Order of the Dragon cavalier count as his own ally?


Rules Questions


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

For the purposes of the Order of the Dragon's challenge, does the cavalier count as his own ally?

I know the general understanding is that you ARE counted an ally for special abilities unless specifically stated otherwise, but it seems somewhat cheesy in this instance.

Dark Archive

I would say so, I don't see anything particularly cheesy here, just a small bonus to attack a specific target a couple times a day. Cavalier is already a sub-par class so it's best to give them the benefit of the doubt.


I think everyone understands that the INTENT is that you are not buffed yourself...

But it looks as though you do buff yourself by RAW. Huh. That's pretty crazy.


If you mean the 2nd level power Aid Allies, that is just a standard Aid Another action that works better that the +2 that it normally gives. You have to aid another in the first place for this to work.

The 8th power affect allies and you count as ally, on top of the text even says that outright.

The 15th level power. That's odd ball. You spend standard action to move and attack. Then all your allies get to move and attack so since you are your ally I guess you get to move and attack again. I suspect this is one you are talking about?


He says he means the challenge, probably the part where his allies (and apparently, he himself) gets a bonus against the challenged target.

To be fair, it's nowhere near as ridiculous as what an Order of the Dragon Huntmaster can do with his army of birds flocking around a target, each granting each-other the bonus.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I just noticed that, if he can apply it to himself, it is worlds better than most of the other challenge bonuses for the other orders.

Dark Archive

Meh, I dunno if I'd go as far as to say +5 to hit agaisnt 7 enemies a day at level 20 is "worlds better." But it would make it a bit better than most of the challenges. If there is only one Cavalier in the party, let him have it. If there are two and only one of them is Dragon Cav, then worry about the balance.


per bard rulings on performances, everyone is their own ally.

that allows both this, and things like a dimensional savant rogue/slayer/etc getting a free attack from opportunist (by flanking with himself via savant)


RAW, yes, you take it. RAI... probably not. The wording leads me to believe it's not the intent.


i for one welcome more incentive to play the Good Guy order.

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