Troubled_child's page

Long time, no post. There was a podcast I used to listen to about Pathfinder the name of which escapes me. While this wouldn't normally be an issue I've been trying to track down the song they used to close the show and Google is failing me. I believe it's title is Red Wine and Vicodin as that is the chorus but I could be mistaken. It definately contains the line We've got no Stepford Wives with perfect eyes telling us how to live our lives but Google says there are no pages containing that phrase. Any help would be much appreciated.

Aw. I was super excited until this bit! Where on earth am I supposed to find tabletop roleplaying gamers who haven't played Baldur's Gate 2?

*sheepishly raises hand*

I saw it as pulling from a lot of real life and fantasy fiction cults. The emphasis on the money flow tying into moving up to the next "step" of the religion does bring one particular RL group to mi-POSTER HAS BEEN SUED

in all seriousness, I don't want Paizo to get entangled in any frivolous litigation, and that concern should spell out exactly who is being referred to

Considering Lisa has a South Park avatar I think breaking the 4th wall and screaming "SUE ME!" would probably be the response to any threats of litigation.

Not technically dead but has become an NPC

Name: Magister Zoran Novakovic
Race: Human
Class: Wizard 5
Adventure: RRR
Location: N/A
Catalyst: Ongoing Party strife

Gory Details: Zoran and Daphi had been arguing pretty much since the first time they met. They argued about the Kobolds (who Zoran was trying to redeem and convert to the worship of Apsu), they argued about Zoran's skill as a wizard (If he was a proper wizard then why didn't he have any Gearsmen?), They argued about Daphi's idea that the kingdom should have a standing army that consists of 100% of the citizens (That way they could conquer a better already established kingdom) and they argued about another hundred things that I'm too slow at typing to list. After the Baron died (see top of page, it's not been a good few weeks for the party) the one thing holding these two apart fell away and while on watch (something Daphi religiously tried to avoid) an argument started about if Daphi was falling asleep or just closing her eyes to listen better. Zoran decided to see if she was asleep by using unseen servant to draw one of her swords. A fight ensued for a few rounds before the others managed to intervene. Zoran decided that this was enough and headed back for the capital before moving on the silver mine to collect the Sootscales. He intends to seek out the silver dragon in order to aid in their redemption.

Name: General Daphi of Chesed, Numeria
Race: Human
Class: Barbarian 5
Adventure: RRR
Location: Lonely Barrow
Catalyst: Being blind

Gory Details: Having lost two of their number in quick succession the party decides to head for the Lonely Barrow in order to recover the legendary weapon said to reside there in order to boost the moral of the kingdom. Unfortunately they set off the trap leaving two fatigued and one exhausted. With movement coming from both flanks (the skeletons) Daphi volunteered to hold the corridor while the rest of the party advanced further. As they were forced into a bottleneck only two could get to her at once her chances of defeating them were pretty good. On the first round however she suffered a critical hit which left her blind. The others were unable to help as the fight with the Lonely warrior was not going well. Daphi successfully destroyed 8 or 9 (My apologies I've forgotten the exact number) before being cut down. One round later the Lonely Warrior finally succumbed and the party finished off the remaining skeletons. The party decided this was Daphi's tomb now and she replaced the Lonely Warior in the main chamber surround by the remains of those she defeated.

Name: Baron Karalius Aldori
Race: Human
Class: Fighter 4 (Swordlord Archetype)
Adventure: Rivers Run Red
Location: Mad Hermits tree
Catalyst: An unbelievable number of 1's thrown by the party

The Gory Details:The party was camped outside the tree cooking lunch and failed to spot the Hermit and Cat sneaking up on them. With the surprise round and being beaten on initiative the Baron had already taken over 20 points of sneak attack damage by the time the fumblefest started. Not a single member of the party could land a blow for several rounds and an AOO added sneak attack back into the mix taking down the Baron.

Aftermath:His former apprentice (Formally Marshal) becomes Baroness Aldori but the death of the Baron generates some unrest at the worst possible time as Grigori is about to be unleashed on the capital.

For those of you who remember Keeping up Appearances, "It's Bouquet, not Bucket!" :-)

That just made my day.

Replacing fiction with 6 pages of "How to adapt the adventure" advice wouldn't be much different though... 'cause guess who the best person to write that article would be? That's right... the person who's most familiar with the adventure in its final form—the developer who's already got his 40+ hour week full developing the maximum sized of a monthly adventure he can develop. Shifting this to another employee or writer would be fantastically inefficient, since that would mean that employee would have to become an expert on every adventure AND would have to be a great adventure developer (something we still have a shortage on at Paizo, frankly)... and he'd have to do so in about half the time the primary developer has to do the whole adventure since the ship date can't really change and he can't START this process until the developer's done with the adventure.

I appreciate the constraints your under and that a lot of time it must seem like we're throwing our toys out of the pram. That said one page in the first book being given over to some basic advice is not beyond the realms of sanity. I don't think anybody is looking for a step by step guide to overhauling every encounter (there's a statement that will come back to haunt me as thousands of voices cry out "that's exactly what we want!"). At the end of the day though I understand that you can't please everybody.

This might not prove to be a popular suggestion but if the problem with having an advice section in the AP volumes (and I favour it, especially when it came to the gunpowder/skull and shackles debate) is space, rather than messing with the adventure design (a very complicated and difficult task) why not drop the fiction?

Stuff

Yeah at that stage I'm not surprised you were pissed off.

"@ James Jacobs: While I see your point with the rogue disarming a trap statement, how would the player of that rogue feel if he was sent into a mayors house alone and had to break into the mayors office the his safe, and that he had to share all the XP from that with the rest of his party that stayed back at the inn?

IMO the shared XP thing leads to people "ROLL" playing ....and not "ROLE" playing.

Couldn't disagree more. In your example the rest of the party not sneaking into the mayor's house is ROLEplaying. Granted I would penalise them for not being nearby in case something went wrong but recognising something is beyond your skill shouldn't be punished. That said in our group you level when the GM says, that way nobody is basing decisions on being only 50 XP from next level (now that is ROLLplaying).

Apparantly you have to be able to read minds to tell if someone likes you.

That's generally been my experience with the opposite sex ; )

I'd actually say that the ratio depends on location. I see primitive societies having more Oracles and Druids than Clerics for example.

When you give explicit mechanics for something, don't you expect them to cover the effects? From the rum you get a short CHA bonus and Con damage. You are expected to use the Cha bonus to help out, so I assume you aren't passed out. No mention is made of Dex or Wis penalties which is what I'd expect from alcohol. Do you handwave those into existence too? As well as making everyone pass out after one shot of the rum?

It has an explicit mechanic because it goes beyond what you would normally expect. I think I should clarify that by passed out I don't mean the hit the deck the second they take a swig just that they can't stay up till the middle of the night plotting. Spend a day doing physical labour in the tropical sun, don't eat properly and then drink a RATION (not shot) of over strength (possibly spiked) rum and then try to stay awake.

Not the PCs. The whole crew. That's most of my point.

I don't think he cares about the rest of them either. If it's really bothering you though just have anyone who gets below 5 CON sent to the surgeon because they look like their dying and give them a few days rest.

You have fun with that. 16th level character against 20 1st level crew members. He'd never need to go to full defense. And that's without his trusted officers to help. It would be a slaughter.

I wasn't saying he needed to go on full defence just that assuming your untouchable is what gets seems to get most RPG villains killed. I for one am happy to see a villain taking his survival seriously.

Frankly I don't know why he'd bring the crew with him attacking the Man's Promise. He needs them alive to sail the ship, so why take the chance of losing too many in the attack?

Action economy, meat shields and the fact that he doesn't know he's a 16th level character or that the crew are level 1 or anything about the opposition on the other ship.

Except they don't pass out at night. They don't pass out at all, until they die.

Not everything in the game needs a rule to make it work.

They just get more fragile and easier to kill, which is exactly what you want when you're going to be pirating.

I really don't think the captain cares if any of the PC's survive the voyage.

As for mutiny, it's not like Harrigan, at 16th level, couldn't kill them all with little trouble. He'd have trouble sailing home afterward though.

It's that kind of hubris that leads to so many BBEG's dying because they can't stop monologuing when they should be on full defence.

I don't have the book yet but based on the description on the boards I figured the "rum" was probably mixed with something like wood alcohol. It makes perfect sense to me that somebody who has shanghaied most of the crew would want them passed out at night to prevent any attempts at management restructuring.

Troubled_child wrote:

A computer simulation of James Jacobs.

Like this?

And the best thing about this simulation is you only have to say his name to summon him : )

Sailors are also superstitious though and might not like the idea of one on ship. It is of course entirely up to the GM.

A computer simulation of James Jacobs.

In my game the reason he didn't just take Oleg's by force the second the PC's started causing trouble was because he was raiding Mivon's Northern border while they were at war with Pitax. If they haven't reached the Thorn River Camp then have them assault that and find Svetlana there.

We play our games at my friends house. He built a Tiki Bar in his kitchen called the Sunburned Penguin so I'm going to turn it into the Formidably Maid for a night. Then I'm going to randomly hand out campaign traits. Then I'll pass them a drink to drown their sorrows and make them roll characters but keep them to themselves so that in the early part of the adventure they're all alone.

I find maybe half ofbthem of any use and some to be utterly a waste of $. The two primers and goblins of golarion falling solidly into waste. The upcoming blood of series looks to be useless as well.

There are a few awesome ones though, Pirates of the Inner Sea was great, the nation ones like Andoran I loved, I look forward to the knights book. The faiths series was meh.

The fact that we arent getting the modules monthly adds hate to it also, I would be more forgiving of the line if I didht feel it was at the expense of modukes.

I'm with you on the nation love and I'm really hoping we see more of that now it's gone monthly. I enjoyed the faith series but the knights book and 'blood of' series has me concerned the nation based books will take a back seat and if that's the case the primers are a vital stop gap for me as I don't let my player's read anything outside of the companion line.

Anyway enough of derailing this thread.

Back then modules were monthly, try as I might they wont go back to that, instead moving the companion line to monthly which infuriates me.

As someone who has recently stated that I think the companion line is the best idea since the OGL I have to ask what is it that infuriates you about it?

To me, lore bloat is about a few things:

1) Players who love setting info absolutely hate it when that info is ignored or even worse contradicted.

2) As a DM it is much harder to build a consistent world through improvisation, published adventures (especially non-setting based), and houserules when there are reams of material to negate or contradict your efforts.

It's unfortunate, but a lot of players see published material as canon and cannot move past that fact.

Full disclosure, I am the type of player that loves settings and hate when lore gets ignored. That said I GM Golarion and Paizo have created the greatest system to combat this problem any RPG company has ever come up with. The Companion Line. They are the only setting books I let my players read. Now granted I'd prefer to see more nation (or geographical area) based Companions but at it's core I really do think it's the best idea since the OGL.

I plan on not letting the players discuss their characters before the game starts. That way they'll be less confident as they won't have a party to back them up right from the start.

If you can wait a little to start the campaign people often post guides here to how to convert AP's for 6 players. Full disclosure I AM NOT VOLUNTEERING.

I think that many, if not most, players prefer the strong narrative to versimilitude regarding their rate of advancement.

Obviously I can't speak for everyone but I think a lack of verisimilitude damages the narrative. At the end of the day ideas have a tipping point where the old style of doing things no longer measures up. TV and to a lesser degree film are reaching that point now but who can say how long it will take for RPG's to get to the same point. All I know is my group wouldn't touch published adventures with a barge pole until Kingmaker came along but then again we've also given up on handing out experience in the traditional manner, pretend the wealth by level chart doesn't exist and have basically abandoned the D20 system in favour of Traveller for all modern and sci fi games so I'm not sure how representative we are of the gaming community as a whole.

What was Rule By Fear? Well, okay that was more a GM reference. National Players guides have become rather rare for some reason.

It's true there have been several campaign setting books that are nation based but I only let my players read the companion line. I'm surprised that so few have been released in support of the AP's (Though obviously we're getting Pirates of the Inner Sea).

I've been away from the boards for awhile so forgive me if this topic has resurfaced in my absence but a few people were talking about using Warpath to replace the mass combat system. Anybody actually tried it yet?

I've asked for it before but I'd really like to get back to nation based companions. I'm not saying I don't like the books on other subjects (I own them all), it's just we haven't had a true nation book since Sargava.

Not to rain on all the Tian-Xia love, but we've had a ton of Tian-Xia support recently.

I agree the Dragon Empires Gazetteer is outstanding, and expect no less from the primer, but with Jade Regent just finishing up, I can say there's a lot of other APs I'd rather see them tackle before putting out another Tian-Xia-related AP.

Of course, I suppose my vote doesn't really matter; not like I'll be canceling my subscription regardless :)

I think this petition is more about saying don't forget about Tian Xia after Jade Regent than we want an AP set there this instant. Specifically it's to respond to suggestions in the other thread that nobody would buy it.

Alice Margatroid wrote:

Hardcover Dragon Empires guidebook plus Adventure Path would be superb.

This. ^

Signed.

+1

Played a Shoanti like that in a home brew game and it wasn't a problem. The AP's set in Varisia though tend to ignore the struggle. I think it is possible but it's hard to give advice without spoilers. The fact is the Shoanti know the secrets of the land better than the invaders. Talk to the GM and try to set up a situation where you are forced to recruit these interlopers to your cause because of the greater threat.

am sure there are other things I have forgotten. But as a GM with this kitchen sink set up, it is fairly easy for me to pick and choose what elements I want in my own campaign, and I can leave what I don’t like where it is. For example If I don’t like guns, it will be fairly easy for me to say, leave them in Alkenstar, and make up some plot device like Alkenstar has been able to keep their guns to themselves, or magic interferes with the workings of the gunpowder or something like that. The reason doesn’t really matter nor does it have to be logical. But I can keep guns isolated there if I want to.

Paizo already has you covered. Alkenstar keeps almost all of the guns it ever makes so that they will always have them as an advantage.

As to Jedi in non-saga d20, they suffer from the problems that a lot of 3/x stuff did, role playing to balance power. My Jedi medic (not a healer, a counsular medic) had this in spades. Clear to the point that the DM was dazed and confused that I wanted to build a light saber with a 'stun setting' so I could knock out foes instead of just cut them apart.

It was the the 'extend defence' that proved to be the problem in our game. When used to add defence to non Jedi it was no problem but get 3 or more Jedi in a line and and the number shoots up, as does the percentage of shots that get deflected back. It wasn't game breaking but did cause a few problems. Expending a bit of vitality to do so seems like a reasonable balance.

Anyway I should stop derailing this thread by talking about star wars and just say I hope that Paizo does include psionics (their own or adopting the ones from dreamscarred press) out of the purely selfish reason that one day I want to see Vudra.

In (non-saga) Star Wars d20, the Jedi force powers did something like this.

That's where I was stealing the idea from. I got reminded of it by the inclusion of the wounds/vitality system in UC. Thought if I brought it up though it might run the risk of fanning the flames of psionics being too sci fi. I really liked it as a system for representing that there was a cost to doing what others could not. If Jedi had been forced to spend their vitality for lightsaber defence as well then jedi would have been slightly more balanced but I still think its a better game than saga.

I have ZERO knowledge of ANYTHING to do with Ultimate Equipment, but it suddenly strikes me that vehicles that allow you to travel to different planes and world's within the solar system would really kickass.

Although I have little interest in travelling to the other planets any time soon I am now picturing a van sized brass capsule with massive solar sails and it is pretty awesome.

*shouted from cover*

Would people be more open to the idea of a power points system if the points in question were hit points?

*full defence*

I was responding to troubled child's remark about never running out of Chronicles material. And they're right, in terms of campaign geography. There's tons to cover. But we have seen misfits, (2) undead books, many themed books, many classic books, now a dedicated giants book.

I could see redirecting some of the energy into Mythic campaign material however. Or Asian material if there is sufficient sales.

If I was cautious it's only because it sucks when the Creative Director shows up and says you're completely wrong. Which I could be.

I'm just saying a lot of topic bases are getting covered nicely now. But yeah, there is a lot of world geography untouched too.

First off I'm sorry for the touch of necromancy but I've been without the internet the past few days.

As the geography expands so does the scope of the other books in the line. For instance Dragon Empires Magic to follow up on Inner Sea Magic. Your right though in that if Paizo does release epic/mythic/legendary rules they will release support material for it in the campaign line because otherwise the rules wont sell as well. The catch 22 situation being that it's the idea of such content being written for Golarion that leads to so many people arguing against Paizo publishing the rules in the first place. I feel very sorry for Paizo sometimes, having to put up with all our contradictory demands and nerdrage.

There is the Chronicles/campaign line, which in a couple years might be looking for new topics to address.

Considering that's where most of the material for Southern Garund, Tian Xia, Casmaron, Arcadia and Sarusan will be published I don't think there is a shortage of topics to address in that line.

I'm going to guess thats it's the Star Trek license. Since the deal never went through with Mongoose I imagine it's still up for grabs.

You probably have more swords though, and swords don't need to be reloaded.

And they don't make as much noise (which is just going to attract more zombies). Now that I think about it my friends do seem to own a lot of melee weapons.

Remember that we in the UK need to plan ahead a bit more as we don't have as many guns as you do.

For those looking for dice for Carrion Crown the same company does dice for Cthulhu that would fit. If your willing to spend a bit more cash they even do glow in the dark ones.

Seriously though, I'd love to live in a city where I knew the police and fire were ready for a slow zombie outbreak.

I do live in Bristol and would like to say that it requires a certain amount of preparedness on behalf it's citizens as well. My gaming group for instance has a rally point, emergency supplies and a planned fall back point should we be forced to abandon the city.

The Aristocrats win.

Not sure if your just without hope or a collaborator ;)

I don't want epic level content.

TheLoneCleric wrote:

Something that comes to me. Why do you NEED cannons when you can have a shipboard Wizard or Sorcerer casting Fireball or Gust of Wind, etc.

One use of Acid Arrows on the enemy sails can ruin their day.

Arguments in favor of cannons:

-Unlike wizards and sorcerers, cannons can't be killed, turned to stone, or have their attacks counterspelled.
-Cannons can be destroyed with "Break Object" type spells and by dealing enough damage to them, but that takes the focus of an attack off the wizard preparing "Fireball" right next to the cannon. (i.e. they're a distraction)
-If the wizard or sorcerer dies, the minion can still use the cannon (at great personal risk), but not the magic scroll the wizard dropped in his death throes.

Plus (and this is a big plus as far as pirates are concerned) cannons can't lead a mutiny.

Also there are those of us that still hold to the idea that casters are supposed to be rare and only get rarer the higher level they are. Though obviously this is a personal preference I would say that the number of casters in the shackles is extremely limited and depending on what the set up is for the start of the AP might impose such limitations on the party.

I'd forgotten about this thread.

First I'd like to say how everything I have read about the content and direction you're going in with Tian Xia is just what I was looking for.

My concerns at this stage boil down to a simple request that you factor in sales of all Tian Xia products, not just the Gazetteer, when deciding to do a World Guide or not.

To back up your theorizing with data collected from Pathfinder players, just take a look at how much the Andoran faction dominates the five factions in PFS from Seasons 0 to 2. I mean, I guess it could be because of the slave-freeing aspect, but from what I've seen, the major draw is that it is the faction that best fits "Big Darn Heroes" and is least likely to have morally ambiguous missions. I'm guessing it loses a lot of market share to the new good-aligned faction starting in Season 3. So while I definitely enjoy the nuance of having many shades of gray in my settings, it seems there's a serious market (if PFS is any good indicator for the APs, which it might not be) for a highly heroic AP.

First I'd like to say in the interests of full disclosure that I have never been involved in organised play (It's not as widespread this side of the Atlantic). That said it seems to me that I would find it a lot easier to play a "Big Darn Hero" than I would someone more "Morally Ambiguous" (or Chelaxian if you prefer) if I was playing with/in front of strangers at a convention/store.

Thinking that a player isn't going to read a setting book is silly. Settings can make or break a purchase and anyone who expects to be involved in a game is a pre-fabricated world is likely to buy, or at least read through, the setting. Many gamers are going to be both players and GM's at some point.

I can only speak to my group but it got to the stage at one point a few years ago when everyone knew all the little secrets about the Forgotten Realms setting that none of us wanted to play in it anymore. We've since decided on a system where different GMs run different systems and settings. As such we can keep a more clearly defined line between what's for players and whats for the GM.

In any case, for the arguement to hold water, the Inner Sea World Guide would have to be listed as a GM only book; which it is not.

I don't let my players read any of the books from the campaign setting line as I've always viewed that as being for GMs. It's not listed that way because it's very much a matter of personal taste if you wish to play that way.