Kyller Tiamatson's page

Ok, tell me I haven't been doing it wrong ... So I got a 3rd level fighter and I multiclass to ranger ... would I add +1 to my base Fortitude or would I add +2, as per the 1st level Ranger? this rule seems kinda confusing to me.

Second: animal companions as they gain level they get increased ability scores, is there any reason why I would be forbidden to add the scores to Intelligence, thus having a speaking wolf at 20th level; and by the same token any reason why I could give him a skill like perform singing?

I am sure that having a class, alternate class or archetype named: Warlock, and mirroring Wizard's non-ogl, will not really be a big issue. Even if Paizo brought it to print since, the term warlock is not intellectual property of WOTC. As per using material of WOTC for your own games, I do that all the time. You might be surprised to hear my game setting is in "The Great Wheel" my player's already have problems with the cultists of Graz'zt, and Iggwilv is hot on their trail. One of the PC's in my campaign is an Incarnate, the prince of the main kingdom is an Azurite, there is a nation of Vasharan in the north, and The Order of the Seropaenes have just formed an allieance with the Order of the Planes-Militant... and all using Pathfinder rules and material :)

Answers in order:

1). Yes, that is correct.

2). Again you are correct. Your wildshape melds your armor because is a polymorph effect, but with the thousand faces you need to provide the means to hide your equipment.

3). You are correct, your dragonhide full plate acts as a masterwork full plate for all purposes of determining armor check, arcane failure, and max dexterity bonus.

4). yes, is still a full plate, heavy armor, so you do need those proficiencies.

5). Yes your speed drop to 20 ft. because you are a creature with a base speed of 30 ft. wearing a heavy armor.

6). No you do not get any racial bonuses or abilities except for low-light vision, darkvision 60 ft., scent or swim 30 ft. if applicable, in which case would only be the darkvision and a +2 Str bonus.

7). That sounds like an excellent idea, but it would be up to you.

Maybe no one will take notice to my two cents, but ...

There are a lot of ways of handling it:

1. Die with Honor - where a TPK is a tpk. No hard feelings, just the nature of life...

2. It was only a dream - a deus ex machina system where under the event of a tpk, all characters find themselves waking from a horrible nightmare, perhaps a threat from main antagonist, warning the PC's not to meddle with his plans.

3. Death is only the Beginning - in this scenario, some unearthly force decided to interfere with the PC's fate, but not by resurrecting them, but by granting them undeath/deathless/reincarnation/reincorporation (your pick), the motivation and purpose of this could be left unanswered as the PC's try to regain their lost life.

My most recent home-brewed world had a rather unusual baseline assumption that I heartily recommend to GMs who want a change of pace:

The genetic incompatibility of different species shall be respected.

I don't know exactly how it happened (maybe Planescape's to blame, or maybe the 3.0 Monster Manual was the real kickoff point), but the 'default assumption' has somehow become that the only thing keeping cyclops/vegepygmy babies from happening are a few minor cultural taboos. If you as a GM are designing a setting, I heartily recommend 'enforcing' a more realistic (not totally realistic, duh) sort of genetics on your world. Let's face it - if humans could hybridize as widely as the PF baselines assume they do, pureblooded humans would be extinct after this many centuries - nothing left but a bunch of half-(every other monster in the Bestiaries).

(Yes, this means no half-elves and no half-orcs.)

I like the emotional impact and bit of pathos this brings to interspecies romances. (Not that a temporary species change or limited wish might not be a work-around, but those are unusual circumstances.)

Discussion?

Personal anecdote on my PC: Kyller Tiamatson is a human, but his father is a dwarf and his mother is human. As such he has all the game stats of a human with a slight "burly dwarf" shape. As an added bonus, he gets +10 to use magic device checks to "emulate race" whenever he tries to use dwarven specific items, also because of this "special" heritage, he is allowed a re-roll on any craft (stone masonry), profession (miner), or knowledge (dungeoneering) checks, taking the best roll. As a drawback, his appearance is not easy on the eyes and people tend to distrust him whenever he is lands where dwarves are not welcomed. Not only that but he is married to Aislynn the Great Druid, a half elf. The couple has two daughters and both of them are considered half-elves... how each individual GM handles interracial relationships is up to him. A human/dwarf cross should be rare at best, in the case of my PC there were some unusual circumstances and his birth was the product of an alliance that forged the peace between the human/dwarf races. now for that cyclops/vegepygmy... let's say the crossbreeding needs to be kept within the same creature type the exceptions are: outsiders and dragons. But make it fun, create a system, a chart with percentiles and rates of success assigning each race a base score and factoring up any situational modifiers, then roll. If you make the roll you can build your character. I would suggest, certain traits and drawbacks should be assigned.

Sounds like the first Fast and Furious...or any of a dozen earlier flix.

Borrowing the plot line of a movie is one of the easiest ways of setting up an adventure sequence. Just change genres. I used to watch a Saturday afternoon western channel, jot down what passed for plot (some were real bad!) and adapt. My favorite was a 20+ index card 'Big Jake' knock-off that ended in a ruined labyrinth of some kind. I ran it in D&D, Champions, 3 different space games and once in Boot Hill. The last was a BIG mistake. Everyone caught on by halfway through and I was cold. Couldn't think of a single twist to add to the storyline.

Yep I was thinking Fast and the Furious. I have been catching up with this system lately, and this have helped me "rediscover" countless films which I have forgotten.

This is something probably a lot of people do already. I would like to read some ideas and experiences with stuff like this. My latest pet project involves a homebrew quasi-darksun setting, from which I'm borrowing a lot of material. Namely, the silt sea, silt skiffs, city states, powerful kings and templars a lot of the weapons and Muls. My movie adaptation ... in this world there is a very strong law enforcement body, but poverty is abound. Famine, disease, madness are rampant, many have become renegades, outlaws, and brigands. The largest routes of commerce and lightning rails (borrowed from Eberron) have been hit by a band of expert skiff-sailing bandits. A young gunslinger, is appointed to infiltrate the local clandestine skiff racing circuits to find clues that would lead to the assailants. Just for fun, guess the movie...

Looks like a decent oracle archetype. The best thing about archetypes is that you can always tinker the base class a little bit for some exquisite flavor and avoid all the "lining everything just right" of the prestige classes.

I have used the incarnum classes, the nine sword classes and the binder & shadowcaster with moderate success, it takes quite some work but it is worth it. My main concern is how to replace the concentration as a skill effectively, especially when dealing with a lot of the Sword Sage stuff. Any suggestions? (not as per the spell)

Lazy GM-ing at it's worst! Poor little GM can't handle detect magic. (Nystul's) magic aura, nondetection, all work wonders against this kind of stuff. A long time ago one of my groups devised a house rule that allows magic users to spend extra components or additives to suppress the auras of the items or area effects they created, the trumping effect was any caster with higher level could detect it with a caster level check.

Saying that "your own magical aura gets in the way of detecting the aura of the sword" is like saying "I cant hear you over my own heartbeat, blood flow and breathing pattern", any one could follow someone's conversation even if there is another group of people talking in the vicinity.

So the PC's: an eclectic lot of scoundrels, rogue/sorcerer, ranger/bard, witch, and oracle/wizard/artificer; are positively fed up with a gang of centaur barbarians who happen to be stalking the PC's and then punk them and steal their hard earned loot whilst they're at their worst (i.e. on the aftermath of big battles). The spellcasters happened to have expended most of their "significant" spells, most of the ammunition (the ranger is an archer type with low strength), the witch is on single digits, no "cure" potions at hand, then they happen to be carrying the loot back home. The said band of 6 centaur barbarians, led by a half-dragon centaur, just comes by and alleviates the load of the team ...

The guys just happen to be fed up and won't take it anymore. They device to find a village idiot, fascinate him, use some enchantments and arm this idiot to the teeth ... but with cursed equipment, lots of it! they even stuff a bag with strong poisons and label the bottle in the likes of "cure moderate wounds" "bull strength" "heroism" ... etc. Their plan to convince the idiot (through spell and a very well placed bluff check) that he is a legendary mercenary hired to kill the centaur gang... I imagine you can see where this is going. So if you were the DM, would you allow such conduct? Would you let your players pull such a dirty trick, or you think this strategy is just a fair response to months of bullying?

Just for the record: The witch is CN, the Oracle/wiz/artf. is NE, the ranger/bard is the "nicest" being a very loose CG, the rogue/sorcerer is N.

I've been looking through the core book for the last couple of days, trying to find out whether elves sleep or not.

I know they are immune to sleep effects, and that in 3.5, they would 'trance' (during which they were still partially aware of their surroundings) for 4 hours a night instead of sleeping for 8.

However, i can't find eny referance to this in the core book. So, can anyone give me a book/page referance to ANYTHING that clarifies this one way or the other?

Thanks in advance for answering my stupid question!

First, let me state that there are no stupid questions, just stupid guys too scare to make the question or stupid guys that would make fun of you for a question.

I have not found any "core" material for Pathfinder which would shed any light whereas elves sleep. My two cents: Elves do sleep, otherwise child-raising would be a miserable stage in an elf's life. In other words, I'd like to think that elves of "age" could choose not to sleep and trance instead with the same results. This ability would be less "racial" and more to do with diet and psychology. The immunity to sleep effects would be more associated to their early age magical studies, as they are more familiar to resist certain spells, in the "default" campaign your elves train to avoid sleep spells because they could be one of the most disastrous "non-damaging" spells. But, as a GM you could rule that the elves in your campaign could just develop an immunity to other spell "effect" like fear for example.

it is best assumed that to understand magic missile you would need to understand it's greater cousin: Wall of Force.

It is a "force" that renders an area of open space impregnable by making the electrons in such area just repel anything that would try to cross it much like a real wall, but with the "air". Magic missile could be understood as an encapsulated version of wall of force on which a pea-size amount of "air" is affected to repel anything in it's path.

it is normal to tantalize with bringing our fantasies to "reality" but in all truth, our world does not function in the PFRPG way. RPGs are at best a simplification of a narrative situation. We have created rules to ensure consistency and congruence. For example "cold" is not an energy but the effect of heat loss. For decades science have pondered "cold elecro-conductivity" yet this is quite impossible. Since loss of heat produces loss of movement by the electrons, thus less conduction...

Killing in real world is wrong, but if you are under attack you would do it. Would you be evil? Our government system legalizes weapons, most of them, like the mini-gun are not intended for hunting or "self- defense". Would our government be evil? I know I'm going to catch a lot of flame for this comments, but like stated above: the scenarios are not evil ... unless his motivations were evil. My PC (a CG human ranger/fighter/ wizard/eldritch knight) would do the same, and actually have done comparable, his alignment was never jeopardized...

The following is an excerpt from a short story I wrote about a character I DM'd a lot of time ago:

Once, a great hero for the elves of Evermeet, Heimdall Celenaress became a notorious adventurer. Along some figures of renown, like Morphix, the would-be king-lizard, the powerful Lancelot Arial Zerphdien, Teleri Morwel the eventual chosen of Mystra and sergeant Nottingham Darkholmes of the Mercykillers. Heimdall traveled to Sigil where he learned about the planes and became member of the Transcendent Order. With secret assignment from the order he hired mercenaries to track and investigate the murders in the Town of Crux. During the events that had the band following the trace of a puzzling god-slayer, their investigation took them to a forgotten castle in Lovelost, where the party used cunning and power to overcome obstacles and solve the labyrinthine puzzle of the castle. During such adventure, Heimdall and Lancelot came to blows for the love of Teleri; this fight was brutal but not fatal. Heimdall abandoned the party when it was clear to him that the mission was compromised by the strain in the party. One wrong turn and Heimdall became lost, soon to be trapped by a fateful cave-in. Heimdall was divided from his group. An unidentified presence blocked all likely scrying attempts to locate the sun elf. His comrades, buried him symbolically, and continued their journey. Abandoned and trapped, Heimdall gave into hatred and self-reflection, and then he felt the call of that which lurks below. For weeks Heimdall traveled and sought the exit of his imprisonment on this foul forgotten dungeon. Surviving on a diet of fungi and vermin, Heimdall eventually felt his sanity escape from his hands, and then he found it. Starved and deprived, Heimdall found a secret shrine of the forgotten. Far from the exit he sought, he found the lost temple of Cabiri, an entrapped Obyrith lord, which for ages had consorted with the Elder Evils of the Far Realm. Manned by a terribly sick and mangy arcanaloth, the temple had been forgotten over six centuries. The primordial cultures who build it, summoned the yugoloth for defense, but a rival tribe brought them to annihilation. With nothing to lose, Heimdall gave up his name and past life, his memories of his friends and his hope, sealing his destiny with his own soul. He learned the secrets of soul binding from the ancient, nearly mummified arcanaloth. Heimdall learned to call upon Amon the fallen god, Balam the heretic and Cabiri the watchful master; no other way to go he learned with old tomes the art of pact making. Becoming a binder, he tried to learn as much as he could from the vestiges of the lost souls. His current path leads him to seek his old comrades for a still mysterious motivation to him, but as long as it makes sense to his masters, he is in for the ride.

I am looking to make a wizard who has discovered a book containing the sanity shattering secrets of the old one. Obsessed with the beings form the dark tapestry. What feats/class features/spells and other things of the sort can help to emphasize a wizard gone mad searching for secrets in books never meant to be read.

Are you trying to stay canon or are you willing to cross to old 3.5?

I still call it D&D because that is what it feels like to me. 4th Edition is not D&D to me... Heck, GURPS feels more like D&D to me than 4E.

Which of these would be acceptable uses of a Wish?

1) "I want [creature]'s Will save reduced by 20 for a single round."

2) "I want [creature]'s Spell Resistance reduced by 20 for a single round."

3) "I want to cancel all of [creature's] Spell-Like Abilities for a single round."

4) "I want to prevent all forms of teleportation, gates, summoning, or planar travel within a 120' radius centered on [creature] for 3 rounds."

Assume that [creature] is not a god, demon lord, archdevil, or equivalent. Permissible?

Doug M.

I actually agree with keeping it in character terms no metagame. I think it could fly somewhat ...

so... what would happen if the spellcaster belongs to a race which DO lay eggs? Harpy and xill come to mind...

You are basing your shadow demon inspired on Paranormal Activity (1 & 2) i presume. Not a bad idea to put the master of the unseen hand PrC. But I may suggest my own conclusion, based on the observations it would seem that the "demon" afflicting Katie's family is actually a Night Hag...

I love it! my wife plays a succubus who was in the service of Merrshaulk and then "abducted" by the forces of Dispater. In the game she became pretty much the whore of Hell, and caused so much mayhem that she eventually attracted the unwanted attention of Asmodeus. One reoccurring joke was that she would go to Cainia to consult some matters with Mphistopheles, he would give the advice, but charge his services with sex. Ol'flames being of quasi-deity status would "sex her to unconsciousness". She would wake up in the courtyard of Dispater's tower all mauled up with only a handful of hp left and a "little gift" usually a minor magical item with some pesky drawback. LOL

I've always likened hp to your combat ability to avoid fatal blows. As you grow stronger you gain more hp which makes it "harder" to deal a blow like that. If the enemy is helpless severing a head is covered by the rules of coupe de grace, the reason why enemies with longer heads have a harder time to protect their neck is just because of the size. Then take into consideration that the hydra is effectively using the heads as weapons, engaging them against the sharp swords and axes. You could try to severe the head of a 1st level commoner, just roll an attack roll declaring how you swing and where are you aiming, if the attack roll is successful and the commoner is reduced to -10, congrats! you have a commoner's head to display as a symbol of your viciousness...

Paladin archer, honorable ... lets see this scenario:

setting, midnight, citadel compound home base for "baddies", a handful of children have been kidnapped by the psycho cult leader to sacrifice to Moloch, Cthulhu, the four horse men or the flying spaghetti monster (take your pick). Time is pressing and the children will be slain within the next few hours ... now lets see which hero is more efficient:

The fighter and the rogue are tunnel ratting through the sewers trying an assault from below (the rogue is more thinking on a swift escape through the tunnels)... or
The oracle and the sorcerer scry the interior of the citadel and preparing for a good ol' teleport-summon monsters/create illusions-two or three lightning bolts-(grab the kids)-teleport back to safety... or
The wizard and the monk use passwall-stinking cloud-flurry of blows to the guards-open cell (get the kids) and fly away on the flying carpet ... or
The ranger uses "archery" kills the sentries atop the wall, he and the druid crash a Roc through the wall, cast creeping doom on the guards, smash the lock with a well placed hammer, grab the children, are engaged by the boss baddie, whic the ranger replies by shooting his repeating crossbow through his face, magically heal the roc and fly away, not before casting a final "earthquake" on the citadel... or
The paladin and the cleric knock to the gates "<bam, bam, bam> open the doors to this hole of naughtiness! I challenge thee to a duel-to submission, hand over the illegally obtained young folk, come out with your hands in the air and we shall take thee to just trial in front of a legally minded magistrate!"...

which style reflects what the god would prefer this situation to be handled?

what's his alignment? if he's just a CN for example he might act on whim/instinct. I used to have a player like this, and a whole bunch of crazy $#!+ ended up happening to his character. In my scenario this was a lythari barbarian with a Int dumb stat of 5, and a Wis of 9. my approach was to play him amnesic as far as the player thought, but in reality he was a lobotomized specimen. Thus his name was Lobo, because of a small broken piece of tile he found when he first woke up.

Because gods can and will die. Remember the poor clerics of Maanzecorian when Orcus did him off? whatever becomes of clerics if their Big Guy drifts on the astral? They loose their cleric abilities, unless they jump ship. On the other hand not even the Lady of Pain can kill the concept of Valor or Disease, for example.

P.S.

BTW, the effect of the One Ring, which provides invisibility, as portrayed by PJ's film version resembles more "etheral jaunt"

Marvel Universe's Sue Storm not only become invisible but she also can project a "force field" the rough equivalent of a wall of force or a globe of invulnerability (at will if you mind)

The D&D/PF universe is a high magic world where any adventurer seeing some "floating object" or hearing some minor unerring sound should slap out his nearest magic detection device/spell, I don't know any fighter who would not pick blind-fight at the earliest most convenient opportunity, and now that wizards can do cantrips at will, detect magic is a must! Hell, I could even visualize the druid's animal companion or witch's familiar getting startled as soon as some "invisible" sneaky wizard get close enough.

most fiends can detect you invisible. invisibility does not bypass spells like alarm. invisibility is perfectly fine, now if you are thinking of a uber powerful invisibility spell I would most likely suggest something like this:

Perfect Vanish
School Illusion; Level sorcerer/wizard 9
Casting Time 1 swift action
Components S
Range personal
Target caster
Duration 1 hr/level, or until dismissed
Saving Throw Fortitude negates (harmless); Spell Resistance no

with a swift motion you become utterly invisible, remaining so until desired. the invisible caster can use any actions while invisible, creatures with blind-sight or tremor sense could locate the caster and possibly attack him, but not end the effect. perfect vanish masks one's odor making you invisible even from scent. invisibility purge can temporarily suppress the effect but the caster can resume his invisibility the next round as a swift action.

The complexity and disparate view points expressed in this thread just reflects events in history like the Nicaean Council (the council which tailored what would become the Christian faith).

I wonder if we will ever agree enough to write the bible....

Queen - Witch/Druid/mystic theurge (or hierophant if you allow 3.5)

let the queen be also the religious leader of your society.

King - Magus, or if you can't wait then go with the Ranger/Horizon Walker

he's the king so give him extras on protective items, contingent raise dead and the such, maybe an ancient pact with a mystical creature "ready to be summoned" lest the kingdom comes under peril, etc.

now the captain of the guard should be at least 20th level, take your pick, Cavalier/Sorcerer/Bladesinger, or perhaps go for Rogue/Fighter/Exotic Weapon Master, or even Ranger/Barbarian... for an even more interesting approach maybe tweak the samurai with some elven flavor and try to wash away the feudal orient

I don't know how you would take this but, how about "heavens" are the highest unreachable heights of the stratosphere of your world, whereas Hell might be the planet core, the demons could come from the plane of nightmares, the quilipoth (sp) might reside in the realm of madness (akin to the far realm). The proteans, inevitables, aeons could be all extraterrestrials from other planets, whereas, azatas and agathions would be "mortal" heralds of the gods in the world.

the idea of a mithril chain armor with some properties similar to the celestial armor is tempting, but as a GM I have to warn:

1. watch for game balance, don't end up giving an item so powerful that in order to "balance" you have to slam the titans at them.

2. PC's creativity and ingenuity should be rewarded, rather than a min/max-er's greed.

3. To me is sounds more worth it to create a whole new armor, an intelligent armor with a special purpose perhaps?....

Is your game, by all means do as thy will yet harm none.

ooh but then what happens if the PC is in a world where normal time does not pass, or an outer plane, like the limbo or the astral? how does one keep track of "time" on a plane like the deepest cave in the plane of shadow? what if a PC is knocked unconscious and wakes up not knowing when ...? My guess this is for the GM to adjudicate.

BTW as a trivial note, I am an adamant adherent to the old planescape material and the great wheel cosmology as per Saint Gary Gygax

it just seems to me like your GM is "preventing" you from entering the door. or your party just pissed him off enough. otherwise the solution to this dilemma is simpler than you might expect...

how about halfling, gnome or kobold familiars with the Greater Improved Familiar feat (Int 16, Cha 14, caster level 18th)? or perhaps the mighty Aeonic bloodline? the Deific bloodline? or the Alien Orphanbloodline (which enables the sorcerer to planeshift to and from any Outer Plane in the PF cosmology or the ol'great wheel, or even the crappy 4th edition one? the Amazonic tradition bloodline which enables the female sorcerer to gain a male commoner familiar (use the stats of the village idiot presented in the Game Mastery Guide)?

...all of this is just silly jokes from me, but if you feel like implementing them into your campaign as house rules....

you see, everything being situational. if the LE cleric is just summoning the bone devil as a back up and the PC's have already a tactical advantage, I would rule no. but on the other hand if the PC's just beat up their butts retrieving the lost child of the princess from the evil cultists and they are well under their 50% capacity, and the bone devil was just a "random encounter" while exiting the damned ruins, I would just allow it, mostly for flavor... on a situation like this i would just pull some "divine blessing" going on, etc...

If you are familiar with old school planescape, I suggest introducing a (up till now) secret organization, akin to the Athar. Think academicians, who discover of the incident and invite the character to their circle, immediately denouncing the pantheons as a bunch of charlatans, or even perhaps, since you actually brought it up, Asmodeus is trying to control and take advantage of this situations. Gods, and I mean all deities ever worshiped in the "real" world have seldom been what Lawful Good is supposed to be ... yes even Yahweh who unleashed the angel of death upon the babies of Egypt. The rules since TSR's 1st edition were clear that deities are above and beyond traditional alignment. They might be labeled as lawful, chaotic, evil, good or some neutral, but in reality this moral compass affects the lesser forms of life (due to the gods' omnipotence and self perceived eternity)

Spell damage, for one, anything else? Adamantine?

like it has previously stated, adamantine won't bypass DR#/-, but while you are not killing your dreaded opponent, might as well destroy anything he holds dear, like his armor, weapons, and keep sundering about anything you see this foe is fond of. To some enemies poverty is worse than death....

well we are talking about one of the most hybridiest hybrids that have ever hybrided a hybrid. Depending on how you build your druid, you could be playing a frontline melee combatant with boat loads of HP or a trick battlefield spellcaster, shifting the ground under their opponent's feet. Oh, and all of them can heal themselves if so prepared. Need a scout? wildshape into a mouse or an air elemental.

With all that said, no class is special snowflake these days. While some classes are better in some roles, most classes if built well enough can cover something they are usually meant to cover. Even with spellcasting, usually somewhat exclusive, anybody with a high UMD and a wand or two can cover some of it.

In the end it matters little that druids can take on a lot of roles. What matters is are you having fun playing in a party of 4 druids.

The fun factor is covered, even on my part as GM. The theme is mostly the old cliche of the protectors of nature. Four children from across the world taking on against the mighty evil technocrat empire. They'll be very busy and have all their fun, until they actually reach the capital ... hint, hint ...gunslingers....

They can't just grab a silver dagger or use silver arrows like a lot of other classes can.

Also, druids don't get access to high threat ranges weapons(falchions, rapiers, etc) which also help in overcoming DR.

I haven't found anything in the game mechanics that disallow a druid from using or wielding silver/adamantine/cold iron weapons. Indeed, many an elven druid in my campaign have just purchased a long bow with silver arrows, and I do know of a certain druid in my campaign who took a level of fighter to burn the bonus feat on two-weapon fighting, and had both a +2 cold iron scimitar and a +1 silver kukri, she was a storm to behold!

Also, I think i remember something about magical weapons being able to bypass DR just by sheer magic, something like a weapon of +1 or higher ignores the DR X/special material or something like this....

This is not a complaint, but it is my opinion that a party with 4 druids can own roughly 80% of the campaigns thrown at them? What is your take at this? Starting at the 6th level the druid gains the wildshape ability to trans-morph into a fire elemental, thus trolls means very little to her anymore. Likewise, the ability to fly pretty much kills the challenge of any long distance to be covered. Add to this the druid's decent attack rolls, the good weapon selection, an animal companion, summonings and healing magic, not to mention stuff like heat metal, call lightning and the mighty sirocco, and you've got an unstoppable army. I mean I would think it twice before jumping in front of a druid... less four of them.

I don't want to sound naiive, but what about the druid with heat metal/chill metal? He could make the gunslinger's precious firearms his worst enemy. Plus one the gun is ruined, what does he have to be awesome?

I believe that both the ninja and the gunslinger could benefit from an approach more closely resembling the maneuver system of the old Tome of Battle from 3.5. I recognize that the wounds between Paizo and W's haven't healed yet (and as such I have taken Paizo's side), but the Bo9S had something going on. Well it was spells disguised as sword blows, but so what?, this approach could help by leaps and bounds the broken grit/deed system. Another optimum change could be trading the second level ability (tough and brave) for the bonus feat Quick Draw, then Rapid Reload, Precise Shot, Far Shot, and cap it off with an ability to automatically confirm critical.

Note to the Moderator: My apology if I actually infringed TM or Copyright,I actually do not understand the legalities too well.