I miss Seven :(
It warms a GM's heart when their games are remembered. :)
Who let the cheese into this game? :)
I miss Seven :(
Me too, and Malka :(. At least we had a nice ending!
Gag...get a room!
PS, I miss Bryn and Lief.
Gag...get a room!
PS, I miss Bryn and Lief.
Wow, now that is going back sometimes.
That was 3.5 Eberron, excellent setting btw.
Good times. :)
I think your claws total attack bonus should be +4 (+1 BAB, +3 Str) before taking the rage in consideration, to a +6!
I wasn't sure - here's what it says... At 1st level, you grow claws while bloodraging. These claws are treated as natural weapons, allowing you to make two claw attacks as a full attack, using your full base attack bonus. These attacks deal 1d6 points of damage each (1d4 if you are Small) plus your Strength modifier.
I think that means I don't use my STR modifier to hit?
I mean, I'm happy to take it...
@Professoer - yes, I miss Eberron. It was a great setting.
I think we need to talk about what's happening over in Gameplay right now. It raises some important questions and, since we're in this game for the long haul, we ought to set ourselves on the same page from the start.
First, this post assumes Jenni was not being mind-controlled or something like that. I know we're keeping a lot of information secret, so I realize it's possible Jenni was acting on secret knowledge of which I'm not aware.
I was initially quite dismayed to read Jenni's post. In Pathfinder Society, where I got my start, PvP is strictly forbidden. In my own games, PvP has been strictly forbidden. In other games in which I've played, PvP never happened. Sure, people roleplay being angry or annoyed with other characters, but it's never come to blows. In PFS, this will actually get you kicked out of the table. I've taken this "unspoken rule" for granted for so long that it was quite a shock to me to see someone act contrary to it. When a post "bothers" me, I try to walk away from it for a while. So I did. Then I realized that I shouldn't be upset with Jenni's post, because we haven't talked about player v. player at all, or made any rules about it.
So let's talk about it.
This AP is a horror AP, and that it's meant to be different from other APs in that regard. The player's guide clues us in on certain elements, including a frank discussion of "trust" in the GM. For all of that, I honestly was not expecting another player to decide, unilaterally, to attack my PC. The genuine surprise I experienced was not the sort of "fear" I was hoping for in the AP. In fact, it was antithetical to fun. When the GM decides to attack a PC, or mind control a PC, there's generally an understanding that the player has consented to this in advance. After all, we all know that the GM is the one who sets up the challenges and doles out the rewards. But giving that agency to another player is not something we normally expect.
On top of this, what are the logistics of this fight? The doctor fell. Were we out of initiative? If so, Jenni's attack would have triggered another initiative roll, not automatically resolved. Perhaps we were still in initiative--e.g. the doctor has Jenni under some sort of mental control. This isn't clear, so I don't yet know how to respond to this action. Another problem is that Edrick is in ectoplasmic form, which is basically just physical form. Beating him into negative hitpoints doesn't cause him to "disappear into a puddle of sticky goop." He just falls unconcious like any other character. Does Jenny continue to ravage his unconscious "ghostly" body? It looks like her rage and fear compelled her to attack, so if she perceives Edrick as a threat, what would stop her from doing so?
I'm not opposed to this course of action. It does, after all, offer compelling roleplay opportunities. I would just like us to come to an agreement as to what's acceptable in this very unique adventure, to save us from future heartaches and headaches.
Thoughts?
I'll be gone most of today and won't be able to post until this evening. Please bot me as necessary.
I don' think this is a PvP or a mind-controlled PC.
I think Jenni just thought that the 'ghost' was another monster that was keeping her prisoner (was somehow allied with the doctor).
Jenni will tell us what her intentions were but the fact that she apologizes for rolling so well rules out PvP from the start.
@Cirio: I think you need to get your coffee and re read the post again. :)
The 'goo' part was Jenni protrayal of ripping part of the body (what would be gore, blood, skin, etc. on a regular 'being') and then having that 'disappearing' in a 'goo'.
You can pretty much bet that this is everyone's first time in seeing a 'phantom' and Jenni (unlike Lucius) didn't see that you were talking to it.
I may be mistaking here but everything looks normal, just a misunderstanding.
I don' think this is a PvP or a mind-controlled PC.
I think Jenni just thought that the 'ghost' was another monster that was keeping her prisoner (was somehow allied with the doctor).
Jenni will tell us what her intentions were but the fact that she apologizes for rolling so well rules out PvP from the start.
@Cirio: I think you need to get your coffee and re read the post again. :)
The 'goo' part was Jenni protrayal of ripping part of the body (what would be gore, blood, skin, etc. on a regular 'being') and then having that 'disappearing' in a 'goo'.
I may be mistaking here but everything looks normal...
Maybe so. Still, I've never had one player roll an attack against another. Learner's curve? Either way, I have to disagree that it "looks normal."
Maybe so. Still, I've never had one player roll an attack against another. Learner's curve? Either way, I have to disagree that it "looks normal."I don' think this is a PvP or a mind-controlled PC.
I think Jenni just thought that the 'ghost' was another monster that was keeping her prisoner (was somehow allied with the doctor).
Jenni will tell us what her intentions were but the fact that she apologizes for rolling so well rules out PvP from the start.
@Cirio: I think you need to get your coffee and re read the post again. :)
The 'goo' part was Jenni protrayal of ripping part of the body (what would be gore, blood, skin, etc. on a regular 'being') and then having that 'disappearing' in a 'goo'.
I may be mistaking here but everything looks normal...
Please note that I added this "You can pretty much bet that this is everyone's first time in seeing a 'phantom' and Jenni (unlike Lucius) didn't see that you were talking to it." to my post above.
About the rolling. What would you have done? Assume a hit or a miss after your intention to attack? I think Jenni wanted some sort of outcome so she could write about it.
Trust me on this. I've been playing with Jenni for a long time and she's not 'that kind of player'. In fact, I'll bet she is embarrassed by all the 'words' that were generated by her actions. :)
Game on!
@Wicked, I completely apologize for my post last night. The truth is, I was just got caught up in the moment of writing, and thought it would be fun to misidentify Edrick as a threat.
After I posted it and went to bed, I realized that I should have conferred with you first by pm, and worked out a storyline together. I know absolutely nothing about your character class, and assumed that Edrick was basically like a spell that I ended early. As I lay in bed, I was going over the post in my mind and realized that I may have been wrong about that, and that it was definitely something that needed talking about. I had already decided to address it in the morning.
It is certainly not my intention to rampage through the party, pissing everybody off. Does anybody mind if we hold the action here until Cerio's back at the table? It was my mistake, and I think too important of one to bot his character through it until this has been resolved. I'm happy to a) either delete the action altogether, and have Jenni "realize" that the ghost looks like one of the prisoners before she attacks, b) have her start to attack and be stopped before she gets to far, or c) continue as written, with any adjustments necessary.
Wow, I'm glad I'm here soon enough (I think) to avoid any spilled blood and hard feelings.
About PVP: PVP is never encouraged and I agree with you completely Cerio. This isn't a game for this like many others and I think we'll have enough horror and deadly things to kill you without the need of PVP.
That being said, I imagine Lucius is correct in assuming that it wasn't Jenni's intention to start a PVP with you. I fully believe her post was solely thinking about RPing and had no second intentions, even if it could have been handled differently, like threatening the ghost first, giving you a chance to react before attacking. Like she said, she (as a player) wasn't aware of the importance of the phantom to a spiritualist.
________________________________
Wearing Janni's shoes, here is how I see things: She, like the remaining of you, don't remember anything about your past and is locked in a jail. She sees through the bars a 'doctor' torturing a man and when she manages to escape, she lashes into it until it is down. She then looks around and sees a ghost.
The ghost have attacked the doctor but during a fight it is possible that she missed it and since the 'googles girl' had the only keys, how this creature is out? The conclusion that it could be an enemy is not far-fetched at all.
________________________________
How to solve this conundrum:
As Jenni started to attack (while her claws were in mid air) Cerio had started (consciously or not) to call Edrick back to his mind. The goo that resulted from the attack was similar to the goo left on the cell bars. This way, Edrick is 'gone' for the scene, but without any consequence to Cerio, who can summon/puke him again. I think this is the easiest route to take.
I believe that nothing is final and I'm completely not against bend the rules sometimes to correct an honest mistake. I hope there are no hard feelings between any of you.
What would you have done? Assume a hit or a miss after your intention to attack? I think Jenni wanted some sort of outcome so she could write about it.
@Lucius - I would probably have written something like: "PC raises his claws as if to attack! Tag other PC" then waited for a response. Or even just ask in discussion, as I recently did in WotR when my PC's "blinding shield" risked impacting a party member.
These are only suggestions, of course, meant to reduce confusion.
I'm not opposed to this course of action. It does, after all, offer compelling roleplay opportunities. I would just like us to come to an agreement as to what's acceptable in this very unique adventure, to save us from future heartaches and headaches.
@Jenni - You don't need to apologize. Your post contributes to the atmospheric tension of the scene, which is a very valuable thing. As Lucius wrote, he has known you for a long time and knows how you play, while you and I have just "met." There are no hard feelings!
I like your idea about sending a PM to explain a post or ask a question.
@Thing - That interpretation of the post works great because it's completely consistent with what Jenni actually wrote. In my post tonight, I'll go with that.
*Backspaces very long post that got ninja'd by the GM*
@GM Thing: I totally agree and think its the best way to handle it.
While I agree that it's obvious that Jenni's intentions were innocent and just a result of unfamiliarity with the Spiritualist class, Cerio losing his spirit this early would be a huge disadvantage to his character. I imagine would make things pretty un-fun for him, given how it would have been lost. So, I'd be glad for the retcon.
So what is it that Lucius always say, Game on? :)
*Backspaces very long post that got ninja'd by the GM*
@GM Thing: I totally agree and think its the best way to handle it.
While I agree that it's obvious that Jenni's intentions were innocent and just a result of unfamiliarity with the Spiritualist class, Cerio losing his spirit this early would be a huge disadvantage to his character. I imagine would make things pretty un-fun for him, given how it would have been lost. So, I'd be glad for the retcon.
So, how does a phantom heal? Can they 'die'?
I had an idea like they were similar to eidolons in which they don't really die but sort of go dormant for a while until healed.
I'll read up it later I guess.
Phantoms are very similar to eidolons. Instead of from a myriad of planes like the eidolons (depending on its alignment), phantoms are always from the ethereal plane.
Regarding his mechanical life, they work just like an eidolon: they don't heal naturally and are sent back to the ethereal plane if 'killed', being unable to be summoned for 24 hours. Like the summoners, spiritualists can also sacrifice their hp to keep a phantom from being sent back to his plane.
Wow, a lot can happen when you're asleep...
It sounds like everything has been resolved and there's nothing that I can add. I just wanted to assure Cerio that I don't believe Jenni had any malicious intent. (Lucius summed up what I would have said nicely). I know Jenni personally, not just virtually, and she's a way nicer/better person than I am :)
Do we even our names to introduce ourselves?
'the man with the mustache' and 'the man with white hair' is getting 'old'. :)
Unfortunately you don't, but nothing is stopping you from creating an alias for yourselves.
Ok, fresh from a 'confrontation', I'm going to stir the pot again. :)
About the secret knowledge bit, which I know we agreed upon.
One of the PMs sent to me had a flashback for Lucius. I thought that it was a very good piece of writing and think it should be shared with the players (not the characters, at least not yet).
How do you guys feel about that?
These flashbacks are great for immersion into the game and I would hate for our GM's writing to be limited to just my enjoyment.
Should we share flashbacks and other similar 'immersive/storytelling' scenes?
Thoughts?
I shared my flashback - that was the italics bit that was her memory when she freaked out. It was way too good not to share. I think we can all keep that knowledge separate from our characters.
If it makes sense to do so, and we feel like doing it, I think flashing back is fine.
Thing - are we still spooked? Thanks for putting the fear rules up.
I shared my flashback -
You weren't supposed to. Now, you've done it again. :)
There's no defending you, Jenni. :)
Watch yourself, Mustard. Mustang. Seriously, phone? How am I supposed to threaten him if I can't use his name. Aha...It's an American/Canadian spelling issue. Watch yourself, Moustache, or I'll slit your throat while you sleep. I'm crazy that way. Rawr.
Too soon?
I think that you are more than welcome to share these flashbacks. My idea about sending you these 'secret knowledge' PMs are to give you the opportunity to share them or not, but the ultimate decision would be up to you.
I think it is importance of keep sending them via PM is that it won't feel weird when some real important bit of information comes from one of you.
For an example, lets say that in some point you get split in 2+ groups and a mean doppelganger kills and takes the place of one of you. In this case I'd be sending PMs to coordinate the RP with the 'unlucky' player and it would be common for him to come up with information... if I normally only spoiler them to you, when the mentioned player comes up with new information, the others would be too suspicious.
I like the PMS, and I Like being surprised by reading little details like the one in Jenni's post. Since the flashbacks are of your character, and since it's "sensitive" information, I'd suggest placing it into a "Background" spoiler in your profile. Then, those of us who're interested can read through, while those who want to avoid any such spoilers can just ignore that info until the PC presents it through roleplay.
In fairness, I don't think it's trapped, since she opened and closed it when I used Ghost Sound.
@Lucius: Since the inspiration rolls are done after the roll itself, I'm thinking about sending you a PM informing you that you can use your inspiration in a roll.
As a player, I only roll for inspiration when I have the original check is good but I sense that a slightly higher roll might be better... for an example, when the GM asks me for a Sense Motive and I get an 18. Using my knowledge of how APs are made, much of the DCs are 10, 15, 20, and 25, so when I hit something close, but not quite one of these scores (specially 20), I go for the inspiration roll.
If you agree with this logic, I'd be sending you a PM when your check is around 3 from such 'benchmarks', meaning that you'd have at least 50% of chance to succeed.
Inspiration rolls are precious things for an Investigator and as a player we all have that 'feeling' when a roll is important or not, so I'd try to focus more on important events then simple and meaningful tests.
Thoughts?
________________________________
As a side note, I've noticed that you are all Chaotic, and most of you are also Neutral (I don't even know Mira's alignment!). It occurred to me that perhaps you took this alignment to fit your background so I thought it was important to tell you that you don't need to do so.
Your amnesiac state is like a blank sheet. You could have been a fallen paladin before (thus CE) and then become a paladin once you awake. We are still on the beginning and none of you made any real moral decision so feel free to pick whatever alignment you want!
@Lucius: Since the inspiration rolls are done after the roll itself, I'm thinking about sending you a PM informing you that you can use your inspiration in a roll.
As a player, I only roll for inspiration when I have the original check is good but I sense that a slightly higher roll might be better... for an example, when the GM asks me for a Sense Motive and I get an 18. Using my knowledge of how APs are made, much of the DCs are 10, 15, 20, and 25, so when I hit something close, but not quite one of these scores (specially 20), I go for the inspiration roll.
If you agree with this logic, I'd be sending you a PM when your check is around 3 from such 'benchmarks', meaning that you'd have at least 50% of chance to succeed.
Inspiration rolls are precious things for an Investigator and as a player we all have that 'feeling' when a roll is important or not, so I'd try to focus more on important events then simple and meaningful tests.
Thoughts?
________________________________As a side note, I've noticed that you are all Chaotic, and most of you are also Neutral (I don't even know Mira's alignment!). It occurred to me that perhaps you took this alignment to fit your background so I thought it was important to tell you that you don't need to do so.
Your amnesiac state is like a blank sheet. You could have been a fallen paladin before (thus CE) and then become a paladin once you awake. We are still on the beginning and none of you made any real moral decision so feel free to pick whatever alignment you want!
INSPIRATIONS
That's fine. I just wanted to make sure that I got to use them at all. :)Don't forget my inspirations that are free to use on trained knowledge, linguistics, and stealth. Please always add those to your rolls. I suspect I will get more 'free inspirations' as the character grows but I will let you know.
ALIGNMENTS
I'll confess that I care very little about alignment. .
I just try to get in my character's skin and react accordingly. I do have some general guidelines but nothing too strict. For example, my NG, CG, and LG PCs may react exactly the same way to a certain situation.
Re: alignment. So basically we're the cast of Dark Matter....:)
I also care little about alignment. I've never played a game where it's really been important.
I think we're all ready to climb the stairs.
As a side note, I've noticed that you are all Chaotic, and most of you are also Neutral (I don't even know Mira's alignment!). It occurred to me that perhaps you took this alignment to fit your background so I thought it was important to tell you that you don't need to do so.
Your amnesiac state is like a blank sheet. You could have been a fallen paladin before (thus CE) and then become a paladin once you awake. We are still on the beginning and none of you made any real moral decision so feel free to pick whatever alignment you want!
Oops. I think I had her as Chaotic Good on the initial sheet I used to build the character, but never copied it over. That being said her alignment isn't the easiest thing to peg down. Her tendency towards manipulation and trickery definitely fits the bill for chaotic, but its more than a little ironic since she hates chaos more than anything else. She is very protective of other people (good), but sort of resents it and does it out of a lot of the time out of obligation (not as good...sort of lawful?). Oh, alignments. I'll probably throw down Chaotic Good for the sake of staying within one step of the party and for things like Protection from Alignment spells.
@Thing: Is it possible that in her alchemist's kit that Alenka has a mutagen and extract already prepared or has too much time elapsed? Just wondering because she wouldn't have had time to use the kit or prepare anything. If not that's fine, at least she has her cleaver :)
The map looks to be seriously off. I tried to avoid peeking, but I can't help but notice everything is suddenly visible.
The map looks to be seriously off. I tried to avoid peeking, but I can't help but notice everything is suddenly visible.
Thanks for letting me know! Something happened (not sure if on my part) but it is fixed now!
@Alenka: Unfortunately, too much time have passed.
It takes a full minute to manifest a phantom, but how long to "recall" it back into my head? Here's the only forum post I found, stating it's a standard action, but that didn't look official...
Was thinking to pull ghost out of the way..
It takes a full minute to manifest a phantom, but how long to "recall" it back into my head? Here's the only forum post I found, stating it's a standard action, but that didn't look official...
Was thinking to pull ghost out of the way..
It is indeed a standard action. Actually it is stated on third paragraph of the 'Phantom' entrance. The fun thing is that I think they just recently added it since a couple days ago I also tried to find it and wasn't able to!
Is the Current Map, correct? Trying to determine if going north leads to an exit.
@Cerio: With the unnatural storm outside, it is practically impossible to know... it seems to be daytime, but if it is still in the morning or in the afternoon you can't tell.
@Alenka: The map should be correct. Since only Jenni can see in the dark, I've added a shaded area which represents her darkvision. Since you can't see in the dark, you can't be sure if going north would lead to an exit until you actually explore it.
Thanks, that makes sense. Going north keeps us inside and out of the weird rain, right?
Thanks, that makes sense. Going north keeps us inside and out of the weird rain, right?
Yes, the rain only takes effect on the courtyard, which has no exit since the north wall is collapsed (It could actually be cleared but it would take several hours in the rain).
So, just to make sure, you are all moving north, not opening any doors?
Goggles likes her doors shut :) Although I'm sure Cerio will be flinging all the doors wide open...
Correct, I've not attempted to open any doors. Yet...:)
Also recognizing that if creepy is spotted, he could draw a slew of enemies right on top of us!
Not if he's in a different room, and walking through walls. Can he communicate with you while he's in a different room? Could you resorb him from a distance?
He should stay within 50 feet of me. He can move up to 100ft away, but beyond 50ft I have to concentrate to keep him on this plane.
We can communicate telepathically as a free action, even across such a distance. He can also be reabsorbed across such a distance, but that's a standard action.
I'll put something in gameplay now.
As discussed, I've started putting the 'flashbacks' part of my 'secret knowledge' in my alias (bottom of page).
GM Thing is doing too good a job to have these be private. My PC sounds better every time I read one of these. :)
Enjoy but please remember to keep player and character knowledge separate.
Game on!
Those flashbacks are wonderful.
Thing, I have a question that needs a ruling, and I can't find any answer at all. What do you think?
When the phantom is fully manifested, the spiritualist can change the form of the phantom's manifestation (either from ectoplasmic to incorporeal or vice versa) as a full-round action that provokes attacks of opportunity.
So if the spiritualist is standing back a safe distance, but the phantom is in melee, and the spiritualist takes a full-round action to change the phantom's phase, does the phantom provoke an AoO, the spiritualist only, or both?
It makes sense to me that whichever one is in battle would provoke the AoO. If both are engaged, both would get it, but if one is not engaged in battle, then he should be safe from an AoO. But I'm no rules-knower-person.
It makes sense to me that whichever one is in battle would provoke the AoO. If both are engaged, both would get it, but if one is not engaged in battle, then he should be safe from an AoO. But I'm no rules-knower-person.
Disclaimer: I have no real knowledge nor did I research this.
I would say the spiritualist because he's the only doing something that requires some sort of concentration.
The phantom is just the target of the ability.
it would be similar to when someone cast a polymorph spell; the caster may incur AoO but not the target of the spell.
@Cerio: The way I understand it, I think only the spiritualist provokes the AoO. I also believe this is the RAI, even if it is a little vague in RAW.
What did Jenni do to provoke an AoO?
What did Jenni do to provoke an AoO?
Moving 'past' (leaving, NOT entering) a threatened square provokes an AoO except when you move a '5-foot step'.
You probably moved past both centipedes...