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The FLGS I was at in St. Louis stayed afloat partially due to these auctions. THere's had grown to taking 3 days, and generated easily $5,000 to $10,000 per auction. That's just from bids. Not to mention the fact people usually buy more than their store credit covers.
Which FLGS in STL? I live in MO and would be interested in such opportunities.
I have a friend who worked in distribution who said that there are a number of game stores critical of Paizo because of its online store and subscription program. But one of the main complaints was about shipping vs street dates. And it's true that I have gotten my subscription materials via the mail before my local store can begin selling. But I really can't see that, itself, as a major problem. The main issue there really should be Paizo competing with the stores they're also serving.
Fortunately, my FLGS is pretty enthusiastic about Paizo stuff (as well as 4e) and knowledgeable about the products, and stocks multiple copies of the main rulebooks. Other stuff like Pathfinder Chronicles tend to sell out. In fact, I think I'll be stepping back two of my subscriptions to toss some more support my FLGS's way on Pathfinder (plus, those lines are getting to the point where I don't think I want each and every entry hitting my budget).
I believe that all RPG publishers should do as much as they can to support the FLGS. As those stores disappear so will more and more of their customer base....and thus our hobby will shrink even more.
My local FLGS does a lot to support its customers, it has a large room with several large gaming tables which are all FREE TO USE. Also a board to reserve your time/table. We need more of these types of stores to help sustain the RPG hobby and grow it.
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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I took some time to speak with the owner about Pathfinder and he said he sells 4E at about 6 times the rate of PF. He also went on an unsolicited rant about how Hasbro/WoTC supports the FLGS while Paizo does not.
This guy has no business being in customer service, much less store ownership, as he obviously doesn't understand when to keep his opinions to himself. I have a lot of opinions about all the products I carry. Every single one of them sounds like, "I love it/them," to anyone who asks. If they want a more in depth opinion, I will go so far as to compare and contrast mechanics and flavor, trying to figure out what the customer is interested in so that I can show them something they'll like. But saying, "this company pisses me off because of X or Y," is not an option.
I've said it before, and I'll maintain it, now: Paizo isn't competition.
In order to survive, brick and mortar stores need to do more than whine about what internet retailers are doing. Be proactive, get involved, and provide something that internet retailers can't provide: face to face customer service and a playing environment that is fun, to start with. It's the only way for customers to justify spending more money than they could with "those bastard internet dealers."
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My FLGS owner (Ken at The Griffon in South Bend, IN) seems to do very well with Paizo material, but has to dedicate more shelf space to WOTC stuff, I think simply because there is more crap to buy. Anytime a new Piaoz release comes out, the copies are snatched up as soon as they come in from the distributor.
I think the owner mentioned by the OP may be creating his own problems.
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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I believe that all RPG publishers should do as much as they can to support the FLGS. As those stores disappear so will more and more of their customer base....and thus our hobby will shrink even more.
No. Stores need to adapt to survive. And the good ones will. That will keep the hobby from dying, not the other way around.
My local FLGS does a lot to support its customers, it has a large room with several large gaming tables which are all FREE TO USE. Also a board to reserve your time/table. We need more of these types of stores to help sustain the RPG hobby and grow it.
This is an example of adapting.
And you're absolutely right: there need to be more of these types of stores. The days of the dingy, dark, smelly game store stuck in a non-visible corner of the decrepit strip mall with the crabby employee who refuses to come out from behind his counter are over. Support the ones who don't follow that model. Sounds like you've found one. Spread the word.
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In order to survive, brick and mortar stores need to do more than whine about what internet retailers are doing. Be proactive, get involved, and provide something that internet retailers can't provide: face to face customer service and a playing environment that is fun, to start with. It's the only way for customers to justify spending more money than they could with "those bastard internet dealers."
**APPLAUSE**
I wish - WISH! I had a FLGS with this kind of attitude around me. My FLGS isn't bad, but it's not too "L"...45 minutes away.
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In order to survive, brick and mortar stores need to do more than whine about what internet retailers are doing. Be proactive, get involved, and provide something that internet retailers can't provide: face to face customer service and a playing environment that is fun, to start with. It's the only way for customers to justify spending more money than they could with "those bastard internet dealers."
+1
One of my local game stores offers their own "subscription service" for Pathfinder products. If you pre-order all products of a certain line (for example, the Pathfinder RPG books, e.g., Core, APG, GMG, etc.) they will give you 15% off just like Paizo does. Now, the FLGS can't offer the free .pdf like Paizo does, but at the same time, you don't have to pay for shipping.
Another store has been thinking about doing similar things--offering discounts equal to those offered online (although they can't beat Amazon) if a product is ordered through the store. They figure if they can get the business and get people used to ordering through them (again the advantage is no shipping). For example, offering 20% off any miniatures ordered (same discount you get if you ordered through the Warstore).
The one thing a good FLGS can offer than no online store can is community and connections. You can't play a pickup game at Amazon. The store I frequent most holds occasional "mini-gaming cons." You pay a $10 cover fee (you get a discount if you bring friends), which gets you lunch and soda and access to the games. Prizes are raffled off (nice prizes. They're usually things given to the store for free for demoing their games, but they've included brand new copies of bookshelf board games and the like. I won a copy of Endeavor once). Any game product bought in store that day is also discounted somewhat (the idea being people are buying enough product they still earn a good profit by the end of the day). And furthermore it brings people together for future games and opportunities in a way the Internet just can't do. Even messageboard communities like this are nice, but it's not the same as being able to sit across a table from a fellow gamer and chat.
I don't think folks should blindly support local game stores. Stores with poor customer service should not be supported--of any type. If the staff harass customers (mdt's story) or tell the customer why, essentially, they shouldn't buy a product from them (cibet's story; I mean, I can understand the owner's frustration but he basically told him "I don't want anyone's money if they're going to buy this game"), then there's no reason to go back. But if a LGS is truly a Friendly Local Game Store, then absolutely, encourage them any way you can do, with whatever you can afford or feedback you can provide. Encourage the community building aspects of it as well--try to show up to events they hold--even if you end up not buying anything, contributing to the numbers that appear helps the store's image and popularity, etc. (as long as you behave well when you are there, of course :) ).
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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1. His biggest complaint was what he calls the "shopping cart" that Paizo has (their web-store). His quote: "When you go to the D&D web site there is no shopping cart it's all store locators. When you go to Pathfinder, the shopping cart is right there the whole time."
True. But WotC product is splashed all over the place at Target and WalMart. I can't tell you how many times I'll hear a mother say to her son, "You can get a pack of Magic cards at WalMart for $2." Nevermind that the product isn't the same product (8 card packs with no rare versus my 15 card pack with a guaranteed rare). WotC sells this product to the big box, specifically. It's far worse to deal with locally than any internet shopping cart ever will be.
2. He runs D&D encounters 2 days a week with "full tables" and he has enough interest to start a third. Apparently Hasbro does something to support this and make it possible but he didn't directly say what it was.
Good for him. He should also run Pathfinder Society. The two programs have exactly the same amount of support. More from PFS, actually, when you consider how many modules are available.
3. The Paizo PDFs. He wants to be able to give customers some kind of code where they can get a PDF from Paizo of a product that they buy in his store. "I have seen other companies do this and D&D doesn't even have PDFs." his quote.
I sell a lot of books by saying, "And you can get the PDF for $10. I'll even give you a $10 discount so you can get the PDF for free." Works every time. WotC, on the other hand, drove a lot of people away from their game when they killed PDFs. Worse, they have an online character builder that costs money. Why buy books when I spend money on this Official online tool that has every single rule I need for my character in a drop down menu?
4. Hasbro apparently has some kind of program where his store can get new releases in advance.
The only legitimate complaint he has. I will admit I like getting WotC RPG material 10 days ahead of big box and internet retailers.
5. Hasbro and Green Ronin (for the Dragon Age game) periodically release some kind of "special editions" of their products that were only available in FLGS, apparently these programs are a big help to him, I'm not sure why.
What? I have no idea what he's talking about. Unless it's the Collector's Edition stuff. Which is just an overpriced "high class" version of the same book. I might sell one set for Christmas. Otherwise, I wouldn't bother.
6. People apparently still come in looking for 3.5 stuff (which he had a decent amount of on the shelf) but he: "repeatedly has to explain to them that 3.5 doesn't exist anymore, it's not a product. If you want to play that game you have to buy Pathfinder." Again his quote, but I just thought his whole understanding of this situation was very odd.
Every last one of these people who come into my store becomes a Pathfinder customer. I love them. I can only hope they love me, in return, for showing them that they have continued support.
7. The Paizo subscriptions. His comment was: "...and those Paizo subscriptions." <rolls his eyes> No follow up.
The guy who subscribes gets a worse deal than the guy who goes to Amazon. The guy who goes online will never go to his store, whether Paizo does online sales or not.
That's what I remember of the conversion. Now obviously there are rebuttals to some of his complaints that I admittedly did not provide.
That's alright, I will. (-:
This was primarily because of what I mentioned in my OP. I just don't think supporting FLGS is my responsibility or even necessary. Look, I'm standing in his store dropping almost $50 bucks on a book I could get for $30 with a few clicks on my droid but the guy still can't see the potential in the product? He is instead asking for handouts from the publisher? Nonsensical to me and not a business I need to spend my time "supporting".
And this is why he should be telling you that Pathfinder is awesome. His loss. Fool.
More importantly, however, I think the need for FLGS's at all is overblown. Most of the time when I go in them (for any gaming need not just PF) they don't have what I want and it takes them weeks to get it, and they charge a premium on whatever I buy, so no benefit to me.
This is the only place you're wrong. Hobby stores are good for the community. I'd go into detail, but you don't want opinions. That is not to say, however, that it is your duty to support them. They (we) exist to support you. That support should lead to your making purchases, even if it's not Paizo stuff, which allows us to survive. So we can continue to support you, and you can continue to buy stuff, ad infinitum.
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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I have a lot of opinions about all the products I carry. Every single one of them sounds like, "I love it/them," to anyone who asks.I know, really. I'm plunking down over 40 bucks on a book, right in front of him, and he decides to start bashing the company that published it? Right then??
I should have said: "You know, you're right Paizo is driving you out of business, I refuse to support them!" And left without buying the book. You think that would have made him feel better?
Heh. I would've wanted a picture to show my staff the unintended consequences of un-thought out actions. You should actually go do that, now.
The FLGS I was at in St. Louis stayed afloat partially due to these auctions. THere's had grown to taking 3 days, and generated easily $5,000 to $10,000 per auction. That's just from bids. Not to mention the fact people usually buy more than their store credit covers.Which FLGS in STL? I live in MO and would be interested in such opportunities.
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RPG Superstar 2015 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16
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I took some time to speak with the owner about Pathfinder and he said he sells 4E at about 6 times the rate of PF. He also went on an unsolicited rant about how Hasbro/WoTC supports the FLGS while Paizo does not.This guy has no business being in customer service, much less store ownership, as he obviously doesn't understand when to keep his opinions to himself. I have a lot of opinions about all the products I carry. Every single one of them sounds like, "I love it/them," to anyone who asks. If they want a more in depth opinion, I will go so far as to compare and contrast mechanics and flavor, trying to figure out what the customer is interested in so that I can show them something they'll like. But saying, "this company pisses me off because of X or Y," is not an option.
I've said it before, and I'll maintain it, now: Paizo isn't competition.
In order to survive, brick and mortar stores need to do more than whine about what internet retailers are doing. Be proactive, get involved, and provide something that internet retailers can't provide: face to face customer service and a playing environment that is fun, to start with. It's the only way for customers to justify spending more money than they could with "those bastard internet dealers."
QFT. Brick and mortar stores in other industries compete with Internet retailers by providing superior, face-to-face customer service. Game stores that do not do this inevitably fail. It is not enough to love games; you have to love your customers. You have to know the people who repeatedly spend money in your store well enough to make recommendations to them. You've got to help them find what they want, and moreover, help them find the products they don't yet know that they want.
This same principle is actually one reason Paizo's so successful in Internet retail. If you want, you can go to Paizocon, have a beer with Erik Mona, and tell him exactly what you want, and you can believe he's really listening. Liz will fix your customer service problem with a smile and hand you a cookie.
The stores that are having a hard time competing with Paizo have that problem because Paizo's better at customer service. If those stores would exploit the customer service advantage they have in physical, face-to-face presence, they'd fare a lot better.
Luckily here in Vancouver you can't go 6 blocks without running into a game store. Are you people not in larger cities or is that just the norm for wherever you're located?
The size of the city has nothing to do with it. New York has 1 Gaming store, the Complete Strategist, and it is more or less purely retail (no gaming space)
...New York has 1 Gaming store, the Complete Strategist, and it is more or less purely retail (no gaming space)
The no gaming space bit is completely inaccurate.
I've been runnning my Curse of the Crimson Throne game and before that my 3.5 game there for well over a year now. There is a gaming space, it's just that it's in the basement of the store.
There are weekend boardgame and Minature tournaments there as well.
I will give the guy he has a legit complaint with the PDFs. Not that Paizo gives them to subscribers. The fact that you can't buy something for someone else in the store, or have coupon codes to get items.
If Paizo had a way for people to buy 'gifts' for people, then I'm sure the guy could probably work out a bulk discount on the PDFs from Paizo.com. Say, buy a 100 PDFs for $5 apiece, and give out a gift card with every purchase. Or just sell the PDF gift cards for $7.50 in his store.
Ah, then I retract my former comment. He needs to get his cranial assembly out of his anterior assembly and contact Paizo about volume discounts on the PDFs. :)
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Owner - Enchanted Grounds, President/Owner - Enchanted Grounds
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Ah, then I retract my former comment. He needs to get his cranial assembly out of his anterior assembly and contact Paizo about volume discounts on the PDFs. :)
Waaiiit a second....
Do you really think they'd do that? Inquiring minds want to know.
I have to admit, I've been trying to figure out a way of finagling the "Paizo certificate" thing for a while. Perhaps you've nailed it?
Ah, then I retract my former comment. He needs to get his cranial assembly out of his anterior assembly and contact Paizo about volume discounts on the PDFs. :)Waaiiit a second....
Do you really think they'd do that? Inquiring minds want to know.
I have to admit, I've been trying to figure out a way of finagling the "Paizo certificate" thing for a while. Perhaps you've nailed it?
Dunno, I'm not with the company. Having said that, most companies are willing to work with their partners and down stream people, as long as everyone's making a profit. It certainly couldn't hurt to talk to the marketing people about it, or the paizo shop people, or more likely both.
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We have two FLGSes that I'm aware of in my area:
One is more of a collectibles store that stocks lots of action figures and board games, as well as a lot of WotC content (Magic cards, D&D, etc.). They have some Paizo, but hardly any. Last time I was in there I think I saw 2 Core Rulebooks and 1 APG on the same shelf as 5-10 4e Player's Handbooks. They also have a poor miniatures selection, which is mostly Games Workshop, and maybe 20 Reaper figures at any time (and NONE of the Pathfinder Reaper minis!).
The other is more or less a Games Workshop store, even though it isn't branded as such. They have about 90% Warhammer, and the rest are Magic Cards and 4e. I've never seen any Paizo products there.
I pre-ordered Ultimate Magic from the first store, and they still don't have it in. My dad, on the other hand, has an RPG subscription from Paizo, and got his book in the mail on Tuesday.
So... I can get an RPG subscription from Paizo, get my books on time, and get a free PDF copy, or deal with the FLGS and get the books... eventually. Same for miniatures. Online, I can buy what I want. In the FLGS, I have a very limited selection to pick from.
If the FLGSes in my city went away, it would be sad, for sure, but I'd get by just as well - maybe even better.
More importantly, however, I think the need for FLGS's at all is overblown. Most of the time when I go in them (for any gaming need not just PF) they don't have what I want and it takes them weeks to get it, and they charge a premium on whatever I buy, so no benefit to me.
My FLGS can get anything you need in 4 days. I've never had to wait more than a week to get anything. Heck I've ordered 4 products from 2 different publishers once and he got them all in in 4 days.
Edit: and her never charges premiums. I understand the decision to go to Amazon, but (for me) I love my FLGS
...New York has 1 Gaming store, the Complete Strategist, and it is more or less purely retail (no gaming space)The no gaming space bit is completely inaccurate.
I've been runnning my Curse of the Crimson Throne game and before that my 3.5 game there for well over a year now. There is a gaming space, it's just that it's in the basement of the store.
There are weekend boardgame and Minature tournaments there as well.
Really? I never knew. Though I guess I never frequented the strat, and just assumed there wasnt any since there was none visible. I will have to check it out sometime. Still only 1 store for the whole of New York City is pretty thin dont you think?
Really? I never knew. Though I guess I never frequented the strat, and just assumed there wasnt any since there was none visible. I will have to check it out sometime. Still only 1 store for the whole of New York City is pretty thin dont you think?
There used to be be more stores in New York City, but they closed for the most part.
Neutral Ground was quite well known too, it closed a while ago.There are at least two left in Brooklyn: Kings Games and another one (forgot the name).
But that's true that basically the Strat is the main store.
Yes there is some game space inside.
When you enter the store, follow the right side, you'll see a door, often open, which leads to a small room with a few tables and a stairway going downstairs to a large gaming room.
You can play for no charge and even can get a discount if you play there, as you bring potential customers.
The room is sometimes flooded with Warhammer 40k or other games like that, but there is often also some D&D and Pathfinder games.
I used to play and GM there, although I don't frequent much the store these days, as we now play at a player's place.
But the Strat is a great store.
Actually I am supposed to play tomorrow, I might pass by...
Really? I never knew. Though I guess I never frequented the strat, and just assumed there wasnt any since there was none visible. I will have to check it out sometime. Still only 1 store for the whole of New York City is pretty thin dont you think?...New York has 1 Gaming store, the Complete Strategist, and it is more or less purely retail (no gaming space)The no gaming space bit is completely inaccurate.
I've been runnning my Curse of the Crimson Throne game and before that my 3.5 game there for well over a year now. There is a gaming space, it's just that it's in the basement of the store.
There are weekend boardgame and Minature tournaments there as well.
Years ago there was another Strat store in the city over on 59th near Columbus Circle and recently there was Neutral Ground, a huge gaming space(in the low 20's then moved to the high 30's). They're gone now, mostly becasue of because of the astronomically high rents in Manhattan.
Hell, at one point there were something like 4 Games Workshop stores in Manhattan (and one out near me that was in Forest Hills) at the same time. That lasted for about two years, now the only one that remains is the first store in the East Village.
I think there is also a store somewhere on 2nd Avenue, I don't know if it's still there.
One or two years ago, there was also some guys who were talking about opening another spot, but it seemed more like a fantasy than an actual project. Never heard about them anymore.
Really? I never knew. Though I guess I never frequented the strat, and just assumed there wasnt any since there was none visible. I will have to check it out sometime. Still only 1 store for the whole of New York City is pretty thin dont you think?There used to be be more stores in New York City, but they closed for the most part.
Neutral Ground was quite well known too, it closed a while ago.
There are at least two left in Brooklyn: Kings Games and another one (forgot the name).
But that's true that basically the Strat is the main store.
I live in brooklyn, and I wasnt aware of kings games, do you know where it is?
And I used to frequent Neutral Grounds in my magic days. We used to frequent a small store on Staten Island back in my highschool days but that place closed down. It was really sad to see Neutral Grounds go, but such is life I guess.
that, or it's "Dnd" partisanship.
Well, Rule One (well, one of many Rule Ones) in retail is: If you want success, you're not allowed a low opinion of products. You might think of yourself as the Holy Defender Of Everything that is Good and Right, but everyone else will see you as an opinionated nut. That may be cool for other opinionated nuts who come to your store if they have the same opinions, but those will probably still buy if you are neutral, and you won't lose the custom of lots of normal people, not to mention opinionated nuts with a different opinion.
And unless my assessment of the RPG market and the place of retail stores in it is completely wrong, any emotional actions that will make you sell less stuff is not something you can easily afford.
I live in a city of 300,000 odd people
How many normal people?
1. His biggest complaint was what he calls the "shopping cart" that Paizo has (their web-store). His quote: "When you go to the D&D web site there is no shopping cart it's all store locators. When you go to Pathfinder, the shopping cart is right there the whole time."
Ooo. It's a bad shopping card. Make it go away daddy!
Please. So the manufacturer is competing. Get over it.
I wish more companies would do that. Competition is good.
If the manufacturer competes with you, you can do two things: Either whine about it like a little girl, or compete right back. Should not be anything new to you, since you're already competing with your competition. If you don't have any competition, it's high time you get some (Though it's unlikely - in many of the bigger countries around, Amazon Dot Something is already competing you).
He does know that Paizo charges their list price. The only way to get a better price than that is to commit. You can give people the regular price - without shipping. Or go below. Maybe with, maybe without commitment (or do both).
He also knows about the thing his Favourite Company in the World does? The thing where they try to get you abandon books altogether? Pay a monthly fee and you get all the rules in a nice special programme that does lots of work for you, like compile all the rules texts. If I were selling books for a living, I'd be a lot more up in arms about something that tries to replace the books altogether. (I'd still stock both lines - and yes, I know how much I hate 4e and wizards. I'd still sell the stuff if it meant me and my staff eating regularly and being able to afford other niceties, too)
3. The Paizo PDFs. He wants to be able to give customers some kind of code where they can get a PDF from Paizo of a product that they buy in his store. "I have seen other companies do this and D&D doesn't even have PDFs." his quote.
Well, I can actually sympathise with the complaint itself - I think Paizo should do something about that. And I think they're working on it.
Still not a reason not to sell the stuff.
Plus, I feel drawn again to that thing wizards does: They let you completely ignore the books. Except maybe the core books, for the basic rules. Beyond that, you just subscribe to their programme and you get to print your own "character book". No need to have a book or a pdf for reference then.
4. Hasbro apparently has some kind of program where his store can get new releases in advance.
Has what? In advance of what?
5. Hasbro and Green Ronin (for the Dragon Age game) periodically release some kind of "special editions" of their products that were only available in FLGS, apparently these programs are a big help to him, I'm not sure why.
So he needs this? The company has to do his job for him? He deserves to fail.
It's a free market. No one holds your hand for you. You have to hold your own against your competition, or you go under.
Sounds like this guy isn't holding his own - probably because he's not a businessman - and wants to cast blame.
6. People apparently still come in looking for 3.5 stuff (which he had a decent amount of on the shelf) but he: "repeatedly has to explain to them that 3.5 doesn't exist anymore, it's not a product. If you want to play that game you have to buy Pathfinder." Again his quote, but I just thought his whole understanding of this situation was very odd.
If that is an actual quote, and I read his tone right, he was not very polite about it. I mean, he's b!!*~ing about the very thing you were to buy, that's not exactly polite.
7. The Paizo subscriptions. His comment was: "...and those Paizo subscriptions." <rolls his eyes> No follow up.
Yeah. Those crazy Paizo people treating their customers with respect. What are they thinking?
I just don't think supporting FLGS is my responsibility or even necessary.
No. Not at all. Especially since this LGS doesn't seem very F.
Stores might be on their way out. The Paizo store is the least of their problems. Amazon is probably the biggest killer of book and gaming stores.
This is because those online stores are so very convenient, their products so reasonably-priced. Amazon has a huge number of books (and other stuff) in stock, they deliver lightning fast, and their prices are just great (and most of the time, delivery is free to boot). And those reviews and product info will help you make your decision, too.
If you want to compete with that, you must play to your strengths. Price probably isn't one (though that doesn't mean you can charge anything you want), but you can do service.
B@**%ing about how bad you have it isn't service. It's giving people an excuse to avoid you. Don't give people who are undecided on supporting local stores an excuse to go online, calm their conscience so to speak.
It's a simple fact that people don't owe gaming stores squat. It's the gaming stores who have to win over their customers. If they can't do that, they totally deserve to fail.
Look, I'm standing in his store dropping almost $50 bucks on a book I could get for $30 with a few clicks on my droid but the guy still can't see the potential in the product?
Which is weird. Here I have this guy who voluntarily pays almost double for something in exchange for worse service. A sane person would have laughed all the way to the bank.
As for either Pazio or WotC supporting your FLGS(they do exist...) both in my opinion do a horrible job at it.Pazio with those subsciption benefits...a pretty good discount... getting the book early(usualy) and a free PdF.
If you are saying anything that as much as could be interpreted as a plea for them to stop, you might have to start looking out for lynch mobs....
(I, for one, am forming one right now). ;-P
Luckily here in Vancouver you can't go 6 blocks without running into a game store. Are you people not in larger cities or is that just the norm for wherever you're located?We must be living in different Vancouvers....or I am that out of the loop. I don't generally visit LGSs anymore but still, there are not that many here.
We might, I'm refering to british columbia not washington
Actually,
I've known a game store owner to disparage a product before, quite heavily and often. :) Usually when he was auctioning it off.
"Oh, this thing again. Yeah, this was some marketing genius's bright idea." Holds up 2nd edition Wraith book by White Wolf. "See this? What book is this?" He holds it around. "Yeah, can't read it can ya? That's because it's only readable in the dark when the name glows. So basically, the only people who can read this stupid thing are burglars who have broken into my store at 2 AM. What a BLEEPING idiotic thing to do."
:)
This is an excellent time to point out this service for store owners and gamers. Get the word out, Paizo folk, to your LGS, so they can sign up, so we can help you find places to network and find other gamers!
Charlie Bell, thanks for the kudos. ^_^
Yep there's a lot of good sense in this thread that LGS owners might take heed of.
The old bookstore LGS concept died years ago, these Zombies need to come live in the now and adapt themselves to providing a service to gamers - organised gaming space that happens to do a sideline in selling gaming products.
Look at LAN cafe's, then adapt for tabletop gaming.
Now as much as Warhammer isn't really my thing, I can walk past a Games Workshop store (any of them) and the place is FULL. There are umpteen people at tables chucking dice and moving mini's on the provided tables, and others milling around.
When they are in your store and milling around, they start buying the products on your shelves.
Retailers need to learn fast that no one owes them a living.
Well done too for Paizo for setting up systems that help these retailers, unfortunately the retailers can be boneheads.
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He was in Tennessee at the time, so not available to tell. By the time he got back (8 months later), I had already stopped shopping there. I told him at the auction they run every 3 months. The auction is a thing where customers bring in product and the store auctions it off for them. The store gets the cash, the customers get store credit. So I was ok spending money on that. I found out the guy was fired about 3 months after this interaction because of other complaints against him by other customers. Those were not the only incidents that caused me to stop spending money there, just the two biggest gaffs that were the final straws. I'd been getting sub-par customer service for years, and complaining to the owner for years. His response was always to the effect of "Well, really competent people won't work for what I can afford to pay".@mdt: I have a a speech impediment. I have ran into similiar siturations before. When it happens usualy I leave and never come back even for a 50% discount). But if I knew the manager....I would have waited for him...or gone and seen him and tell him exactly what happened. I would than atleast gaved him a chance to fix the problem...if they don't I will never step into that store again.
Sounds like the Fantasy Shop chain in STL.
Edit: I finished reading the thread. Yeah you are talking about the Fantasy Shop chain.
Sounds like the Fantasy Shop chain in STL.Edit: I finished reading the thread. Yeah you are talking about the Fantasy Shop chain.
Wow, really? I've had nothing but good experiences at the FS on Manchester or the one in St Charles. The workers are indeed very "gamer" looking, but they seemed quite knowledgeable about the product lines, and were very good at customer service, asking me once if they could help me and then leaving me alone to make my purchase. One even told me they were having a discount at the auction and did I wish to put off my $30 purchase a couple days (which I declined. I needed that freaking vinyl grid!). YMMV, of course, but I'd definitely recommend either the St Charles or Manchester St. locations. I've never been to the others.
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Wow, really? I've had nothing but good experiences at the FS on Manchester or the one in St Charles. The workers are indeed very "gamer" looking, but they seemed quite knowledgeable about the product lines, and were very good at customer service, asking me once if they could help me and then leaving me alone to make my purchase. One even told me they were having a discount at the auction and did I wish to put off my $30 purchase a couple days (which I declined. I needed that freaking vinyl grid!). YMMV, of course, but I'd definitely recommend either the St Charles or Manchester St. locations. I've never been to the others.
Sounds like the Fantasy Shop chain in STL.Edit: I finished reading the thread. Yeah you are talking about the Fantasy Shop chain.
No I meant that it sounded like that was the chain he was talking about. I didn't know where he was talking about at first. Though I have had issues with some of the people that worked there myself. The Saint Charles store is by far the best cause thats where the main manager spends most of his time. I was just more talking in general since I also replied before my edit that that chain had a auction and stuff as well etc and was no need since it was covered.
I use to hit the auction years ago, I haven't been in years. But some of my friends go and they call me if something comes up I want and ask me how much I would pay for it. Dave the owner is pretty funny though, i do miss that part of the auction. Just a bit of a drive for me to go up there when more often than not there is nothing I want.
Luckily here in Vancouver you can't go 6 blocks without running into a game store. Are you people not in larger cities or is that just the norm for wherever you're located?
Vancouver? I miss you Van. Coming home soon.
Wow, really? I've had nothing but good experiences at the FS on Manchester or the one in St Charles. The workers are indeed very "gamer" looking, but they seemed quite knowledgeable about the product lines, and were very good at customer service, asking me once if they could help me and then leaving me alone to make my purchase. One even told me they were having a discount at the auction and did I wish to put off my $30 purchase a couple days (which I declined. I needed that freaking vinyl grid!). YMMV, of course, but I'd definitely recommend either the St Charles or Manchester St. locations. I've never been to the others.
Sounds like the Fantasy Shop chain in STL.Edit: I finished reading the thread. Yeah you are talking about the Fantasy Shop chain.
The St. Charles location has the best people working in it, although there's a couple of lunkheads there. But being the biggest store, there's usually at least one good person on.
The Florissant location, on the other hand, has never recovered from moving north by the Schnucks store. It's just awful, it's also the store I had the run in with the chuckle head who told me to go to the warhammer 40k store.
Just as a note, the St. Charles location had the bases I wanted.
I use to hit the auction years ago, I haven't been in years. But some of my friends go and they call me if something comes up I want and ask me how much I would pay for it. Dave the owner is pretty funny though, i do miss that part of the auction. Just a bit of a drive for me to go up there when more often than not there is nothing I want.
Yeah, Dave's the only reason I even continued going to the store for the auctions. Him and his wife, who's almost as funny as he is. :)
