them the ability to do more than full attack every round. On the other hand, why in the world would a caster need to be a better archer? Every round spent shooting a bow is a round spent not casting. Imbue Arrow doesn't add that many options to what you can already do. Sure, you could imbue Detonate, but why would you take that miss chance instead of just Fireballing? And Antimagic Field, when imbued, is certainly a powerful shutdown, but not much more than Silence cast on your frontline fighter.
I think it's a great idea, but it simply doesn't hold up in the face of everything else that's possible for a caster.
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I have a level 13 AA in PFS right now, and I love it. I fly around on a broom and rain arrowy death on opponents. The Seeker/Phase Arrow is fantastic for finding running or hiding enemies. I use the Seeker Arrow with a smoke arrow to have a trail to follow. It might not be the most broken class in existence, but AA has some really great flavor and some fun abilities.
I'm not sure how I feel about a caster-focused AA, though. The abilities simply aren't built for it. I could see doing something like Wiz 4/Fighter 4, or even Wiz 6/Fighter 3, but going wizard all the way seems excessive to me. Arcane Archer is built under the assumption that you'll multiclass to get in. Trying to avoid that is just going to slow you down.
And as to Imbue Arrow, it's a great ability with some interesting uses. But there aren't that many spells that work well with it (with a few notable exceptions), and I would say that it's barely worth the dip for a full caster.
The basic problem is that casters can already do everything they need to. The purpose of an Arcane Archer is to supplement the archer's fairly narrow (if powerful) set of options. In other words, give them the ability to do more than full attack every round. On the other hand, why in the world would a caster need to be a better archer? Every round spent shooting a bow is a round spent not casting. Imbue Arrow doesn't add that many options to what you can already do. Sure, you could imbue Detonate, but why would you take that miss chance instead of just Fireballing? And Antimagic Field, when imbued, is certainly a powerful shutdown, but not much more than Silence cast on your frontline fighter.
I think it's a great idea, but it simply doesn't hold up in the face of everything else that's possible for a caster.
THats the Golden part about the Rocket Build: You Dont NEED to hit your enemy at all!!!! Imbue pretty much states that wherever the arrow striekes thats where it hits meaning if your enemy has ridiculusly good AC it Allows you to circumnavigate that by hitting and adjacent square instead. Plus for the sake of Cones and Lines since the arrow is the center of the attack you can have the blast go in Any direction you want. This allows you to save on Spell Slots, Metamagic and healing stuff for allies since you can pretty much choose whether they get hit from the splash damage. Or you can, as ive said before, charge with a buff/heal spell and making it as a "Ranged Healing Shiv". Really your using your bow as a free Metamagic feat to increase distance of some spells.
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Your right, i shouldn't have said plink, that was my mistake.
Also the Dragon example wasn't about imbue at all. If you reread the AA rules you'll see that as you level up in it Every Arrow you nock gets not only a +1enhancement, but also simultanious Distance, Energy, Energy Burst, and Alignment enhancement. Meaning that dragon is getting shot from a farther distance than a normal arrow, is burning/bursting/cleansing all in one shot, and is bypassing all forms of armor. THink of what railguns do in real life, that is what your arrows can all do now IN ADDITION to thier other traits (Se Sesharan's comment to the Railgun) and doesn't cost a single extra dime. The Railgun has no real need for Imbue except for the most extemperanious of cirmunstances, he's merely an Archer who dips into caster in order to get some bonuses to his arrows that are both decently strong and Free!! and the PrC itself has a Full BAB.
It seems both you and Sesharan have oppisite problems, try observing eachother's ideas and you two might start to see how the other works
Your dragon example doesn't seem to do anything that you couldn't have done with a spell in the first place, unless you're thinking of some awesome self-centered area spell that I'm not aware of. Also, that example makes it all about imbue arrow again, so if that's what makes the railgun awesome, what's the difference with the rocket again?
Then again, what can't you solve with spells, anyways? If you think that way, there isn't much incentive to play anything other than a caster. Besides, the Railgun is a mundane character with just a sprinkle of caster, the point is that he can do more varied stuff than "I attack it with my arrows". You won't be advancing your base class features, true, but you're not losing BAB, and can net some unique features along the way.
On a totally unrelated note, I found it very funny that Arcane Archer could be considered "bad", when it got so absurdly better since 3.5. A matter of perspective, eh? =D
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For Future Reference here is the Rules for Enhance arrow
At 1st level, every nonmagical arrow an arcane archer nocks and lets fly becomes magical, gaining a +1 enhancement bonus. Unlike magic weapons created by normal means, the archer need not spend gold pieces to accomplish this task. However, an archer's magic arrows only function for him.
In addition, the arcane archer's arrows gain a number of additional qualities as he gains additional levels. The elemental, elemental burst, and aligned qualities can be changed once per day, when the arcane archer prepares spells or, in the case of spontaneous spellcasters, after 8 hours of rest.
At 3rd level, every non-magical arrow fired by an arcane archer gains one of the following elemental themed weapon qualities: flaming, frost, or shock.
At 5th level, every non-magical arrow fired by an arcane archer gains the distance weapon quality.
At 7th level, every non-magical arrow fired by an arcane archer gains one of the following elemental burst weapon qualities: flaming burst, icy burst, or shocking burst. This ability replaces the ability gained at 3rd level.
At 9th level, every non-magical arrow fired by an arcane archer gains one of the following aligned weapon qualities: anarchic, axiomatic, holy, or unholy. The arcane archer cannot choose an ability that is the opposite of his alignment (for example, a lawful good arcane archer could not choose anarchic or unholy as his weapon quality).
The bonuses granted by a magic bow apply as normal to arrows that have been enhanced with this ability. Only the larger enhancement bonus applies. Duplicate abilities do not stack.
So last I check it pretty much states your Elemental, burst, distance and Alignment enhancements are all active at one, you just have to choose which ones you want at the beginning of the day.
Also Soupturtle I highly recomend playing an Arcane Acher for a little bit. Everyone Who says they've used it have all seemed to really enjoy it immensely.
Attempting to access this guide keeps popping up a dialog saying that I may not have access to this file soon because it may have been trashed. Any way to fix this?
^I guess putting the guide somewhere other than Google Docs is one way to fix the problem.
Just noticed something: Dwarf is rated Orange in general and Red if you are going to be Sorcerer. While the reasoning for this is fairly obvious, you COULD be a pretty good Dwarf Sorcerer if you have the Empyreal (Wild-Blooded) Bloodline, which moves your spellcasting stat onto Wisdom. This could even work for a Cleric/Sorcerer/Mystic Theurge build, if only Mystic Theurge hadn't been nerfed into oblivion by the recent SLA FAQ.
EDIT: Reading to the end of the new link to the guide, I see that Zenith Games took it upon themselves to provide a workaround.