3.5 Loyalist what is your first sentence saying?
If a rule seems ridiculous, change it.
Profoundly chaotic, I know.
If a rule seems ridiculous, change it.
Profoundly chaotic, I know.
We all agree on what the RAI is. The disagreement is on the RAW. I don't think anyone here is advocating denying monks the right to use haste.
It does if you want it to, and the other camp seems ridiculous.
Monks are supposedly weak, so it might be amusing to put in a monk faction whose members all seems to attack at blinding speed whenever encountered. The adventurers must find out why?
Why? Because they are all high on haste potions, from a hidden magic spring at their temple. Now we have an adventure idea and the dm says sure, haste on. Resolution, ommmmm.
Haste has been the #1 arcane martial buff for as long as I can recall. It's a 3rd level spell available at 5th level. It's the whole reason to buy boots of speed. It affects one target per level and is a power multiplier. I suppose if your party doesn't take advantage of it, then there would be no issues with monks and the rules. Of course, monks could really use extra attacks at their highest bonus and legally they don't get it. But the haste spell is possessed by Bards, Wizard, and Sorcerers (all the core arcane casters), so suggesting that you have to get it from GM fiat and strange springs of speed is a bit silly, don't you think?
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Rawdiculous!
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In many ways, I feel that haste became too good in 3rd Edition, and continued so (even with the nerfs) in 3.5 and Pathfinder. The original spell was single target only and aged you (physically) a year each time it was cast upon you.
When the game updated to 3.0, they got rid of that part of the spell, but made it a multi-target buff . . . while keeping the same spell level. No, for what it does (with no drawbacks), it really should have been a single-target spell at somewhere around 5th level.
In my opinion.
MA
We all agree on what the RAI is. The disagreement is on the RAW. I don't think anyone here is advocating denying monks the right to use haste.If a rule seems ridiculous, change it.
Profoundly chaotic, I know.
Nobody that I know of. >.>
This whole thing came up because in a discussion about monks in the game as RAW with no house rules it was noted. I counted it as a problem that monks have with keeping pace with even NPC warriors (and didn't assume haste with the monks I built during the thread for the same reason). When discussing the game, I follow the RAW unless we're talking house rules and mods. Not what someone somewhere said it should do, but what it does do. Do I play this way in my games? Heck no. I don't even use the monk as written (I've posted a monk fix that removes pretty much every and all complaints I've seen presented about monks). Do I think monks need to get the shaft so much in the system? No of course not.That's why I'd rather bring these things up and look at where monks are actually hurting in the system.
Ha ha, imagine a monk drank a haste potion, it did nothing. Tries one from a teammate in case he got a bad brew. Nothing. Monk flurries his own face off while screaming.
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Don't worry citizen, the other side has identified a problem they believe no one is actually having, because no one plays that way they say, and they are bringing it to our attention that everyone who is playing the way they say everyone is playing is wrong so that the problem that isn't occurring can be fixed.
Heroes they are, each and every one of them that created this thread and clicked the FAQ to bring the problem that they believe isn't occurring into the light of day to get addressed.
EDIT: As long as you understand you were wrong of course, and that they are right.
And handsome.
Premise 1: A Monk treats their unarmed strike as a manufactured and/or natural weapon, as is convenient for them, for the purposes of being enhanced or improved by spells or effects.
Premise 2: The words "enhance" and "improve" have no in-game meaning beyond what is given in common English language.
Premise 3: Enhance means "to raise to a higher degree; intensify; magnify:" or "to raise the value or price of:"
Premise 4: Improve means, "to advance or make progress in what is desirable" or "to make useful additions or amendments".
Premise 5: The Monk's ability does not limit its scope--that is, it does not specify that the spell must directly target the unarmed strike, only that it must in some way be enhanced or improved.
Premise 6: Haste is a spell or effect.
So far so good.
Premise 7: Haste makes progress in what is desirable re: unarmed strike, makes a useful addition, and otherwise increases the value of the Monk's unarmed strike.
*buzzer* Oops, there you go again. Haste does not enhance or improve a weapon. Not even by your definitions.
From the PRD:
Unarmed Strike:
A monk's unarmed strike is treated as both a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons.
From the PRD:
Haste:
The transmuted creatures move and act more quickly than normal. This extra speed has several effects.
When making a full attack action, a hasted creature may make one extra attack with one natural or manufactured weapon. The attack is made using the creature's full base attack bonus, plus any modifiers appropriate to the situation. (This effect is not cumulative with similar effects, such as that provided by a speed weapon, nor does it actually grant an extra action, so you can't use it to cast a second spell or otherwise take an extra action in the round.)
Is haste a spell? Yes. Therefore it works.
So, how is it that anyone can read that the monk doesn't get an extra attack with haste?
Likewise, Flurry of Blows doesn't have a caveat that states it doesn't work with haste, so why wouldn't that work?
Likewise, Flurry is "effectively" TWF. There is no place in the rules that says that someone using TWF doesn't get an extra attack from haste.
So, without a SPECIAL RULE that states: "Monks cannot use haste with their unarmed strikes or when using Flurry of Blows", there is absolutely NO RULE that prohibits them from benefiting from getting the extra attack from haste.
In fact, if any errata really needs to be put forth, it should be that the text of haste be clarified by including unarmed strike specifically--for those people who are going out of their way to exclude it.
That's an ambiguous sentence. That's what the problem is. You can read either way. You read as unarmed strikes are treated as natural or manufactured weapon for the purpose of spell and unarmed strikes are treated as natural weapons for the purpose of effects that improve or enhance either manufactured weapons or natural weapons. As well you can read a spells and effect together that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons.
In my opinion Haste enhance both the creature and any weapon or natural attack they choose to use the extra attack with. That's my opinion and other obviously disagree. But I'm right the above argument is moot. If I'm wrong the RAW is ambiguous and it's up to the GM to decide which way it goes because in the end it's their interpretation that matters not yours. RAI I'd say would be the Haste works with unarmed strikes.
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For the love of god! Yes! Haste grants an additional attack to Monks just like any other class! This thread has come up over and over again. Stop trying to give the Monk the shaft. We have it hard enough as it is.....just kidding. Playing a Monk and dealing a buttload of damage is easy. But, yes, we do get an additional attack when Hasted.
Hey Ciretose, chill out, yeah?
If a bad rule is bad, how does ignoring it change anything? We complain about bad RAW so that the devs can see where changes need to be made, not to tell anyone else how to play their game.
So, in the interest of attempting to make this game better/more clear, would you mind not continously trying to derail a thread, just to get your licks in against one poster? Kthx
@SoulGambit0 - Haste improves/enhances a target creature. It does not improve/enhance a weapon of any kind. Therefore, it does not work with a Monk's UAS, as a Monk's UAS is only treated as manufactured/natural when dealing with spells and effects that improve/enhance a weapon.
I didn't read all 214 posts on this subject (and that's just in this thread) but I'm sure someone has posted these quotes already. But just in case some of you Monk haters weren't paying attention...
This is a quote from the description of the Monk's unarmed strike:
"A monk's unarmed strike is treated as both a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons."
And here is an excerpt from the description of Haste:
"When making a full attack action, a hasted creature may make one extra attack with one natural or manufactured weapon."
I really don't understand the confusion. Now, you may try to argue that the Monk gets an additional attack when Hasted while using the Full Attack Action but not with a FoB because the description of FoB says the Monk can't use a Natural Weapon as part of an FoB. Wellllllll, then it's a good thing the Monk's Unarmed Attack is also considered a Manufactured Weapon, isn't it? Seriously now...it's pretty clear isn't it?
Happy Gaming
Premise 1: A Monk treats their unarmed strike as a manufactured and/or natural weapon, as is convenient for them, for the purposes of being enhanced or improved by spells or effects.
Premise 2: The words "enhance" and "improve" have no in-game meaning beyond what is given in common English language.
Premise 3: Enhance means "to raise to a higher degree; intensify; magnify:" or "to raise the value or price of:"
Premise 4: Improve means, "to advance or make progress in what is desirable" or "to make useful additions or amendments".
Premise 5: The Monk's ability does not limit its scope--that is, it does not specify that the spell must directly target the unarmed strike, only that it must in some way be enhanced or improved.
Premise 6: Haste is a spell or effect.
Premise 7: Haste makes progress in what is desirable re: unarmed strike, makes a useful addition, and otherwise increases the value of the Monk's unarmed strike.
Premise 8: Making an unarmed strike in any way more useful regardless of how indirectly is a method of improvement (Reflexive property).THEREFORE: Haste affects a Monk's unarmed strike.
Stop skipping post. The unarmed strike is not being enhanced. The user is being affected. If the spell affected the weapon then anyone could pick up a manufactured weapon and use it after it was dropped, but since the effect is on the user, well you can figure it out.
Premise 1: A Monk treats their unarmed strike as a manufactured and/or natural weapon, as is convenient for them, for the purposes of being enhanced or improved by spells or effects.
Premise 2: The words "enhance" and "improve" have no in-game meaning beyond what is given in common English language.
Premise 3: Enhance means "to raise to a higher degree; intensify; magnify:" or "to raise the value or price of:"
Premise 4: Improve means, "to advance or make progress in what is desirable" or "to make useful additions or amendments".
Premise 5: The Monk's ability does not limit its scope--that is, it does not specify that the spell must directly target the unarmed strike, only that it must in some way be enhanced or improved.
Premise 6: Haste is a spell or effect.So far so good.
Premise 7: Haste makes progress in what is desirable re: unarmed strike, makes a useful addition, and otherwise increases the value of the Monk's unarmed strike.*buzzer* Oops, there you go again. Haste does not enhance or improve a weapon. Not even by your definitions.
Saying you are correct without supplying evidence or precedence does not make you correct, even if you add funny sound effects beforehand. There is a mental "value" associated with the action "using unarmed strike during a Full Attack." The spell haste increases the value and effectiveness of selecting that option. I'm also not entirely sure how you can state that an extra attack isn't a "useful addition." Therefore, it is making progress towards what the Monk player feels is desirable.
You also agreed with premise 5, which is actually the key premise. I'm afraid you are wrong as long as Premise 5 is upheld and a connection, no matter how tenuous, can be made between a spell or effect and promoting what the Monk player feels is desirable, then the Monk's unarmed strike is a manufactured or natural weapon for purposes of it....
Sorry, but making me be able to swing a weapon faster is not improving or enhancing the weapon any more than righteous might improves a weapon because of what it does to me if I cast the spell.
When arguing the rules it is good to be neutral in your approach in order to remove bias. :)
edit: added "to"
Saying you are correct without supplying evidence or precedence does not make you correct, even if you add funny sound effects beforehand.
What, did you miss the evidence as you stumbled through three pages to get here?
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Saying you are correct without supplying evidence or precedence does not make you correct, even if you add funny sound effects beforehand.What, did you miss the evidence as you stumbled through three pages to get here?
I am sure he just skipped to the last page. He had too or else he would have quoted the more detailed posts and tried to refuted them.
Well that is what I would do anyway if I was in a debate. :)
Don't worry citizen, the other side has identified a problem they believe no one is actually having, because no one plays that way they say, and they are bringing it to our attention that everyone who is playing the way they say everyone is playing is wrong so that the problem that isn't occurring can be fixed.
Heroes they are, each and every one of them that created this thread and clicked the FAQ to bring the problem that they believe isn't occurring into the light of day to get addressed.
EDIT: As long as you understand you were wrong of course, and that they are right.
And handsome.
You conclusion did not bring anything that my earlier arguments did not already counter. In other words you have not said anything to refute the earlier arguments, but I will provide one more scenario, or I should say, set of questions.
If I am faster, and therefore swinging my sword faster would you really argue that the sword has been improved?
If so why do you think there is no difference between the tool and the user being better? Would you apply the same argument to divine power or any other spell that specifically affects the user? If so then why do the rules call out spells that say anything about spells that enhance natural attacks if all specificially if anything that affect the wielder applies to the weapon anyway? Would you also allow an affect that affects a weapon to apply to the wielder?
If not then how does the same argument not apply to haste?
I'm actually presuming that you have all read the 4+ pages and that making you relive the merry-go-round would be unpleasant and utterly pointless. I take the approach of adding something new to conversations, in this case pointing out the lack of limit in the scope and targeting, which has not been brought up. Where I to limit myself only to the information that has already been said in this thread prior to my entrance, then the obvious conclusion is that RAW Haste does not affect unarmed strikes. It is the addition of this new information that makes the discussion interesting.
That said, if you fear new things being brought to the conversation rather than walking in circles well... I like my conversations progressive. I understand that the internet offers a wide and varied pallet, and I'm sorry if ours isn't compatible.
But since we're debating now: Stawman Fallacy. My ability to or not to quote the past has no bearing on the validity or lack of validity of my argument. If you're refuting my argument, please keep it to a discussion about the premises.
I have addressed your concern regarding both skipping post and the issue of targeting the individual instead of the weapon itself. Do you have any other concerns with my conclusion?
Only that the spell still has to enhance or improve your weapon. It doesn't. Magic fang is a great example of a spell that doesn't target a weapon but enhances or improves one. Haste doesn't.
That's why Premise 5 is there. The Monk's ability never requires that something target its unarmed strike for the "counts as Natural/Manufactured" flag to be turned on. All that's required is that the Unarmed Strike could hypothetically benefit in some fashion. It's a spell and, at the end of the day, when you roll your d20 you are adding a bigger number to your Unarmed Strike attack. How doesn't matter. Target doesn't matter. As long as it somehow benefits the Monk's unarmed strike, you could target the Monk's pet dog with the effects and his unarmed strike would benefit (i.e. Spell with the effect, "This dog's owner's manufactured weapons receive a +1 bonus to-hit").
Or, perhaps I've missed something somewhere and scope and targeting is somehow relevant. A lot of people seem to be adding the word "targeting" to the ability in their minds, so I could be wrong. If so, could I please get a citation that somehow demonstrates this?
Wow. Ok, here it is....Haste has no affect whatsoever on any weapon, manufactured or natural. Haste affects the character only. A Monk would get an additional attack when Hasted whether he is unarmed, throwing shuriken, or swinging a Temple sword, just as a Hasted Fighter would get an additional attack swinging a long sword.
Wow. Ok, here it is....Haste has no affect whatsoever on any weapon, manufactured or natural. Haste affects the character only. A Monk would get an additional attack when Hasted whether he is unarmed, throwing shuriken, or swinging a Temple sword, just as a Hasted Fighter would get an additional attack swinging a long sword.That's why Premise 5 is there. The Monk's ability never requires that something target its unarmed strike for the "counts as Natural/Manufactured" flag to be turned on. All that's required is that the Unarmed Strike could hypothetically benefit in some fashion. It's a spell and, at the end of the day, when you roll your d20 you are adding a bigger number to your Unarmed Strike attack. How doesn't matter. Target doesn't matter. As long as it somehow benefits the Monk's unarmed strike, you could target the Monk's pet dog with the effects and his unarmed strike would benefit (i.e. Spell with the effect, "This dog's owner's manufactured weapons receive a +1 bonus to-hit").
Or, perhaps I've missed something somewhere and scope and targeting is somehow relevant. A lot of people seem to be adding the word "targeting" to the ability in their minds, so I could be wrong. If so, could I please get a citation that somehow demonstrates this?
RAW, he does not.
That's why Premise 5 is there. The Monk's ability never requires that something target its unarmed strike for the "counts as Natural/Manufactured" flag to be turned on. All that's required is that the Unarmed Strike could hypothetically benefit in some fashion. It's a spell and, at the end of the day, when you roll your d20 you are adding a bigger number to your Unarmed Strike attack. How doesn't matter. Target doesn't matter. As long as it somehow benefits the Monk's unarmed strike, you could target the Monk's pet dog with the effects and his unarmed strike would benefit (i.e. Spell with the effect, "This dog's owner's manufactured weapons receive a +1 bonus to-hit").
Or, perhaps I've missed something somewhere and scope and targeting is somehow relevant. A lot of people seem to be adding the word "targeting" to the ability in their minds, so I could be wrong. If so, could I please get a citation that somehow demonstrates this?
A spell does not affect what it does not target.
Most spell entries have a target line
Targets one creature/level, no two of which can be more than 30 ft. apart
In some cases a spell may affect a weapon while targeting the creature, but it will be specifically stated. Someone already presented a specific example where the weapon itself was improved, not the users ability to improve the weapon even though the creature was targeted IIRC.
Also read this.
Does making comparisons to Frank Trollman count as Godwinning the thread?
Wow. Ok, here it is....Haste has no affect whatsoever on any weapon, manufactured or natural. Haste affects the character only. A Monk would get an additional attack when Hasted whether he is unarmed, throwing shuriken, or swinging a Temple sword, just as a Hasted Fighter would get an additional attack swinging a long sword.That's why Premise 5 is there. The Monk's ability never requires that something target its unarmed strike for the "counts as Natural/Manufactured" flag to be turned on. All that's required is that the Unarmed Strike could hypothetically benefit in some fashion. It's a spell and, at the end of the day, when you roll your d20 you are adding a bigger number to your Unarmed Strike attack. How doesn't matter. Target doesn't matter. As long as it somehow benefits the Monk's unarmed strike, you could target the Monk's pet dog with the effects and his unarmed strike would benefit (i.e. Spell with the effect, "This dog's owner's manufactured weapons receive a +1 bonus to-hit").
Or, perhaps I've missed something somewhere and scope and targeting is somehow relevant. A lot of people seem to be adding the word "targeting" to the ability in their minds, so I could be wrong. If so, could I please get a citation that somehow demonstrates this?
You only get an extra attack within a selection of weapons, which include Manufacture or Natural Weapons.
Unarmed Strikes has been intentionally removed from being either a Manufactured or Natural Weapon.
Since Unarmed Strike is neither Manufactured or Natural, Unarmed Strikes can't be used to make the extra attack from Haste.
Haste doesn't target or affect the Monk's weapon, it targets and affects the creature. The Creature runs faster. The Creature can swing caster. The Creature can dodge blows faster. The Creature can avoid spells faster. The Speed of the Creatures swing allows their attacks to hit more often.
The Weapon is never affected by Haste.
That's the RAW. The reality is everyone plays with Haste affecting all weapons, whether they be Manufactured, Natural, or Unarmed.
Does making comparisons to Frank Trollman count as Godwinning the thread?
Someone already beat you to the punch.
Maybe he was Hasted?
Only if Hitler GM'ed a group of Nazis would a Monk not be allowed to get an extra attack from Haste!
Oh... Did I just lose?
RAW, he does not.
Doesn't be an additional attack? How so? Unless there's a specific line somewhere that says "Monks do not benefit from Haste", the rules seem extremely easy and obvious to interpret the other way.
RAW, he does not.
Doesn't be an additional attack? How so? Unless there's a specific line somewhere that says "Monks do not benefit from Haste", the rules seem extremely easy and obvious to interpret the other way.
The Rule As Intended is that Unarmed Strikes should benefit from Haste.
The Rule As Written, however, is that Unarmed Strikes don't benefit from Haste.
You only get an extra attack within a selection of weapons, which include Manufacture or Natural Weapons.Unarmed Strikes has been intentionally removed from being either a Manufactured or Natural Weapon.
Since Unarmed Strike is neither Manufactured or Natural, Unarmed Strikes can't be used to make the extra attack from Haste.
Haste doesn't target or affect the Monk's weapon, it targets and affects the creature. The Creature runs faster. The Creature can swing caster. The Creature can dodge blows faster. The Creature can avoid spells faster. The Speed of the Creatures swing allows their attacks to hit more often.
The Weapon is never affected by Haste.
That's the RAW. The reality...
Except:
A. a monk's UAS is treated as both a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons.
B. a hasted creature may make one extra attack with one natural or manufactured weapon.
C: A monk's UAS can be considered to be a natural weapon when a haste (which can enhance a natural weapon) is cast on him.
Therefor haste grants a monk an extra attack.
If haste can be cast on a person and thereby improve/enhance that person's natural attack(s), how can the monk's UAS not be affected if - as the monk description states - the UAS is considered a natural weapon for a spell that enhances or improves a natural weapon.
Seems pretty straightforward.
Maybe not for most classes but a Monk's Unamed Stike is treated as both a natural weapon and a manufactured weapon which would allow Hasted Monk another attack.
RAW, he does not.Doesn't be an additional attack? How so? Unless there's a specific line somewhere that says "Monks do not benefit from Haste", the rules seem extremely easy and obvious to interpret the other way.
Because the spell only allows the target to make an extra attack with certain weapons. An unarmed strike falls into neither category.
Haste also does not improved the weapon. It improves the character, by allowing him to move faster. That is represented in games terms with the bonus to reflex saves, the dodge attack, and the ability to swing a weapon faster, depending on what that weapon is.
The weapon however is not enhanced, just because you can use it better, anymore than it is enhanced because you just drank a bull's strength potion.
Edit:Just to be clear the unarmed strike is only treated as the other weapon types when those weapon types are improved. This spell makes the user better, not the weapon itself.
You only get an extra attack within a selection of weapons, which include Manufacture or Natural Weapons.Unarmed Strikes has been intentionally removed from being either a Manufactured or Natural Weapon.
Since Unarmed Strike is neither Manufactured or Natural, Unarmed Strikes can't be used to make the extra attack from Haste.
Haste doesn't target or affect the Monk's weapon, it targets and affects the creature. The Creature runs faster. The Creature can swing caster. The Creature can dodge blows faster. The Creature can avoid spells faster. The Speed of the Creatures swing allows their attacks to hit more often.
The Weapon is never affected by Haste.
That's the RAW. The reality...
Except:
A. a monk's UAS is treated as both a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons.
B. a hasted creature may make one extra attack with one natural or manufactured weapon.
C: A monk's UAS can be considered to be a natural weapon when a haste (which can enhance a natural weapon) is cast on him.
Therefor haste grants a monk an extra attack.
If haste can be cast on a person and thereby improve/enhance that person's natural attack(s), how can the monk's UAS not be affected if - as the monk description states - the UAS is considered a natural weapon for a spell that enhances or improves a natural weapon.
Seems pretty straightforward.
Haste DOES NOT enhance the weapon it enhances the creature.
If Haste enhanced the weapon, as Magic Weapon does, then the weapon could be dropped, and another creature could pick it up, at which point they could make an extra attack.
Likewise, if it only enhanced the weapon, then if you try to use a different weapon than the one that was enhanced at the casting of the spell, you would be unable to make an extra attack with the secondary weapon because it wasn't enhanced, the first one was.
Example: Haste enhances the creature.
Fighter is Hasted by the Wizard.
Fighter kills the goblin he's fighting and still has the extra attack from Haste, but his next target is 40 ft away.
Fighter can drop his sword, quick draw his bow, and fire an arrow at the next target, because he, the fighter, is enhanced to move faster.
Example 2: Haste enhances the weapon.
Fighter is Hasted by the Wizard.
Fighter kills the goblin he's fighting, but still has the extra attack from Haste. He can't draw his bow and shoot, because his Sword is enhanced, not his bow. So he throws his sword at the Goblin instead.
See what happens when you say the Weapon is being enhanced? It's not, the creature is being enhanced. By enhancing the creature, you allow the creature to make an extra attack using any Manufactured or Natural Weapon he carries.
The Monk's Unarmed Strike only counts as Manufactured or Natural if a spell or effect enhances or improves a Manufactured or Natural Weapon. Since Haste enhances the creature, not the weapon, a Monk's Unarmed Strike is never a viable weapon for Haste.
An Unarmed Strike from any other creature is never enhanced because they don't have that special clause that Monk's do.
Your name says it all.
The Haste spell targets a specific creature, and grants them benefits, such as +1 to hit. It also allows a creature with a natural or manufactured weapon to make an additional attack at full BAB in conjunction with a Full Attack Option.
The Monk's Unarmed Strike says their Unarmed Strikes count as both Natural and Manufactured weapons for the purpose of spells that target Natural or Manufactured weapons.
Do the math.
The result is that by RAW, a Monk's Unarmed Strike (or anyone's Unarmed Strike for that matter) does not benefit from Haste because the Haste spell targets a Creature, not a Natural or Manufactured weapon. Spells like Magic Weapon or Magic Fang would apply to a Monk's Unarmed Strikes, but Haste would not.
I will iterate again; the issue is that the spell Haste affects a creature. The Monk's Unarmed Strike description affects spells that target Natural or Manufactured weapons. The Monk's Unarmed Strike description is mutually exclusive (and two separate conditions altogether), and since the Haste spell affects a Creature that uses Natural or Manufactured weapons to attack, and not the Natural or Manufactured weapons themselves, Haste ultimately has no impact on the Monk's Unarmed Strike description (and vice versa).
Okay. Consider me a convert. Damn.
