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I have been looking over the threads and I do not understand why so many want a bastard sword over a long sword.
Once you spend the feat on exotic weapon, you can use the bastard sword exactly the same as a long sword, one or two handed an it seems that the only benefit you gain is a bump from 1d8 to 1d10 damage.
Am I missing something?
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If you get proficiency through your class or race (Clerics/Inquisitors of Ragathiel, Tengus) it's just straight-up better than a longsword.
There's also the Titans Grip Barbarians using Large Bastard Swords to get higher base damage, though it's not really worth the feat.
The other thing is that Bastard Swords are just way cooler than Longswords.
I've taken it for flavor reasons, but the extra damage doesn't hurt.
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...this one goes to 11.
for flavor reasons: Sun Blade
Truth of the matter is a lot of people choose their weapons by taste rather than stats, otherwise I would go kukri/scimitar every time.
That aside, Bastard Sword is really good weapon for Clerics and other magic/martial hybrids. If their deity allows it (one in my setting does). You can wield it one handed, allowing you to maintain a grip on your holy symbol, but if you're out of channels/spells you can go back to two handed for increased damage.
Ok, I was wondering if I was missing something, or just not understanding.
What threads were you looking over? I thought from an optimization standpoint it was pretty clear EWP Bastard Sword is not worth a feat.
I take them all the time but that's just because it's been my favorite sword since AD&D.
A Large B-Sword will do 2d8 damage (with the proficiency feat you can use it 2 handed with a -2 to hit)
The only other weapon that you can do that without a proficiency with maybe is the Scizore, but that's a bad decision as that would mean you have a -3 to hit. Also doesn't make sense as that's a a tube that fits on one arm.
I can understand the flavor aspect.
I have been looking through the message boards searching longsword bastard sword and trying to read my way through them but they all seem the same.
I just keep seeing people state the same thing though, use it one or two handed if you need to. Same thing can be done with the long sword but not use a feat.
Like I said, I just wondered if I was missing an aspect of the bastard sword that made it so popular.
But with the large size weapon I can see a use for it that way.
Why do you say it's so popular though? I thought all the optimizer folks hated it.
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Dwarven Waraxe can do the same... but only ever counts as a martial weapon if you're a dwarf.
But for both the bastard sword and the waraxe you need to be looking at getting bigger to make the most out of them. So take a large-sized one and two-hand it (for 2d8 base), then add a lead blades spell to bump that to 3d8, and an enlarge person spell to bump that off the chart... ;)
I just look through the boards and it seems like the bastard sword pops up every so often and I was wondering why.
Mainly for the ability to have a larger version, 2d8 is the highest damage you can get for a 2 handed sword. The feat expenditure lets you get away with that though.
Large sized aklys is a 1handed 2d6, and has trip and some range.
Bastard swords are mostly just beloved by the masses for flavor. Only 1-2 more damage, sunblades work as a shortsword too, and apparently many folk don't realize you can choke up 2handed on any 1handed weapon without penalties.
Coolness is the only factor in making the EWP feat worth taking with very few exceptions.
That is a very good reason there, ProPotts. I hadn't thought about all the buffs like those.
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for flavor reasons: Sun Blade
You only need to be proficient in the short sword. It's one in all but name and damage.
I would give unloved exotic weapons like the bastard sword and waraxe a bonus to confirm crits equal to their critical multiplier.
You only need to be proficient in the short sword. It's one in all but name and damage.
I know, but I'd call that one a Sun short Blade.
Amiri, the Iconic Barbarian, wields a Large-Sized Bastard Sword.
Is that what that thing is?
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Amiri, the Iconic Barbarian, wields a Large-Sized Bastard Sword.Is that what that thing is?
Yes. You can find out how she got it here.
But if I'm going for a 2-hd fighting build...it's in that sweet spot of weapon to damage.
I'm not sure I follow you there... do you mean like you look a great sword and say "2d6? That's just excessive. But 1d10, that's just right"?
Honestly unless you can get it for free there really is no reason to waste a feat on the Bastard Sword which is a shame considering it's been one of the iconic weapons of D&D since 1e.
Personally I just houserule all the EWP into martial weapons and modify the stats a little to bring them into line with the martial weapons.
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But if I'm going for a 2-hd fighting build...it's in that sweet spot of weapon to damage.I'm not sure I follow you there... do you mean like you look a great sword and say "2d6? That's just excessive. But 1d10, that's just right"?
"Pardon me sir. Yes, we don't mind personal protection, but you are not bringing that barn yard door on a stick in here."
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"This hand-and-a-half sword is perfectly acceptable, but this two-handed sword? Sir, we are not savages here."
-nobody ever
True but they are pretty well represented on the boards. He said he saw the bastard sword trending in threads here, that's what took me back.
Yes. You can find out how she got it here.Amiri, the Iconic Barbarian, wields a Large-Sized Bastard Sword.Is that what that thing is?
I always thought it was just a greatsword...
Anyway, yes using a large sized bastard sword probably is not bad, but I would most likely still go with a medium greatsword.
2d6 vs 2d8 isn't a huge difference really, but the -2 to attack hurts a lot more.
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Man I like when I read a post like BBT's and I feel like the dude in the sonic commercial, "FIFTY-FOURRRRR!"
From a math perception (rounding up) (Format: Dice (Average on each dice roll, rounded up)
Weapon: Medium -> Large -> Huge -> Gargantuan -> Colossal (Large Impact Weapon with Lead Blades and Enlarge Person)
Longsword: 1d8 (5) -> 2d6 (8) -> 3d6 (12) -> 4d6 (16) -> 6d6 (24) (Max damage: 36)
Bastard Sword: 1d10 (6) -> 2d8 (10) -> 3d8 (15) -> 4d8 (20) -> 6d8 (30) (Max damage: 48)
It's overall a nice weapon, especially when you get size increases
It's also pretty weird. If I remember, increasing the size of a weapon to the next size category increases the handedness (or whatever). A One-handed becomes a Two-handed and a Two-handed becomes unwieldable.
In other words, a Impact Greatsword with Lead Blades and Enlarge Person will cap out at 6d6.
While a Large Impact Bastard Sword with Lead Blades and Enlarge Person will cap out at 6d8.
Although ultimately, I'd rather go for the Falcata (19-20/3x seems lovely.)
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Because they're cool.
I do it just for flavor. I like hand and a half swords. It's how I roll. Stats take a very much back seat to flavor and coolness factor. In sci fi games I tend to end up with light sabers or "Laser swords" I don't care if the stats are less than other melee weapons. It's just what I like.
Okay, so if I math this out and really get down to the number-crunching I think I can find out if a D10 can give some higher numbers than a D8, I think. Hold on, I'll see what I can come up with.
No man, it's cool, feather fall
If that is who you want to model yourself after, fine.
Wait.. what gave you that idea?
I have been looking over the threads and I do not understand why so many want a bastard sword over a long sword.
Once you spend the feat on exotic weapon, you can use the bastard sword exactly the same as a long sword, one or two handed an it seems that the only benefit you gain is a bump from 1d8 to 1d10 damage.
Am I missing something?
People use their gut to make choices like this instead of math. 1d10 feels bigger than 1d8 than it really is. In the end, EWP: Bastard Sword is basically just a feat for +1 damage.
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Larger damage die and a free hand for the shield. Optimizers will now bring up the Falcatta.
Larger damage die and a free hand for the shield. Optimizers will now bring up the Falcatta.
Oddly enough, no one mentioned the Falcata but me.
And then people tell me scimitars are better because 18-20 crit.
Just use whatever weapon. My friend has used a door as a weapon, himself as an adamantine gnome on a stick (via Artificer's touch), and we did have some wizard tossing to get across cliffs (Even though it was more painful than necessary.)
Any time I feel like using a bastard sword I remember that longswords do exactly the same thing -1 damage, and save myself a feat.
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As a one-handed weapon it should be compared to a longsword; as a two-handed weapon it should be compared to a greatsword.
One-handed: it does an average of +1 damage at the cost of a feat (EWP-bastard sword). It's not worth a feat for most people because there is nearly always another feat which would be better. If you can get the EWP for free without expending a feat then it's better than a longsword. The above also applies when intending to regularly switch between one and two-handed use. A medium creature cannot use a large bastard sword one-handed without some special ability.
Two-handed: the special ability of bastard swords it that, when used two-handed, you don't need to waste a feat on EWP; being proficient in martial weapons is enough. Greatsword is a better choice as it does an average of 1.5 more damage per hit, with the only downside being that you can't use that weapon one-handed should the need ever arise. The only exception is if you can put the throwing special ability on your weapon. A thrown greatsword is a two-handed weapon so throwing it is a standard action so cannot be combined with a full attack. A thrown bastard sword is a one-handed weapon so it can be thrown as an attack, therefore it can be one attack of your full attack! Best make it the last one, as it won't come back until just before your next turn. : )
Since a bastard sword is a one-handed weapon, a large one counts as a two-handed weapon for a medium creature, irrespective of the wielder's proficiency. Since the special ability of bastard swords is unchanged no matter it's size, if you wield a bastard sword in two hands you do so as a martial weapon, so you don't need the EWP. Compared to a medium greatsword (large greatswords are unusable) the large bastard sword does an average of +2 damage but takes a -2 attack penalty; probably too much of a disadvantage at low levels but at high levels you may feel it's worth it.
All the above also applies to battle-axe/dwarven waraxe/greataxe just as much as it applies to longsword/bastard sword/greatsword.
It's also a convenient save when you accidentally swear:
"What a BASTARD sword."
'Cuz rolling 2d10 on a crit with one hand is just cool.
'Cuz rolling 2d10 on a crit with one hand is just cool.
Why is it cooler than rolling 2d8? Or rolling 2d6 50% more often?
Any time I feel like using a bastard sword I remember that longswords do exactly the same thing -1 damage, and save myself a feat.
Any time I feel like using a bastard sword I remember that dwarven battleaxes do nearly the same and play a dwarf.