RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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How about some disgusting parasite, miniscule and squamous, native to the swamp water around the Naga's lair. One of the Naga's friendly suggestions to her charmed victims is to drink the brackish water, which infests them with the parasite, which maintains the charm effect indefinitely.
When the naga dies, the parasites lose control over their hosts, who spend an unpleasant round retching the things out of their system.
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the players will definitely want to know where she got that ability...
First I want to say that N1 is a great module, I love it.
Second, who cares if the players want to know where she got the ability, maybe it is something the players are not meant to know.
This has been the big problem for me as a GM. 3.5 and Pathfinder pretty much put in the assumption with all the skills and abilities that the players will have knowledge of a lot of which I as a Old school gamer thinks should be a mystery.
Players do not need to know why or how a lot of what goes on in the adventure came to be or is unless it is specific to the storyline and progressing it.
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First, Douglas Niles deserves a metal for writing my favorite AD&D module ever.
And, yeah, I have to go with bigkilla on this one. That's my biggest beef against 3x/PF. It could be a power granted by an evil deity, it could be a mutation unique to Explictica, who knows? Not everything has to fit into formula.
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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I see where derek and bigkilla are coming from, and I agree with them to a degree. It's my style (which may not be for everyone) to have answers to this kind of thing worked out ahead of time, even if the players never find out what's going on.
Because, I think, it makes a difference. If the long duration is the gift of an evil god, then the players might be able to disrupt it through getting the naga to violate one of the god's taboos. If it's something common to all dark nagas, then they'll be forewarned,should they run into another such monster later in the campaign.
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I would also like to convert this excellent module to Pathfinder.
Platinum, how is your conversion going?
One thing that I'm mulling over is the fact that a Spirit Naga is CR 9 and this adventure is for much lower levels (1-3). I'm thinking maybe the newly updated and converted Pathfinder version should maybe be for levels 5-7?
Or, I might use the Young template in the Bestiary to make the Spirit Naga a little less powerful (CR8) and make the adventure for levels 4-6 ...
Anyone else have any thoughts on the CR9 Spirit Naga?
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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Marc,
I'd rather keep the Spirit Naga at CR 8 or 9, and I'd certainly like to keep the adventure set for low-level / beginning PCs. But characters rise in level much faster in Pathfinder than in AD&D. If the party starts out at 1st Level, they might well be 2nd Level by the time they have to take the fight to the cult, and 3rd by the time they reach the Spirit Naga.
If you add in a side adventure (see below), the party could be 4th Level.
My choice would be to give the PCs a couple of serious situational advantages. That is, keep the monster's CR high, but lower the Encounter Level. Overcoming an EL 6 or 7 showdown is tough for a 4th Level party but plausible.
Another consideration: AD&D doesn't have anything like the Sense Motive skill. A character with that skill and a reasonable Wisdom will be able to suss out exactly what's wrong with the folks of Orlane fairly quickly. So, I would recommend confusing the point a little with a red herring plot. Put another wicked force -- maybe agents of a near-by temple, sent to investigate the situation -- into play. In this way, you can muddy the waters, require the party to sort out the various factions, and give the heroes another series of encounters before the final showdown in the swamp.
I think the simplest method would be to give the naga a level of sorcerer and say that it's casting Charm Monster instead. 8 days is close enough to permanent for government work. :-)
The question then is, "How useful do you want that wand of Protection from Evil to be?"
I admit that I haven't read the module; does it fall apart if you're able to rescue a villager without killing the naga first?
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I think the simplest method would be to give the naga a level of sorcerer and say that it's casting Charm Monster instead. 8 days is close enough to permanent for government work. :-)
I think this would work within the premise of the module - which is a great and underappreciated one. I remember the blast my players had when I ran this when it first came out.
So up the sorcerer level by 1 and then apply a diminishing template to bring the CR down – not the young template though.
Also some of the higher ranking members may have actually turned reducing the need to recast the spell since their loyalty is true. I don't have the mod in front of me, but it could actually help on the moral dilemma/killing charmed people side of the issue if some of the human henchmen are actually evil and stand to gain power or wealth for serving the Naga.
I like the idea of parasites acting as a kind of battery prolonging the Charm. It's easy, and why not? It's a side effect of the Naga's magic combined with the Naga's decaying molted snakeskin in the water of her lair. Even if the PCs connect the dots, Miss Ex is dead and molts no more! :D
Good luck running this ancient classic!
GNOME
Now back to the original question, how does she have this great charming power? Magic. If a Wish spell (or ring) is not good enough for having given her this obscene power, then make up some obscure artifact that she posessed for a time, but has conveniently lost prior to moving (perhaps forcefully) to this location. You should stray away from divinely given powers though as she is trying to become a god herself....and the gods do not really help you do that.
I'm with Bill on this. Players of mine always wanted to know the in's and out's of why stuff works the way it works and why this monster can fly or how that monster can do this.
Answer I always use: You are applying Real Life rules to Magic. Stop doing that.
After that it really doesn't matter what you do, if the Big Bad Evil Guy needs to be able to use Mass Charm Person for months at a time they can do that as the story requires it. Make the plot device within reason and for the PCs to find a way around it. Providing the PCs with a feeling like they are slowly being consumed or enthralled. Give them headaches, nosebleeds, nausea, or other ailments where they assume their mind is being controlled but they are fighting it off. They are the hero's after all so give them a bit of a break. Building up that way lets them see that they might turn into one of the Charmed.
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I would LOVE to take a look at them. Do you do them yourself?I have 3.x conversions of Saltmarsh and Cult of the Reptile god if you need them?
Mike
Me also. I decided to start tackling some of the old AD&D 1e stuff myself, and seeing what others have done to address (as Chris Mortika pointed out in the Tomb of Horrors thread) the differences in player attitudes between the editions, not necessarily the mechanics.
You could use the meta-magic rods as a template.
Give the naga a rod of extend spell-like ability. If you go backwards into 3.5, you can find the persistent meta-magic adjustment.
Alternately, give the the naga 4 levels of bard. Pick up suggestion as a bard 2 spell, and go to town. She should be able to convince people to obey her with social skills alone, and the suggestions/charm persons will help too. That can be meta-magiced as normal.
She's also not far from qualifying for the leadership feat. With a base of operations and a solid charisma, there should be a lot of followers available.
Bard also explains her motivations, a powerful bard has mooks do all the work, and is most powerful working through them.
Bards also make good villains. Anything you might need a villain to do can be explained with the UMD skill.
Have fun, this is one of my favorite adventures.
I have 3.x conversions of Saltmarsh and Cult of the Reptile god if you need them?
Mike
I also would very much like a copy of the CotRG conversion.
For what it's worth, I was going to give the naga a magic, evil tree.
I've been scattering such trees around my campaign world since I started it with a run through the _Sunless Citadel_ module.
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...In the original version, the spirit naga antagonist afflicts villagers with a permanent charm effect that is only broken when the naga is killed... If I make the naga's charm spell permanent, the players will definitely want to know where she got that ability.What I'd do is replace the "muddy caverns" of the lower level with text descriptions of ancient serpent statues half-buried in the slime, columns with bizarre hieroglyphs, and archways in the shape of great reptilian mouths: you can make the builders Pathfinder's serpentfolk or even a long-gone advanced civilization of lizardfolk or troglodytes. By the time they get to Explictica's lair, they shouldn't be surprised to see a great stone egg, or an altar wound with serpentine shapes - some big, immobile item which augments her abilities. This would also explain, btw, why she didn't just set up shop in somebody's basement.
Excellent idea - the problem/power becomes location based so it works for monsters and bad guys and it also makes a good amount of sense.
Evil auras would be a good deterrent from PC wanting to set up base afterwards; knowing my players they would try to find a way to seal/bring down the whole thing for good - even at 1st-3rd levels.
ps: NPC's don't follow the rules players need to follow.
Different play styles. I INTENSELY dislike this "answer," as it leads, in my opinion, to "Bugs Bunny: The RPG." If there are no in-game-world laws, no consistent rules, and no cause-and-effect relationships, then I personally would rather just watch a Roadrunner cartoon and be done with it.
I'm very much in the Chris Mortika school of thought on this one: as DM, I ALWAYS have an explanation for stuff, because I like a game that's relatively internally-consistent.
I'm with Bill on this. Players of mine always wanted to know the in's and out's of why stuff works the way it works and why this monster can fly or how that monster can do this. Answer I always use: You are applying Real Life rules to Magic. Stop doing that.
If your group accepts that answer, more power to you. Not to take away from your game, but I would immediately quit a game like that -- not that anyone else should, mind you -- but personally I'd have too hard a time tolerating it; I really like mystery novels, but I like them because there is some explanation that's fun to uncover -- the genre would really suck for me if the explanation for the clues was, in every case, "never mind, it's just magic, there's no explanation."
Larry Niven wrote a great essay on how there are implicit ground rules to mystery stories, to avoid the reader feeling "gypped." And there are also implicit ground rules to hard SciFi -- and when writing a SciFi Mystery, the author needs to follow BOTH sets of rules, or else have some very, very good reason for breaking them as a unique occurrence that's the focus of the story. I feel the same way about fantasy mysteries in my D&D.
Did anything ever come of this? :)
I see where derek and bigkilla are coming from, and I agree with them to a degree. It's my style (which may not be for everyone) to have answers to this kind of thing worked out ahead of time, even if the players never find out what's going on.
Because, I think, it makes a difference. If the long duration is the gift of an evil god, then the players might be able to disrupt it through getting the naga to violate one of the god's taboos. If it's something common to all dark nagas, then they'll be forewarned,should they run into another such monster later in the campaign.
Just give her a special ability that allows the charm person to attach to the target and stay in place until she dies.
I agree that players don't need to have every answer to every question. Rule Lawyers drive me crazy if a player is going to question every thing I do they don't have a place at the table... one of the good things about AD&D was there was a lot left to the DM to flesh out and control...
AllenDm