Thanks for the quick answer, DM.
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And dumb question #2: do any of these tieflings look at all like beast-folk? I've been wondering about the daemon-spawn and rakshasa-spawn.
I've been hoping for animal-headed tieflings (rakshasa-spawn) *and* aasimar (agathion-spawn) from these books.
The thought of an ancient Osirioni culture that had animal-headed planetouched in positions of authority, considered as intercessors with the gods whom their parents served (even if not always, with some cheerfully taking advantage of that assumption...), appeals to me.
The pic of the Rakshasa-spawn Tiefling looks like a tiger based female Catfolk with red eyes. But with being said you can decide how you want the Tiefling to look based on any fiend in that subtype of Tiefling.
Three more days after today. GAH!
GAAAAAAHHHHHHH~~
How are the curses, btw?
And I wonder what the Daemon-spawn Tieflings are supposed to look like. The book hasn't gotten here in Finland yet, apparently...
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Awesome! Again so happy to see subdomains for the alignment domains that don't have anything to do with outsiders makes it easier to make gods of varied alignments and make those alignments mean more then "ohh this is the outsider that is closest to their alignment". Case and point i don't think that most successful NE gods would necessarily want to be directly associated with Daemons and their goals lest they lose followers but an evil god who extols the powers of fear, that i can see picking up followers and helping flesh out the god in general.
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Awesome! Again so happy to see subdomains for the alignment domains that don't have anything to do with outsiders makes it easier to make gods of varied alignments and make those alignments mean more then "ohh this is the outsider that is closest to their alignment".
I am not sure what you are saying here...
But the first line of the subdomains...
The following subdomains grant powers to those divine spellcasters whose power comes from patrons of Abaddon, the Abyss, or Hell.
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Awesome! Again so happy to see subdomains for the alignment domains that don't have anything to do with outsiders makes it easier to make gods of varied alignments and make those alignments mean more then "ohh this is the outsider that is closest to their alignment".I am not sure what you are saying here...
I *think* he's saying that a cleric of Urgathoa might have zero interest in taking the 'daemon' domain, since she's not that strongly associated with daemons, and a cleric of Rovagug or Zon-Kuthon (or CE or LE cleric of Gorum or Irori) might have no interest in demons or devils, or a sub-domain tied to them.
(That being said, a Kyton sub-domain, for Kuthites, could be funky!)
What are the kyton and asura tieflings like? Fluff and crunch wise.
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What Set said. I like that we are getting more subdomains for the alignment domains that are not based on the associated outsiders. Don't get me wrong I like that we have them but i think that the domain of evil, law, chaos, etc. have more to them then the outsiders that are associated with them and subdomains are a perfect way to represent that.
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I *think* he's saying that a cleric of Urgathoa might have zero interest in taking the 'daemon' domain, since she's not that strongly associated with daemons, and a cleric of Rovagug or Zon-Kuthon (or CE or LE cleric of Gorum or Irori) might have no interest in demons or devils, or a sub-domain tied to them.(That being said, a Kyton sub-domain, for Kuthites, could be funky!)
Another example is Zon-Kuthon I never really associate him with devils since much of his backstory and modus aperindi has nothing to do with them so the devil subdomain doesn't make much sense to me. But Fear, fear makes perfect sense for Kuthon and his followers to have as a subdomain maybe even a favored one as he is a god of envy, pain, and loss. Another could be Norgorber since i never really see him as caring about daemons save for the knowledge they acquire but i can see his followers as both respecting lauding fear as a tool to gain knowledge and make changes in the world subtly. Make more sense?
Also with you set would love to see a Kyton subdomain, maybe even a qlippoth or asura just to see how they play out ^-^.
I'm presuming either the Oni spawn or Rakshasa spawn are the ones getting the ability to look like a human instead of the darkness spell-like ability.
Would anyone be willing to spoil the BASICS of the Daemon Sorcerer Bloodline? I'm not asking for full text just a basic summary blurb. I am currently making a daemon-spawn sorcerer for a game and I would like to know if this will be a worthwhile choice for me or if I can wait to get the book later down the road.
The Sorcerer bloodline
1st-waisting ray- inflict starvation or thirst-make con check or take 1d6 nonleathal damage.
3rd-resistances
9th-Age Out-temperally age yourself to get rid of fort and/or will save based effects.
15th-Wound warp-teleport out of the wounds of dead bodies, deal 4d6 acid damage(ref 1/2) to adjacent targets.
20th-standard immunities, resistances, etc.
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Azura-spawn(Faultspawn)
+2dex +2wis -2int
Hideous laughter(1/day)
Appraise,Knowledge (Local)
Daemon-spawn(grimspawn)
+2dex +2int -2wis
Death Knell(1/day)
Disable Device, Sleight of Hand
Demodand-spwan(Foulspawn)
+2con +2wis -2int
Bear's Enderance(1/day)
Intimidate, Knowledge(Religion)
Demon-spawn(Pitborn)
+2str +2cha -2int
Shatter(1/day)
Disable Device, Perception
Devil-spawn(Hellspawn)
+2con +2wis -2cha
Pyrotchnics(1/day)
Diplomacy, Sense Motive
Div-spawn(Spitespawn)
+2dex +2cha -2int
Misdirection(1/day)
Diplomacy, Linguistics
Kyton-spawn(Shackleborn)
+2con +2cha -2wis
Web(1/day)
Escape Artist, Intimidate
Oni-spawn(Hungerseed)
+2str +2wis -2cha
Alterself(1/day)
Disguise, Intimidate
Qlippoth-spawn(the Motherless)
+2str 2wis -2int
Blur(1/day)
Escape Artist, Survival
Rakshasa-spawn(Beastbrood)
+2dex +2cha -2wis
Detect Toughts(1/day)
Disguise, Sense Motive
Is there anything that really goes well a Tiefling Rogue?
what about favored class options or alt. racial traits?
Traits
born damned- +2 trait bonuses vs curse effects
shadow stabber- +2 trait bonus on melee weapon damage rolls against foes who cannot see you.
twilight zeal- +1 trait bonus t will saveswhile in dim light or darkness.
Feats
Blinding sneak attack-blind enemy for 1 round(Fort Negates) if you sneak attack in magical darkness.
Fiendish darkness- darkness(3/day) istead of once.
Fiendish Rescilance-+4 save vs one energy type you are resistant too(must have evasion class feature)
Fiendish Facade-+5 bonus to disguise yourself as a particular race(must be taken at 1st level).
I didn't see any racial favorite class bonuses(maybe in Advanced Races)
I was only listing abilities that someone would find useful for a Rogue.
The heritages that I posted above are the only thing that replaces racial abilities of the Tiefling.
Cool thanks for the Info Dragon78 and Dragnmoon. yeah Race trait and racial trait do get confusing/frustrating some times.
Does the Motherless get any feat options?
Like, say, the Please Don't Kill Me So My Player Can Play Me feat?
Does the Motherless get any feat options?
Like, say, the Please Don't Kill Me So My Player Can Play Me feat?
Not just the Motherless. Would not ANY mosterous appearing character need that?
The feats in the book are for basic tieflings, none were designed with a particular heritage in mind.
Motherless traits
Repel Sin- +2 trait bonus to saves vs evil spells
Vile Kiss- +2 trait bonus to dirty tricks combat maneuvers to grant the sickened condition.
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Got it. Still reading it, but it's been really good so far.
I really like that it was left open on whether many tieflings went evil because of their blood or because of society's treatment and expectations of them.(I lean hard towards the latter, so I'm glad it was kept open as an option).
And it really does look like there's a lot of support for heroic tieflings. (and non-heroic non-evil tieflings that lead mundane lives) :) This is what I wish the orcs book had been.
Sarenraen tiefling is one of my new favorite pieces of Pathfinder art.
Not just the Motherless. Would not ANY mosterous appearing character need that?Does the Motherless get any feat options?
Like, say, the Please Don't Kill Me So My Player Can Play Me feat?
That is true. But when you compare "I have horns and pointy teeth" with "I look like something that H.R. Geiger refused to paint because it was too weird", well...
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That is true. But when you compare "I have horns and pointy teeth" with "I look like something that H.R. Geiger refused to paint because it was too weird", well...Not just the Motherless. Would not ANY mosterous appearing character need that?Does the Motherless get any feat options?
Like, say, the Please Don't Kill Me So My Player Can Play Me feat?
If a motherless is anything like a Qlippoth, I can definitely see a motherless inquisitor that attempts to grasp the concept that you can combat demons without having to kill innocents before they sin. As for what deity the Motherless would fight for... that's a good question.
When is the PDF supposed to be available? It says "PDF available today US/Eastern" and its now 2am US EST Wed 25th. but still not available.
When is the PDF supposed to be available? It says "PDF available today US/Eastern" and its now 2am US EST Wed 25th. but still not available.
Paizo bases everything off of their time, which is Pacific. I believe PDFs go live at 12am Pacific time, which means 3am for us east coasters.
@Joseph
Thanks for that. I honestly wish they'd say US/Western rather than US/Eastern then. Not that its a huge issue, just kind of annoying. Was hoping to have it downloaded before the brunt of my work hours started.
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So! Question! This book makes no mention of the Fiendish Heritage feat from bastards of Erebus. In fact, it seems to imply that Fiendish heritage isn't needed. the only thing it mentions is:
"A player may choose one of the following 10 heritages for her tiefling character in place of the traditional tiefling racial features."
So do we still need Fiendish Heritage to take these heritages?
Oh, I'll still buy the book because I'm a sucker for all things fiendish (quippoth and kyton heritages, bonus). Also new art and more fluff, always good.Well... wait until you see the demon-spawn tiefling first! She DOES happen to look kind of succubusy...Well... darn.
Yeah, I know about the Alu-Fiend from ToHC. I was hoping for something a bit more reasonable to lay out in front of the DM. Alas, back to homebrew...
Well, I have the book now and I have to admit that the Pitborn illustration does indeed look succubusy. It's a pity that the rest of the entry describes an Orc.
Ok, I'm trying to be funny but I'm afraid that'll read a bit snarky. To undercut that, I have to say the illustration quality in this book is awesome and I'm hoping the portrait of the Pitborn winds up being usable on these forums as an avatar pic because it's great. Lots of nice, thematic, Feats and Traits and other things, the only thing that jumps out at me as a bit of a derp moment was the handling of Fiendish Sorcery. Easy to houserule that, though.
But I get it, the Pitborn's a DM tool to create low level threats for a Worldwound based campaign, not really for PCs. Unless, you know, you want to be an Eldrich Knight on 'roids.
Chief Technical Officer
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It used to say 3 am us/eastern (or in my case 8am/GMT) but hasn't been for a bit.@Joseph
Thanks for that. I honestly wish they'd say US/Western rather than US/Eastern then. Not that its a huge issue, just kind of annoying. Was hoping to have it downloaded before the brunt of my work hours started.
The time zone we display is actually based on a preference you set: https://secure.paizo.com/paizo/account/settings/messageboard.
We don't show specific times for PDFs to become available, just days, which are adjusted to your time zone. So if you had looked at 11:59 PM EST, you'd see "Available tomorrow," which would be correct for you, and if you looked two minutes later, you'd see "Available today," which would also be correct for you. At that very same moment, people on Central Time would still see "Available tomorrow," because that's what's true for them.
So! Question! This book makes no mention of the Fiendish Heritage feat from bastards of Erebus. In fact, it seems to imply that Fiendish heritage isn't needed. the only thing it mentions is:
"A player may choose one of the following 10 heritages for her tiefling character in place of the traditional tiefling racial features."So do we still need Fiendish Heritage to take these heritages?
That is correct; you no longer need the Fiendish Heritage feat to take one of the heritages listed in Blood of Fiends.
That is correct; you no longer need the Fiendish Heritage feat to take one of the heritages listed in Blood of Fiends.So! Question! This book makes no mention of the Fiendish Heritage feat from bastards of Erebus. In fact, it seems to imply that Fiendish heritage isn't needed. the only thing it mentions is:
"A player may choose one of the following 10 heritages for her tiefling character in place of the traditional tiefling racial features."So do we still need Fiendish Heritage to take these heritages?
This ought to please a lot of people, given how many of us were asking for it. Thanks, Paizo!
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But I get it, the Pitborn's a DM tool to create low level threats for a Worldwound based campaign, not really for PCs. Unless, you know, you want to be an Eldrich Knight on 'roids.
This really shouldn't be the case for Player's Companion material.
Looking at the specific heritage write-ups as very generalized gloss-overs helps a bit, something others might expecct of your tiefling at a glance rather than specific details you have to shackle to your character.
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Creative Director
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As with all the tiefling variants, pitborn included... these tieflings do not HAVE to be evil.
And some campaigns allow evil PCs anyway.
That said... while all of these variant tieflings do grant players new options, they absolutely do grant GMs options as well. That's a strength, not a flaw.
(There's going to be one of these variant tieflings in an upcoming adventure path adventure, for example.)
As for pitborn tieflings being able to benefit "more" than others if they're sorcerers due to their Charisma bonus... I don't have a problem with that, honestly.
But I get it, the Pitborn's a DM tool to create low level threats for a Worldwound based campaign, not really for PCs. Unless, you know, you want to be an Eldrich Knight on 'roids.This really shouldn't be the case for Player's Companion material.
Looking at the specific heritage write-ups as very generalized gloss-overs helps a bit, something others might expecct of your tiefling at a glance rather than specific details you have to shackle to your character.
I don't have a problem with it, really. Looking back at Bastards of Erebus, you can see it was always the plan and that's not a bad thing.
And yes, I get playing against type and all that and the book does do a good job of saying 'they're usually evil but there's room for your good PC'. I'd be happy to discuss my problem with the Pitborn elsewhere but really it has nothing to do with Blood of Fiends, which is a good book.
As with all the tiefling variants, pitborn included... these tieflings do not HAVE to be evil.
And some campaigns allow evil PCs anyway.
I would love to find one of these mythical beasts, I've never seen one IRL and I've been playing since 1e.
That said... while all of these variant tieflings do grant players new options, they absolutely do grant GMs options as well. That's a strength, not a flaw.
I agree.
As for pitborn tieflings being able to benefit "more" than others if they're sorcerers due to their Charisma bonus... I don't have a problem with that, honestly.
Oh, that's balanced out by their 1 net base skill point per level. And hopefully all their Str buffs will encourage them to get into hand to hand and discover almost everything is better than they are at hand to hand... though I'm sure there are builds with Transformation that can mitigate that too.
(Sorry for the re-post)
I have a problem with the 'Fiendish Sorcery' racial Trait.
Fiendish Sorcery: Tiefling sorcerers with the Abyssal or Infernal bloodlines treat their Charisma scores as 2 points higher for all sorcerer class abilities.
There is no indication in the book that this effect only applies to 'mongrel' tieflings, or those who stem from the 'appropriate' fiend type.
So, by RAW, neither a Beastbrood nor a Grimspawn would have any problems in getting this bonus when claiming an Infernal Bloodline (after all, it has been a long tradition that pretty much any sorcerer can be of any bloodline)... while, for getting this trait to work with his defining parental bloodline, the Beastbrood has to take the Improved Fiendish Sorcery Feat. The Grimspawn is out of luck altogether.
Umm... huh? Can anyone help me with this type of logic? Am I the only one who thinks that for those 'pure-blooded' Tieflings, their heritage Bloodline would be the one they are most closely tied to?