Boreal Melee Sorcerer?


Advice


I know, I could just make a barbarian, but whats the fun in that?

Am looking at the Boreal Bloodline for a sorcerer, and am wondering if it would be possible to make a melee focused character. I was thinking of being a Half-Orc for the greataxe proficiency, as the description of the bloodline makes me think of some powerful viking awakening in a young sorcerer. And powerful vikings don't use light blades.

"Descended from inhabitants of the lands of ice and snow, you count among your ancestors giant-kin, troll-born, and frost-rimed spirits. Their savage and raw energies flow down through generations to infuse you to the marrow with the chill of the polar wind, crackling auroras, and the long winter’s night."

For the 2 games I have coming up to play in, I have a 15 points to spend on ability scores.

Any suggestions?


If you go into melee with 1/2, and low AC you will either be ignored or killed unless the GM decides to go easy on you.

Now that my naysaying is out of the way.

str 14 (5)
dex 10
con 14 (5)
int 10
wis 8 (-2)
cha 15 (7)

Put the extra 2 from being a half-orc, human, or half-elf into strength.

1. Power Attack
1. Toughness(you will need a lot of HP if you draw attention to yourself since you won't always have time to put up buff spells.

edit:The above choices assume you chose a human.

Sovereign Court

No Power Attack with 0BAB


I would really strongly not recommend it, especially on a 15 point buy.


Fozbek wrote:
I would really strongly not recommend it, especially on a 15 point buy.

I would not reccomend it with a 25 point buy. Well maybe if the game stays at a low level, but it is not something that works in even a midlevel game.


Mad Alchemist wrote:
No Power Attack with 0BAB

True. I had forgotten about that.

Shadow Lodge

If you are absolutly set on this path then I'd go for the Dragon Deciple prestige class and say you're descended from a white dragon, then you'll be competent in melee and it will help with the, IHMO, stingy 15 point buy.

EDIT *if you really need the boreal bloodline you can always go dual bloodline or take the eldritch heritage line of feats*


You could also go the route of using the Eldritch Heritage line of feats to grab some of the bloodline abilities, but using them on a melee chasis. You get a more effective melee character and the sorcerer bloodline flavour.


The fun in being a barbarian is being decently effective, so that you don't instantly die. You just want the powers, not the spells.

First off, ask for 20 points.

Str 16
Cha 13
Con 12
Rest 10.

Half Elf.

Be a barbarian.

Take Skill Focus (Survival) with your free skill focus.
Take Toughness.

At third level, take Eldritch Heritage (Boreal).

And...done.

Alternative:
Play a Waves Oracle.
Str 14
Cha 14
Con 12
Dex 12
Rest 10.

Place +2 into Strength.

Get a greataxe,

Take Ice Armor or Water Sight.

Buff up and smack stuff.

Both offer the same exact flavor, but won't die due to a goblin's sneeze :)


Cheapy wrote:

The fun in being a barbarian is being decently effective, so that you don't instantly die. You just want the powers, not the spells.

First off, ask for 20 points.

Str 16
Cha 13
Con 12
Rest 10.

Half Elf.

Be a barbarian.

Take Skill Focus (Survival) with your free skill focus.
Take Toughness.

At third level, take Eldritch Heritage (Boreal).

And...done.

Alternative:
Play a Waves Oracle.
Str 14
Cha 14
Con 12
Dex 12
Rest 10.

Place +2 into Strength.

Get a greataxe,

Take Ice Armor or Water Sight.

Buff up and smack stuff.

Both offer the same exact flavor, but won't die due to a goblin's sneeze :)

Cheapy is always helpful, thank you!


Pleasure to be of assistance.

Do note that I'm partial to the barbarian version. Put the +2 from Half-elf into Strength, of course.

You can grab the Elemental Totem (cold) and elemental resistance (cold) rage powers to channel the frozen wastes.


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Ayrphish wrote:

I know, I could just make a barbarian, but whats the fun in that?

Am looking at the Boreal Bloodline for a sorcerer, and am wondering if it would be possible to make a melee focused character. I was thinking of being a Half-Orc for the greataxe proficiency, as the description of the bloodline makes me think of some powerful viking awakening in a young sorcerer. And powerful vikings don't use light blades.

"Descended from inhabitants of the lands of ice and snow, you count among your ancestors giant-kin, troll-born, and frost-rimed spirits. Their savage and raw energies flow down through generations to infuse you to the marrow with the chill of the polar wind, crackling auroras, and the long winter’s night."

For the 2 games I have coming up to play in, I have a 15 points to spend on ability scores.

Any suggestions?

Half-Orc Sorcerer (Boreal) 1

16 Str (+2 race), 12 Dex, 13 Con, 10 Int, 8 Wis, 15 Cha
Favored Class Bonus to hp
Skills: Spellcraft 1 (+4), Use Magic Device 1 (+6)
Feats: Ironhide
Spells Known: detect magic, ray of frost, read magic, touch of fatigue (re-flavored to be lowering body temperature); grease (re-flavored to be a coating of ice), mage armor

Starts with 12 AC (16 AC with mage armor), 8 hp, and +3 on melee attacks. Not great, but decent. For future advancement, you might want to consider a level of fighter and then going eldritch knight (the Magical Knack trait is pretty much a must have in this case).

Crossblooded boreal/draconic (white) and then dragon disciple (as mentioned), is also a possibility.


Sorcerer only:
Party composition will be very important.
If you have THE melee role, this won't work. (w/o DM's kindness or Barb 1/EK X)
If you are support in a 5-6 PC group, you should do just fine (and the others should appreciate your buffs/tricks).
With low BAB & h.p., you need more boosts, and more AC, and Str is even more important than to a normal melee character.
Str 16 (w/ racial) Dex 14 Con 14 Int 7 Wis 9 Cha 14 (Half-Orc)
Sorcerer's have nice skills, but...
(Alter if Human)

Longspear/Combat Reflexes is I think your best route to start.
Enlarge Person (w/longspear or greataxe) is really nice w/ a 16 Str character (goes to 18 for 2d6/2d8+6) which works fine, and lets you hit first, maybe from behind a meat-shield.
Also nice that you can't get swamped in surprise round w/o getting in some attacks.

Feats:
Combat Reflexes
Toughness (bloodline bonus, but take earlier)
Arcane Strike (also bloodline bonus, take at 7th) This allows for chunks of extra damage w/ Polymorph if you're DM allows w/ natural attacks. Still good otherwise.
Extend Spell (for all those buffs you want to layer on)
Leadership (if allowed). You have the buffs, so get melee ally. Paladin (for auras/shared smite) or Sword/Board Fighter. Maybe even w/ Bodyguard Feats/Stalwart Defender to take hits for you or Teamwork Feats.

Consider:
Spring Attack line (especially w/ some mobile-flying/high-single-attack polymorph shapes or Exp. Retreat)
Teleport Attack chain (w/ Dim Door later) in Ult. Magic
Vital Strike (because your iterative attacks are really low, and w/ standard actions you can be more mobile) Not until 13th though...and only if you like Enlarge/Giant Form/big weapons.
Brew Potion (IF you like Transformation, very expensive component.)

Beware:
Ironhide: Dodge is better, and w/ Polymorph, I think you lose your own natural AC.
Eldritch Heritage: Yes, best feats for CHA character, but give you breadth and options (which you won't lack).

Spells: Focus on buffs, defenses (because you are playing 'catch up'), w/ a token attack/battlefield control every 2 or so levels for variety/flavor. The Polymorph line of spells can keep you competitive (a.k.a. alive), and the multiple primary attacks will make up for lack of iterative attacks.
By 9th level, when you can see through fog, etc., have a few options to throw out for: entering combat, retreating, stalling. Choices depend on party abilities.
Grease w/ longspear to hit humanoids across 5' greasy gap works fine.
Beware: True Strike, as 1 attack/2 rounds is not enough contribution. At higher levels when you hit only every 2 rounds, maybe.

(Not listing all spells you should take, just spells to make the core build function as 'barbarian')
1st level: Enlarge Person first (swap out at 4th after it's a bonus spell)
Mage Armor (swap for wand later?), Grease
2nd level: Alter Self. Physical buffs. False Life first.
3rd level: Extended self-buffs. (Then use 2nd level slots for Resist/party buffs). Blink over Displacement. (Oddly, you get Rage before you can cast it...errata?) No suggestion for first.
4th level: Polymorph, Dim. Door, Stoneskin first(expensive, but 80+h.p. on a 40 h.p. character is pretty important.)
With this core set, you should be able to survive, and then you can branch out your spell options.

You should be able to thrive at early levels when Str./Enlarge shines. It'll get deadly once Ogres hit the field, but w/ False Life & positioning, you should survive. When bad-ass grapplers hit the field, you'll need that Stoneskin to live.
I think the most difficult part of playing this is remembering you are not the viking you play.

Also consider:
Boreal (Eldritch Heritage) Summoner w/ Valkyrie Eidolon.
Archer Elf (w/ "Cold Steel" on arrows)


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Castilliano wrote:

Beware:

Ironhide: Dodge is better, and w/ Polymorph, I think you lose your own natural AC.

The problem I have with Dodge for a melee arcanist is that, unless you have a 15+ Dex, you lose the benefit when under the effect of enlarge person (-2 Dex). Combat Reflexes is in a similar boat: a 14-15 Dex gives you only one additional AoO when enlarged (effective 12-13 Dex).

As for Ironhide vs. the polymorph spells (i.e., giant form), the first one that grants a natural armor bonus is beast shape I (3rd-level spell); giant form I is a 7th-level spell. It's like turning down a ring of protection +1 because you will eventually be able to cast protection from evil.

Also, don't forget the combat arcanist's best two spells: haste and heroism.


Try something like this:

Barbarian 1
Sorcerer 9
Eldritch Knight 10

BAB = 15 (Medium)
Caster Level = 18 (Level 9 spells)
Sorcerer Level: 9 (Many benefits)
Barbarian Rage

The reason I suggest taking the PrC Eldritch Knight is because you need to keep your BAB up and max your spellcasting ability for buffs.

You keep a lot of your abilities. Should you want to wear armor, You can get braces of armor later on, and wear Robes of Arcane Heritage for an extra +4 boost to your sorcerer level for the purpose of abilities.

Also, because of the sorcerer side, you can still learn spells as you level, unlike wizards who have to learn them themselves.

If you take the Magical Knack trait, you can make your caster level for the purpose of the effect of your spells = your character level to not fall behind as far as spell duration/power are concerned.

With this build you can have decent BAB, spells for buffs, many of your sorcerer powers, pretty good hit dice (12+10d6+10d10), and proficiency with whatever weapon you want.

Depending on how much you care about spells though, you can follow the earlier recommendation and just go barbarian with appropriate sorcerer powers of course. I like more spellcasting because that way you can buff yourself with stuff like Bull's Strength, Overland Flight, Haste, etc

also, when I tried making a melee sorcerer, I chose the Verdant Bloodline for Barkskin as a bonus spell (More AC!) and the arcana that boosted my natural armor whenever I cast a personal spell (Even more AC!). The ability to only need 2 hours of sleep and require no food to live was nice gravy too :D


Dragonchess Player wrote:
Castilliano wrote:

Beware:

Ironhide: Dodge is better, and w/ Polymorph, I think you lose your own natural AC.

The problem I have with Dodge for a melee arcanist is that, unless you have a 15+ Dex, you lose the benefit when under the effect of enlarge person (-2 Dex). Combat Reflexes is in a similar boat: a 14-15 Dex gives you only one additional AoO when enlarged (effective 12-13 Dex).

As for Ironhide vs. the polymorph spells (i.e., giant form), the first one that grants a natural armor bonus is beast shape I (3rd-level spell); giant form I is a 7th-level spell. It's like turning down a ring of protection +1 because you will eventually be able to cast protection from evil.

Also, don't forget the combat arcanist's best two spells: haste and heroism.

Yes, Haste. I went to bed thinking "Why didn't I write 'Haste'?"

Game-changer. Definite first spell for 3rd.

As for Ironhide, I love the feat. I just think the build can't afford it, and it's of less value when his AC's so low and he'll get natural AC elsewhere. If one could swap it out, sure, but he can't.
It's more like trading the +1 Ring for a +1 Weapon (not dropped for nothing), knowing you'll get the +1 defense later.

As for Dodge, it's for if he does want AC. I wouldn't recommend it either unless going for a Spring Attack PC or he expects to be toe-to-toe more often than perhaps he can handle. (w/ the ability to see in fog/move on ice, SA could be neat, as long as the other PCs get to play too.)
Also, I didn't think people lost feats due to penalties (unlike in 3.5), and that he'd keep it while enlarged. Hmmm...

As for Combat Reflexes only giving one extra attack when enlarged, I think that's very important with a person who won't get a 2nd attack until 12th level, who can do significant damage, and who wants to stay mobile. (w/ EK, I might recommend differently, and worry about Dex less, giving more stat points elsewhere.)
It's a matter of taste, Ayrphish. None of these feats will be 'wrong' choices.
Also, some Polymorph forms grant Dex & size (Air/Fire Elemental Body III, level 6.) That may be too late in the game, depending on how many medium critters you're still fighting then.

Ayrphish, you may want to explore your spell choices before you choose your stats, to see what forms/buffs you'll be taking and how they mesh with your Str/Dex/Con to give you the Att./Dam./h.p./etc. you need.
You'll probably want to swap something every chance you get to keep upgrading your top Polymorph buff, and dropping the last.

If you do go EK, Giant Form is that much further away...I think go full Sorcerer. Crazy risky, but I think you'll appreciate the better buffed state over the better unbuffed state.
Just don't stand toe-to-toe. Let them come to you and your readied action. If they stay far away...well, you're the Sorcerer.

Also, if you face a lot of casters, get a Ring of Counterspell w/ Dispel Magic.

Thoughts?

JMK


Well, building as a Barbarian with the Eldritch Heritage feats would probably be one of the more effective ways to do this concept, but you asked for a Boreal Sorcerer, so that's what I'll try to work with. Here it goes.

Half orc, definitely. Strength will be your biggest stat, followed by Con, Dex, then Int, in my oppinion.

I would probably take the 3 lvl dip into monk with the Monastic Legacy feat to add 1/2 you lvl to your effective monk lvl for determining unarmed strike dmg and get a monks belt and amulet of mighty fists as soon as possible.

The other option for dmg is to specialize in the Falchion with improved critical, power attack, and take the vital strike tree and devastating strike.

Either way, though, you don't have great HP, so the spring attack tree is likely going to be a must. Get in, get out, don't #**% about.

I probably would go crossblooded Dragon Disciple for this build.

If you go the monk US route, I'd opt for the Silver/White Draconic bloodline and the Emperial bloodline. You loose spells, but you seem to want to me a more martial character anyway, so you'll still have access to decent buffs. Going this route would require you to take the Boreal bloodline powers via the Eldritch Heritage feats, but then you could minimize your reliance on Dex for armor and switch you Int requirement for spells to a Wis requirement, seriously reducing the number of stats you have to boost.

The bloodline powers I would choose between draconic and Emperial in this build would be the Claws, Draconic Resistances, Sacred Cistern (though it's not necessary the ability to channel energy is useful), Wings, and (if your campaign gets to a high enough lvl) Ascension for the improved resistances since you will be getting blindsense anyway. And you can still get all the Boreal powers except capstone ability (which is more of a handicap with the fire vulnerability anyways).

If you go with the 2h falchion DD build, though, I'd maintain the draconic/boreal bloodline combo. This will grant you better access to the feats you need to be effective and survive (Power Attack, Toughness, and Arcane Strike). The main issue here is that you must now choose between Claws (which is boosted by DD) or Cold Steel.

Past that, I'd still select Draconic resistances as the only thing you loose is special benefits to moving on ice, but for which you gain a decent natural AC. (Or you could be the uber controller using Sleet Storm and your Blizzard ability whilst spring attacking them to death. Your choice I guess.) I'd probably stick with the Boreal Snow Shroud and Blizzard abilities, especially if you plan on sticking out DD for the Breath Weapon and Wings abilities anyways. And I would most definitely select the Power of Wyrms capstone ability, as the vulnerability to fire from Child of Ancient Winters is too much of a drawback. Too many creatures use fire.

If you want to have more casting ability, I'd only take the first 4 lvls of DD, especially if you go with the Monk US dmg build. But I imagine that you want a good dip into a combat role, so I'd likely take the 2h falchion build and max out DD for all the stat boosts, which would mean that your Int wouldn't have to be boosted above 16 before the DD bump for you to get access to all your spells (which will still most likely reach lvl 8 spellcasting, if only just).

If your DM will allow you to "stretch" DD, I'd just continue in that path going Sorc 5, DD 15 for the better BAB and save progression. If not, you can either continue with Sorc (not a melee build option), or switch to Eldritch Knight (definite melee option, but losing the Bloodline capstone ability).

All-in-all, though I haven't written either of these up or done any real calculations, I'd say the 2h falchion build would win, though he'd likely want to take the Iron Will feat to compensate for the Will save penalty from being crossblooded (which the other build overcomes with the boost from being a monk and again with Still Mind). That build seems to (in my estimation, anyways), be a better spellcaster, has a slightly better BAB, can control the battlefield better with his bloodline powers, and can still flit in and out of the fray without taking as much dmg, assuming he has applied all his buffs as well.

Either way, I think I still counted some open feats that could be used to further optimize these builds.

Hopefully this will be of some use.

P.S. One of your favorite 8th lvl spells should definitely be Statue, if you ever get to that point. Look it up. It's sexy.

& don't forget that when it's active you count as an object for the purposes of being damaged by energy attacks (1/2 the dmg before applying hardness).


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Castilliano wrote:
Dragonchess Player wrote:
As for Ironhide vs. the polymorph spells (i.e., giant form), the first one that grants a natural armor bonus is beast shape I (3rd-level spell); giant form I is a 7th-level spell. It's like turning down a ring of protection +1 because you will eventually be able to cast protection from evil.

As for Ironhide, I love the feat. I just think the build can't afford it, and it's of less value when his AC's so low and he'll get natural AC elsewhere. If one could swap it out, sure, but he can't.

It's more like trading the +1 Ring for a +1 Weapon (not dropped for nothing), knowing you'll get the +1 defense later.

For a melee-focused sorcerer, AC is very important at the starting levels (there aren't many options to increase it); you don't have the luxury (IMO) to wait until 6th level (or higher). That's why I also recommended mage armor (1 hr/level duration) as one of the two 1st-level spells. With a 15-point buy especially, you don't have a lot of flexibility between needing a fairly high Str and a 15+ Cha; having AC 16, 1d12+4 damage, and two Skill Ranks/level is more likely survivable than having AC 14 (assuming mage armor and 14 Dex before enlarge person), 3d6+6 damage (when enlarged), and one Skill Rank/level. The point is to avoid being a glass cannon; you're more likely to reach higher levels by taking advantage of the minor bonuses early. I'd say pick up Combat Reflexes at 3rd level, when you'd gain enlarge person as a bonus spell* and you will probably have an amulet of natural armor +1 to help with AC; I agree that your first 2nd-level spell at 4th level should probably be false life.

*- Because of how bonus bloodline spells work, you should avoid learning the bonus spells before you get them as a bonus; you do not get a different spell known (or an extra "spell known slot") in place of the bonus (unless house-ruled), so you're effectively losing a spell.

The Exchange

Dragonchess Player wrote:
*- Because of how bonus bloodline spells work, you should avoid learning the bonus spells before you get them as a bonus; you do not get a different spell known (or an extra "spell known slot") in place of the bonus (unless house-ruled), so you're effectively losing a spell.

It's not quite that bad, since you can swap out the selected-but-now-duplicated-by-a-bloodline-spell spell on your next level (i.e. change the spell you originally selected, and leave the bloodline spell which duplicated it), but you're effectively one spell known down for a level... which is a pretty big deal for a Sorcerer... but can be worth it if the bloodline spell in question is good enough to want access to it earlier than the bloodline grants it as a bonus.


Wow, I had thought this was 'dead,' but it here it is with lots of great options for me to think about. Thanks a million everyone who is giving me ideas.


Cheapy wrote:

The fun in being a barbarian is being decently effective, so that you don't instantly die. You just want the powers, not the spells.

First off, ask for 20 points.

Str 16
Cha 13
Con 12
Rest 10.

Half Elf.

Be a barbarian.

Take Skill Focus (Survival) with your free skill focus.
Take Toughness.

At third level, take Eldritch Heritage (Boreal).

And...done.

Alternative:
Play a Waves Oracle.
Str 14
Cha 14
Con 12
Dex 12
Rest 10.

Place +2 into Strength.

Get a greataxe,

Take Ice Armor or Water Sight.

Buff up and smack stuff.

Both offer the same exact flavor, but won't die due to a goblin's sneeze :)

The ethnicities of the two for the barbarain mixed together in this would probably be snowcaster elf and an ulfen. That does seem like a good build cheapy.If you had 20 points with that build you might like to get con to 15 to get raging vitality somewhere.


Castilliano wrote:

Sorcerer only:

Party composition will be very important.
If you have THE melee role, this won't work. (w/o DM's kindness or Barb 1/EK X)
If you are support in a 5-6 PC group, you should do just fine (and the others should appreciate your buffs/tricks).
With low BAB & h.p., you need more boosts, and more AC, and Str is even more important than to a normal melee character.
Str 16 (w/ racial) Dex 14 Con 14 Int 7 Wis 9 Cha 14 (Half-Orc)
Sorcerer's have nice skills, but...
(Alter if Human)

Longspear/Combat Reflexes is I think your best route to start.
Enlarge Person (w/longspear or greataxe) is really nice w/ a 16 Str character (goes to 18 for 2d6/2d8+6) which works fine, and lets you hit first, maybe from behind a meat-shield.
Also nice that you can't get swamped in surprise round w/o getting in some attacks.

Feats:
Combat Reflexes
Toughness (bloodline bonus, but take earlier)
Arcane Strike (also bloodline bonus, take at 7th) This allows for chunks of extra damage w/ Polymorph if you're DM allows w/ natural attacks. Still good otherwise.
Extend Spell (for all those buffs you want to layer on)
Leadership (if allowed). You have the buffs, so get melee ally. Paladin (for auras/shared smite) or Sword/Board Fighter. Maybe even w/ Bodyguard Feats/Stalwart Defender to take hits for you or Teamwork Feats.

Consider:
Spring Attack line (especially w/ some mobile-flying/high-single-attack polymorph shapes or Exp. Retreat)
Teleport Attack chain (w/ Dim Door later) in Ult. Magic
Vital Strike (because your iterative attacks are really low, and w/ standard actions you can be more mobile) Not until 13th though...and only if you like Enlarge/Giant Form/big weapons.
Brew Potion (IF you like Transformation, very expensive component.)

Beware:
Ironhide: Dodge is better, and w/ Polymorph, I think you lose your own natural AC.
Eldritch Heritage: Yes, best feats for CHA character, but give you breadth and options (which you won't lack).

Spells: Focus on buffs, defenses (because you are playing...

Followed this pretty closely, half orc with a long spear, but I took toughness at first level instead of combat reflexes... get to play the character for the first time in about 20 minutes, and am looking forward to seeing how he does!


I'd take a 1 level of Barbarian off the start or fighter but Barbarian makes more sense for the background. Then Boreal sorcerer for 6 levels, dip into Eldrich Knight for 4 levels to pick up the BAB. This gets you a 15 BAB in the end at the cost of 2 caster levels. Pick up the cloak that adds 4 to your sorcerer level for blood lines powers.


Cheapy wrote:

Pleasure to be of assistance.

Do note that I'm partial to the barbarian version. Put the +2 from Half-elf into Strength, of course.

You can grab the Elemental Totem (cold) and elemental resistance (cold) rage powers to channel the frozen wastes.

I am not sure the getting 1d6 shock to damage for one round like you would at level 3 would be the most useful. I think it may be better if you get eldritch heritage at level 5 for that build as then in one level you get shock for two rounds. Of course this might not be as flavorful.


doctor_wu wrote:
Cheapy wrote:

Pleasure to be of assistance.

Do note that I'm partial to the barbarian version. Put the +2 from Half-elf into Strength, of course.

You can grab the Elemental Totem (cold) and elemental resistance (cold) rage powers to channel the frozen wastes.

I am not sure the getting 1d6 shock to damage for one round like you would at level 3 would be the most useful. I think it may be better if you get eldritch heritage at level 5 for that build as then in one level you get shock for two rounds. Of course this might not be as flavorful.

I never said it'd be useful, just that it'd help his character concept :)


I think it could be great fun with a sorceror melee build. My ideas require some good will from the DM, and will of course be a melee/caster hybrid, expanding on the sugestions above...:

Tiefling, with the options of demon spawn (+2 str , +2 cha,-2 int), and the option of a bite attack. If not allowed, human will work fine, for the extra spells option.

Overall idea is to build strength, and rely on natural attacks.

Sorcerer 1-5, Draconic.
Dragon Disciple 6-15
Sorceror 16-20

Traits: magical knack, reactionary

Some Feats (not in order):
Skill focus survival, eldritch heritage orc, improved heritage orc (str)
Improved natural attack (claws), Multiattack, Snatch
Quicken spell
Perhaps the pit-touched elsritch heritage line for con development

Str development:
Race: +2
ability increases: +5 @ lvl 20
Dragon Disciple: +4
Orc Bloodline: +6
Dragon Form 3 (lvl 8 sorc spell): +10
Enchantment item: +6

Total:+ 33, on top of your starting Str, which could be 15, giving a total of 48, which gives a bonus of 19. In dragon form 3 you would (assuming haste) have 4 primary and 3 secondary attaks. Your BAB will be lowish (12), but somewhat countered by having all your primaries at full attack bonus, and the secondaries at -2.

Edit: if enough feats, and taking pit touched, the prerequisites for eldrictch heitage: serpentine is fulfilled, adding poison to the bite attack.


... Hover + spell: tactical acumen can add +5 insight on to hit at lvl 20, when hovering ober the oponente...


I am beginning a campaign at level 1 as a human boreal sorcerer i put 16 in str and dex and took arcane strike and expanded arcana feats so at first level i have both mage armor and shield spells to boost my ac by 8, i figure i dont have to hit as hard with the weapon since it can be a frost weapon and i have the option of wading through enemies nd using touch spells


I'm currently playing a melee sorcerer, so let me tell you from personal experience, it can very easily be done. Not only is it a competitive build, the only PC in the group that can outdamage him is the fighter (archer). And he contributes far more to combat than just damage, so he's easily one of the most useful PC in the group. I did go dragon disciple, so it might be more difficult as Boreal which gives you very limited melee abilities.

However, if I can advise the feat/spell progression, let me say that you'll want to focus on strength more than charisma, and having a 16 dex is relatively worthless. Arcane Strike might be more useful, but think about making a charger build. As a caster, you can have access to a lot of powerful mounts via Summoning spells (even if your DM doesn't give you access to Leadership), so Spirited Charge is great, particularly with your lack of access to a lot of melee feats (it's the least feat-intensive damage build).

With a lower Charisma than a standard sorcerer, focus on buffs, debuffs and battlefield control (such as Walls). Summoning spells are great, not just for setting up flanking, but also to summon you flying mounts as soon as possible.

If you don't go with a Charger, I would still recommend stacking damage for a single attack, due to your horrendous BAB. Vital Strike (and it's derivatives) are an absolute must. You only want one attack, and you want it to be as effective as possible. Size altering buffs are great (Enlarge Person early on, Giant Form later in the game). Consider delving into Use Magic Device and stocking up on Cleric wands and scrolls (wand of righteous might ftw).

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