I have a question concerning how much ammunition a weapon magazine holds in Starfinder 2e. A machine gun magazine holds 20 rounds (Core, pg 266). When you upgrade the weapon (to tactical, advanced, etc.) does the magazine hold more rounds?
Same question for a laser pistol - it normally holds 10 charges. When you upgrade it to tactical, you can use a tactical battery (which holds 20 charges). Does that mean the laser pistol can now hold 20 charges?
If the answer is "no" to question 1 and "yes" to question 2, it seems odd that weapons that use batteries improve their capacity, but projectile weapons do not.
If energy weapons do not improve their magazine capacity, what is the point of buying higher level batteries?
Hi there,
PAZ42 wrote:
If the answer is "no" to question 1 and "yes" to question 2, it seems odd that weapons that use batteries improve their capacity, but projectile weapons do not.
my answer would indeed be no to 1 and yes to 2.
Since energy weapons can "hold" batteries up to their grade (pg 254 player core).
My explanation for energy weapons somewhat scaling in "magazin" size while projectile weapons don´t would be that higher graded batteries have a higer energy density which allows to store more energy in the same size of a battery.
And shrinking projectiles might render them useless.
Also I admit to a certain degree, that some projectile weapons might be able to simply hold larger magazines. But these do not exist (yet ?).
But if there were differten sizes of magazines you would need an additional entry for every projectile weapon with the largest possible magazine size (just imagine a semi-auto pistol holding a 100 shot drum magazine if no limits would exist).
So not scaling magazines might be the easiest way to go.
Pyrius_42 wrote: Hi there,
PAZ42 wrote:
If the answer is "no" to question 1 and "yes" to question 2, it seems odd that weapons that use batteries improve their capacity, but projectile weapons do not.
my answer would indeed be no to 1 and yes to 2.
Since energy weapons can "hold" batteries up to their grade (pg 254 player core).
My explanation for energy weapons somewhat scaling in "magazin" size while projectile weapons don´t would be that higher graded batteries have a higer energy density which allows to store more energy in the same size of a battery.
And shrinking projectiles might render them useless.
There is a slight increase in bulk when you start going to higher-capacity batteries, so not quiiiiiiiite the same? I think it just goes from -- to L though, so not really much of a difference unless you're carrying loads of batteries around with you.
Pyrius_42 wrote: Also I admit to a certain degree, that some projectile weapons might be able to simply hold larger magazines. But these do not exist (yet ?).
But if there were differten sizes of magazines you would need an additional entry for every projectile weapon with the largest possible magazine size (just imagine a semi-auto pistol holding a 100 shot drum magazine if no limits would exist).
So not scaling magazines might be the easiest way to go.
My guess is that, if/when we do get larger mags for projectile weapons, they'll either have fixed increases, so the next-highest increases mag capacity by 2, or 5, or 10, or they'll work off percentages, like 20%, 50%, 100%. I also imagine they'll be bulkier than batteries are, but ultimately hold more shots.
As far as I can tell - battery ammunition and chemical ammunition magazines come in larger tiers, but projectile ammunition magazines do not.
Battery Weapons: "Weapons listed with charges represent battery-powered weapons. These weapons hold charges equal to the maximum charges of each battery and can use batteries up to the same grade as a weapon (so a tactical weapon can use a commercial or tactical battery)."
Chemical Weapons: "Some weapons instead utilize chemicals (chems), which are sold in tanks and otherwise function as batteries."
Projectile Weapons: "Most projectile weapons have magazines that hold a maximum number of projectiles, which act as ammunition. Depending on the specific type of weapon, projectiles could be bolts, darts, flechettes, rounds, or other appropriate ammunition. Most projectile weapons use rounds, while most injection weapons use darts."
Yes, that does seem strange to me. I'm not sure why projectile weapon magazines don't have higher tiers.
Hi,
Perpdepog wrote:
There is a slight increase in bulk when you start going to higher-capacity batteries, so not quiiiiiiiite the same? I think it just goes from -- to L though, so not really much of a difference unless you're carrying loads of batteries around with you.
I agree.
I noticed this too, but to be honest in my opinion bulk does not equal size in this case. Just compare a cubic foot of lead to a cubic foot of aluminum. Same weight (obviously ;-) ) but differnt size.
Pyrius_42 wrote: Just compare a cubic foot of lead to a cubic foot of aluminum. Same weight (obviously ;-) ) but differnt size. of course the other way around...
Pyrius_42 wrote: just imagine a semi-auto pistol holding a 100 shot drum magazine if no limits would exist Like this one?
Energy weapons do scale their capacity. Projectile weapons will eventually have their own advantage in the form of special ammo. (We'll actually get some in an AP this year.) I wouldn't be surprised to see an ammo-focused archetype at some point.
Chems are in a rough spot I feel though.
Bullets are dirt cheap. It's bookkeeping, but I mean, dirt. cheap. Often have good magazine sizes too. Like even the rocket launcher? 8 shots before Reload 1.
Batteries are the most expensive but they're refillable and they come in bigger sizes at higher levels. This means they quickly have very big functional magazines since you get double base capacity at 2 and quadruple at 4. Most weapons are only using 1-2 charges per shot so 40 charges will last a long time. The least bookkeeping as well - like two batteries at level 4 and you're set for life.
Chems? Chems are magazines you can't reload partially. They're much more expensive than projectiles but the only advantage you have over them is bigger tanks at higher levels. Smaller tanks than batteries at all tiers but level 4 and the pricing is wonky. So you get the bookkeeping of bullets and some of the cost of batteries. And while the level 4 ones have the best credits/shot I think in the long run you'll spend more on chems than batteries if you're playing from 4-10 the whole way since those two batteries I mentioned? You get a whopping 4 tanks of 40 chems each for that. Best case, 80 total shots of a weapon before chems cost you more.
|
1 person marked this as a favorite.
|
Yeah, for now anything that's not batteries is a major downside.
|
1 person marked this as a favorite.
|
thistledown wrote: Yeah, for now anything that's not batteries is a major downside. Honestly that seems pretty reasonable to me. Batteries higher up front cost but designed for reuse and makes sense that higher grade ones are simply denser energy storage units so much easier to scale capacity if you throw money at it.
Bullets cheap old tech but they are physical objects so you can't just scale them like a battery. They take the size they to do the expected amount of damage. I do expect to see things like weapon mods for bigger clips or ability to hook up to a separate ammo drum to be available especially with power armor.
Chemical launchers are also kinda understandable. If it is a gas/fluid higher tech storage could be storing them at higher and higher pressures to jam more in there or using more efficient chemicals. The price also sort of makes sense just a lot messier/more pricy to deal with than bullets but you are getting the ability to apply various other damage types like cryo/corrosive/fire with an analog weapon.
Give bigger clip and mag sizes nao.
bullet should get extradimentional magazine or something similar
otherwise everyone will be using tech weapon at mid level or higher
Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Personally, I would suspect that we will get one or more SF2e weapon upgrades similar to the SF1e manufacturing (create ammunition out of UPBs instead of reloading) and/or energetic (use a battery to fire "bullets/darts/etc." of telekinetic "force") fusions. Possibly in the upcoming tech book with the mechanic and technomancer classes.
Also, there will likely be more "special" types of ammunition, like the Pow! ammunition in Guilt of the Graveworld, to supplement (expensive) adamantine, cold iron, silver, and skymetals.
Recent threads in Starfinder General Discussion
|
