Hey guys, I'm detailing a little bit more of my world, and I got to thinking about the Elven Queen and King. I'm lookign for advice on powerful builds and maybe even a couple of magic items that only they would have.
For the Queen I'm going to use a Wizard/Fighter/Arcane Archer
and
For the King I'm leaning towards some kind of Druid/Barbarian build.
Any thoughts?
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Hey guys, I'm detailing a little bit more of my world, and I got to thinking about the Elven Queen and King. I'm lookign for advice on powerful builds and maybe even a couple of magic items that only they would have.
For the Queen I'm going to use a Wizard/Fighter/Arcane Archer
and
For the King I'm leaning towards some kind of Druid/Barbarian build.
Any thoughts?
First of all, the fact that you are statting them up basically implies that they can be killed, and that you are ok with that. If they are not likely to physically fight the PCs, don't bother doing anything more than figuring out what they are for flavor.
If, on the other hand, you foresee a boss fight with one (or both) of them, then statting them up is reasonable.
For the elf queen, don't use Arcane Archer because it is weak compared to options like the Eldritch Knight. You can always make her something else and then fluff it into Arcane Archer. I mention this because my current DM really likes Mystic Theurges and decided the group would fight one. The poor guy was soundly murdered, and despite being 2 levels higher than out ECL, he would have needed another 10 or so to pose a threat.
For the king, there is a lot of 3.5 splat prestige classes for druid/-, with the Bear Warrior coming to mind as good but not horribly broken. If you are not using 3.5 stuff, maybe make the king barbarian/oracle instead for rage prophet.
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First of all, the fact that you are statting them up basically implies that they can be killed, and that you are ok with that.
Speaking as a DM/GM, I have to disagree with this "implication". I like to know what the powers and abilities are for my really important NPCs regardless of whether or not I intend to use them as potential foes...
Pathfinder and 3.5 books are literally filled with examples of this...
Just because something has stats doesn't means it's meant for PCs to fight...
Nor, does everything with stats have to be optimized...
But that's just my two coppers...
YMMV...
-That One Digitalelf Fellow-
Best way to make a powerful build? Don't multiclass unless you have a prestige class worth taking.
My recommendation?
Queen= Wizard or Witch. You would expect a queen to be the best at what she does, or the King wouldn't want her. He's a king after all, and kings want the best. Unless you plan on going to epic levels, Arcane archers can't possibly cast the highest level magic, and you are going to need high level magic if your elven kingdom is going to survive. Elves don't have the numbers generally, they have to make up for it with power, and Elves make the most powerful Wizards and Witches out there, with their racial bonuses. Take advantage.
King= Guide Ranger/Horizon Walker. There is no greater warrior within the forest than this build. Outside of the forest, he isn't that great, but inside... watch out. Let me tell you how. Favored terrain, the horizon walker gets the equivalent of 8 terrain bonuses over 10 levels, and guide ranger gets one before he qualifies. At 18th character level (ranger6/hw/10/ranger2) if the king puts all of his bonuses into one terrain (forest for example) then while in that terrain, he gets +20 bonus on initiative checks and Knowledge (geography), Perception, Stealth, and Survival skill checks.
And because of Terrain Dominance he gets When dealing with creatures native to that terrain, the horizon walker treats his favored terrain bonus for that terrain as a favored enemy bonus (as the ranger class feature) against those creatures. This bonus overlaps (does not stack with) bonuses gained when fighting a favored enemy.
Then theres a fun little spell called instant enemy. Put it all together, and with a custom item that lets him cast instant enemy x times a day, he gets a +20 to attack and damage with every attack. Then, he can use whatever style you like, and destroy practically anything that he doesn't want in his kingdom.
Of course, any elf king should have a decent court, so you can just add some high level druids, archers, or whatever to suit your taste, but as far as power goes, you will want to go with those two.
Best way to make a powerful build? Don't multiclass unless you have a prestige class worth taking.
My recommendation?
Queen= Wizard or Witch. You would expect a queen to be the best at what she does, or the King wouldn't want her. He's a king after all, and kings want the best. Unless you plan on going to epic levels, Arcane archers can't possibly cast the highest level magic, and you are going to need high level magic if your elven kingdom is going to survive. Elves don't have the numbers generally, they have to make up for it with power, and Elves make the most powerful Wizards and Witches out there, with their racial bonuses. Take advantage.
King= Guide Ranger/Horizon Walker. There is no greater warrior within the forest than this build. Outside of the forest, he isn't that great, but inside... watch out. Let me tell you how. Favored terrain, the horizon walker gets the equivalent of 8 terrain bonuses over 10 levels, and guide ranger gets one before he qualifies. At 18th character level (ranger6/hw/10/ranger2) if the king puts all of his bonuses into one terrain (forest for example) then while in that terrain, he gets +20 bonus on initiative checks and Knowledge (geography), Perception, Stealth, and Survival skill checks.
And because of Terrain Dominance he gets When dealing with creatures native to that terrain, the horizon walker treats his favored terrain bonus for that terrain as a favored enemy bonus (as the ranger class feature) against those creatures. This bonus overlaps (does not stack with) bonuses gained when fighting a favored enemy.
Then theres a fun little spell called instant enemy. Put it all together, and with a custom item that lets him cast instant enemy x times a day, he gets a +20 to attack and damage with every attack. Then, he can use whatever style you like, and destroy practically anything that he doesn't want in his kingdom.
Of course, any elf king should have a decent court, so you can just add some high level druids, archers, or whatever to suit...
Very Impressive, Very Impressive Indeed, you have given me much to consider.
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Hey guys, I'm detailing a little bit more of my world, and I got to thinking about the Elven Queen and King. I'm lookign for advice on powerful builds and maybe even a couple of magic items that only they would have.
For the Queen I'm going to use a Wizard/Fighter/Arcane Archer
and
For the King I'm leaning towards some kind of Druid/Barbarian build.
Any thoughts?
Pathfinder has a companion called Elves of Golarion, and it has the elven queen in it. That might inspire you for some ideas for your own, but I do highly recommend magic heavy for the queen. Maybe instead of wizard how about sorcerer? With the fey bloodline?
The king I can see more or less as a ranger rather than a druid, and a fighter more than a barbarian.
i second Elven Sorcerer for the queen.
Nothing says power better then a high Chr queen, besides what would you marry as a king the dry wizard or the hot sorceress?
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I don't know why being born to rich, powerful people suddenly makes you an awesome character with loads of PC levels.
Give each of them 3 or 4 levels of aristocrat.
Unless your Elven society is actually a meritocracy of some sort and 'king' and 'queen' are just titles affixed to individual leaders appointed through acclamation or somesuch.
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I second Elven Sorcerer for the queen.
Nothing says power better then a high Chr queen, besides what would you marry as a king the dry wizard or the hot sorceress?
There are a lot of assumptions here that seem a little odd to me:
Kings and queens marry appropriately to form advantageous alliances for their kingdoms.
And is this a heavily patriarchal society anyway? In Golarion (the default world for PFRPG) the Elven queen is a lone ruler, it's implied that the firstborn gets to inherit, regardless of gender.
So, if she did have the choice, why would the Queen marry any boring ranger/fighter who doesn't understand her interest in the arcane arts?
And, for that matter, why is the sorceress hot? Why isn't the wizard? Charisma is power of personality, not hawtness.
I agree in that Elven society has always been described as very gender equal, if there is both a king and queen it would be a fair assumption they are equal in status.
I'd be inclined to make the elf queen a powerful witch and the king an eldritch knight and possibly arcane archer, presumably both chaotic good, since that is what most elves gravitate towards or not more than one step away from that without a good reason.
A barbarian class for a king/noble would not be my first choice, I'd stick with fighter or ranger.
For both I add a few Aristocrat levels, just to make them a bit tougher, I'd give them some magical protections as long as they are in their kingdom, possibly binding them to the land in the coronation ceremony and able to draw power from it. This could give them effectively slotless magical items or powerful possibly unique spell-like or supernatural abilities, like summoning a powerful guardian from the celestial realm.
Elf Queen witch 20 / Aristocrat 10
Elf King Ranger 2 / EK 10 / Wizard 5 / AA 3 / Aristocrat 10
Queen - Witch/Druid/mystic theurge (or hierophant if you allow 3.5)
let the queen be also the religious leader of your society.
King - Magus, or if you can't wait then go with the Ranger/Horizon Walker
he's the king so give him extras on protective items, contingent raise dead and the such, maybe an ancient pact with a mystical creature "ready to be summoned" lest the kingdom comes under peril, etc.
now the captain of the guard should be at least 20th level, take your pick, Cavalier/Sorcerer/Bladesinger, or perhaps go for Rogue/Fighter/Exotic Weapon Master, or even Ranger/Barbarian... for an even more interesting approach maybe tweak the samurai with some elven flavor and try to wash away the feudal orient
I really don't want either to have more then 18 levels, and yes I do allow 3.5 material.
The Reason I was thinking Barbarian is for the image I have for the King as a wild untamed man with leaves in his beard, while his mighty frame is swiming around a great axe. Now I could easily adjust this to fit the ranger, I'm just trying to step out of the "Elf Sterotype" a little bit.
Actually, why not make the queen a bard? They are extremely social and inspirational figures, well-skilled at courtly intrigue, versatile and not entirely without magical abilities. Being able to work with people can be even more appropriate for a noble than direct power. It's not like an elven monarch can't find a good archmage ;) - but finding someone as skilled at working with people as a bard can be quite the challenge. Whether it is spinning intrigues at a ball, giving the gathered army a rousing speech, or remembering secrets of the elven sages from long ago, a high-level bard can make an incredibly effective queen. It depends on just how civilized and urbane the elves in question are imo - the queen of an urbane, courtly society may be a court bard, trading inspirational skills to become even more skilled at intrigue, while the queen of a wild tribe may be a savage skald, traveling with her guard to battle where her heated oratory urges the warriors to reckless abandon.
If not, I'm generally leaning towards a sorcerer. Sorcerer works well due to the charisma involved, and a pure-blood elf (as a noble should be) may well have the blood of their fey/draconic/whatever ancestors coursing through her veins, giving her arcane power beyond a mortal's comprehension. Everyone can learn magic - but only a true noble can BE magic. Witchery involves dependence on an external power to give one magic abilities (the patron and the familiar), which a noble might find... distasteful, not to mention possibly dangerous.
For the king, I would actually suggest something more inspirational like a cavalier, but a more savage elven tribe could appreciate the raw power of a barbarian or druid. Still, I think it fits a monarch to be an inspirational figure, not just a great warrior. He may well BE a wild warrior, as much an elf as a force of nature - but you don't have to be "civilized" just because you have levels in fighter, cavalier or even paladin. If you go barbarian I suppose the mounted and beast (or perhaps even elemental) totems might work well, although I'd at least consider the chevalier PrC for some extra "heroism." Having a mount would certainly fit the image - I'd say a giant stag would be the best option for aesthetic reasons, but it depends on your taste :) .
I'm actually thinking of converting the Frenzied Berserker prestige class, according to my quick math he would have roughly a 46 str while in frenzy rage, and when you convert supreme power attack your looking at roughly a +6 damage for every -1 to atk (if you change it to fit current power attack rules)
So at 18th level he would be doing roughly 1d12+62/x3 when two handing a +5 greataxe.
Now as for the Inspiring King, well the Beserker does have Inspire Frenzy, which would increase the raw power of his elven warriors.
Eh, I'm not keen on the berserker for anyone in leadership position. It's a hard enough job surviving in a battle, I'd say, that you don't want to keep an eye on your boss trying to kill you when he runs out of victims. "Blood for the Bloody Handed God!" isn't exactly the kind of warcry that you want your king shouting. Go for it if you like it, it just feels kinda iffy to me.
Well it has to do with the theme I'm aiming for. The King was the chieftian of the wild elfs and married the Queen of the Elven Capital in order to allow his people to freely enter the city, and to bolster the Elven military ranks. So thats what I'm thinking some kind of Beserker, or at least rage profet. I still may go ranger; but I'll toss a couple of builds together and let everyone see what they like better
Elven Queen: Bard works well; the arcane duelist, court bard, and magician are good archetypes. For a more traditional sorcerer or wizard, sorcerer or wizard 6/fighter or ranger 1/eldritch knight 2+X/arcane archer 2 can provide a decent mix of spellcasting and ranged combat ability (gives up 3 levels from casting progression for a BAB of +3+1+2+2+X); the arcane, celestial, destined, dreamspun, fey, starsoul, and verdant bloodlines are probably the most appropriate for a sorcerer; the admixture, conjuration, divination, enchantment, enhancement, foresight, life, manipulator, and teleportation schools are probably the most appropriate for a wizard; the guide archetype for the ranger is probably more useful than the extra feat from fighter (especially with the ability to use spell trigger items with ranger spells like aspect of the falcon, barkskin, cure light wounds, longstrider, etc.).
Elven King: Barbarian/oracle (battle or nature)/rage prophet can work; the invulnerable rager and totem warrior (beast totem or spirit totem probably fit best) barbarian archetypes are probably the most appropriate. Other options include straight druid (melee-/wild shape-focused), druid (animal shaman) 6/horizon walker 1/nature warden, and straight ranger (beast master, shapeshifter, skirmisher, or spirit ranger); wild elf doesn't automatically mean barbarian/berserker.
Just a quick question to clerify the Rage Profet
He doesn't gain extra revlations, nor does he gain any other effects that a barbarian archtype will grant him correct?
Ex. Barbarian 2/ Oracle 5/ Rage Propfet 10 will not grand him DR 6, nor extra revaltions after the first 2 are selected
wild elf doesn't automatically mean barbarian/berserker.
That's good to remember. Just because you may be a barbarian or berserker culturally doesn't mean you have to only take barbarian levels.
Well here is my King, this is just is raging version, doing up his non raging stats now, but yea this is basicly him, note he's been augmented by the spirts of battle giving him divine bonus to his stats in the form of +4, +2, +4, +2, +4, +2. He might even be CR 19. Thoughts and feedback. Thanks
Warchief Amarandlon King of Elywin CR 18
Male Wild Elf Barbarian 2/Battle Orcale 6/ Rage Propfet 10
CG Medium Humanoid
Init +11; Senses low light vision; Perception +19
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Defense
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AC 35, touch 30, flat-footed 26 (+8 Armor,+8 Dex, +5 Deflection, +1 Dodge, +5 Natural, -2 Rage)
hp 264 (2d12+6d8+10d10+)
Fort +26, Ref +17, Will +25 (+2 vs. Enchantment)
Defensive Abilites See Invisability
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Offense
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Speed 50 ft.
Melee +5 Elven Curve Blade +32/+23/+18 (1d10+30/15-20 x2)
Ranged +3 Composite Longbow +31/+26/+21 (1d8+9/x3)
Special Attacks rage (18 rounds/day) rage powers (moment of clarity)
Spell like Abilities (CL 10)
1/day dancing lights, ghost sound, mage hand
Spells Known (CL 15, concentration +24)
6th (5/day) mass bulls strength, cure moderate wounds mass, heal, summon monster 6, shadow walk
5th (7/day) righteous might, cure light wounds mass, spell resistance, flame strike (DC 24), breath of life, dream
4th (7/day) wall of fire (DC 23), cure critical wounds, divine power, freedom from movement, restoration, dimensional anchor (DC 23), divination
3rd (7/day) magic vestment, cure serious wounds, remove disease, protection from energy, magic vestment, water walk, speak with dead
2nd (8/day) fog cloud, cure moderate wounds, spritual weapon, shield other, remove paralysis, entrall, hold person, augury
1st (8/day) enlarge person, cure light wounds, shield of faith, entropic sheild, command, obscuring mist, remove fear, unseen servant
0 create water, detect magic, stabilize, resistance, purify food and drink, mending, light, detect poison, read magic
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Statistics
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Str 40, Dex 26, Con 34, Int 16, Wis 22, Cha 26
Base Atk: +13; CMB:+28; CMD: 46
Feats: Power Attack, Cleave, Weapon Focus (Elven Curve Blade), Furious Focus, Improved Critical (Elven Curve Blade), Leap Attack, Improved Initiative, Iron Will, Greater Iron will, Greater Weapon Focus (Elven Curve Blade), Dodge, Extra Rage
Skills Acrobatics +18 (+28 Jumping), Climb +30, Diplomacy +17, Handle Animal +13, Heal +25, Intimidate +29, Knowledge (nature) +8, Knowledge (religion) +25, Perception +19, Sense Motive +19, Spell craft +22, Survival +11,
Languages: Common, Elven, Sylvan
SQ revlation (battlecry 3/day), Weapon Mastery, Telpathic Bond (Queen), Elven Immunities, Elven Magic, Orcales curse (Tongues)
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+8 Bracers of Armor
+3 Composite Longbow (+6 str bonus)
+6 Belt of the Physical Perfection
+6 Headband of Mental Prowless
+5 Cloak of Resistance
+5 Ring of Deflection
+5 Amulet of Natural Armor
Boots of Spring and Stride
Ring of Sustances and improved jumping
Wild
Forged in ages past by great Elven blacksmiths and enchanted with the soul of a powerful wild elf shaman, Wild as he became known only cares about one thing, and that is protecting the elven people
History: Not much is known about Wild except that he was a priest who believed in defending the elven people.
Personality: Wild is a quiet sword only speaking out to the wielder if he is of elven blood. He will reveal his presence only if the elf is of good nature and willing to defend the people that he himself has sworn to protect
Powers: Thirst is a +5 cold iron thundering elven curve blade. Defending the elven people is its special purpose, and it can cast stoneskin at will, but only when the weilder is in combat 3/day (CL 15). Finally whenever the weilder is on the verge of defeat the item will cast heal (CL 15) .
Alignment Chaotic good Int 10 Wis 14 Cha 20 Abilities telepathy, darkvision 120 ft. Cost 248,100 gp Ego 28