nuff said?
No reason there can't be. That's what Item Creation feats are for.
I was under the impression you cant enchant non weapons with Bonuses.
If so I wasn't aware of it. I've done it for years. I guess if not then it's a houserule. *shrug*
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think about it a cup that is enchanted to kill dwarves. you sit down with them have a few drinks then swing the cup right at them. Pure Genius
A weapon must be masterwork before it can be enchanted as a magic weapon. Improvised weapons (like mugs and shovels) are not masterwork weapons, so can not be enchanted as magical weapons.
A weapon must be masterwork before it can be enchanted as a magic weapon. Improvised weapons (like mugs and shovels) are not masterwork weapons, so can not be enchanted as magical weapons.
that right there.
The same applies to armor. However, Robes of the Archmagi have been enchanted to give a +5 armor bonus, and Bracers of Armor can be enahcnted just like armor can. So there is precedent for non-armor being enchantable like armor. It wouldn't be much of a stretch to apply the same to weapons. They would be created with Craft Wonderous Item, instead of Craft Magic Arms and Armor (just like the Robe of the Archmagi and Bracers of Armor.)
how do I make a Shovel Masterwork?
how do I make a Shovel Masterwork?
A masterwork tool costs 50gp, according to the core rulebook, and that should apply to shovels. However, that won't work. It would be a masterwork tool, not a masterwork weapon.
spend 350 gold pieces on a masterwork shovel. 50 because it's a masterwork tool, an additional 300 because it is a masterwork weapon.
Yup, pretty much that. If a long stick can be made with the same quality as a masterword sword (quarterstaff) I do not see how the more-complex shovel can't.
It's just made at weapon quality and strength so it won't break if you hit something with it, seems appropriate justification for me.
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Weapons come in all shapes and sizes. A shovel is just an axe that cuts the ground rather than timber. Make your shovel an axe in terms of stats, but a shovel in terms of appearance.
Your mug is just a Cestus with extra properties. Pay the price, describe it however you want and voila.
For inspiration, check out the Ben Stiller movie where "the shoveller" uses the tool of same, one girl uses a bowling ball with her fathers skull inside, and don't get me started on " the spleen" . If they can do it in movies, you can try it in a role play game.
Cheers
Edit - the movie is called Mystery Men. Funny show, worth checking out.
how do I make a Shovel Masterwork?A masterwork tool costs 50gp, according to the core rulebook, and that should apply to shovels. However, that won't work. It would be a masterwork tool, not a masterwork weapon.
Houserule! Assuming non-PFS game.
So a +1 Zombie Bane Shovel would cost 50(mwk tool)+8000(+2 enhancement price).
I don't think it should get the +300 for a mwk weapon since it is not a weapon. It is an improvised weapon at best and the wielder would still take the penalties associated with using an improvised weapon. (mitigate with feats)
You might need some skill in Craft(Tools) and spellcraft, and i'd say you still need Craft Magic Arms and Armor since you are adding weapon enhancements. But with the precedent noted by Jeraa Craft Wonderous might be the way to go.
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I think this is one of those things where it is more about the tone of the game you and your friends want rather than what can the rules do.
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If a scythe can be a masterwork weapon than a shovel can be.
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I think any killer shovel should have bonuses for enemies that are prone.
My .02?
They are not magic shovels and tankards as weapons (out of the box and standard) because those items are 'tools' not 'weapons'. If you can afford to fork out the several thousand worth of GP to make a item masterwork and a +2 equiv enchantment on it to make it a 'weapon', you probably want to do it with something that is a weapon to begin with and designed to actually hurt people, not hold your beer.
Why is there no greatswords of digging? Same reason. You use a tool for that, not a weapon.
Might there be 'magic weapon tools' out there.... can't see why not, but they aren't going to be purpose built by someone. A shovel might be have been imbued with necromantic energy over the years spent in a restless graveyard, or with wild energy from being used to tend a druidic grove. A mug might be a gift from Cayden Cailean that is imbued with his chaotic essence (and is always full). A mug might have been used by a king to defend himself against an ambush and saved his life years ago and become a minor historical artefact to a country, imbuing it with improved ability against whatever race ambushed him in the first place.
But that's the only way I see those things coming about. Hand of fate kind of objects rather than purpose built. You ask a magician to enchant your shovel and your probably going to get some odd looks and they may actually tell you to bugger off (who wants their name associated with a shovel? There's no prestige in having your name associated with a shovel, because heroes don't use shovels).
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PathfinderDB has a Combat Shovel I believe. Really this is something to talk to your GM about.
I would make it a Shortspear, Javelin, or club that can't be thrown.
@Ecaterina_Ducaird: You do realize the Shovel was the weapon of Choice for the Original incarnation of the Antihero Gravedigger from Black Night Comics right?
I'd probably make a weaponized shovel some kind of polearm. I could see it being wielded as one. Depending on the shovel's orientation it could be wielded as a bludgeoning weapon or a slashing weapon or even a piercing weapon.
And if you think that guy with the shovel is bad, wait until you run into the guy with the post-holer.
Seriously though, +1 shovel could be a nice find in an undead campaign, especially if it is treated as bludgeoning, piercing, or slashing based on approach of attack.
A +1 rock rake (deals piercing damage) could be used as a trip weapon.
.... You ask a magician to enchant your shovel and your probably going to get some odd looks and they may actually tell you to bugger off (who wants their name associated with a shovel? There's no prestige in having your name associated with a shovel, because heroes don't use shovels).
That all depends on the type of mage. I have a sorcerer that'd probably jump at the chance to create a tankard +2 of goblin bane. Sure, a wizard might not want their name and reputation associated with enchanting a shovel, until a PC with Catch Off Guard does something, like kill a mad Necromancer, with one. Then all of the wizards will be clamoring to make the magic zombie/dragon/drow slaying shovel that the PC buys next.
Honestly saying something like, "you'd probably want a weapon to begin with" total ignores several factors. Would it be more in character for a PC to use a shovel to perform heroic deeds? Does it fit the tone of the story that the GM has set up? Would it be funnier, or more fun, to use a shovel? Is this something that would make for story that gets retold for years?
Personally, if I was gming and a PC asked me about this, I'd allow it. A shovel makes a hell of a lot more sense as a weapon than a scythe, at leas the sharp side is facing away from you.
Actual war scythes had their blades turned so they were in line with the shaft and used as pole arms. but I get what you are saying!
A Farmer turned Adventurer after the 5th goblin raid of his village might wield his trusty shovel over a sword.
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Pathfinder has a plethora of weaponized tools for you to enjoy. I think what you're looking for is called the "Monk's Spade". You don't have to be a monk to dig holes with it of course- that's just flavor. Or you could add some kick to your masterwork makeup kit with the Iron Brush. And what big game hunter's place setting would be complete without a well polished Tiger Fork (preferably alchemical silver for special occasions)?
There are already tools-as-weapons (see the mattock of the titans). You just enchant them as wondrous items...
Hmm a Monks spade could be modified into a more basic version...
Say drop the double weapon part and lighten the weight a bit...
this is more of an issue of "reflavoring" in 3.5 i could make my gear look how ever i wanted it to look, i could have a d4 dagger that looked like a great sword.
if you want to write the stats of a "club" on you character sheet and treat it as a mug of ass whoop, then i dont see an issue with that. i would allow my player to do that if they chose to.
Actually, Pathfinder has several weaponized tools. Shovel may not be so far fetched.
Farm implements: sickle, scythe, flail, pitchfork (as military fork).
Mining: pick.
Animal handling: lasso, whip.Several eastern weapons fall into the weaponized tool category as well, if I recall.
in history they actually had all of these weapons that were adapted from farm toolsinto actual wartime weapons that were cheap to produce, mainly used for militias. so i dont think you can label these as farm tools, since they were modified for killing animals(human).
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My shovel is at least +5.
And I bash bad guys in the face with it all the time.
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this is more of an issue of "reflavoring" in 3.5 i could make my gear look how ever i wanted it to look, i could have a d4 dagger that looked like a great sword.
if you want to write the stats of a "club" on you character sheet and treat it as a mug of ass whoop, then i dont see an issue with that. i would allow my player to do that if they chose to.
in history they actually had all of these weapons that were adapted from farm toolsinto actual wartime weapons that were cheap to produce, mainly used for militias. so i dont think you can label these as farm tools, since they were modified for killing animals(human).Actually, Pathfinder has several weaponized tools. Shovel may not be so far fetched.
Farm implements: sickle, scythe, flail, pitchfork (as military fork).
Mining: pick.
Animal handling: lasso, whip.Several eastern weapons fall into the weaponized tool category as well, if I recall.
I don't think the sickle and scythe were altered to be used as a weapon; their natural shapes and functions as cutting tools made them effective as is. Point on the flail and pitchfork - alterations were needed to make them effective weapons of war.
Which does support the chain of thought of making an enchanted battle shovel...
Wonder what other inspirations await among tools - trowel of stabbing? Plumber's snake of doom? :-)
Most Japanese weapons used by Ninja were Farm Tools.
I think a Sap would fit a Mug better...
screw the rules, if I'm in any home game, this is totally going to be fair game.
Now where's my +1 Earth Bane Shovel? I need it for digging.
Would that be the same shovel I just used against a Earth Elemental?
Would that be the same shovel I just used against a Earth Elemental?
I have to say that I love the visual of attacking an earth elemental with a shovel.
The shovel is a very effective weapon, like when I took out a bunch of Cassanova Frankenstein's disco goons.
(My scene starts at 0:40)
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Oddly enough, rules for a weaponized mug called the War Mug of the Ogre Magi were published in Dragon Magazine. They were also reprinted in the Dragon Compendium.
The War Mug of the Ogre Magi is a large, heavy mug about the size a fish bowl that never spills and can be wielded by any character as a +2 simple weapon that does 1d6+2 damage.
The only enchanted shovel I recall is the Spade of Colossal Excavation, which let you quickly dig massive holes, but there is a precedent for enchanted tool/weapons in Pathfinder. Both the Maul and Mattock of the Titans are tools that can be used as weapons.
Aside from the weapon enchanting rules, I suspect the only reason weaponized mugs and shovels aren't common is because there haven't been many subimissions for publication of those items. In Golarion, I could totally see a cleric of Cayden Cailean, swinging a Blessed Mug of the Lucky Drunk using the rules for the War Mug of the Ogre Magi or some other enchantment. It would just take somebody putting the item into a book or a player working with their GM to make the item. In either case, I would suggest both Craft Wondrous Item and Craft Magic Arms and Armor be required to enchant a shovel or mug for combat.
Would that be the same shovel I just used against a Earth Elemental?I have to say that I love the visual of attacking an earth elemental with a shovel.
So do I... So do I... I am currently stating up a Combat Shovel. I just can't decide on Damage Dice. I'm thinking 1d4(s) & 1d6(m).
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Something I just remembered...
Anyone familiar with the Ultima series of computer RPGs? Ultima VII featured a weapon called the Hoe of Destruction that was the second or third strongest weapon in the game.
The story behind the hoe was that a farmer hired a wizard to enchant the gardening implement to enhance its digging ability. The wizard mixed up the farmer's order with another contract to enchant a warrior's sword with deadly power and ended up handing the warrior a sword capable of cutting through the toughest roots and dirt while the farmer got a hoe capable of cleaving through plate armor with ease. The angry warrior beat the wizard to death with his sword of gardening and stormed off while the farmer went back to his field. Finding the hoe pretty much useless for digging, the farmer locked it into a tool shed and lost the key while fishing. If the player could find the key, (which had been swallowed by a fish near the farmer's cabin,) he could get into the shed to obtain the hoe.
I love it!
Having checked the equipment section, I see nothing preventing you from making masterwork improvised weapons.
Masterwork Weapons
A masterwork weapon is a finely crafted version of a normal weapon. Wielding it provides a +1 enhancement bonus on attack rolls.
You can't add the masterwork quality to a weapon after it is created; it must be crafted as a masterwork weapon (see the Craft skill). The masterwork quality adds 300 gp to the cost of a normal weapon (or 6 gp to the cost of a single unit of ammunition). Adding the masterwork quality to a double weapon costs twice the normal increase (+600 gp).
Masterwork ammunition is damaged (effectively destroyed) when used. The enhancement bonus of masterwork ammunition does not stack with any enhancement bonus of the projectile weapon firing it.
All magic weapons are automatically considered to be of masterwork quality. The enhancement bonus granted by the masterwork quality doesn't stack with the enhancement bonus provided by the weapon's magic.
Even though some types of armor and shields can be used as weapons, you can't create a masterwork version of such an item that confers an enhancement bonus on attack rolls. Instead, masterwork armor and shields have lessened armor check penalties.
Improvised Weapons: Sometimes objects not crafted to be weapons nonetheless see use in combat. Because such objects are not designed for this use, any creature that uses an improvised weapon in combat is considered to be nonproficient with it and takes a –4 penalty on attack rolls made with that object. To determine the size category and appropriate damage for an improvised weapon, compare its relative size and damage potential to the weapon list to find a reasonable match. An improvised weapon scores a threat on a natural roll of 20 and deals double damage on a critical hit. An improvised thrown weapon has a range increment of 10 feet.
Seems to me that you can make a masterwork improvised weapon using the same rules that you do any other masterwork weapon. Not surprising as a large number of the normal weapons are in fact farm implements (a D&D scythe is not a war-scythe, kamas and sickles are farming tools, etc). As best as I can tell if you want a magical +1 mug, then it's a mug worth 2,300 gp deals about 1d4+1 damage and is fairly useless to anyone who lacks the Catch Off Guard feat.