The Red Mage's page

...And look, I'm not an expert on psychology or mental illness. I have no formal training and do not experience any mental illnesses myself...

It is much more likely that a psychopath would worship Rovagug than someone without that condition. A lack of empathy, amoral tendencies, and violent trends make it more likely a person will do physical harm to others than someone without those conditions. Bizarre and extreme philosophical beliefs also point in the direction of that sort of mental illness. A worshiper of Rovagug, as presented, meets both criteria.

Representation here matters, and the presentation of "madness" in this context is lazy and dishonest at best, and actively damaging (physically, mentally, and socially) to those who suffer stigma for their mental illness(es) at worst.

It is intellectually dishonest to assume all people who suffer from the stigma of a mental illness are necessarily offended or harmed by "fantasy madness". With some basic understanding of tropes and context, a reasonable person would not necessarily be taken aback by these terms. The writers do assume most readers will be reasonable, rational people, and that's their call.

As a sufferer of a mental illness (a severe chemical mood disorder), I am neither offended by "fantasy madness" nor do I think it contributes to any social harm. Real social harm comes from a lack of recognition that mental illnesses are also physical, chemical illnesses that should included with any other illness as an important part of overall healthcare.

In my opinion, you're expressing a totalitarian viewpoint on what a writer can and cannot say based on well-meaning but ill-conceived notions of social harm. Taking offense to something does not automatically make it a valid offense. "Madness" in the context of a fantasy roleplaying setting based on time-tested sword and sorcery tropes isn't. I'd rather you be offended and choose not to use that section of material than eliminate an inoffensive tidbit.

To me, "fantasy madness" is shorthand for malignant psychopathy/sociopathy/chaotic evilness, not a blanket term for those who suffer from any form of mental illness. Madness is a discredited term anyway, and I don't feel "fantasy madness" crosses over into modern sensitivities. If the designers used contemporary terms like mentally ill, I would have a huge problem because of what that means in a real-world context.

That is to say, you would have to be a chaotic evil and extremely unstable psychopath to worship Rovagug (which opens up the roleplaying option to do so in the first place and allows for that trope), but just being unstable in some form does not in any way qualify you as such.

Nothing wrong with pointing fingers at SKR for things though. That's always a good thing.

Favorites: Alkenstar, Andoran, Galt, Hold of Belzken, Mendev, Mwangi Expanse, Osirion, and Realm of the Mammoth Lords.

Least favorites: Druma, Hermea, Cheliax, Hermea, Nidal, and Hermea.

Dire?

Dat x6 crit multiplier on a 20th level lethal keen scythe fighter.

I don't always threaten critical hits, but when I do, it dies.

Lethal doesn't make sense as a name. Longswords are already lethal weapons :P

The Red Mage wrote:

That shaman is totally about to tip over.

maybe she's a little tipsy?

If she's anything like a real world shaman, she's definitely tipsy.

Minor gripe: Why does Djem So grant a benefit when fighting multiple opponents and a penalty when dueling only one? And why does it grant Weapon Finesse? It's supposed to be a slower style emphasizing brute force and effective against overpowering a single opponent.

That shaman is totally about to tip over.

Incredibly stupid guards are a standard fantasy trope. But usually for a one-scene gag purpose only.

Anything that can fool superhuman genome soldiers can fool even the most observant fantasy guards.

I'd give anyone using a cardboard box as a Stealth aid a +10 circumstance bonus. +20 for a mithral box.

The Red Mage wrote:

Honest Feelings

Thank you The Red Mage for looking over the IB6. For my players and myself we are really hoping this system works for us. It wasn't meant to remove gear or save wealth, just standardize certain treasure so a PC doesn't feel like a they are not equipped for a challenge.

It sounds like you have a fix that works for you group and you guys are good with it.

Thank you again for looking it over.

Sure thing, it was in good faith. You're on the right track in trying to solve a problem that has plagued the game for like 15 years. It just has a lot of room for improvement in my opinion.

I appreciate the revised WBL charts, but the fix itself is really convoluted. It isn't so much as a real patch as it is a more complicated way of achieving the same result as in the core game.

It's sort of a strange porridge of a lack of gear dependency (but actually just as gear-dependent) and wealth-saving for cooler stuff (but not really, because you're getting less WBL to spend on said stuff.)

Easier for me just to let my players get the big six for free at the appropriate levels without strings attached, and maybe swap slots around where necessary.

My half-orc bard was heavily influenced by Treantmonk's build, and I was definitely strong as a controller. It was a ton of fun to play that character. To bad the campaign is in extended stasis.

Guts: 20th level Fighter.

Guts? Fighter? He wears medium armor (breastplate), cleaves through everything with an unstoppable berserker rage, and has lots of untyped damage reduction. He tanks hits to his bare flesh constantly and never goes down all the way. I can't imagine him as anything but a barbarian, probably invulnerable rager. His rage is so unstoppable that he

Not to mention he doesn't fight like a disciplined soldier. He's a force of nature.

Edit: His present era armor is pretty much half-plate though. Must've taken proficiency at some point after the golden age.

20 million arrows.

Let them fight in the shade!

Easiest way to solve this problem:

Cut the brake lines or puncture them for a small leak (harder to notice at first.) Don't forget to shred up the cable of the emergency brake- that's a rookie mistake.

The Caustic Slur thread is filled with real gems from SKR.

Can't say I'm crying in my beer over him not handling any mechanics anymore.

Why not just raise spell failure to 100 percent when someone just simply wields a sword in the same room while you're at it, the way it was done in Saberhagen's books?

A fighter who misses his opponent is out a hit opportunity. He still has infinite amount of sword swings left in him. A wizard who loses a spell to arcane failure is out a daily resource he's not getting back until tomorrow.

That's a massive false equivalence. Standing next to a guy waving around a greatsword can and should impose a significant penalty to being able to alter reality at a whim using precise gestures, vocalizations and components.

There are so many ways for a wizard to not even get into a defensive casting situation it's not even funny. Not to mention having a huge pool of resources he can draw from if he (for some unknown reason) spends every round standing next to melee guys and somehow always fails his defensive casting, like using wands, school powers, pearls of power, staves, scrolls, his bonded object, using the SLAs of his summons, etc. Don't pretend like wizards' resources are meaningfully limited.

And any number of spells prevent any chance a melee martial might even have to physically get next to the wizard.

Has anyone ever tried changing the casting defensively mechanic to just being a flat arcane spell failure chance increase instead of a check? Something like 50%, 35% with combat casting, stacks with all other arcane spell failure chance. Would hurt just as bad at all levels. Disruptive would increase the failure chance by 25% or something.

Sarcasm is such a great way to point out something's potential or inherent flaws with language that denotes no such problem.

It's also a great way to talk about something that would send me into a blind rage if I tried to talk about its flaws earnestly.

If I had to guess the idea was that they were taking a penalty so its a bad thing.

Of course getting hit by someone with a bonus to damage is a bad thing, and power attack can be a really good trade...

The funniest thing about the feat is this line:

"If the creature already has the power attack feat, the attack penalty increases by 1 and the damage bonus increases by 2."

So it essentially gives you the next increment of power attack for free. At the higher single digit levels, any CR-appropriate creature is going to hit most player ACs most of the time on its first attack. So it's a straight up buff.

Even sillier is that getting Caustic Slur'd is the only way I know of for a PC to get +14 to damage with power attack (+21 with two-handers!)
You'd normally need BAB +24 to do that.

You might want to reroll that Sense Motive check...

Wow. I guess Glibness really is that good!

Another prediction: a completely spell-less ranger with an animal companion on par with a druid and nifty hunting tricks. You could call it the Hunter! Totally spell-less though. You know, cuz when I think of a word as catch-all and archetypal as hunter, I don't think of spells. But that's an obvious one.

No, I mean, that's the actual flavor text.

"You are faster than most."

I assume you don't allow blood money or simulacrum at your tables either.

People allow blood money and simulacrums at their tables? Whoa.

I'd have atomic breath deal untyped damage.

It destroys everything, man. I don't care how immune a balor is. He's getting torched.

I sure hope they don't do anything silly like make a class that combines the best mechanics of the wizard and the sorcerer without their inherent weaknesses, minmaxing your character before you even pick your spells.

That would be pretty silly.

Obvious worst: Caustic Slur

Stealth worst: Extra Rogue Talent (powerful sneak)

Worst flavor: Fleet

You are, um... Faster than most?

They're releasing an advanced class guide? Cool!

Predictions: awesome new Style Feats, a repeal of the Crane Wing errata, errata that allows Vital Strike to be used with Spring Attack and charging, powerful rogue talents, lots of tasty archetypes, a handful of setting-neutral prestige classes, and maybe even a brand new base class (something we've never seen before, like an engineer or something), and no caster power creep at all.

Change wasn't needed, it was balanced and acceptable.

The main use of the feat was to provide a buffer against normally unblockable attacks like natural 20s or True Strike- which could spell doom for skinny finesse characters on crits.

My weapon master fighter/duelist was going to take it next level. He's focused on mobility, baiting AOOs to free up the party, has respectable damage output, and solid AC.

When I saw the Crane Style line, I knew more nice things would be had. That nice thing can be had no more.

My group won't be touching this errata with a ten-foot pole.

EDIT: Oops, sorry for the unintended necro. Not too terrible to raise more awareness for this though, aye?

There are tons of tweaks that bring full casters down a notch, but as I'm pressed for time, I'll just post a really quick and dirty one.

Quicken Spell does not exist. Only feather fall and other incredibly minor spells have less than a standard action casting time. There is no way to cast more than one spell per round except feather fall and similar spells.

"I have an app for that" spells are kicked up a spell level or two (basically anything that insta-trivializes skills), and the particularly egregious examples (Glibness) do not exist.

Not panaceas, but they help a little bit.

I didn't know about Crane Wing. Cannot unsee that errata.

Can someone cast Modify Memory on me? I'll willingly fail my save.

And being constantly badgered insulted and called a child by a bunch of people hiding behind fake names and avatars who can't just accept my position constantly is annoying as well.

I'm happy to discuss the game. But don't try to be an internet tough guy and accuse posters of "hiding" behind fake names.

If I was talkin' crazy and then regretted it later, I wouldn't want that to be attached to my real name. Just a thought.

Yea, there's that.
On the other hand, my players (including those who play wizards) asked me to nerf Ice Assassin because some of them liked the idea but didn't want to break the game.

Haven't heard of ice assassin, but I'm glad your players game responsibly in that regard.

[

I dont think he's a troll. In any game, people who play a certain class will vehemently deny that their class needs a nerf.

I LIKE THE GAME THE WAY IT IS AND DON'T WANT WIZARDS NERFED TO THE GROUND

You sure?

But I know what you mean. MMO forums are particularly fun.

And now I'm whining. . . you can't just accept my opinion that I LIKE THE GAME THE WAY IT IS AND DON'T WANT WIZARDS NERFED TO THE GROUND and move on?

Dude, if you like the game how it is, don't buy this hypothetical 2e that has reasonable casters and less exponential caster progression.

I enjoy the game the way it is now.

I don't want a new edition.

Why do you have to insult me for liking Pathfinder?

You're overreacting and crying foul when no one has said they want to gut wizards, so my troll detector is going off. I've played wizards. I like wizards. Wizards have been friends of mine. Wizards will always be top dog in a 3.x-styled system. But a little humility on their part would go a long way for everyone else's fun.

Just because you hate wizards why do you insist on trying to force them to be taken away from everyone else?

Why is the way me and my group have fun wrong?

How is it that the two players at my table who play almost exclusively martials and often actual fighters have never had a problem with "OP Wizards" that would require some new edition where Wizards can't be player?

Balance out the most overpowered class a little to stabilize the game at higher levels = hating wizards.

One group's fun = better than game design.

Two outlier players who enjoy playing gimped classes = everyone enjoys it.

Troll detected?

The Red Mage wrote:

Nathanael Love wrote:

Suffocation and Mass Suffocation the two most powerful save or die spells EVER published were brand new, Pathfinder only additions.

But oh yeah, totally nerfed save or dies.

Cool. Does that make the game better for you?

Would it make the game better for you for me to not be able to play a wizard?

If you can't play a wizard just because he's taken down a notch, then yes. Because then more people who appreciate diversity would be having more fun, and PF1 would still exist for those who don't.

Suffocation and Mass Suffocation the two most powerful save or die spells EVER published were brand new, Pathfinder only additions.

But oh yeah, totally nerfed save or dies.

Cool. Does that make the game better for you?

Is that a no?

You wouldn't want to play a game where all your good stuff was taken away, your kool aid defiled, and you favorite class reduced to a shadow of its former self?

So why do you expect me to?

Why would you think me or anyone else who enjoys the game now would want to double down on buying a ton of new books with nerfed classes?

Not nerfed classes, a reworked magic system.

Why do you think several aspects of the magic system (polymorphing, CoDzilla, save-or-dies, many others) were nerfed for PF? The game is better for it. 3.5 would better suit your needs.

Edit: In other words, I'd rather have a more balanced, less exponential, and less gamebreaking magic system rather than buffed mechanics for martials that further exacerbates the mechanical breakdown of the game at higher levels.

The Red Mage wrote:

Talk about crying the end is near.

Lessening the overwhelming impressiveness of spells would in no way throw casters into the garbage. You realize PF is an extremely high-magic system, right? Even with several game-breaking spells receiving nerfs, magic would still be better than mundane options in every way, if only because they bend reality to the will of the caster in a way martials could never do.

You realize I want to play an extremely high-magic game, right?

That's why I found one in the form of D&D 3.X and then Pathfinder and decided to play it.

I'm not going to decide to play a game that takes that away.

Then play PF as it is. A large contingent of PF players enjoy the system's versimilatude/rules based on real-life physics (except magic, for obvious reasons.), but don't enjoy high-magic being the only viable option.

This is a thread for what we would like to see improved for a new edition, not a rehash that carries over the same problems of previous editions.

Because many people love having things taken away from them and being told they should be happy and like it because "its better".

How about we give fighters nothing new, and put them on d4 hit dice?

Actually, that's my suggestion-- martials are too powerful-- all classes with full BaB get d4 hit dice and are only allowed to use Knives that do d3 damage and nothing else-- trust me its better.

You fighter players interested?

Evidently you've never played a martial, or any system other than 3.x.

This is false equivalence of the highest degree. Casters are far superior to martials. Martials don't need power creep, casters need a less broken magic system.

The Red Mage wrote:

No bandaids for martial characters, or giving them resource management abilities that are spells by another name, or just giving them a bunch of overwhelming static bonuses.

Just redo the core magic system. That's where the problem of 3.x lies in the first place. As long as magic works the way it does, PF will always be lopsided. I'm tired of the "I have a spell for that" situation that makes careful skill allocation redundant. Magic will still be just better. But it doesn't need to be this good.

Edit: I'm not suggesting I don't like the martial/vancian divide. It's one of the things I love about all pre-4e editions of the game and it's always made the system unique, though your mileage may vary on whether or not vancian casting is a pain. I really enjoy its versatility. I just don't think spells need to be so powerful.

Yet again, taking the Wizard out or ruining him is not going to bring people along to the new edition. Every single person who enjoys writing "Wizard" "Sorcerer" "Cleric" or "Druid" on their sheet is out straight from the gate.

Enjoy playing that game where only die hard martial fans play-- of course it already exists in a half dozen forms now, so not sure why we need a new edition to ruin the game and throw half the classes into the garbage.

Talk about crying the end is near.

Lessening the overwhelming impressiveness of spells would in no way throw casters into the garbage. You realize PF is an extremely high-magic system, right? Even with several game-breaking spells receiving nerfs, magic would still be better than mundane options in every way, if only because they bend reality to the will of the caster in a way martials could never do.

No bandaids for martial characters, or giving them resource management abilities that are spells by another name, or just giving them a bunch of overwhelming static bonuses.

Just redo the core magic system. That's where the problem of 3.x lies in the first place. As long as magic works the way it does, PF will always be lopsided. I'm tired of the "I have a spell for that" situation that makes careful skill allocation redundant. Magic will still be just better. But it doesn't need to be this good.

Edit: I'm not suggesting I don't like the martial/vancian divide. It's one of the things I love about all pre-4e editions of the game and it's always made the system unique, though your mileage may vary on whether or not vancian casting is a pain. I really enjoy its versatility. I just don't think spells need to be so powerful.

A man after my own heart!

Dot.

I think it makes some sense, but considering that Acrobatics is already a combination of a few skills I'm compelled to max it out.

A wizard, for example, usually has some ranks in Fly for his flight spells. I just find it a little head-scratching that he'd now (presumably) get what used to be jump and tumble as class skills. YMMV if your GM thinks wizards should be trained athletes. And creatures that can fly really well can also be pretty cumbersome and sluggish on land.

It's a nitpick for sure, but since Acrobatics is already arguably a strange combo of old skills, adding Fly seems a little over-the-top. I haven't run into a case where a player feels maxing out both is too taxing.

EDIT: And PF rolled Balance into Acro as well IIRC. I also miss fighters being able to leap around, but that's another topic.

The Acrobatics-as-Fly makes no sense. Oppose the hell out of that.

I can think of dozens of creatures off the top of my head that can soar across the skies but can't do a barrel-roll/headstand worth a damn.

Like dragons, for example.

Hm. Maybe it'll be more useful here than it was in KOTOR...

That was a game that knew how to make TWFing the be all end all of combat, fo sho'.

Totally, TWFing was insane in KOTOR. My first run through was with a dual wielding sentinel (red and purple 'sabers), and in my second playthrough I wondered why my attacks suddenly sucked.

In PF though, there aren't a ton of ways to get flat bonuses to attack and AC through feats. Weapon focus, greater weapon focus, shield focus, greater shield focus and dodge are the only ones I think. And they all require you to pick a very specific weapon or use a shield. I've found that giving one-handers just a little gravy that eventually scales in the form of attack and AC works pretty well.

Edit: But our group has also nixed Weapon Finesse and removed it as a prerequisite for any feats that rely on it. Any light or finessable weapons can be optionally used with Dex. So it probably works for us better than RAW groups that have to deal with more feat taxes.

The one-handed fighting idea reminds me of a feat my group uses.

Dueling
Prerequisites: Dex 11, base attack bonus +1
You are especially skilled at fighting with a single weapon in your main hand.
Benefit: You gain a +1 circumstance bonus to attack rolls and +1 dodge bonus to AC when wielding a single melee weapon in your main hand and nothing in your off-hand. These bonuses improve to +2 when your base attack bonus reaches +8, and to +3 when your base attack bonus reaches +15.

We pretty much stole it from the KOTOR feat of the same name, but it's a nice bonus and it opens up an expansive homebrew feat chain for freehand types.

3.5-

We had some doozies in the early days. All four of these players didn't last long in our group.

Tobias Danceholic: CE gnome necromancer who was burned at the stake by angry townsfolk after a few sessions.

Master Bates: half-elf ranger. Killed by a roof collapse.

Stiggs: incredibly annoying miniature anthropomorphic raccoon. Drowned unceremoniously after being tossed off a galleon by an exasperated NPC.

The Great Shirar: variant goblinoid sorcerer. One game he fell asleep in someone's backpack in a forest. We ended up fighting a dire bear and accidentally burned most of the forest in the process. We later discovered his charred remains in the backpack by a scorched tree.

Pathfinder-

Mountain Dwarf: a...mountain dwarf... with a warhammer musket. Still with us. And his player actually characterizes him really well (his name is one he bestowed upon himself for reasons that would take a long time to explain)