Oh, and if you can fit an aspidochelene (spelling?) in there somehow..I believe we already did in a previous AP bestiary... can't remember what one though off the top of my head. Probably in Legacy of Fire?
Council of Thieves actually (not sure why, but my mind is saying the second volume). I meant in one of the adventures.
|
Council of Thieves actually (not sure why, but my mind is saying the second volume). I meant in one of the adventures.Oh, and if you can fit an aspidochelene (spelling?) in there somehow..I believe we already did in a previous AP bestiary... can't remember what one though off the top of my head. Probably in Legacy of Fire?
Part three I think, as the bestiary was theme as 'crazy things the pathfinders found'
Sweet sounding AP.
+1 to all suggestions so far.
I particularly like the Jason and the Argonauts suggestions.
Don't know if anyones suggested a couple of Sinbad or Oddysey references in there too? Personally as a GM I'd love an excuse to use Cyclops, Scylla, Sirens, Charybdis and other funky beasties. Can't think of many aquatic demons but seeing the Adaro, Ningyo and the mentioned but not seen Deep ones, sentient devilfish and shark elves might be a plus. I'd love to see a version of calypso statted up too.
I'd love to see a Ship crewed by Draugr crop up as well. That'd be awesome.
From a setting building perspective. I'd love to get some fluff on the ship designs from the various nations and races of the world. Would add a hell of a lot of welcome flavour
Just my 2 Dubloons.
Isle of Dread... Full steam ahead!!
:D
I am always a major fan of AP components that reference other APs, and as such, I would love to see Kassata Lewynn show up for a cameo.
In other news, I think that these books will be cool as long as they can stick away from hexploration and random encounters.
Isle of Dread... Full steam ahead!!
+ 1 Grognard Vote
Creative Director
|
One of the reasons we waited so long to do a Pirate AP was because in the last 12 issues of Dungeon, we DID an AP with a strong pirate theme to it. This was the Savage Tide Adventure Path, and there were several adventures that dealt pretty strongly with Pirates.
But it also actaully sent the PCs to the Isle of Dread as well. Of the 12 adventures in the Savage Tide AP, a third of them (parts 4–7) took place on or under the Isle of Dread. We've detailed the HECK out of that (awesome) adventure site, and so we won't be going back there at all in Skull and Shackles.
But mostly we'll not be going there because the Isle of Dread is owned by Wizards of the Coast, of course! :-)
One of the reasons we waited so long to do a Pirate AP was because in the last 12 issues of Dungeon, we DID an AP with a strong pirate theme to it. This was the Savage Tide Adventure Path, and there were several adventures that dealt pretty strongly with Pirates.
But it also actaully sent the PCs to the Isle of Dread as well. Of the 12 adventures in the Savage Tide AP, a third of them (parts 4–7) took place on or under the Isle of Dread. We've detailed the HECK out of that (awesome) adventure site, and so we won't be going back there at all in Skull and Shackles.
But mostly we'll not be going there because the Isle of Dread is owned by Wizards of the Coast, of course! :-)
Incidentally, that AP was cosmically awesome. But I understand why you wouldn't want to revisit it any time soon. That said, there is no reason why someone couldn't get themselves a copy, update it to pathfinder rules, and go to town revisiting the old neighborhood with a bit of kingmaker and Gamemastery rules for fun and colony building.
for my part, I'm looking forward to what you've got in mind for a pirate-y adventure. i've been continually impressed with every AP that's come out so far and from what I've seen, each story arc seems to get a bit better than the last.
|
In terms of structure, there needs to be a mechanism and/or plot point that is really keyed to ships and sailing or ship-ship combat as an objective (whether in the over-arcing AP or in an adventure). Too many "pirate" adventures are landlubbery. Even the Monkey Island games and Pirates of the Caribbean movies tend to have the McGuffins land-based (except when the objective is getting/stealing a ship).
This makes sense in that most "stuff" can be found easily on land, but Paizo needs to break away from that somehow - making a McGuffin or two that is distinctly tied to ships/sailing/sea (or an undersea component, as some have suggested). That's what I think could distinguish the AP the most, and be really cool to play.
In terms of structure, there needs to be a mechanism and/or plot point that is really keyed to ships and sailing or ship-ship combat as an objective (whether in the over-arcing AP or in an adventure). Too many "pirate" adventures are landlubbery. Even the Monkey Island games and Pirates of the Caribbean movies tend to have the McGuffins land-based (except when the objective is getting/stealing a ship).
This makes sense in that most "stuff" can be found easily on land, but Paizo needs to break away from that somehow - making a McGuffin or two that is distinctly tied to ships/sailing/sea (or an undersea component, as some have suggested). That's what I think could distinguish the AP the most, and be really cool to play.
Savage Tide was great, but Skull and Shackles will Savage Tide Not be...
Honestly just in terms of scope they have to be different ST was like 13 issues going from level1 to 21 or so, while SaS will be 6 books, ranging from level 1 to 15ish. Add in the amount of closed ip in ST (All that greyhawk lore, Isle of Dread) and they have to have a different beast altogether. Not to mention 2 of the primary story arcs are guarenteed to not be involved
In terms of structure, there needs to be a mechanism and/or plot point that is really keyed to ships and sailing or ship-ship combat as an objective (whether in the over-arcing AP or in an adventure). Too many "pirate" adventures are landlubbery. Even the Monkey Island games and Pirates of the Caribbean movies tend to have the McGuffins land-based (except when the objective is getting/stealing a ship).
This makes sense in that most "stuff" can be found easily on land, but Paizo needs to break away from that somehow - making a McGuffin or two that is distinctly tied to ships/sailing/sea (or an undersea component, as some have suggested). That's what I think could distinguish the AP the most, and be really cool to play.
Honestly some landbased debauchery is almost gaurenteed, just looking at pirate movies and stories in general, quite a bit of the action takes place on deserted isles, and in port taowns. I expect we will see those along with ruins and the like.
|
The other thing that this AP is going to need is a system for being a merchant, buying in one port several tonnes of X and selling it in another. Perhaps the booty system will accommodate that; I hope so.
1) I'm not sure there isn't anything here you need a system for, you have various profession/appraise/diplomacy skills to handle moving your merchandise, and a cargo hold to well move your merchandise, the rest is your GM simulating a real world.
2) Merchantnanigans are for NPCs, were HEROES (or villains as the case may be.)
Is there any convenient way to get Savage Tide? Those backissues are rare, expensive, or OOP. Is there a compilation somewhere like they did for Shackled City?
Is there any convenient way to get Savage Tide? Those backissues are rare, expensive, or OOP. Is there a compilation somewhere like they did for Shackled City?Not possible due to terms of WotC license for the mags and its termination before the PDFs of final Dungeon issues could be completed.
Incidentally i've got hard copies of those magazines in a safe place at home. I lurve that final adventure path. the ending was epic....literally!
WoTC is/was stupid for not putting those up for sale via online PDF distribution.
Removed a post. Please do not advocate illegal activities on our boards.
Removed a post. Please do not advocate illegal activities on our boards.
I didn't say go out and do it, I just passed along a story about what happened last time WoTC started acting like RIAA-lite.
Not possible due to terms of WotC license for the mags and its termination before the PDFs of final Dungeon issues could be completed.
y'know...I kinda wondered if that's why you can't find a legal copy of those PDF files anywhere via the usual channels. WoTC is pretty dumb not to allow them to be sold via online PDF distro. I strongly suspect they'd sell pretty well. Just look at the response to a pirate theme AP in these forums. updated to pathfinder rules and given the kingmaker AP rules for building a colony, you could run a pretty epic game out of making the Isle of Dread into a new nation-state.
|
|
Something that comes to me. Why do you NEED cannons when you can have a shipboard Wizard or Sorcerer casting Fireball or Gust of Wind, etc.One use of Acid Arrows on the enemy sails can ruin their day.
Arguments in favor of cannons:
-Unlike wizards and sorcerers, cannons can't be killed, turned to stone, or have their attacks counterspelled.-Cannons can be destroyed with "Break Object" type spells and by dealing enough damage to them, but that takes the focus of an attack off the wizard preparing "Fireball" right next to the cannon. (i.e. they're a distraction)
-If the wizard or sorcerer dies, the minion can still use the cannon (at great personal risk), but not the magic scroll the wizard dropped in his death throes.
|
Also in favor of Cannons:
Cannons are not subject to rules for Concentration for "Vigorous, Violent or Extremely Violent motion while casting" such as those found on a boat.
Nor are they subject to Concentration for "Wind with Rain or Sleet" while casting, or "Wind with Hail and Debris" while casting.
All very common occurrences, especially in a place like the Eye of Abendego.
Furthermore: Spellbooks are rarely waterproof (see also: Scrolls).
In conclusion: "Light the cannons ye scurvy dogs!"
|
Creative Director
|
We've already established in canon (ha) what role cannons play in the Shackles—they're basically all owned by the Hurricane King, and no one else really has any at all. As such, there WILL be a role for cannons in the Skull and Shackles AP, and probably a pretty KEY role... but not a very big role.
I very much doubt they'll be available for PCs to use on other ships. Especially since we'll be focusing more on boarding action type ship to ship battles.
|
We've already established in canon (ha) what role cannons play in the Shackles—they're basically all owned by the Hurricane King, and no one else really has any at all. As such, there WILL be a role for cannons in the Skull and Shackles AP, and probably a pretty KEY role... but not a very big role.
I very much doubt they'll be available for PCs to use on other ships. Especially since we'll be focusing more on boarding action type ship to ship battles.
*sigh* Well, if you aren't going to let us have the gunpowder stuff as an integral part of the campaign, might I prevail upon you to consider leaving the design open enough so that GMs can go for a more Pirates of the Caribbean blackpowder feel if we want to bolt it on?
I know gunpowder is a knee-twitch for a lot of Pathfinder fans, but even Azmyth (and he's a guns in my D&D??!!?? hater)was warming to the idea of black powder and pirates in Skull and Shackles.
The reason why is simple: it just FITS in terms of flavor when it comes to pirates, so I would hate if this proves to be a missed opportunity to add gunpowder into the game with both barrels, as it were.
|
|
I would hate if this proves to be a missed opportunity to add gunpowder into the game with both barrels, as it were.
I very much doubt [cannons will] be available for PCs to use on other ships. Especially since we'll be focusing more on boarding action type ship to ship battles.
Never underestimate the creativity of PCs! They can McGuyver or steal almost anything if they put their minds to it. I once had a PC make "moonshine" liquor using an old suit of armor and some rotted bannanas.
-Definitely gonna have to have an article about Besmara. I mean, really, come on.
-Provided they work with the same crew for most of the AP, its gonna have to be full of good characters. Not anything like the guards/mercenaries in Legacy of Fire, those were cardboard cutouts.
-Make the ocean a frightening place. There are things down there that will tear you to pieces the moment you stick a toe beneath the surface. Falling into the water should have serious consequences early-mid level.
-No gum-gum fruit.
-I am 100% ok with having treasure as the main objective of this campaign. What more does one need? Maybe some ale and wenches...
-Improved ship to ship combat.
-Acro DCs for various tricks, such as leaping from one rope rigging to another.
-More support for aquatic-oriented spellcasters (sorc's, druids, rangers, esp.)
-More water/ice spells
-More enchantment spells that aren't so broad (such as Charm Person)
-If you must have cannons as new equipment, please make them as optional as possible. (If you have cannons, after all, why build/use castles?)
-A side quest with tongue-in-cheek jokes at the pirate genre.
|
|
It doesn't bother me too much that Paladins are heavily discouraged from this campaign, but I hope there's leeway for good characters to still follow their conscience. Loyalty to captain and crew first and foremost.
Even if that captain and crew aim to misbehave.
Is that a Firefly reference I detect? Well, I know what direction I'm taking my crew now. ^_^
Is that a Firefly reference I detect? Well, I know what direction I'm taking my crew now. ^_^It doesn't bother me too much that Paladins are heavily discouraged from this campaign, but I hope there's leeway for good characters to still follow their conscience. Loyalty to captain and crew first and foremost.
Even if that captain and crew aim to misbehave.
But ... that means that the Arch Villain Rupert Murdoch will TPK your heroes at the end of the first book!
Hm, not too excited about that AP (so far).
So let's see:
Somebody mentioned Norgober - Nidal has quite a few dealings with Norgober and in Cities of Golarion it is mentioned that pirate ships from the Shackles use Nidal as a save haven - link established...
Oriental involvement you say? So Ameiko is coming back in full force with a fleet, having sailed around the world to take vengence for the wrong doings against her family?
Ruyan.
Uuuuuhhuuuhhhuuuhhh, and superstitions concerning ships, travelling the seas and such which were prevalent during the Middle Ages.
Darn it, you got me (again)!
|
- Tactical maps of ships
- Ship stats and stats for modifications to said ships
- Ship vs. giant sea monster battles (at least one giant squid or octopus)
- Treasure maps
- Port cities
- Memorable pirate captains
- Ghost ships
- Ship graveyards
- A way to have duels without the players outside the duel getting bored and where you're doing more than rolling a d20 over and over until someone falls over
As a sandbox style video game, I think Sid Meier's Pirates! should be great for inspiration.
Bermuda Triangle type place, where ships get lost....end up.....elsewhere......
Bermuda Triangle type place, where ships get lost....end up.....elsewhere......
I remember reading about a ship that disappeared in the Eye and showed up off the Chelaxian coast, IIRC...
Will at least some part of the AP be underwater? Even half a chapter would be more than I dare hope.
I'd love to see that, my Aquatic/Seaborn Sorcerer would be thrilled. :D Also, AFAIK, there hasn't been any significant underater encounters in the APs so far. The only thing that crosses my mind is the backdrop adventure in 4th Chapter of Legacy of Fire, but that can hardly be called signifact or important to the general storyline...
|
|
Will at least some part of the AP be underwater? Even half a chapter would be more than I dare hope.
I'd love to see that, my Aquatic/Seaborn Sorcerer would be thrilled. :D Also, AFAIK, there hasn't been any significant underater encounters in the APs so far. The only thing that crosses my mind is the backdrop adventure in 4th Chapter of Legacy of Fire, but that can hardly be called signifact or important to the general storyline...
Underwater encounters are notoriously difficult to pull off, due to their 3D nature and necessity of remembering somewhat obscure part of rules that rarely gets used in everyday games...