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In the eighties Dnd was assailed as the gateway game that would lead us all to devil worshiping. For those of us who were unlucky, we not only played the game, but also happened to listen to the second threat to our souls, Ozzy Osbourne. The rarer few like myself, who listened to even worse bands like Slayer, were considered damned beyond all hope.
I know it sound like a joke now, but for the fervent of the time, it was a full time business. Those of us who were identified as RPG'ers and listeners of such foul music were really unfortunate because we were constantly assailed by people wanting to save us. We did our best to avoid them, but in the end we had to endure endless lectures denouncing our deeds and pressing us to help them find their savior.
So I was just pondering with a smile... Now that I play pathfinder am I redeemed? Is part of my soul cleansed now that I do not play Dnd?
Now that I'm thinking about it, do any of you feel any holier now that you play pathfinder? How many of you managed to play Dnd and not fall victim to Satan? Or, maybe, just maybe, is this some grand devils conspiracy meant to rope in another generation of youth?
Hmmm… I think I will have to go consult some goat entrails and my Ouija board to find out =)…
PCP, that's my guess.
Paizo and Pathfinders is a far out game. Swords... poison... spells... battles... maiming... killing!
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Did you hear my groan all the way from the sunny lands of Arizona =). Sigh... The thing he had, that we didn't, was a really bad script (or really illicit pharmaceuticals =).
Thanks for the throwback. I not only had a good chuckle, but added it to my Netflix so I can show it to my kids and their gamer friends (Yes I spread the disease to another generation =). A definite must see for any gamer (forewarned is forearmed =).
Thanks for the throwback. I not only had a good chuckle, but added it to my Netflix so I can show it to my kids and their gamer friends (Yes I spread the disease to another generation =). A definite must see for any gamer (forewarned is forearmed =).
What movie was this?
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Thanks for the throwback. I not only had a good chuckle, but added it to my Netflix so I can show it to my kids and their gamer friends (Yes I spread the disease to another generation =). A definite must see for any gamer (forewarned is forearmed =).What movie was this?
Mazes and Monsters.
Damn, somebody beat me.
Things have really changed in the last 30 years, for the most part people are a bit more open-minded (or at least it is culturally less-cool to be afraid of stuff you don't understand). Hell, those 80's nerds went on to become tech CEOs and flooded Wallstreet with money. If anything buys you cultural acceptance, its being rich.
Then of course there are the celebrities that proudly claim their chunk of nerd-dom. Steven Colbert wasn't much of a surprise, but Vin Deisel was a little unexpected.
Of course once we elect a president who is a gamer, we can enact our plan for radical world domination, summon nyarlathotep, and fulfill our destinies.
Edit: This was pretty funny too :D
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I was constantly disappointed that none of the people I played with ever went up to the top of a tall building and tried to fly off of it. I mean, what was Tom Hanks doing that the rest of us were missing out on?
I am still constantly disappointed that several of the players I've played with haven't done this. I can name a few I wish would.
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Mazes and Monsters. It was released during the anti dnd movement. The movement was spearheaded by a lady whose son killed himself. She blamed dnd as the cause, just like another mother under similar circumstances who blamed Ozzy. It was actually a really odd time to be a gamer.
The scary part is that most of fringe people of that time who attacked the game and music industries are now mainstream religious folk. The idea that type of zelotry is actually accepted, and courted politically, nowdays is astonishing to me.
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mmm
so.. if i play a mex of DnD 3.5, PF races and the Beta domains... mixed with lots of Monte Cook's BoXM... iam saved? or worst i am some kind of freak cultuist that took his own follow up to Satan and now the dark lord would not answer my prayers (or mayebe answer sooner?) :P
*shivers at hearing Mazes and Monsters*
the beginnings of LARP! besides the bad script and the psd the Larping was a bad mixture for a weak mind!
So, about that soul - if you're interested in a trade.....
What movie was this?
They're referring to Mazes and Monsters, a TV movie based on a novel of the same name, about an FRPG that makes one of the players go crazy and nearly kill himself.
I must say that both my mother and I read the book and saw the movie, and although my mother never understood D&D, neither of us got the impression that the idea of D&D making people nuts had any basis in reality. I was surprised, later in life, to find out about the bad publicity D&D got because of this movie.
But yes, it is good to play an RPG without the controversial name, as I've commented in another thread.
EDIT: Yeah, I knew I'd be ninja'd... but hey, I provided a link to the wikipedia entry!
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I was just talking to my son yesterday about how I would love to hear hear a general say, "Well you see the tactic we used today was quite simple, we had to build a perimeter and postition forward observers so when the Zerg... I mean the Taliban..."
Edit: Sorry Bitman, not much good on the archiving bit =)
Things have really changed in the last 30 years, for the most part people are a bit more open-minded (or at least it is culturally less-cool to be afraid of stuff you don't understand). Hell, those 80's nerds went on to become tech CEOs and flooded Wallstreet with money. If anything buys you cultural acceptance, its being rich.
Then of course there are the celebrities that proudly claim their chunk of nerd-dom. Steven Colbert wasn't much of a surprise, but Vin Deisel was a little unexpected.
Of course once we elect a president who is a gamer, we can enact our plan for radical world domination, summon nyarlathotep, and fulfill our destinies.
We can also thank popular fantasy movies that have moven from cult classics to true mainstream for widespread acceptance. It is hard to call the idea of magic itself evil after the success and acceptance of the Lord of the Rings films, let alone harry potter. Even series like buffy the vampire slayer have helped on that end. The simple act of more fantastic elements in mainstream media, mean that more people realize there are no ACTUAL spells in the core rulebook or the DND players guide. And that is truly just a game and a story.
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Mazes and Monsters. It was released during the anti dnd movement. The movement was spearheaded by a lady whose son killed himself. She blamed dnd as the cause, just like another mother under similar circumstances who blamed Ozzy. It was actually a really odd time to be a gamer.
The scary part is that most of fringe people of that time who attacked the game and music industries are now mainstream religious folk. The idea that type of zelotry is actually accepted, and courted politically, nowdays is astonishing to me.
Don't forget the other primary opponent of D&D. Tipper Gore. She went after D&D and Rock and/or Roll.
In the eighties Dnd was assailed as the gateway game that would lead us all to devil worshiping. For those of us who were unlucky, we not only played the game, but also happened to listen to the second threat to our souls, Ozzy Osbourne. The rarer few like myself, who listened to even worse bands like Slayer, were considered damned beyond all hope.
I still listen to Slayer. \m/
This soul thing sounds like a pain in the ass. I'd just unload it and not worry about such things any longer.
Ah yes, it seems great minds think alike.
Yeah all because her kid was listening to WASP. Sigh... When I tell people I still don't like the Gores for that they give me a crazy look and proceed to tell me they didn't even know that it occured. Love that PMRC.
But like Blackie Lawless, I wanna be somebody ... be somebody cool!
Edit: Ditto Urizen... That is why you are going to hell too =)
As an atheist, they'll probably put me someplace worse ... like purgatory. Wait, that's an Iron Maiden song.... YES! \m/
;)
As a Christian gamer, I can safely say, those people who condemned your souls for playing D&D were totally wrong :) Yes, we do exist, and yes, we fight for gaming as acceptable too =P
But Pathfinder did save my gaming soul, because I thought I was going to lose it when 4e was announced....
Nope, you're still going to hell.
I was waiting for Jack to show up!
Who is Jack Chick you youngters ask? Why the guy who brought us Chick Tracks, of course!
I was waiting for Jack to show up!
Who is Jack Chick you youngters ask? Why the guy who brought us Chick Tracks, of course!
Wow... can you take that link down? I'm seriously embarrased by it for how uninformed it is and what a misrepresentation it portrays. I mean, really, my group is all Christians, and we use our faith to inform our gaming. I can't tell you how mad that makes me to see that.
Nope, you're still going to hell.
agreed.
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While I did experience some who saw D&D as Satan's Game there were far more people who felt it was just a game and nothing more. But what I've found surprising is how many gamers who are supposed to be so open minded and intelligent turned out to be more narrow minded about the Christian faith we evangelicals practice without giving us so much as a chance to explain it. Not for nothing, as they say in my neck of the woods, New York City, but I think if one claims to be oh so awfully open minded one should listen and not judge before one has heard the whole story. Otherwise one is just and "intolerant" and ignorant as those one is pointing at.
Just my 2 cents.
I have no problem with anybody practicing whatever faith they want. It's the proselytizing that evangelicals are so fond of that I have a problem with. Christians have waged war against non-believers for centuries and now that society has reached a point where non believers can voice their dissent, it has become a war against christianity.
Believe what you want, just keep it out of public school, tone down the hate speech, and stop trying to convert everyone you come across.
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As a gay man, I've always found it funny when evangelicals talk about how people aren't open minded towards them.
People in your camp are a big reason why people like me are second-class citizens.
But they aren't intolerant...they're trying to reestablish "seperate but equal" policies...because it worked so well last time. The fearmongering that the religious right is resorting to is no better than the propaganda Hitler used to rise to power in pre-WWII germany.
Were it not for the fact that my wife and I are already married, we would wait to do so until everyone was able to get married...not just those of us in "opposite marriages" as Stephen Colbert puts it.
As a gay man, I've always found it funny when evangelicals talk about how people aren't open minded towards them.People in your camp are a big reason why people like me are second-class citizens.
Actually, if you go through that site, Tract List, you will find all kinds of other tracts regarding, among other things, how muslims are being deceived by Satan, Catholics aren't christian, God hates gay people because they're an abomination and they convort with devils, and the dinosaurs went extinct after they got off of Noah's Ark because the air had changed.
Seriously. You can't make this stuff up, and while I go certainly go off on it in length, I'll just say it amazes me how people can use Jesus Christ to push messages of hate & intolerance.
Dragon - Draconis - the devil, the snake who seduced eve, the beast which name is to mega therion
Dungeons - place of torture and bondage, hell
people who think of themselves as druids, heathen priests sacrificing humans to taranis, clerics of heathen gods, wizards and sorcerers who practise magic, which is power granted by the devil, heathen barbarians and more, playing races like elves - everyone knows that "elf" is only another name for "demon"...
There´s only one way to deal with such demon worshippers.
See what happens if you commit your soul to the dark arts of roleplay
Amen!
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32
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I sense a lock coming on...
But I'm going to throw in my two cents anyway. ^_^
Too many evangelicals that I've met have a problem, that they do not practice what they preach. They've spewed dogma from the pulpit, altar, or soapbox without really understanding the core messages of their religion. They've forgotten how to 'convert by example', and wallow in hypocracy as a result.
By their fruits ye shall know them...
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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I have no problem with anybody practicing whatever faith they want. It's the proselytizing that evangelicals are so fond of that I have a problem with. Christians have waged war against non-believers for centuries and now that society has reached a point where non-believers can voice their dissent, it has become a war against Christianity.
Believe what you want, just keep it out of public school, tone down the hate speech, and stop trying to convert everyone you come across.
Hey, Xpltvdeleted. Nice post.
I am myself a Catholic who tries to be devout. My gaming group includes a couple of evangelicals* and some dyed-in-the-wool atheists. In the past, I've been in gaming groups where I'm the only one who wasn't a Wiccan-styled pagan.
Penn Jillette is a prominent atheist, and I am heartened by his stand that, while he doesn't believe any of the mumbo jumbo that evangelicals throw his way, he is gratified and thankful that they pray for him and offer him chances to repent and accept Christ.
As he notes, in their worldview, they believe that accepting Christ is essential for salvation, and they're trying to save his soul. He's commented that he has no respect for Christians who think it's esential to be a believer, and then don't care enough to help save him.
(Myself, I've read Matthew 25, and I don't believe that an explicit and overt "acceptance of Jesus as one's personal savior" is wither necessary or sufficient for salvation.)
Let's just dispense with the religious overtones and move on. Let's say the majority consensus realizes that Chick is pretty much a crackpot and leave it as is. It's an embarassment (although an amusing one) to both believers and non-believers.
Thanks.
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As an evangelical I can tell you people in "my camp" have nothing to do with you being considered 2nd class citizens. An honest look on your part at history and the Faith would clarify that for you.As a gay man, I've always found it funny when evangelicals talk about how people aren't open minded towards them.
People in your camp are a big reason why people like me are second-class citizens.
Do you honestly believe this? Evangelicals and the mormons were large backers of the prop 8 movement. Evangelicals are behind the National Organization for Marriage, which still serves to uphold the "seperate but equal" policies of civil unions. The evangelical group "the family" is a backer of the politician in unganda (if i remember the country correctly) who was pushing for the execution of homosexuals. Going back further, the bible was used as a justification for slavery and a majority of KKK members were christians. That's not even counting the inquisition, crusades, and salem witch trials.
EDIT: And don't even get me started on the motherf*&ker who protests at military funerals saying that military deaths--people who are dying for this POS's right to spout his hatred--are the result of America's acceptance of homosexuality.
Back in the 80s we had gaming club. Regularly you get weirdo's coming in dropping off religious material. That most I ever saw. One time though a church group was going to protest and made a drive to have as many Christians show up in front of the local gaming shop as possible. It made the front page new but no one showed up on the day that was set to protest.
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Hey, Xpltvdeleted. Nice post.
I am myself a Catholic who tries to be devout. My gaming group includes a couple of evangelicals* and some dyed-in-the-wool atheists. In the past, I've been in gaming groups where I'm the only one who wasn't a Wiccan-styled pagan.
Penn Jillette is a prominent atheist, and I am heartened by his stand that, while he doesn't believe any of the mumbo jumbo that evangelicals throw his way, he is gratified and thankful that they pray for him and offer him chances to repent and accept Christ.
As he notes, in their worldview, they believe that accepting Christ is essential for salvation, and they're trying to save his soul. He's commented that he has no respect for Christians who think it's esential to be a believer, and then don't care enough to help save him.
(Myself, I've read Matthew 25, and I don't believe that an explicit and overt "acceptance of Jesus as one's personal savior" is wither necessary or sufficient for salvation.)
Thank you--I am of the same school of thought. If somebody offers to pray for me i simply say thank you and move on. I don't take offense to it. Organized religion is the root of alot of modern problems IMO. A removal of emphasis on organized religion and a refocus on spiritualism would do the world alot of good. That's not to say that everybody who follows a large religion is bad, but i have seen enough of them that are to sour me on the whole prospect.
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"proselytizing" or should I say the preaching of the Gospel is not the same as making war. And as for keeping my beliefs out of public schools (funny how you believe it's only public for some) you first.
As for so-called "hate" speech, now there's a phrase often used to censor people some don't agree with. As as for trying to convert everyone we come across?? What would you do if you believed in something that could not only help people but save their very souls. What good is it claiming to believe in something that benefits all mankind and claiming to love humanity and then selfishly keeping it to yourself. Would you do that?
Your holy book calls homosexuals "abomination" and calls for them to be stoned to death. I would say that that falls into the category of hate speech and should be censored.
As to your sharing those "benefits," please share with me one shred of proof and i'll be more than happy to listen to you. Until then stay out of my space and quit trying to indoctrinate my children by way of public schools...religious views should not be endorsed in a government sponsored forum...period.
Let's just dispense with the religious overtones and move on. Let's say the majority consensus realizes that Chick is pretty much a crackpot and leave it as is. It's an embarassment (although an amusing one) to both believers and non-believers.
Thanks.
and let's all agree that Mazes & Monsters should be required viewing for all gamers, if only because it's such a good bad movie.
Let's not turn this into an angry religious debate, aye?
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Your holy book calls homosexuals "abomination" and calls for them to be stoned to death. I would say that that falls into the category of hate speech and should be censored.
Here's a thought, lets have the Bible burned, as a matter of fact let's burn any book that even mentions the word God in it or Jesus. Is that really what you want?
As to your sharing those "benefits," please share with me one shred of proof and i'll be more than happy to listen to you. Until then stay out of my space and quit trying to indoctrinate my children by way of public schools...religious views should not be endorsed in a government sponsored forum...period.Then you'd better go to Washington, DC and start tearing down every religious reference to God on the monuments and buildings down there. And have you looked at your money? It says....drum roll......in God We Trust.
When I mentioned earlier about the intolerance and ignorance of some gamers, I wasn't kidding. This is not an attack on you friend, I'm just trying to make you see that the bogeyman Radical Christians coming for your children does not exist. If it did, there wouldn't be anything you could do about it. The way said movement is described by some we would all have a real nightmare on our hands with a well funded, well armed and fanatical group which is backed by millions who would turn this country in a real theocracy. But rest well, that "movement" only exists in the minds of those who line their pockets daily with that kind of fearmongering.
Fear for profit is nothing new.
So you are not disputing the fact that your holy book calls for the murder of homosexuals, yet try to demonize me as a book burning crazy?
There are references to god on our currency, etc. but that is a far cry from teaching religion in schools as right-wing evangelists would have it.