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Kolokotroni |
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We're not ready to start talking about Ultimate Magic yet.
I am sure you arent. Doesnt mean we cant wildly speculate.
I hope to find a satisfying non-vancian system for magic. I love the vancian system, but something that works well and doesnt favor either spontaneous or prepared casters like the spell points system does (or one that revamps how all the classes deal with magic).
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SmiloDan RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
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I think you could make a fun class by giving it a full BAB, one or two good saves (Fort and/or Will), and 1d10 hit dice. 2 + Int skill ranks per level, Int-based spells, and cast like a bard.
The spell list would have to be really tight and focused, mostly focusing on buffs, de-buffs, mobility, sensory, and close-range and/or single target attack spells. Hopefully a lot of them will be Swift Action spells that have a 1 round or instantaneous durations.
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I think you could make a fun class by giving it a full BAB, one or two good saves (Fort and/or Will), and 1d10 hit dice. 2 + Int skill ranks per level, Int-based spells, and cast like a bard.
The spell list would have to be really tight and focused, mostly focusing on buffs, de-buffs, mobility, sensory, and close-range and/or single target attack spells. Hopefully a lot of them will be Swift Action spells that have a 1 round or instantaneous durations.
Perhaps you could try it yourself? I would love to see what would you come up with.
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BenS |
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The templar did indeed get cut. After Jason did the work on the antipaladin, then tried to make yet another version of the paladin, he came to the conclusion that there really WASN'T a way to make a Templar work without it basically just looking like a fighter.
And for what it's worth, I agree. The more variant paladins that exist, the less special the actual paladin feels. And that's a shame.
Spellthane, by the way, is not a good class name because it's a combination of two words. That's something that NO other base class does, and we're not about to break that rule now.
Thanks for clearing this up James, though I'm very disappointed in that decision. The (3.0) Dragon articles on variant alignments for (well, evil at least) paladins was an excellent and long overdue idea. Also, Green Ronin's Book of the Righteous had the right idea for a Holy Warrior type class, even tailored for individual gods.
As for the nix on "spellthane", are you telling me that "anti-paladin" is neither 2 words nor a base class? B/c that would seem to disprove the arguments against using a compound noun naming convention.
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James Jacobs wrote:The templar did indeed get cut. After Jason did the work on the antipaladin, then tried to make yet another version of the paladin, he came to the conclusion that there really WASN'T a way to make a Templar work without it basically just looking like a fighter.
And for what it's worth, I agree. The more variant paladins that exist, the less special the actual paladin feels. And that's a shame.
Spellthane, by the way, is not a good class name because it's a combination of two words. That's something that NO other base class does, and we're not about to break that rule now.
Thanks for clearing this up James, though I'm very disappointed in that decision. The (3.0) Dragon articles on variant alignments for (well, evil at least) paladins was an excellent and long overdue idea. Also, Green Ronin's Book of the Righteous had the right idea for a Holy Warrior type class, even tailored for individual gods.
As for the nix on "spellthane", are you telling me that "anti-paladin" is neither 2 words nor a base class? B/c that would seem to disprove the arguments against using a compound noun naming convention.
Technically "anti" is a prefix, the - is just there to emphasize it. Antimagic and Anti-magic are both one word (and the same word), as are Antipaladin and Anti-paladin.
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MerrikCale |
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MerrikCale wrote:personally I hope the Magus is more like the Runeblade than the DuskbladeWhat are the mechanics/features of the Runeblade? I know the runeblade is a class by Monte Cook, but since it isn't allowed in the games I play I haven't bought the book.
essentially it's a fighter that uses various runes to add powers to it's weapons, self buff, and to things like doors and whatnot. It's Gish without the spells
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Thanks for clearing this up James, though I'm very disappointed in that decision. The (3.0) Dragon articles on variant alignments for (well, evil at least) paladins was an excellent and long overdue idea. Also, Green Ronin's Book of the Righteous had the right idea for a Holy Warrior type class, even tailored for individual gods.
As for the nix on "spellthane", are you telling me that "anti-paladin" is neither 2 words nor a base class? B/c that would seem to disprove the arguments against using a compound noun naming convention.
1) I was the one who wrote the 3rd edition "paladins for every alignment" articles for Dragon (#310 and #312, if I remember right), and that actually went a LONG way to convince me that variant paladins are not a good idea. It was really hard to come up with themes for every alignment, and in the end what you had was a dilution of the paladin ideal. Fortunately, both those articles AND "Book of the Righteous" are compatible with Pathfinder, so if you want to use either of those rules you can.
2) Antipaladin is not a base class. It's a subclass of a base class. Subclasses don't get iconic art treatment, nor do they introduce a new class mechanic. They're variants of an existing class, and therefore it's fine for them (or for prestige classes) to have names composed of two words. And on top of all that, as mentioned above, "anti" isn't a word on its own anyway.
And for what it's worth, I just don't like the word "spellthane" for the fighter/wizard class combo because:
a) It makes me think you're asking me to spell the word thane.
b) The word "thane" has nothing to do with fighting OR spellcasting; it's a Scottish noble's title. I'd have no problem calling a spellcasting noble type class a "spellthane," but it's not a good choice for a fighter/wizard.
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BenS |
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BenS wrote:Technically "anti" is a prefix, the - is just there to emphasize it. Antimagic and Anti-magic are both one word (and the same word), as are Antipaladin and Anti-paladin.snip
As for the nix on "spellthane", are you telling me that "anti-paladin" is neither 2 words nor a base class? B/c that would seem to disprove the arguments against using a compound noun naming convention.
Yes, I'm well aware of what a prefix is. Let's remember the classic definition: "a word, letter, or number placed before another". This adjusts or otherwise qualifies the meaning, agreed. But since "anti-" is neither a letter nor a number, that leaves the only remaining definition of prefix: a word.
Paizo's stated reason for not using certain names for the Gish was that they didn't want a combination of 2 words to describe a base class (not just a core class). Well, anti-paladin is exactly such a combination. That's all I'm trying to say.
Peace out.
EDIT: Ninja'd by James! I'll respond to that separately, sorry.
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BenS |
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BenS wrote:Thanks for clearing this up James, though I'm very disappointed in that decision. The (3.0) Dragon articles on variant alignments for (well, evil at least) paladins was an excellent and long overdue idea. Also, Green Ronin's Book of the Righteous had the right idea for a Holy Warrior type class, even tailored for individual gods.
As for the nix on "spellthane", are you telling me that "anti-paladin" is neither 2 words nor a base class? B/c that would seem to disprove the arguments against using a compound noun naming convention.
1) I was the one who wrote the 3rd edition "paladins for every alignment" articles for Dragon (#310 and #312, if I remember right), and that actually went a LONG way to convince me that variant paladins are not a good idea. It was really hard to come up with themes for every alignment, and in the end what you had was a dilution of the paladin ideal. Fortunately, both those articles AND "Book of the Righteous" are compatible with Pathfinder, so if you want to use either of those rules you can.
2) Antipaladin is not a base class. It's a subclass of a base class. Subclasses don't get iconic art treatment, nor do they introduce a new class mechanic. They're variants of an existing class, and therefore it's fine for them (or for prestige classes) to have names composed of two words. And on top of all that, as mentioned above, "anti" isn't a word on its own anyway.
And for what it's worth, I just don't like the word "spellthane" for the fighter/wizard class combo because:
a) It makes me think you're asking me to spell the word thane.
b) The word "thane" has nothing to do with fighting OR spellcasting; it's a Scottish noble's title. I'd have no problem calling a spellcasting noble type class a "spellthane," but it's not a good choice for a fighter/wizard.
I promise I won't keep beating this Cauchemar Nightmare into the ground.
Thanks for reminding me you wrote those excellent articles, though you've distanced yourself from the concept now. That's fine. And for antipaladin, I didn't think of it as a subclass of a base class, so that's fine too.
It's also fine you just don't care for the word "spellthane". Heck, I don't work for Paizo, you do. I just saw a disconnect between the rules for naming the new Gish-like class and other names and thought I'd point it out.
But the roots for "thane" go back a long time before Scottish nobility titles, fyi. It's from the Anglo-Saxon period, and it was tied to a warrior class in service of a greater lord. That's the only reason I liked it. But it's a moot point b/c "Magus" it is, and that's fine w/ me.
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James Jacobs wrote:BenS wrote:Thanks for clearing this up James, though I'm very disappointed in that decision. The (3.0) Dragon articles on variant alignments for (well, evil at least) paladins was an excellent and long overdue idea. Also, Green Ronin's Book of the Righteous had the right idea for a Holy Warrior type class, even tailored for individual gods.
As for the nix on "spellthane", are you telling me that "anti-paladin" is neither 2 words nor a base class? B/c that would seem to disprove the arguments against using a compound noun naming convention.
1) I was the one who wrote the 3rd edition "paladins for every alignment" articles for Dragon (#310 and #312, if I remember right), and that actually went a LONG way to convince me that variant paladins are not a good idea. It was really hard to come up with themes for every alignment, and in the end what you had was a dilution of the paladin ideal. Fortunately, both those articles AND "Book of the Righteous" are compatible with Pathfinder, so if you want to use either of those rules you can.
2) Antipaladin is not a base class. It's a subclass of a base class. Subclasses don't get iconic art treatment, nor do they introduce a new class mechanic. They're variants of an existing class, and therefore it's fine for them (or for prestige classes) to have names composed of two words. And on top of all that, as mentioned above, "anti" isn't a word on its own anyway.
And for what it's worth, I just don't like the word "spellthane" for the fighter/wizard class combo because:
a) It makes me think you're asking me to spell the word thane.
b) The word "thane" has nothing to do with fighting OR spellcasting; it's a Scottish noble's title. I'd have no problem calling a spellcasting noble type class a "spellthane," but it's not a good choice for a fighter/wizard.I promise I won't keep beating this Cauchemar Nightmare into the ground.
Thanks for reminding me you wrote those excellent articles, though you've distanced yourself...
We could, collectively on the messageboard, make up a word! How about...the Swage! Or the Runnior!
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MerrikCale |
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1) I was the one who wrote the 3rd edition "paladins for every alignment" articles for Dragon (#310 and #312, if I remember right), and that actually went a LONG way to convince me that variant paladins are not a good idea. It was really hard to come up with themes for every alignment, and in the end what you had was a dilution of the paladin ideal. Fortunately, both those articles AND "Book of the Righteous" are compatible with Pathfinder, so if you want to use either of those rules you can.
2) Antipaladin is not a base class. It's a subclass of a base class. Subclasses don't get iconic art treatment, nor do they introduce a new class mechanic. They're variants of an existing class, and therefore it's fine for them (or for prestige classes) to have names composed of two words. And on top of all that, as mentioned above, "anti" isn't a word on its own anyway.
I must say that I like the concept of a holy warrior for any alignment. I like the Templar idea that covers all classes. Frankly, one of the few good things about 4th ed IMO was paladins can be any alignment
I think there should be a holy warrior concept that doesnt just cover LG or CE, and the idea that you guys had for the Templar to cover all the aligments except those 2 I think was a perfect solution. I for one am very disappointed it didn't work out
It makes sense that other dieties would want their own champion, and not just a Cleric/fighter multiclass or whatnot but a Templar or Champion or whatever you would want to call
I hope you revisit this concept in the future
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I really, really liked how the Book of the Righteous Holy Warrior (Crusader, Templar, whatever) was modular and could be used to create a Paladin, right out of the book, or any of a dozen or more other options.
Updating the Holy Warrior to be able to create a Pathfinder Paladin, with the right choices, and upgrading the various other abilities for the dozen or so variations on that theme, sounds like the best possible solution (as well as a heck of a lot of work...).
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SmiloDan RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
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SmiloDan wrote:Perhaps you could try it yourself? I would love to see what would you come up with.I think you could make a fun class by giving it a full BAB, one or two good saves (Fort and/or Will), and 1d10 hit dice. 2 + Int skill ranks per level, Int-based spells, and cast like a bard.
The spell list would have to be really tight and focused, mostly focusing on buffs, de-buffs, mobility, sensory, and close-range and/or single target attack spells. Hopefully a lot of them will be Swift Action spells that have a 1 round or instantaneous durations.
Thaumatumachist
BAB: +1
Good Saves: Fortitude and Will
Hit Dice: 1d10
Class Skills: Acrobatics, Climb, Craft, Knowledge (all), Linguistics, Profession, Ride, Sense Motive, Spellcraft, Swim.
Skill Ranks per Level: 2 + Intelligence modifier
Thaumatumachists are proficient in all Simple and Martial Weapons, All Armor, and Shields (but not Tower Shields).
Thaumatumachists use the spell casting progression from the PH2, with Int-based spells. He makes concentration checks using his Intelligence modifier.
LEVEL ABILITY
1. Armored Mage (light), Cantrips, Spells
2. Combat Casting
3. Weaponized Spell, Wound Penetration +1
4. Swift Spell 1/day,
5. Arcane Bond
6. Wound Penetration +2
7. Armored Mage (medium)
8. Swift Spell 2/day
9. Wound Penetration +3
10. Supernatural Spell 1/day
11. Weaponized Spell (full attack)
12. Swift Spell 3/day, Wound Penetration +4
13. Armored Mage (heavy shields)
14. Supernatural Spell 2/day
15. Wound Penetration +5
16. Swift Spell 4/day
17. Supernatural Spell 3/day
18. Wound Penetration +6
19. Armored Mage (heavy armor)
20. Swift Spell 5/day, Supernatural Spell 4/day, Supernatural Critical
Armored Mage (Ex): Normally, armor of any type interferes with an arcane spellcaster’s gestures, which can cause spells to fail if those spells have a somatic component. A thuamatumachist’s limited focus and specialized training, however, allows you to avoid arcane spell failure so long as you stick to light armor and light shields. Initially, this training does not extend to medium or heavy armors, nor to heavy shields. This ability does not apply to spells gained from a different
spellcasting class.
At 7th level, you learn to use medium armor with no chance of arcane spell failure.
At 13th level, you learn to use a heavy shield with no chanceof arcane spell failure.
At 19th level, you learn to use heavy armor with no chance of arcane spell failure.
Cantrips (Sp). The thaumatumachist knows three 0 level spells at 1st level, and gains an additional one at 4th level and every three levels there after. Cantrips can be cast at will.
Spells. The thaumatumachist knows two 1st level spells at 1st level, and learn one additional spell at each level thereafter. Beginning at 4th level, he can begin learning 2nd level. At 8th level, he can learn 3rd level spells. At 12th level, he can learn 4th level spells. At 16th level he can learn 5th level spells. At 20th level, he can learn a 6th level spell. Thaumatumachist spells are learned from the Thaumatumachist list of spells. Each spell a Thaumatumachist learns, he can cast a number of times per day equal to his Intelligence bonus. The Thaumatumachist must have an Intelligence score of 10 + the level of the spell he wishes to learn. The Save DC of a Thaumatumachist’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the Thaumatumachist’s Intelligence bonus. He makes Concentration checks using his Intelligence modifier.
Combat Casting: At 2nd level, you gain Combat Casting as a bonus feat.
Weaponized Spell (Su): Beginning at 3rd level, you can use a standard action to cast
any touch spell you know and deliver the spell through your weapon with a melee attack. Casting a spell in this manner does not provoke attacks of opportunity. The spell must have a casting time
of 1 standard action or less. If the melee attack is successful, the attack deals damage normally; then the effect of the spell is resolved.
At 11th level, you can cast any touch spell you know as part of a full attack action, and the spell affects each target you hit in melee combat that round. Doing so discharges the spell at the end of the round, in the case of a touch spell that would otherwise last longer than 1 round.
Penetrating Wound (Ex): Starting at 3rd level, you can more easily overcome the spell resistance of any opponent you successfully injure with a melee attack. If you have injured an opponent with a melee attack, you gain a +1 bonus on your caster level check to overcome that opponent’s spell resistance for a number of minutes equal to your Thaumatumachist level. This bonus increases by +1 at 6th level and every 3 levels thereafter.
Swift Spell: Beginning at 4th level, you can cast one spell each day as a swift action, so long as the casting time of the spell is 1 standard action or less. You can use this ability twice per day at 8th level, three times per day at 12th level, four times per day at 16th, five times per day at 20th
level.
Arcane Bond (Su). At 5th level, this ability grants the Thaumatumachist the choice to either gain a familiar as if a wizard equal to his Thaumatumachist level, or choose a weapon and gain a benefit that is identical to the weapon option of the divine bond ability of the paladin, except the is not limited to the listed weapon abilities, although he is limited to the level-based plus allotment.
Supernatural Spell (Su). Beginning at 10th level, the Thaumatumachist can choose to cast one of his spells as a supernatural effect once per day. A spell converted into a supernatural ability automatically bypasses spell resistance, does not provoke attacks of opportunities, requires no components, and has a Saving Throw DC of 10 + ½ the Thaumatumacist’s class level + his Intelligence modifier.
At 14th level, he can use Supernatural Spell twice a day. At 17th level he can use it 3 times a day. At 20th level he can use it 4 times a day.
Supernatural Critical (Su). At 20th level, when the Thaumatumachist scores a successful critical hit while using his Channel Spell ability, he can choose to convert it into a Supernatural Spell as an immediate free action. This use of a Supernatural Spell does not count against his daily allotment of them from his Supernatural Spell ability. Alternatively, if the Thaumathmachist scores a successful critical hit while not using his Channel Spell ability, he can cast any spell he knows as an immediate action as long as the opponent he scored the critical hit against is targeted by the spell or within its area of effect; this spell is automatically considered a Supernatural Spell and does not count against the Thaumatumachist’s daily allotment of Supernatural Spells.
I haven't made the spell list yet, but it will focus on buffs, de-buffs, mobility, sensory, and close range or single target damaging spells.
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magnuskn |
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Evil Lincoln wrote:And that's bad how exactly?
I have to say, it makes me think of Marvel Comics.</unsolicited opinion>
Depends? Are we talking about the terrible Millar comics or the awesome Bendis comics? :p
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Sketchpad wrote:I'm hoping we get a few variant magician builds as well ... maybe something like a Truename Mage or Wild Mage?I would love to see some binding magic maybe as a prestige class
If you want magic along the lines of the Tome of Magic's binder class, look at Secrets of Pact Magic from Radiance House. There's Villains of Pact Magic as an expansion and a free update guide to convert the classes to Pathfinder.
As far as Ultimate Magic itself, I'd like to see more options for a Wild Mage class.
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SmiloDan RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
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MerrikCale wrote:Sketchpad wrote:I'm hoping we get a few variant magician builds as well ... maybe something like a Truename Mage or Wild Mage?I would love to see some binding magic maybe as a prestige classIf you want magic along the lines of the Tome of Magic's binder class, look at Secrets of Pact Magic from Radiance House. There's Villains of Pact Magic as an expansion and a free update guide to convert the classes to Pathfinder.
As far as Ultimate Magic itself, I'd like to see more options for a Wild Mage class.
"the save DC of a wild mage spell is 1d20 + the spell level + the wild mage's Cha/Int/Wis/Con modifier"
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Kvantum wrote:As far as Ultimate Magic itself, I'd like to see more options for a Wild Mage class."the save DC of a wild mage spell is 1d20 + the spell level + the wild mage's Cha/Int/Wis/Con modifier"
And then you need a wild surge table for when you botch (nat 1) that roll... and maybe a different table if you roll a natural 20 on it.
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SmiloDan wrote:And then you need a wild surge table for when you botch (nat 1) that roll... and maybe a different table if you roll a natural 20 on it.Kvantum wrote:As far as Ultimate Magic itself, I'd like to see more options for a Wild Mage class."the save DC of a wild mage spell is 1d20 + the spell level + the wild mage's Cha/Int/Wis/Con modifier"
I'd foresee (pun intended) a lot of BBEG cyclops wild mages using their "declare a 20" power with this. Nasssty.
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MerrikCale |
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MerrikCale wrote:Sketchpad wrote:I'm hoping we get a few variant magician builds as well ... maybe something like a Truename Mage or Wild Mage?I would love to see some binding magic maybe as a prestige classIf you want magic along the lines of the Tome of Magic's binder class, look at Secrets of Pact Magic from Radiance House. There's Villains of Pact Magic as an expansion and a free update guide to convert the classes to Pathfinder.
As far as Ultimate Magic itself, I'd like to see more options for a Wild Mage class.
I have been meaning to check that book out
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meatrace |
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BenS wrote:Thanks for clearing this up James, though I'm very disappointed in that decision. The (3.0) Dragon articles on variant alignments for (well, evil at least) paladins was an excellent and long overdue idea. Also, Green Ronin's Book of the Righteous had the right idea for a Holy Warrior type class, even tailored for individual gods.
As for the nix on "spellthane", are you telling me that "anti-paladin" is neither 2 words nor a base class? B/c that would seem to disprove the arguments against using a compound noun naming convention.
1) I was the one who wrote the 3rd edition "paladins for every alignment" articles for Dragon (#310 and #312, if I remember right), and that actually went a LONG way to convince me that variant paladins are not a good idea. It was really hard to come up with themes for every alignment, and in the end what you had was a dilution of the paladin ideal. Fortunately, both those articles AND "Book of the Righteous" are compatible with Pathfinder, so if you want to use either of those rules you can.
2) Antipaladin is not a base class. It's a subclass of a base class. Subclasses don't get iconic art treatment, nor do they introduce a new class mechanic. They're variants of an existing class, and therefore it's fine for them (or for prestige classes) to have names composed of two words. And on top of all that, as mentioned above, "anti" isn't a word on its own anyway.
And for what it's worth, I just don't like the word "spellthane" for the fighter/wizard class combo because:
a) It makes me think you're asking me to spell the word thane.
b) The word "thane" has nothing to do with fighting OR spellcasting; it's a Scottish noble's title. I'd have no problem calling a spellcasting noble type class a "spellthane," but it's not a good choice for a fighter/wizard.
As the person who came up with spellthane, I have a couple comments. Remember that you already have Eldrich Knight and knight has nothing to do with casting spells either it's part of a feudal system. So nyah.
Also, that article with alternate paladins was one of my all-time favorite Dragon articles!I didn't know you wrote it. You should be proud, it made the idea of playing a holy champion seem FUN instead of stuffy (paladin).
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SmiloDan RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 |
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Kvantum wrote:I'd foresee (pun intended) a lot of BBEG cyclops wild mages using their "declare a 20" power with this. Nasssty.SmiloDan wrote:And then you need a wild surge table for when you botch (nat 1) that roll... and maybe a different table if you roll a natural 20 on it.Kvantum wrote:As far as Ultimate Magic itself, I'd like to see more options for a Wild Mage class."the save DC of a wild mage spell is 1d20 + the spell level + the wild mage's Cha/Int/Wis/Con modifier"
You would need 4 cyclops to predict that!!!
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Derek Vande Brake |
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I just hope if they make a freeform build-your-own magic system it will include lots of guidelines and examples. I did some very sick things with Monte Cook's WoD magic system that I think in part led to my group abandoning the game, and only later did I find out that the factors didn't work in the way I thought they did, while simple spells that mimicked 1st level ones from D&D were too tough to use until 5th level or so.
Epic level spellcasting from 3.5 seemed cool, but it couldn't easily be ported back to lower levels (a simple Mage Armor spell had such a high spellcraft that a 1st level wizard couldn't cast it.)
As for the Magus, I like the half caster/arcane ranger idea - 3.5's Hexblade tried to do this, but they botched it. Still, the lack of spellcasting before 4th level could be made up by the judicious use of a few spell like abilities - Hexblade's cursing was the wrong direction because caster/fighter types don't want mild debuff, they want damage! And yes, it should have more flavor than "I can stab AND burn!"
As for the names... Ultimate Magic reminds me of the Mongoose Publishing series of books, and Magus doesn't sound fightery enough. Probably depends on the flavor, though - magus could work quite well if the flavor fits.
<off topic>Personally I don't like the idea of a paladin-type for all nine alignments, but I do think UA had it right for the four extremes: a CG and LE paladin seem unique enough that they could have their own kits.</off topic>
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Katerek |
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I like Stabracadabra.
How 'bout you call it Super Ultimate Fun-Time Magic Book and the class could be the Stabracadabrist!
That would be more awesome than a bacon pop-tart.
Also, I kid.
Looking forward to this book. I think my favorite thing about the name magus is the inevitable pronunciation debate that will follow. Is it a hard G like in 'gloom' or is it soft like in 'mage'?
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Please stop complaining about the names of the magus and the book. Your opinion isn't ACTUALLY that important to Paizo, and the name makes up about 1% of the class. Just change the name to whatever you want in your home games, but don't derail ANOTHER thread with pointless whining.
This kind of post is also unhelpful, you know. In fact, this sort of tone makes people more likely to want to fight about it than less, so could you please consider being more civil in the future?
Jeremy Puckett
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Omegaphallic |
Some ideas for new mysteries might be:
mystery of the Great Beyond (majorly into summoning and planar travel)
mystery of vice(a little more mortal grey then outright evil which suits the oracle, plus its a frequent theme on Galoron)
mystery of virtue
mystery of passion
mystery of civilization
mystery of peace
mystery of magic
mystery of souls
mystery of time
mystery of far realms
mystery of the east
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Omegaphallic |
Some more guessing, the could take the inquisitor and take it into new areas for those uncomfortable with the idea of playing an inquisitor, such as myself, to make it more compatable.
example of archtypes, Hierodule, Confessor, Guardian of relics,Crazied Heritic, Debater, Divine assisin, avenger, Van helsing/monster hunter, exorist, head hunter (for more tribal faiths), Pacifist.
As for archtypes for oracles, curses and mysteries seemed to be embedded archtypes right in the class, giving an oracle two archtypes to deal with and how they mix, creating more. I mean a fire oracle is vary different in play then a battle or life oracle. Fire Oracle is a major blaster, Battle Oracle is powerful warrior, and life oracle is probably the best healer in pathfinder possible. You add the flavour of the curse to a mystery and you get an even more defined flavour, the huanted fire oracle and you have a character that is heavily invovled with fire spirits and much more tricky in stragety and personality, then say a blind fire oracle who maybe more about summoning guardian creatures of fire to keep an eye out so he can blast them.
Wizard discoveries sound interesting. they maybe feats that modify spells in away different then metamagic.
hopeful Magus is more then a wizard with a sword and armour, and good bab. Hopefully some unique abilities. But not a rehash of the swordmage from 4e.
A planar druid archtype would be cool.
Sorcorer bloodlines for Div, Gods, Werewolves, Oblivion, Time
Witch Patrons Good, Madness, Sex, Music, Ancestors.
Improved Familiars some type of Azata, Latern, Drech, lemure, skull, mini me(small clone/simulacrum of self, Shadow Creature(like something summoned from shades) or a sentient illusion, Nixie.
Normal Familiars Butterfly, Humming bird, gibbon, goat, pig, gold fish.