Looking for a way to make a mechanically balanced, yet powerful & nasty chainsword (ala Warhammer 40,000) for a magic/steampunk setting I'm working on.
I'm thinking about giving it a fuel source reliance, but I don't want it to be over cumbersome like a backpack or some such. I'm thinking more in line with magical/alchemical fuel cell.
Also, I want to work in some variation of this new mechanic, depending on how you manage to stat out the weapon:
"For every consecutive successful hit against the same target by the Chainsword's wielder, the opponent takes a cumulative -1 to their AC, to a max of -3. Missing an attack reverts this negative to 0. This represents keeping the Chainsword pressed against the enemy in one sustained attack, tearing through them and their armor, instead of separate consecutive strikes."
A bonus to sunder also makes sense.
How about attaching negatives like on a Natural 1 the weapon jams, and a full round disable device check must be made to unjam it? Or the weapon does it's unmodified weapon damage to the wielder?
I want to stay away from the standard "just take greatsword/shortsword/battle axe and refluff it" cop-out, since I'm going for a weapon that actually -feels- different as well as -being- different. It's kind of a theme in my campaign setting that there are advanced exotic weapons out there that meaner than the standard sword (firearms, for example, are commonplace, but cost a feat (one of the most precious resources in the game) and often have caveats to their use.
We're reinventing the wheel here, and giving it kick ass steel teeth.
Thanks in advance for any comments or thoughts!
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Well, the only real issue I see here is the mechanic that you want to add. It definitely has the right feel to it, but I would suggest a change to it.
Instead of it giving the debuff to AC on the target every attack, make it to where that effect only applies on a Full Attack. It would really give it the feel of keeping it pressed against the target instead of just swinging it at the target every couple of seconds.
So, basically, someone would do like 2 attacks as a Full Round Action thingy (sorry I'm not entirely familiar with all the terms yet), and with each successful hit from those attacks would apply the AC debuff.
[Ex: You hit against the targets 17 AC on the first attack of the Full Attack, then the next attack would only require a 16 to hit.]
Turn the ripsaw glaive into a one handed weapon?
The consecutive attack thing doesn't work. As soon as the enemy takes a 5ft step away, you would no longer be keeping the sword pressed against them.
Here's a thought: Use the damage die of a greataxe, and give it a special quality that says "On a successful critical hit, this weapon can sever a limb." And roll a die to see if they lose a leg or an arm.
Or to represent the fact that the weapon his being held against the enemy actively if the opponent moves away the user, in order to keep his stacking debuff, must make a Grapple check against the target (-4 for not having 2 hands free) to move with the target and cannot take a move on his next turn (but can still full attack) provoking AoO as normal. If the Grapple check fails the user cannot move on his next turn and must make a DC 15 Reflex save or be staggered for 1d4 - 1 (minimum 1) rounds and deal the weapons unmodified damage to himself (this represents bearing down on something, having that something move but continuing to push down)
The consecutive attack thing doesn't work. As soon as the enemy takes a 5ft step away, you would no longer be keeping the sword pressed against them.
Here's a thought: Use the damage die of a greataxe, and give it a special quality that says "On a successful critical hit, this weapon can sever a limb." And roll a die to see if they lose a leg or an arm.
Well, yes. That's the idea. The enemy can either stay and take the brunt of the attack in an attempt to dish out a full attack, or be pressed back by a maniac with a chainsaw.
Or to represent the fact that the weapon his being held against the enemy actively if the opponent moves away the user, in order to keep his stacking debuff, must make a Grapple check against the target (-4 for not having 2 hands free) to move with the target and cannot take a move on his next turn (but can still full attack) provoking AoO as normal. If the Grapple check fails the user cannot move on his next turn and must make a DC 15 Reflex save or be staggered for 1d4 - 1 (minimum 1) rounds and deal the weapons unmodified damage to himself (this represents bearing down on something, having that something move but continuing to push down)
A complex idea, but I think that might be a bit too much to tack onto the weapon.
Turn the ripsaw glaive into a one handed weapon?
I'm actually not a fan of how the ripsaw glaive is put together, though I do like the idea of 2d-something for damage. Makes it seem brutal.
Well, the only real issue I see here is the mechanic that you want to add. It definitely has the right feel to it, but I would suggest a change to it.
Instead of it giving the debuff to AC on the target every attack, make it to where that effect only applies on a Full Attack. It would really give it the feel of keeping it pressed against the target instead of just swinging it at the target every couple of seconds.
So, basically, someone would do like 2 attacks as a Full Round Action thingy (sorry I'm not entirely familiar with all the terms yet), and with each successful hit from those attacks would apply the AC debuff.
[Ex: You hit against the targets 17 AC on the first attack of the Full Attack, then the next attack would only require a 16 to hit.]
/
That's a great idea, as long as we can work in the cumulative ability to rend armor for the chainsaw wielding player.
There's an AD&D version of a chainsword in Dragon 132, it might be worth looking at to see if you can port it over.
What about damage or stats? Heavy damage makes sense, or a really hard critical. Not sure which one, though. I imagine chainsaw criticals being terrifying things.
I would suggest keeping it simple. Cumulative ac debuffs are going to be hard to keep track of and add in a lot of extra paperwork. Besides, how often do you just stand there and full attack the same guy for more than 2 rounds? and if you do, chances are its because of his dodging/magic not his armour.
Something simple, -2 ac on a full round action, -3 if he is in heavy armour.
As for building the weapon, why not combine the rip-saw and the piston maul? use the power stone aspect of the piston maul and the increased damage/spinnyness of the rip-saw to build something. Something like "a piston maul requires a thunderstone to function; otherwise you treat it as a glaive. When turned on (a move/standard/swift action), a chain spins rapidly around a blade and while spinning, it deals +2 damage and negates 2 points of armour, 3 if attacking heavy armour. Inserting a thunderstone into the weapon's compartment is a full-round action that provokes an attack of opportunity and powers the weapon for 24 hours, after which the thunderstone is consumed. While the blade is spinning, you take a -10 to your sneak skill."
As for statting it out, 2d6 20/3 seems to be good, might be a little high, considering that you add on -ac and +2 damage, making it better than really anything else, but it costs thunderstones and EWP, so I dunno, should be good. 1d10 is what the piston maul and rip-saw is but feels kinda wimpy compared to the minimum 4 damage of 2d6. 2d4 maybe?
So... here is the completed saw, and I like it!
Chainsword 100 gp 1d10 2d6 x3 — 15 lbs. S see text
The blade of this glaive is wrapped in a chain to an axle with a heavy cord. When powered it makes a loud roaring sound.
Benefit: A Chainsword requires a thunderstone to function; otherwise you treat it as a glave. When turned on (a move action), a chain spins rapidly around a blade and while spinning, it deals +2 damage and negates 2 points of armour, 3 if attacking heavy armour. Inserting a thunderstone into the weapon's compartment is a full-round action that provokes an attack of opportunity and powers the weapon for 24 hours, after which the thunderstone is consumed. While the blade is spinning, you take a -10 to your sneak skill.
I would suggest keeping it simple. Cumulative ac debuffs are going to be hard to keep track of and add in a lot of extra paperwork. Besides, how often do you just stand there and full attack the same guy for more than 2 rounds? and if you do, chances are its because of his dodging/magic not his armour.
Something simple, -2 ac on a full round action, -3 if he is in heavy armour.
As for building the weapon, why not combine the rip-saw and the piston maul? use the power stone aspect of the piston maul and the increased damage/spinnyness of the rip-saw to build something. Something like "a piston maul requires a thunderstone to function; otherwise you treat it as a glaive. When turned on (a move/standard/swift action), a chain spins rapidly around a blade and while spinning, it deals +2 damage and negates 2 points of armour, 3 if attacking heavy armour. Inserting a thunderstone into the weapon's compartment is a full-round action that provokes an attack of opportunity and powers the weapon for 24 hours, after which the thunderstone is consumed. While the blade is spinning, you take a -10 to your sneak skill."
As for statting it out, 2d6 20/3 seems to be good, might be a little high, considering that you add on -ac and +2 damage, making it better than really anything else, but it costs thunderstones and EWP, so I dunno, should be good. 1d10 is what the piston maul and rip-saw is but feels kinda wimpy compared to the minimum 4 damage of 2d6. 2d4 maybe?
So... here is the completed saw, and I like it!
** spoiler omitted **...
Nice! We need a numbers guy to come in and take a look at it. Why does it wreck heavier armor harder?
the reason it wreaks heavier armour is because AC is based off of multiple things. Your armour, your dodging ability, magical resistance, ad infinitum. Technically you could get an acrobat that wears no armour but still gets hit easier because the chainsword 'mangles' his ability to dodge. If you are wearing heavy armour, you are more likely to have smaller dodge chances ect. More armour, easier to rip through. Eh that was my thinking anyways.
PS: Like the stealth bit? thats my favorite XD
the reason it wreaks heavier armour is because AC is based off of multiple things. Your armour, your dodging ability, magical resistance, ad infinitum. Technically you could get an acrobat that wears no armour but still gets hit easier because the chainsword 'mangles' his ability to dodge. If you are wearing heavy armour, you are more likely to have smaller dodge chances ect. More armour, easier to rip through. Eh that was my thinking anyways.
PS: Like the stealth bit? thats my favorite XD
I am definitely going to use that! Thanks! XD
Anyone great at math want to try and debug the averages for where that consecutive ac minus and a bonus to sunder would put the damage die in terms of balance and fairness?
Also, do we want to go high die damage (2d6, 1d10, 2d4), brutal crit (x3) or ease of crit (18 or 19-20) for a chainsaw based weapon?
2d6 or 2d8 with a 20/x3 critical.
100 gp
1 pint of Oil for 1 minute of use OR 1 thunderstone for 1 minute of use.
Deadly weapon property.
Slashing & Piercing Damage.
Maybe the Target takes ACP to AC.
When it is active you take a -5 or -10 to Stealth.
is there a tearing equivalent in pathfinder? I cant recall... anywho make the weapon 1D10 19-20/3 roll two dice and take the better result. Thats what it does in the board game if I remember correctly. thunderstone seems like a good call as well.
You could use the touch AC rules, similar to a gun, but you need to run it on Alchemist's fire. Roll a one and the thing has overheated, doing half (bludgeoning) damage until you can fix it.
That's how I'd do it. Just keep the crit rating and the damage low-ish to compensate for the ease of hitting and it should be balanced. Or as balanced as the Gunslinger, at least.
Alluria's Boggle Buzzblade is what you're looking for.
80 gp/1d8 (S)/1d10 (M)/x4/no range/4 lbs./Slashing
This weapon is a toothy, circular blade vertically mounted on the end of a short handle. A tightly wound spring keeps the blade spinning when a trigger is pressed on the handle (free action). The blade can spin for 20 rounds before it needs to be rewound. Unwound, it works as a handaxe. The buzzblade takes 2 minutes to wind.
Feel free to modify the design though ^_^
Iterative attacks make this weapon messy. Say, you're a +6/+1. Take two attacks, and you're really just smashing a sharp pokey thing into somebody real quick, twice in a row.
To use the chainsaw feature, you'd have to use at least a standard action. Because cutting into the person with a mechanical feature means pressing it into him. That's a much more involved action than just hitting him.
So I would begin this process by outlining the two attack forms. Using the weapon normally, it's just like using a non-fragile terbutje (1d8 damage). However, the user can expend a "charge" or whatever, to make a single attack as a standard action to deal extra damage (+1d6).
Then, on a critical hit, you cripple him somehow. Maybe inflict bleed, or something. Or better yet, force his armor to save, and ruin it on a failure.
Maybe make it as a Full-Attack you make a Single Attack targetting Touch AC and can continue attacking up to your full number of additional attacks for each successful hit.
Looking for a way to make a mechanically balanced, yet powerful & nasty chainsword (ala Warhammer 40,000) for a magic/steampunk setting I'm working on.
I'm thinking about giving it a fuel source reliance, but I don't want it to be over cumbersome like a backpack or some such. I'm thinking more in line with magical/alchemical fuel cell.
Also, I want to work in some variation of this new mechanic, depending on how you manage to stat out the weapon:
"For every consecutive successful hit against the same target by the Chainsword's wielder, the opponent takes a cumulative -1 to their AC, to a max of -3. Missing an attack reverts this negative to 0. This represents keeping the Chainsword pressed against the enemy in one sustained attack, tearing through them and their armor, instead of separate consecutive strikes."
A bonus to sunder also makes sense.How about attaching negatives like on a Natural 1 the weapon jams, and a full round disable device check must be made to unjam it? Or the weapon does it's unmodified weapon damage to the wielder?
I want to stay away from the standard "just take greatsword/shortsword/battle axe and refluff it" cop-out, since I'm going for a weapon that actually -feels- different as well as -being- different. It's kind of a theme in my campaign setting that there are advanced exotic weapons out there that meaner than the standard sword (firearms, for example, are commonplace, but cost a feat (one of the most precious resources in the game) and often have caveats to their use.
We're reinventing the wheel here, and giving it kick ass steel teeth.
Thanks in advance for any comments or thoughts!
take the blade, and put a trigger on it (like firearms), as a move action without quick draw yo can pull the trigger and do some plus gamage or add one effect (bypas nat ac+1-+3, or gave it a +2 damage and reduce crit range)
i create one version of the Whipblade in my campaigns, and try to make the feeling diferent... its cost skills points to learn to use it correctly (knowledge dungeoneering), besides the exotic weapon feat (Whipblade), or proficiency with whips and bastardsword or katana or elven curve blade