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A dragon themed AP would be awesome.Distracting wall of text to follow...
** spoiler omitted **
I think it would have to be a story where different sorts of dragons play a game with each other and the characters are pawns in their game.
Lets say in one part the PCs are to obtain an object for their mysterious client (which is a dragon or intermediary of one).The PCs can find out who hired them (maybe Mengkare of Hermea) and decide to work for him - maybe a follow-up mission is to eleminate a fellow gamer/opponent.
It would have to involve the possibility of switching sides to work for another dragon but the missions would essentialy be the same.
Of course the other dragons send their agents to eliminate the PCs and so on.
It could also involve an ancient time dragon who sends them back in time or an imperial dragon who employs ninja.
Of course i am more curious about your 20th AP - the one for Paizos 10th anniversary - which has to be something with the 5 Runelords that are still alive.
Personally i call it Runewar.
Owww Hermea!
That would be interesting. And offer a lot of interesting possibilities while being able to include dragons.
Creative Director
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Hermea adventure path?A dragon themed AP would be awesome.Distracting wall of text to follow...
** spoiler omitted **
Nope.
Hermea is something I've pretty much put off-limits, because nailing down the dragon's true goals and thus alignment in print will angry up too many folks for different reasons. It's a cool concept, but as written, it's not one that we can really explore without frustrating a lot of people.
A bit more detail...
I do not see Mengkare as an ally to PCs, nor do I see Hermea as a paradise or a place to look up to as an example of a healthy society.
Others don't agree. Some folks even push that Mengkare is lawful good. From what we've put in print, I am ABSOLUTELY NOT COMFORTABLE with saying that Mengkare is good (and beyond that, the concept of a non-good gold dragon is pretty fascinating). So if we DO publish more information about Mengkare, and thus Paizo does have to take a stand on the dragon's alignment, it's not going to be Lawful Good as long as I'm here in the role of Creative Director, and that means some folks are going to be incredibly frustrated and angry, I fear. And not just customers.
Thus, for what I see as the foreseeable future, Mengkare and Hermea are more or less consigned to the realm of tantalizing hints and inspiration for individual GMs to expand upon as they see fit in their home games, as each GM has the advantage of being able to handle this very politically-charged topic in a way that his/her table is comfortable without forcing that decision on the entire Pathfinder community. It's a luxury the individual GM has that we, as the publishers of the setting, do not have.
At some point in the future, if the creative staff at Paizo has undergone a major change and the folks running the show then are different than those running it today, who knows what's possible? At this time, though, I am simply not interested in doing anything more with Hermea or Mengkare other than dropping a few more tantalizing hints here and there.
Never say never though. My opinions might change... but I doubt it. Selectively breeding a master race of superior humanity type stuff is pretty much a no-go for a good guy in my opinion. There's just too many uncomfortable and politically charged real-world analogs that, for Godwin's sake, I won't go into here. But they should be obvious.
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Well i absolutely see Mengakre the same way as Mr Jacobs there. He would have to be on the villains side somehow and a lot of things would have to be real challenging moral decisions in such adventures, to a point where many people might be uncomfortable about things implied actually.
And i also agree on the alignment discussions!
Well every boss of each AP volume doesn't have to be a dragon, it just has to be dragon themed and connected to the main story. so we have half-dragons, draconic blooded sorcerers, dragon blooded bloodragers, dragonriders, "lesser" dragons, and dragon like creatures that are not actually dragons.
I would love to save a princess from a dragon or a dragon from a princess, whatever works.
I would still like to see a awesome dragon as a boss especially if it is not a chromatic or umbral. A unique dragon not based on an existing species would be awesome.
Another story line I like to see would be a human villain found a way to turn himself into a real dragon of great wyrm level power.
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For a dragon themed AP I'd suggest the Skyfire Mandate and Drakelands on Triaxus. Sure, there was already an adventure there in Reign of Winter, but the entire setting is dragon themed. It could easily host a full AP. Failing that, Xa Hoi and the 'Dragon Empires' in general would be the next most dragon immersed setting introduced thus far. Or maybe the return of House Rogarvia (and dragons) to Brevoy. Or a resurgence of the dragonriders of Iobaria and/or the Drakeplague. Or...well, it just seems like there are options. ;]
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I love the idea of an adventure path that involves rescuing a dragon from a princess.
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Yeah, a Ha Hoi centred AP would be most obvious option for Dragon centric AP that works from start to finish.
Dragons and non-dragons can be allies, Dragons and non-Dragons can be enemies,
half-dragons/dragon-kin can abound, Dragons in Human form,
Dragons don't need to be "on-screen" because they are the contextual framework of the country and events there-in,
the plot doesn't need to be shoving Dragons as antagonists at every turn,
sometimes there will be Dragon antagonists (very likely opposing other Dragons),
other times it is just other Evil stuff going on - Cthuloid weirdness from Valashmai jungle,
Underdark mysteries, political chaos from Nagajor, cultists from other factions of Tian Xia, etc.
As long as a dragon or a (non-fiend infused/related)princess is the main villain, I will be happy.
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The longer we can avoid cementing in print Mengkare's alignment, the better the game is for it. Alignment debates are no fun for anyone.
Several participants in 1000+ comment threads disagree.
Anyway, Mengkare is awesome because he's a fantasy equivalent of the real world truth that D&D/Paizo alignments are often contrary to actual real world effects - he's definitely not LG, quite probably LE, and his program will unquestionably make the world a better place.
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Hermea adventure path?A dragon themed AP would be awesome.Distracting wall of text to follow...
** spoiler omitted **
Nope.
Hermea is something I've pretty much put off-limits, because nailing down the dragon's true goals and thus alignment in print will angry up too many folks for different reasons. It's a cool concept, but as written, it's not one that we can really explore without frustrating a lot of people.
A bit more detail...
** spoiler omitted **...
Oh wow, many thankies for the detailed response.
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The longer we can avoid cementing in print Mengkare's alignment, the better the game is for it. Alignment debates are no fun for anyone.Several participants in 1000+ comment threads disagree.
Anyway, Mengkare is awesome because he's a fantasy equivalent of the real world truth that D&D/Paizo alignments are often contrary to actual real world effects - he's definitely not LG, quite probably LE, and his program will unquestionably make the world a better place.
No, it's still very highly questionable. But that's a disagreement for another thread.
The longer we can avoid cementing in print Mengkare's alignment, the better the game is for it. Alignment debates are no fun for anyone.Several participants in 1000+ comment threads disagree.
Anyway, Mengkare is awesome because he's a fantasy equivalent of the real world truth that D&D/Paizo alignments are often contrary to actual real world effects - he's definitely not LG, quite probably LE, and his program will unquestionably make the world a better place.
That is exactly the reason some things should be left untouched.
I´m assuming this comment is meant for Golarion only and leave everything else unsaid.History lessons are a thing though somehow.
I've had a couple ideas for a Dragon themed AP for a long time now. Here's the bare bones of it:
The party starts oblivious to all of this and slowly learns about it all while helping a small community whose founder was actually one of the original heroes who prevented Daralathyxl from accomplishing his plan. This person is actually still alive (in my head this is the party's dwarven fighter) because the magic unleashed on him and a few other survivors gave him mythic power... one of the other survivors is none other than a certain green dragon who's considered Daralathyxl greatest rival. The AP deals with the party slowly realizing what they are up against, trying to foil Daralathyxl cultists plan, travelling to the prison demiplane the dragon has made his home and then escaping back to Golarion in a mad rush to prevent the escaped Daralathyxl from achieving his original goal.
I could still see his alignment being LN and still be dangerous enough.
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Yeah, a Ha Hoi centred AP would be most obvious option for Dragon centric AP that works from start to finish.
Dragons and non-dragons can be allies, Dragons and non-Dragons can be enemies,
half-dragons/dragon-kin can abound, Dragons in Human form,
Dragons don't need to be "on-screen" because they are the contextual framework of the country and events there-in,
the plot doesn't need to be shoving Dragons as antagonists at every turn,
sometimes there will be Dragon antagonists (very likely opposing other Dragons),
other times it is just other Evil stuff going on - Cthuloid weirdness from Valashmai jungle,
Underdark mysteries, political chaos from Nagajor, cultists from other factions of Tian Xia, etc.
A Xa Hoi-themed/located adventure wouldn't even have to be dragon-centered to make me want to buy it. Just seeing someone use Vietnamese history, mythology, and folklore in the game would be wonderful.
I so love dragons!!! I wish this was somehow connected to the Dragonrider Class from SSG or Rite Publishings In the Company of Dragons but I'll still purchase this for all its scaley goodness.
Reading the disruption there seem to be both bloodlines and the idea form the last 2 sentences you can become a dragon or you are dragons in some kind of way, but would be cooler if you got to play dragons, but again we will have to see.
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Oh please let there be a dragon type eidolon for the unchained summoner... :D
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It will be months before we get the final description:(
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A dragon themed AP would be awesome.Distracting wall of text to follow...
** spoiler omitted **
I guess dragon campaign could still be done by using dragon type(drakes, wyverns, kobolds, half-dragons, dragon disciples, dragon bloodline sorcerers & bloodragers, gorynych, kongamato, peluda, jabberwock... Though I guess that might not work if what fans want is specifically true dragons :'D) creatures with more interesting varied abilities?*shrugs*
Either way, yeah, just fighting all true dragon types would get repetitive since they have rather similar abilities for most parts :'D
Anyway, on Mengkare... Wait, people really think that dragon building an "utopia" through elitism and eugenics is really LG? I thought the argument was about whether he is LN or LE <_< I'm now kinda curious at reasoning for that, or is it really just because gold dragons are LG normally?
Edit: Aww man, missed the post to tell focus on product X-x; I don't want to scrap whole post though, where is a thread I could relocate it to? I don't unfortunately have a lot of thoughts about legacy of dragons until I know more about it :'D
Dragon super best friends power up.
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Dragon themed items I'd like to see in the book
... Variants of the dragon bloodline - (Swapping the granted bloodline spells & feats to the ones on that ancient dragon spell list)
... New Dragon familiars, mounts and companions
... Since this is a play companion I feel space will but not used wisely to show new dragons, that is more of a campaign item
... dragon themed armor and weapons ( Armor from X-dragon scales that offer the same elemental protection, or swords made of dragon scales that do 1 extra point of elemental damage naturally)
... traits to make the PC's subtype "dragon", but they stay the same race
... feats to allow PC certain aspects of dragons like DR or cloud vision
Souphin, that covers most of my dragon related wish list for this book.
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Oh please let there be a dragon type eidolon for the unchained summoner... :D
If you're willing to go 3rd party Everyman Unchained:Eidolons allows you to make dragon eidolons for the Unchained summoner.
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Just dropped in to cackle and twiddle my fingers.
Hermea: Teach the controversy.
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This would be a good product to drop some Xa Hoi stuff in...hint hint
I recently came up with an Alchemist themed character that uses SCIENCE to replicate "draconic powers" and goes around claiming she is a half-dragon. Perhaps this book would help with that? Maybe some dragon themed discoveries or archetypes? Draconic mutagens?You can actually already get some of that even without this book. Draconic Reservoir and Dragon's Breath formulae, and the Master Chymist prestige class's Draconic Mutagen ability. Now the enhanced mutagen does require a minimum 16th character level, so lower-level options for draconic alchemy would be needed.
Hopefully that's one of the things this book can provide.
Oh thanks! yeah I was also think the discoveries that give you wings, and the ones that let you use your bombs as a breath weapon. I had no idea bout the master chymist. I do hope, this book gives more options. But I do think eventually the character will go the master chymist route.
I new it, Mengkare is a Veiled Master;)
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I new it, Mengkare is a Veiled Master;)
I've been kind of suspecting either this or that he's being controlled by a Veiled Master since his experiments seem a little too similar to what the Abolith did with the Azlanti. Having that odd dislike of the gods seems very Abolith-like as well.
Having the Abolith involved also nicely sidesteps some of the alignment drama, lol.
I was wondering if this new companion might have something relating to Hermea. Maybe some occult dragon bloodlines, or some sort of mash-up between occult rules and dragon-related rules. How about dragon-blooded psychically-powered enforcers of Mengkare's will?
(And yes, the Mengkare alignment debate is interesting, but it really belongs in another thread.)
+1 for more information about the Dragon Empires.
And maybe Triaxus too?
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I was wondering if this new companion might have something relating to Hermea. Maybe some occult dragon bloodlines, or some sort of mash-up between occult rules and dragon-related rules. How about dragon-blooded psychically-powered enforcers of Mengkare's will?
(And yes, the Mengkare alignment debate is interesting, but it really belongs in another thread.)
+1 for more information about the Dragon Empires.
And maybe Triaxus too?
If you're interested in occult matters, have you picked up Occult Realms? There's a section in there about Hermea, although it's all world-building without any new mechanics.
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Yep, I already have Occult Realms and have read about that particular university. It just seems obvious that Hermea - as a state under a dragon's control - would be a candidate for material in "Legacy of Dragons". While less obvious in a dragon-related sourcebook, I think that some sort of psychic vibe combination would fit Hermea too. :)
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May 2010, Adventurer's Armory is the most successful Player Companion ever.
September 2012. Ultimate Equipment.
You heard it here first,
February 2018, Ultimate Arcadia!
...what with Distant Shores in October 2015 being the most successful Campaign Setting ever...right? It was, right?
...
...
*crickets*
Right?
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For example, and confidentially, I pitched "Legacy of Otyughs" as a follow-up, but for some reason no one's gotten back to me about that idea yet...I would buy Legacy of Otyughs so fast...
Pfft, please. The Legacy of Otyughs is a load of crap.
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Can I just say how happy I am that we're finally getting something like this?