The new energy reistance model is too powerful in the hands of characters. Energy resistance spell is a 2nd level spell accessible to almost all classes. It ignores 10 points of damage from a energy type per attack, 20 points at 7th and 30 points 11th, and lasts 10min/level. The average energy resistance of monsters is 10.
At 11th-level it lasts about 2 hours, and fire effect, for example and negates dmage from wall of fire (4th-level spell), almost negates all damage from incendiary cloud (8th-level spell), fireball average damage (3rd-level spell). Its too powerful for a 2nd-level spell.
Anyone know if there are an errata or clarification for this spell?
Only that it's exactly the same as it has been.
"average energy resistance of a monster" is a non-starter -- try giving average energy resistance of each monster CR and then be sure to include the percentage of monsters with immunities.
battlebaby wrote: The new energy reistance model is too powerful in the hands of characters. Energy resistance spell is a 2nd level spell accessible to almost all classes. It ignores 10 points of damage from a energy type per attack, 20 points at 7th and 30 points 11th, and lasts 10min/level. The average energy resistance of monsters is 10.
At 11th-level it lasts about 2 hours, and fire effect, for example and negates dmage from wall of fire (4th-level spell), almost negates all damage from incendiary cloud (8th-level spell), fireball average damage (3rd-level spell). Its too powerful for a 2nd-level spell.
Anyone know if there are an errata or clarification for this spell?
At 11th level you should not be worrying about the 3rd level spells being tossed around at you - so it nearly negating fireball isn't actually a problem.
11th level is when 6th level spells are starting to be seen, and caster NPCs you are facing at that level are likely to be 12th to 14th level, so you may even be seeing 7th level spells flying your way - such as, to expand your example, a maximized & intensified fireball for 84 damage (54 after your energy resistance).
To summarize: there is no problem at all with the way Energy Resistance works, so long as the GM doesn't allow there to be.
...and your "math" for average energy resistance of monsters seems off to me, considering the monster with straight up immunity to some forms of damage.
I don't see an issue with it. It's only 30 points when you have CL of 11.
The wording does not seem to have changed from 3.0/3.5 to pathfinder.
It's very useful when you know what kind of energy you're going to need to resist, of course, but having one party member (usually one without a lot of hit points) take greatly reduced damage from a heavy-hitting energy source never struck me as 'unfair' or 'too powerful'. If they want to burn a ton of 2nd-level spell slots cold-proofing everybody, that's just good tactics if they're right about the enemy using cold. Of course, in some cases (such as entering a hellhound lair), your party is going to be pretty darn certain which energy type is involved.
If you're being frustrated by good guessing or predictable monsters, don't forget that dispel magic is a very, very common opening-round move for any creatures that have it, starting around 7th level. Also, certain energy-spewing creatures (dragons come to mind) know very well about the existence of this spell and will take spells to deliberately circumvent it. (One nasty and effective trick for red dragons is to take the "cold flames" version of fire shield.)
At least there's no more energy immunity... unless you're a word caster.
Zonto wrote: At least there's no more energy immunity... unless you're a word caster. Or you can access evolutions.
The main thing that keeps it balanced is that you must specify at the time of casting what element you are casting to be resistant to. At which point it counters nothing.
Which means that it is entirely possible for you to make your entire party resistant to cold, only to have the frost giant mage cast fireball on your party. Or the red dragon could cast chain lightning, or even better have been a blue dragon in disguise all along. Alternatively, you spend 4 level 2 spells protecting your party from the enemy wizard's ONE fireball, at which point he realises that your party is resistant to fire and uses cone of cold instead. Congratulations, he's just beaten you on spell economy, although you've potentially beaten him on action economy due to your foresight. Well done, but I see nothing 'broken' about it.
Basically, what it *potentially* does is reward research and scouting, which is a good thing in my books.
i have always thought the spell a bit to good for its 2nd lvl slot.
If i had made the spell it would have been 5-10-15 and not 10-20-30.
However its not really a big deal.
battlebaby wrote: The new energy reistance model is too powerful in the hands of characters. Energy resistance spell is a 2nd level spell accessible to almost all classes. It ignores 10 points of damage from a energy type per attack, 20 points at 7th and 30 points 11th, and lasts 10min/level. The average energy resistance of monsters is 10.
At 11th-level it lasts about 2 hours, and fire effect, for example and negates dmage from wall of fire (4th-level spell), almost negates all damage from incendiary cloud (8th-level spell), fireball average damage (3rd-level spell). Its too powerful for a 2nd-level spell.
Anyone know if there are an errata or clarification for this spell?
I don't see this.. but I accept its one of those YMMV situations.
I think that GM's tend to challenge PC's by making them think out of the box. When they get too comfortable with Plan A, for example, the GM is well within his means to toss some Plan A resistant encounter at the PC's and, usually, so long as its wisely woven into the story and not so obviously a middle finger type encounter, he'll be lauded for it. "Oh, look how he challenged his PC's."
Now, along comes a group of PC's with some tool they can use to deal with a specific energy type from time to time... they're basically doing it to the GM. "Yeah, Mr. GM, sir. That's right. We laugh at your will o wisp now! We cast Energy Resistance and amp it up to deal with them... pun DEFINITELY intended."
I pat them on the back! "Well played!!!"
Smart opponents will see their favored attacks aren't working and retreat. Smarter opponents will know the limitations... probe to see if the protection persists, wait till its down or force the pc's to keep using resources and/or spell slots to maintain it... or look for ways to change their attack type... otherwise, the PC's win that encounter... and they'll love it. Until they run into things (like demons?) that do it back to them.
I just don't see how this is a problem.
i've seen this being played against players with an over specialised spell list, it can be used against players just as much...
Crimson Jester wrote: The wording does not seem to have changed from 3.0/3.5 to pathfinder. Energy resistance in general was changed from 3.0 to 3.5, but 3.5 to PF is unchanged. In 3.0, resistances were generally higher but it was counted on a per-round basis. If a monster had Fire Resistance 20 and was hit by a Fireball for 25 points of damage, that would be 5 points getting through. If your buddy then immediately hit it with another fireball for 35 points, that's 35 points of ouch getting through because the resistance was already used up.
Thus adding yet more upkeep to the DM's round-by-round workload. Ironically, I was "doing it wrong" throughout the time I was playing/running 3.0... and my crime was erased from history when 3.5 changed that rule. ;)
I like it. Makes a great scroll.
The drawbacks have already been noted. It's not often worth a spell slot but ALWAYS worth having a scroll or two around. Especially now the 3rd level Communal Resist Energy or whatever. Group buff time! Really dang good!
As others have pointed out you must know which energy type you will need to be resistant to to gain the benefit. You could easily choose wrong if you dont have any foreknowledge of encounters to come. You could very well waste those slots if you never get attack with the choosen energy type.
As for being overpowered for a 2nd level spells.
Lets look at Blur
20% miss change. Meaning that 20% of the attacks aimed at you will miss completely negating all damage that attack would have done. so over the course of the spell it will reduce the amount of damage you would take by 20%. The 20% isnt limited to one energy type but effects all melee/unarmed attacks. Additionally it even effects spells with attack rolls (Scorching Ray, Polar Ray, Enervation, Slay Living, Destruction, etc...)
It has a duration of 1 minute per level so not as long term as Resist Energy but in alot of way far more effective.
Lets look at another 2nd level spell.
Invisibility. As long as your enemies have no way of detecting you which for a good portion of the game and a large number of enemies is likely to be the case. Invisibility actually provides greater than a 50% reduction to the damage you would take. Even if the opponent can determine your square he still suffers a 50% miss chance. If he has no way to determing your square then you are effectively immune to any for of directed damage from that opponent. The draw back is that you have very limited option on what you can do while this "Damage Immunity" is up.
So comparing Resist Energy to other 2nd level spells it still doesnt rank that high. I would prepare both Invisibility and Blur before I would prepare Resist Energy (unless I knew for a fact that we would be facing an opponent that will be using X energy type.)
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