|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
No, this thread was set up to a be a positive place for people to come and discuss LGBT issues without feeling attacked. As Jessica pointed out, Pixie Dust's posts did not fit that topic, and so was asked to take the biological imperative discussion elsewhere. I am immensely grateful. I do not post here very often, but when I do, it is with an expectaction of safety and positivity in mind.
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Oh and for those who are saying "it is not learned it is genetic! Biologists have a theroy showing it!" while that may be true it is not entirely true...
It is ALSO a learned trait as well... There are numerous physchological tests that show a person can LEARN to become homosexual.
Please by all means, provide citations from peer reviewed sources in the scientific literature. But you're making a claim that flies in the face of the current scientific consensus built upon decades of research in humans and even other species.
On human sexuality, to quote Swaab (2004), "nor is there scientific support for the idea that homosexuality has a psychoanalytical or other psychological or social learning explanations, or that it would be a 'lifestyle choice'."
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Oh and for those who are saying "it is not learned it is genetic! Biologists have a theroy showing it!" while that may be true it is not entirely true...
It is ALSO a learned trait as well... There are numerous physchological tests that show a person can LEARN to become homosexual.
Please by all means, provide citations from peer reviewed sources in the scientific literature. But you're making a claim that flies in the face of the current scientific consensus built upon decades of research in humans and even other species.
On human sexuality, to quote Swaab (2004), "nor is there scientific support for the idea that homosexuality has a psychoanalytical or other psychological or social learning explanations, or that it would be a 'lifestyle choice'."
agreed. I would need some serious evidence here.
Returning to the earlier and all-important topic of jelly beans...
Yes, Herman Rowland Sr, the chairman of the board of Jelly Belly candies did donate $5000 last year to the effort to repeal California's law protecting trans students' rights.
Many LGBT groups are pushing to boycot Jelly Belly candies in an effort to get the board to oust this guy. I have mixed feeling about this.
1) This was a private donation by an individual, NOT the corporate will of Jelly Belly Candies, Inc. (Granted, it is the action of the company's chairman, but it's still not an action by the company.)
2) As much as I hate to say it, I'm not a fan of trying to punish a whole company in order to influence the personal political ideology of one or more of its executives.
3) That said, Jelly Belly Candies is a private, family-owned company, and Rowland is a direct descendant of the founder. So they probably won't be ousting him anyway.
So I'm torn.
I guess, on the plus side, while there are a flavor or two of Jelly Belly beans that I think are kind of OK, I'm not a fan of jelly beans. I pretty much only buy them once a year for my kid's Easter basket. And she's pretty much outgrown that anyway. So, even if I did choose to boycot Jelly Belly, they'd only lose about $10 from me a year...
And I've been boycotting Cracker Barrel for years over their documented pattern of racial discrimination.
I can't imagine boycotting Jelly Bellies...
I DEVOUR them... and swedish fish... and flaming hot munchies (those things are JUST AMAZING!!!!)
Returning to the earlier and all-important topic of jelly beans...
Yes, Herman Rowland Sr, the chairman of the board of Jelly Belly candies did donate $5000 last year to the effort to repeal California's law protecting trans students' rights.
Many LGBT groups are pushing to boycot Jelly Belly candies in an effort to get the board to oust this guy. I have mixed feeling about this.
1) This was a private donation by an individual, NOT the corporate will of Jelly Belly Candies, Inc. (Granted, it is the action of the company's chairman, but it's still not an action by the company.)
2) As much as I hate to say it, I'm not a fan of trying to punish a whole company in order to influence the personal political ideology of one or more of its executives.
3) That said, Jelly Belly Candies is a private, family-owned company, and Rowland is a direct descendant of the founder. So they probably won't be ousting him anyway.
So I'm torn.
I guess, on the plus side, while there are a flavor or two of Jelly Belly beans that I think are kind of OK, I'm not a fan of jelly beans. I pretty much only buy them once a year for my kid's Easter basket. And she's pretty much outgrown that anyway. So, even if I did choose to boycot Jelly Belly, they'd only lose about $10 from me a year...
And I've been boycotting Cracker Barrel for years over their documented pattern of racial discrimination.
this flies in the face of my knowledge of cracker barrel standing up to segregation in the 50s. Where is this information coming from?
If you don't mind the small batch sizes, those Green Beans I pointed at up-thread are pretty good and I have yet to find anything objectionable about their creator company.
So can someone please for my reference enlighten me. I have full support and sympathy for trans folks. But i would like to here some of things you folks have had to deal with in the gaming community. Especially everyday stuff.
I can start with my experience as a non effeminate gay male. It becomes very awkward with a new gaming group and even just day to day life. No one expects me to be gay. They don't see any of the stereotypical signs. And because of very prevalent heterosexism, I find I have to come out of the closet a lot. As a matter of course while at work, if it comes up I say I have a "spouse". I do this because I find work a mostly inappropriate place to discuss my personal life, and I try to never do it outside of breaks or with customers. But with every new employee, and eventually regular customers, I have to come out again. They refer to my wife "my wedding ring is visible" and I have to correct them. And it always seems super awkward, but never hostile. But I just wish the awkwardness would go away.....
That is my struggle in every day life and in Gaming circles. Anyone else wish to continue and get it off their chest?
All this talk of Jelly Belly (though I haven't really skimmed the last thousand or so posts) is making me hungry. Damn you all! Where's my pocky!?
So can someone please for my reference enlighten me. I have full support and sympathy for trans folks. But i would like to here some of things you folks have had to deal with in the gaming community. Especially everyday stuff.
I can start with my experience as a non effeminate gay male. It becomes very awkward with a new gaming group and even just day to day life. No one expects me to be gay. They don't see any of the stereotypical signs. And because of very prevalent heterosexism, I find I have to come out of the closet a lot. As a matter of course while at work, if it comes up I say I have a "spouse". I do this because I find work a mostly inappropriate place to discuss my personal life, and I try to never do it outside of breaks or with customers. But with every new employee, and eventually regular customers, I have to come out again. They refer to my wife "my wedding ring is visible" and I have to correct them. And it always seems super awkward, but never hostile. But I just wish the awkwardness would go away.....
That is my struggle in every day life and in Gaming circles. Anyone else wish to continue and get it off their chest?
Eh... I've had less issue these days than I did a while ago. Then again, I live in California, and most people here were pretty cool.
Most recent gripe I've got is the fact I seem to have had to constantly "out" my characters (and thus myself) in my last group. Just because I've got a wonderful woman for a fiance does not mean I do not like myself some boy-candy. (note: boy as in male, not boy as in 'young male'. Southern family, picked up some of the vernacular.)You'd think referring to Seltyiel as sexy several times would have been hint enough. Naturally, after that, the "bear" jokes started to trickle in, considering the annoying amount of body hair I've got. They were humorous for the first few weeks, then they got annoying.
Biggest issue I've ever had with it though, wasn't so much TTRPG circles, by my inner-circle of friends I'd known since I was 5. Long story short, one insisted on "saving my eternal soul and turning me from Satan's path", while the other was so homophobic, if someone even just brushed up against him accidentally while sitting in the tight-circle we had to in order to blow $#!& up on our FPS games, he'd spring up, throw his controller into the air, and scream "DUDE! GAY!". Something about the fear of 'catching it' and that all 'gay dudes wanna do is jump the closest guy-hole'. Suffice it to say, friend A let it slip to friend B, and the whole thing kind of imploded. Despite us growing up together, I pretty much lost my entire circle of friends cause of that. Fortunately, I moved not long after.
Well.. Biggest issue was that, and the whole... Nazi skin head beating thing. But that one's not gaming related.
Can say that I had one GM have my characters get periodically anally raped a few years ago after he found out. After the third time (first two I decided to roll with, and turned out pretty good story with it), I never went back. I later overheard him remarking to someone else "I thought he'd enjoy it."
Currently, my gaming circles are pretty cool. One my fiance and I were tertiary members of (before we couldn't afford to regularly attend our FLGS anymore) were pretty awesome, in an "Cool, whatever, here's some cute guy NPCs for you to hit on too" kind of way. My current group consists of myself, my fiance, and a friend of ours over the net, so, it aint that big a deal.
Contributor
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
So can someone please for my reference enlighten me. I have full support and sympathy for trans folks. But i would like to here some of things you folks have had to deal with in the gaming community. Especially everyday stuff.
I can start with my experience as a non effeminate gay male. It becomes very awkward with a new gaming group and even just day to day life. No one expects me to be gay. They don't see any of the stereotypical signs. And because of very prevalent heterosexism, I find I have to come out of the closet a lot. As a matter of course while at work, if it comes up I say I have a "spouse". I do this because I find work a mostly inappropriate place to discuss my personal life, and I try to never do it outside of breaks or with customers. But with every new employee, and eventually regular customers, I have to come out again. They refer to my wife "my wedding ring is visible" and I have to correct them. And it always seems super awkward, but never hostile. But I just wish the awkwardness would go away.....
That is my struggle in every day life and in Gaming circles. Anyone else wish to continue and get it off their chest?
It depends on whether or not I'm read as a trans woman. Back before hormone therapy, when I had trouble passing, I had to deal with stares and exclusion from a lot of public games, and endured a lot of giggles and angry glares at the game store (this was back in the south). It was stressful enough that I only gamed with my friends; I wouldn't do store games (or wouldn't come back to them) or cons.
Once I started hormones, people just took me for a tall cis woman, and while I've had to deal with plain-old-misogyny, the most frustrating thing I have to deal with are people I game with or otherwise like making crappy trans jokes right in front of me, not knowing I was the kind of person they were tell horrible jokes about. It makes it hard to like gaming with someone after they do that. If it gets bad, depending on whether I feel comfortable being out with a group or not, I usually either leave or tear into someone; either way I'm done with that group.
So can someone please for my reference enlighten me. I have full support and sympathy for trans folks. But i would like to here some of things you folks have had to deal with in the gaming community. Especially everyday stuff.
I can start with my experience as a non effeminate gay male. It becomes very awkward with a new gaming group and even just day to day life. No one expects me to be gay. They don't see any of the stereotypical signs. And because of very prevalent heterosexism, I find I have to come out of the closet a lot. As a matter of course while at work, if it comes up I say I have a "spouse". I do this because I find work a mostly inappropriate place to discuss my personal life, and I try to never do it outside of breaks or with customers. But with every new employee, and eventually regular customers, I have to come out again. They refer to my wife "my wedding ring is visible" and I have to correct them. And it always seems super awkward, but never hostile. But I just wish the awkwardness would go away.....
That is my struggle in every day life and in Gaming circles. Anyone else wish to continue and get it off their chest?It depends on whether or not I'm read as a trans woman. Back before hormone therapy, when I had trouble passing, I had to deal with stares and exclusion from a lot of public games, and endured a lot of giggles and angry glares at the game store (this was back in the south). It was stressful enough that I only gamed with my friends; I wouldn't do store games (or wouldn't come back to them) or cons.
Once I started hormones, people just took me for a tall cis woman, and while I've had to deal with plain-old-misogyny, the most frustrating thing I have to deal with are people I game with or otherwise like making crappy trans jokes right in front of me, not knowing I was the kind of person they were tell horrible jokes about. It makes it hard to like gaming with someone after they do that. If it gets bad, depending on whether I feel...
Stereotype jokes are never a good thing. Granted, some can be humorous, that's only if they're not insulting, sadly, most of them are. 90% that, 10% how my body decided it was going to develop, is why I'm an ex transvestite. I will not give up my much-softer unmentionables though, far too comfortable.
Unfortunately, such humor seems to be the most common type in our hobby. Hell, how often are dwarves drunken scottish midgets with bad tempers and massive battle axes? Or elves being all tall, mysterious, beautiful to every other thing no matter what (my last group had this rule that Elves had +2 charisma when dealing with non-elves), and are Always Archers?
Still, I have to agree. Enduring horrible jokes gets disheartening after a while. I've nearly taken heads off for it (though it was likely the close-minded idiocy as much as the pompous gay jokes). Maybe I've become jaded, but I personally enjoy letting them have their fun, then letting them know about me. I get a perverse sense of almost sadistic glee from the shocked & embarrassed looks on their faces. I don't recommend it. Might be psychologically scarring to other people.
Shifty, must we be on opposite sides of every issue?!??!Because you choose to be arbitrarily contrary?
It's true, I look forward to the day when the subject becomes a non-subject in the way we don't feel the need to converse about whether the sky is blue, and indeed it becomes a general day to day non-issue where the notion of where one puts ones private parts and with whom raises no eyebrows nor interest, and indeed no one really cares apart from those who might be interested in joining in.
Wait... The sky is blue? I thought it was more of a sea-foam with some lavender mixed in.
Seriously though, I agree. It shouldn't be an issue, but it probably always will be for some. Of course, there are also the people who like to stir the pot and will /make/ an issue of it even when one doesn't actually exist. (Like my questioning the Sky being blue above)
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Good God, Artemis. :(
I'm getting a hug from Mikaze? Cool beans.
Anyways, I'm over pretty much most of my past stuff. That was all years ago. At least a decade for most of it. Only part that still annoys me is I went from my preferred slender (teens) to barrel-broad-viking-rawr (complete with hair, that seems to chug miracle gro). With a side order of extra ribs!
In recent years I've had less patience with ignorant close-minded morons. One reason I'm keeping myself mostly out of public until I can re-build my social skills and lengthen my fuse, lol.
Thnx for the hug tho ^_^. First time I've been hugged by someone I'm not involved with, or when I'm not wearing a Free Hugs sign at a con.
It depends on whether or not I'm read as a trans woman. Back before hormone therapy, when I had trouble passing, I had to deal with stares and exclusion from a lot of public games, and endured a lot of giggles and angry glares at the game store (this was back in the south). It was stressful enough that I only gamed with my friends; I wouldn't do store games (or wouldn't come back to them) or cons.
Maybe it's because I live in California that I don't see this happen very often. I'm a regular attendee at Cons both in the capital and the Bay area and you see a lot of different people. I actually like to see the diversity and most of my friends wouldn't blink twice seeing a guy in a dress, let alone even notice if someone is a Transsexual. The feeling I have is, hey, if you want to wear a dress, go for it! It's none of my business. Then again, I had a good friend in high school who used to come to school in the summer in a gauzy skirt because it was more comfortable and it never bothered me. Maybe I'm just more open minded. If you ever get to a Bay Area SciFi or gaming Con, tho, I would recommend attending it and not being afraid of someone pointing you out for being different, because Bay Area California. Basically, if someone did harass you, they'd be jumped on by so many people it wouldn't be funny. That has been what I have always witnessed at least.
Thnx for the hug tho ^_^. First time I've been hugged by someone I'm not involved with, or when I'm not wearing a Free Hugs sign at a con.
That's funny. I don't remember the last time I had a hug with someone I was involved with or when I was wearing a free hugs sign (never worn one). :)
So is there room in this group for Asexual as well as LGBT?
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Sky is actually not blue if you want to get technical xD.
The sky is black, the blue is simply coming from light refracting off dust particles in the air if memory serves right.
Sky is actually not blue if you want to get technical xD.
The sky is black, the blue is simply coming from light refracting off dust particles in the air if memory serves right.
Fine, get all sciencey on me :)
I couldn't tell one dust particle from another, but I could give you the HTML tag for sky blue. LOL
But back to being serious. Does anyone know someone (besides me, although most of you don't know me) who is asexual? I haven't met anyone else. I mean, I'm definitely female, and I like seeing good looking guys and girls, but the thought of anything more than a hug or a kiss completely disinterests me and half the time people don't believe me. Does anyone else know someone like that?
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Actually the sky is currently kind of whitish or grey, depending on which bits I look at.Sky is actually not blue if you want to get technical xD.
The sky is black, the blue is simply coming from light refracting off dust particles in the air if memory serves right.
Lol Washington I take it?
But back to being serious. Does anyone know someone (besides me, although most of you don't know me) who is asexual? I haven't met anyone else. I mean, I'm definitely female, and I like seeing good looking guys and girls, but the thought of anything more than a hug or a kiss completely disinterests me and half the time people don't believe me. Does anyone else know someone like that?
I have a friend who is asexual, and I think BigNorseWolf on these boards has mentioned he is, though I don't know him personally.
@Liranys: Yeah, I have a friend who is asexual. It was a little hard to believe at first since he makes so many dirty jokes and hangs around with some pretty overly sexual people, but I guess there's no reason for them to be any less crude or to hang around with us just because we're a bunch of perverts.
Yuugasa,
Thanks. I've heard about others that felt similarly, but I've never met anyone and I kind of want to.
@Liranys: Yeah, I have a friend who is asexual. It was a little hard to believe at first since he makes so many dirty jokes and hangs around with some pretty overly sexual people, but I guess there's no reason for them to be any less crude or to hang around with us just because we're a bunch of perverts.
Yeah, that is totally me. I'm a bit of a flirt too, but I only flirt with people who already know I'm completely harmless and don't want to do anything /other/ than flirt. I like people, I'm just not interested in any real intimacy. If that makes sense.
Kind of reminds me of my bf...
He really isn't sex or anything, he likes me for my personality and such.
Pixie,
I want to find someone like that. Companionship is important, but I don't want intimacy.
| 3 people marked this as a favorite. |
But back to being serious. Does anyone know someone (besides me, although most of you don't know me) who is asexual?
Yes, I do.
I do think it's important to remember that in striving to be inclusive of various sexualities, we should be just as accepting of those that don't identify on any particular spectrum—and that's okay too. :)
lol yeah,
normally it would create a problem because I am a very.. intimate person.. (most would call me a nympho but meh, I just like to have fun).
Luckily my bf understands and is actually pretty chill with me fooling around if you will, since he knows that in the end I will always cuddle up to him and rest my head on his lap :)
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
That sounds like the perfect relationship to me. :P lol
I'm good for emotional needs. :)
Lilith,
Thanks. That means a lot.
Artemis, mikaze hugs are a natural panacea.
I'm damn sorry you had to deal with skinheads.
While I know and work with several trans folks, I know of noone who is asexual. If they are they have not shared the information with me.
But back to being serious. Does anyone know someone (besides me, although most of you don't know me) who is asexual? I haven't met anyone else. I mean, I'm definitely female, and I like seeing good looking guys and girls, but the thought of anything more than a hug or a kiss completely disinterests me and half the time people don't believe me. Does anyone else know someone like that?
I am pretty sure that there are a few asexual posters here - I think some of them explicitly stated that in this and a few other threads.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Well, I know I am a sexual poster at least. :B
Drejk
Good to know, I'll have to hunt this thread for them, but I'm still working my way through it. :P It's LONG.
Drejk
Good to know, I'll have to hunt this thread for them, but I'm still working my way through it. :P It's LONG.
I think I reread it twice since we started, omitting some more annoying parts. Sometimes I miss atmosphere that we reached at a few points between intrusions from less than supporting people.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
"That's so gay." Is a phrase I use myself sometimes, meaning "That's so lame."
Recently I've been switching up my pejorative phrases based on the group I'm in. When a liberal friend of mine recently did something really lame I told him. "That's so Republican!" =p
That, is hilarious.
I think I reread it twice since we started, omitting some more annoying parts. Sometimes I miss atmosphere that we reached at a few points between intrusions from less than supporting people.Drejk
Good to know, I'll have to hunt this thread for them, but I'm still working my way through it. :P It's LONG.
I regret not being around in the old days of this thread, there were some arguments occasionally, but mostly it seemed to have a really celebratory tone, like a big pride party with music and everything=)
I regret not being around in the old days of this thread, there were some arguments occasionally, but mostly it seemed to have a really celebratory tone, like a big pride party with music and everything=)I think I reread it twice since we started, omitting some more annoying parts. Sometimes I miss atmosphere that we reached at a few points between intrusions from less than supporting people.Drejk
Good to know, I'll have to hunt this thread for them, but I'm still working my way through it. :P It's LONG.
Ye Goode Olde Days Of Yore... When the sun was brighter, grass greener, women (and men) prettier, when we were young and all... :P
Sadly you cannot has the cake though...
GlaDOS beat you to it...
It was so moist...
I may get through this thread someday, but I think I'll hang out at the end for now. lol
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Every time i hear the word Moist now, I have Going Postal flashbacks (Terry Pratchett)...
lulz nice xD