Tentacled Horror

The Authority's page

Organized Play Member. 92 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists.


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Gary Teter wrote:
Please participate in the conversation here in a way that keeps our messageboards friendly and the Pathfinder RPG discussions productive.

"Only hold the stolen fire of the gods at night for so long, lest the tribes of man see your flickering glow in the breathless dark and shoot you full of arrows."

While you're dishing out friendliness and productivity, have someone pick up the torch before it goes out. It's looking like a really long, cold winter is in store between here and next August.

A T wrote:
Warblade 1/Swordsage 4/Bloodstorm Blade 10/Master Thrower 5

God @#$%ing @#$%.

@#$%. This is the Pathfinder RPG board. Why not keep this @#$%ing garbage on a wotc board?

Power attack is fine in it's new incarnation by the way. "If I can't do the MAX damage with power attack I'm getting SCREWED OVER and it's NOT USABLE." Here, let me wipe your tears.

Sueki Suezo wrote:
Where is this list of D&D 3.5 Tiers of which you speak?

Who cares? We're not talking about 3.5 here and what 3.5 classes are really good... or are we?

-Archangel- wrote:

Well this is a good example but it is taken out of context (so to say).

You need to do this will all types of monsters (those that advance 1 CR per +1 HD, per +2 HD, and per +3 HD) for it to be correct.
You also gave all the monsters abilities and numbers that help against spells.
This just shows that a DM CAN improve monsters to be more resistant to spellcaster but nothing else.

This monster will just be weaker against any melee/archer characters. You gave him 0 increase to his AC or fighting skills. He will be a weak enemy (all he has for him is good HP) that will get killed by empowered Scorching Ray and some swordplay.

The monsters getting killed in D&D?

Must mean something's broken! I'll find out what it is, I SWEAR TO YOU ON MY LIFE.

Jal Dorak wrote:
That's a pretty big gamble for a character to rely on to live.

Dragons don't use equipment silly, they run the hell out of their cave when they see adventurers because a dragon "would have to have 1 intelligence to fight someone in melee."

I can't believe you'd even suggest an intelligent creature prepare itself for fights and then fight.

New Ninja wrote:
No self respecting dragon in HISTORY, (knowing FULL WELL their challenge rating and being able to identify the challenge rating of would be opponents ON SIGHT of course) has EVER attempted to kill and eat an Adventurer. NEVER. THAT'S ABSOLUTELY FEEBLEMINDED. Despite it's home court advantage, despite it's preparation, any dragon with higher than 1 intelligence plane shifts via scroll the INSTANT a person walks through the door of his lair.

Well done sir. When you get done pulling the straw out of that burning man scale scarecrow you've built us, I'd be happy to talk to you a bit more about dungeons and dragons.

Old Ninja wrote:
When people disagree with me, or dare question the rampantly inaccurate gleemax presiding opinion drek I shovel all over the internet, I start rattling off forum buzzwords as an ink cloud. You're a trolling troller troll and you probably love 4chan don't you. Whisper gnome PROVES how broken PFRPG wizard is!

You bore me. Besides your decidedly abusive gaming practices that you attempt to cite as examples (The saddest part being that you've not even set them down between here and picking them up elsewhere on the internet) you'd much rather gargle the opinionated leavings of the WoTC pit crew than discuss the real point here, which is how the PFRPG casters compare to the PFRPG melee squad. You've clearly never used any PFRPG class, and cite garbage from 3.5 splatbooks as pathfinder playtest experience on the pathfinder playtest board.

I know for a fact that PFRPG fighter and wizard can and do compete in actual play. I've seen it happen for weeks on end. Since you're not actually playtesting Pathfinder, I have no further need to discuss it with you and I suggest that you close your eyes and lay down in combat because you and every IRC DM you've ever played with agree that laying down in front of someONE that is clearly going to kill you is not the same as laying down in front of someTHING that's clearly going to kill you such as say.. lava.

Crusader of Logic wrote:
I don't think we've even directly talked to each other.

Not to haul the bones out of s#+@ninja's closet again, but he's a real post to agree with himself typa guy. I'm sure that you not being affiliated with him in any way can see where people might associate two smarmy-gleemax-"strawman"-overusing-logic-in-the-name-posting-at-the-same-t ime-at-the-same-rate-with-the-same-verbosity d-bags with each other.

s*%&ninja wrote:
I made a 3.5+splatbooks "wizard" exactly as suggested as the "best build" from the character optimization boards with ludicrous stats and that proves that pathfinder rpg's wizard is super broken. But can YOU prove that fighter is worth playing because people on the forum I got my "wizard" from say it's NOT and they, not you are The Authority!

In our weekly PFRPG game, the Fighter 12 and the Barbarian 12 ripped people in half like they were tearing into tuna salad with a chainsaw. Like usual. The Barbarian single handedly splattered an adult green dragon without being able to critically hit it. And he didn't even have to blatantly @#$%ing misuse suggestion to make a creature you were already fighting allow itself to be killed. I've clearly been trolled, because I violated my refusal to justify your mediocre cheating at dungeons and dragons makes me The Authority knobbery by posting examples. Well done sir, you got me. Then I fell through the railing into the horse trough.

hogarth wrote:
My proposed solution is to allow characters to make money by spellcasting (if they really want to)

Exactly what I've done. I simply took the price of getting spells cast from the "goods and services" section of the PHB and allow my players to sell a certain number (randomly determined) of their spells based on the situation (location, time, etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc)

The gold generated by this technique shocked me at first, but then I realized that the reason why you see 12th level Wizard shopkeepers is because they realized that they could sell protection from energy (fire) and a teleport to adventurers for a decent amount of gold without really getting themselves into harms way.

You notice that doctors are able to sell their services for a lot of money? Well if you were a 12th level doctor who was finding treasure in a trap and monster infested dungeon, you might well consider packing it up and healing for a living as well. That is, if you somehow lost your backpack and bedroll somewhere.

SageSTL wrote:
I don't really like the long ears, either, but I'm afraid it's pretty unlikely that they're going to be changed now with all of the existing art out there...

C:\documents and settings\user\my documents\my pictures\world of warcraft.jpg

varianor wrote:
Now, there's a separate question as to whether you should be allowed to enchant your mage armor like regular armor. ;)

All joking aside, the "mages armor" (Bracers of Armor) can now hold armor enchantments as well as armor bonuses.

Rob Godfrey wrote:
what I do have a problem with is players with SoD affects becoming dominant, so that the rest of the party are at risk of becoming the side kicks.

Pardon my asking, but has this actually happened to you in game?

Crusader of Logic wrote:
the former is useless

This statement really, really makes me wonder if you've actually played a PFRPG fighter or barbarian. The melee classes are not, and have never been useless, and are doubly not so using the PFRPG rules. After the beta came out, there were a lot of cries of "ITS THE SAME!!!!" from people who haven't actually sat down and made a "boring fighter" (as they're so fond of saying) and seen the numbers add up or tried playing one and experiencing the actual stereotypical "adventure" situations that make them so absolutely necessary.

I've seen it in action many times, and I'm pleased with how paizo has worked up the melee classes. Fighter can and does truly become the "master of fighting" in PFRPG and it's great fun to watch. Fighter gets to the point where it's a pleasure to take a nice weapon from an enemy and use it a little bit, instead of selling everything that isn't his s+&@ty favored weapon, and gets the chance to really be prepared for situational happenstance without feeling like he "wasted" any of his feats.

Of course, if this thread were about how Ranger could use a little love ala Barbarian, I'd be singing a little bit of a different tune. But Fighter.. He's the master of fighting and PFRPG has definitely nailed that down for him.

Disarmed: No problem
Blind: No problem
Underwater: No problem
Weapon Broken: No problem
Armor Broken: No problem
Caster's Dead: No problem

"I'm here with half HP, my backpack, my bedroll and an improvised weapon made out of an oversized switch that I used to lower a door, then tore from the floor. I'm the PFRPG fighter, and when I get back to town, I'll buy you a @#$%ing drink."

My PFRPG campaign has had little/no problem with SoD's. In my experience, a player character feels the need to complain when his character is killed not because of what killed him, but because he's feeling down that his guy just died.

If you reduce the power of all spells and spell like abilities to the point where nobody dies in one spell (or two, or three, where to draw the line, really, not to mention that any first level player character can stab a peasant to death in one hit and you don't see the peasants complaining about broken adventurers or g!@!&~n unbalanced longswords) then on top of that insist in adding meta game "buy yourself out of this situation" hero points, you're definitely, absolutely going to end up with players still complaining because the troll barbarian killed their barbarian in a sword fight. It's not the spells, it's the lack of ability for your average person in our culture to effectively deal with loss.

Rob Godfrey wrote:
The point being,

The point indeed being that while the buzzword "strawman" still rings in the air, you've got people claiming that the wizard class is overpowered, and citing examples that consist of "the best possible wizard build with a non-core race, far, far above average stats and access to all the splatbooks" and "monsters with low will saves running towards us down a bowling alley with no chance to come up behind us".

The point of this board is to discuss the pfrpg base classes as played. If I were to set my adventures like an instanced dungeon and go send someone to pull monsters that happened to have low hit points but did nothing to mitigate that disadvantage and mindlessly rushed into my cleave every round, I might come off thinking that my melee character was "broken" no matter how well or poorly it was built.

It's really easy to have an opinion and then write off other people as "trolls" when they point out that the situation you've brought up isn't typical and that similar advantages taken by the enemies might totally change the situation.

That isn't to say that I haven't enjoyed making light of your whining. I'm just taking the time to mention that the "broken wizard" argument is a favorite of people who apply the wizard mechanics to a flat, lifeless board game land and complain that the other classes don't function as well as their example when faced with actual odds.

Crusader of Logic wrote:
Making good posts often is a bad thing how, exactly?

Oh my god, I haven't laughed this hard all evening.

How's the gleemax wizard who's so "broken" treating you?

Crusader of Logic wrote:
Welcome to the football team, buddy! (you're the ball)

So now that we've noticed that Wizards have more spells known than Sorcerer, how about we start pointing out other really well thought out crumbs of "logic" such as "Consolidate your posts to avoid s~%!ting up the board with thirty seven "off the top of my head" comments in every thread" and "Common knowledge (such as how the base classes differ from each other) is commonly known by everyone. No need to post about it."

Now I'd suggest you grab me and try to run for the first down, but there's a sorcerer out there and he doesn't have as many spells known as wizard, and that's terrible.

Rob Godfrey wrote:
Yup that sure is a strong case.........

And with one brilliant post Rob Godfrey proved that he was leagues above the common "trolls" that he likes to complain about and truly a member of the community.

Rob Godfrey wrote:
I think the issue is, the way the game is setup spells and SLA are nearly always going to be better than feats, unless the feats themselves basically are SLA's.

Thanks for that tidbit. Really well thought out and definitely necessary to post. When you're done comparing feats to spells, lets compare arrows to cows and platinum to zombies.

Welcome to the design team, buddy!

Crusader of Logic wrote:
Wizards do not 'have to' buy spells to add to their spellbooks. Even with just the two free spells a level, they will have more spells known than a sorcerer at every single level of the game.

You took the time to point out that Wizard knows more spells than sorcerer in one of your thirteen posts over the last hour.

I rest my case.

Crusader of Logic wrote:
If possible, I'm actually stridently trying to outshit s@%!ninja.

Wow. Just, wow.

LogicNinja wrote:
My DM likes to have groups of low will save monsters run towards the party from the front, and my party likes to let me rest between every encounter to regain my spells. I AM THE MVP OF THE PARTY.

I applaud your reasoning. Now that I can see what passes for a campaign over your way, I completely understand how you feel overpowered compared to the melee classes. I mean, they charge directly down a hallway every single encounter and engage the monsters, while you stand in the back and use the gleemax favorite 3.5 diviner build (notice that you're playing 3.5 , not PFRPG in all of your really great examples) to shoot at monsters with +6 will saves from the back of the football field.

You're OWNING! I'm sure all the party members really appreciate your help too, running a character with superhuman stats, the "approved" minmax build and a completely sheltered casting position, then taking the time to stop, jump on the pathfinder RPG betatest forums and start b~&@@ing about how powerful your 3.5 gleemax character is while the party rests for eight hours to allow you to be prepared for the next encounter with humanoids who serve simply to crash against the "tanks" so you can play "controller".

That sounds kinda familiar actually. Like a board game I've read about recently. I hope you're having fun and I very much wish you the best.

Well kids? What have we learned. "When one jerk minmaxes a character and his buddy the DM sets up encounters that never upset the S.O.P. of the party dynamic, he'll probably be really effective."

I feel enlightened, s@%~ninja, I really do. Thanks for the information.

Bleach wrote:

Um, ok, I'm honestly confused now.

If planar currency is "found in treasures just like gold" how is it NOT gold.

I;m really confused here...

Take a few minutes and think about it, and get back to me.

Jal Dorak wrote:
I'm a smart man who has played D&D.

I agree, you are a smart man, and you have definitely played D&D before in a campaign. If only the majority of the posters here were as experienced as you.

LogicNinja wrote:
In town? Who the hell is dumb enough to try and pickpocket a bunch of heavily armed adventurers in town?

"YOU CAN'T STEAL FROM PEOPLE IN OGRIMARR IT'S NOT A PVP ZONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Almighty Zordon, Lord of the Command Center! Besides the fact that pickpocketing is traditionally nearly completely restricted to crowded urban areas, you clearly have no idea how the slight of hand rules work.

The rate at which you s#+% up every board you visit simply to spitshine whatever someone else has told you and you haven't ever playtested or even bothered to verify astounds me.

Make a PFRPG rogue and learn to play her. While you're doing that, take a long, hard look at your motivation for posting here. If you're not going to bother to know what you're talking about before you start typing, perhaps you'd be better off spending the time playing D&D.

Jal Dorak wrote:
For those interested in Frank at his best, please see the original thread here.

This is a good idea.

LogicNinja wrote:
You can't prove that swashbuckler can cast spells, so book of nine swords is really balanced.

Well done. Like I said earlier, there's a reason you've got that nickname, and it's because you join boards and get angrier and angrier while you post the same thing over and over again, insisting that unless someone can dispute your class mechanic comparisons that have been poured over on gleemax until everyone is well satisfied that they can quote them while they wax their mustaches that no situational issue has any bearing.

After you've actually played a pathfinder fighter, barbarian or ranger (ranger being the least powerful of the new core classes) in a campaign, please come back and post your EXPERIENCE. Until then, let the people who are PLAYTESTING the product talk.

Tremaine wrote:
Someone get me a kleenex, my makeup is running all over my psionic monk drow spiked chain wielding vampire.

You're simply utterly wrong. Please, I urge you, play a campaign sometime and see what actually happens.

hallucitor wrote:
Just curious if anyone else is already creating new additions specifically for the Pathfinder flavor?

I knocked up a few custom races and doused them with a liberal helping of Golarion sauce.

http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/pathfinder/pathfinderR PG/design/ability/customRacesWithLA0

Please comment if you so desire.

LogicNinja wrote:
If you can't use class mechanics to prove that the swashbuckler is able to do as many things as the cleric or wizard, then I WIN AND TOME OF BATTLE WAS JUSTIFIED.

I've said twice now that if you assume the wizard has fly, charm person invisiblity, detect thoughts, major creation, wish, planar binding, peewee's playhouse and all the other spells all memorized, and he's actually able to apply them to the situation, he's probably got it covered. However, the sheer number of times in actual play that the wizard doesn't have a g%%@%*n thing he needs and stands there going "s+%$, man" is outstandingly huge. It happens all the time. It's been like that the entire time. And the one time the wizard actually has charm monster when the 3 will save kobold fighter chief comes around, or the one time the wizard rolls max damage on fireball and everyone blows their reflex save, someone goes "JESUS CHRIST MAN, THAT WAS IMPRESSIVE." And for every time that happens, there's at least another time when one of the melee classes rends someone in twain, and the other players go, "Well that wasn't as good as a psion. Sure wish we had a warblade and then you wouldn't be affected by diseases. Sure wish you were a warlock, because warlocks get infinite ranged touch attacks for more damage than sneak attack and damage reduction. Sure wish you were another class, because I enjoy discounting what you, the lowly barbarian have achieved, and when you do well, I refuse to acknowledge it. I am The Authority."

And to that I say humbug sir. Humbug. I refuse to recount the ages of playtime that I've enjoyed where the fighter or barbarian or god help him the ranger have bloodily dragged the party to victory, by any means necessary, while the caster's corpses sat in the bag of holding because it was undead this time and s@&~ man, they're immune to whatever. Or any other situation, such as the time the fighter had an argument online about how warblade is really balanced because he's got seven god forsaken intelligence and doesn't realize that magic invincible fighter simply isn't a good way to deal with your Major Creation penis envy.

Let me know how your next game of dungeons and dragons treats you. The next time you've got a dungeon master, a storyline, a party and a situation that isn't "Lets set up nickelodeon GUTS on our crappy little DND minis tactical board here and prove that wizard with jump and fly can jump and fly well".

David Fryer wrote:
If I could turn back time...

If I could find a way

I'd take back those words that hurt you
And you'd stay
If I could reach the stars
I'd give them all to you
Then you'd love me, love me
Like you used to do


Tremaine wrote:

I can only assume that you're feeling pretty guilty about playing D&D like it's a fan fiction and lash out defensively whenever someone suggests that someone out there is a psionic monk spiked chain drow paladin.

You might feel attacked, but I need to point out that if you'd read my post without feeling like someone was commenting on your behavior in your psychologist's waiting room you might take a different perspective.

Yet again a thread full of,

"But if the wizard has the absolute perfect setup he will win! THATS NOT FAIR!"

Go play some dungeons and dragons and come back to complain when that actually happens in game.

Evanta wrote:
I play world of warcraft often and for long spans of time.

Any class with UMD can be viable alternative to cleric for healing.

Doing a LA0 Tiny race was tough, especially when I wanted to add an extra limb for that chaotic touch. Let me know what you think!

Abavath - The Soft-shelled People

The Abavath are a peculiar race, spawning from the tainted and Abyss laced waters of the Worldwound and slowly becoming more common in areas outside the demonic infestation, usually accompanying some fell creature. A typical Abavath stands about 20 inches tall and weighs about 40 pounds, most of this weight being a thick rubbery grey flesh that surrounds the Abavath like a shell, though it offers no real protection against attack. The Abavath have tiny, crustacean-like eyes set directly into it’s face, and a flat face lacking any major protrusions. It has gill-like slits that covers most of it’s throat and neck area and it’s mouth contains a ring of sharp, jagged teeth. The most terrifying thing to most about an Abavath is it’s three long, triple segmented arms, reaching far more widely than it is easy to anticipate and set at disturbingly varying angles. Abavath speech is characterized by a slurping, spitting sound and is very unpleasant for most races to listen to, though their words often hold sinister and clever meaning. The Abavath are mortal, but may in some way be related to the Abyssal creatures they so often intermingle with, and often share their psychotic viewpoint, though not prone to cause the wonton destruction demons crave. Abavath are most often Neutral Evil, seeking power from whatever forces with help them advance, though intelligent enough to realize that cooperation with less “efficient” creatures can have it’s benefits.

Abavath racial traits:

+2 Dex, +2 Int, -4 str – The Abavath’s size greatly affects their strength, and would be quite clumsy if they were any larger. However they are definitely intelligent and often engage in the arcane arts, though some with blood tainted from interbreeding with creatures from the Abyss forgo formal training and become Abyssal bloodline Sorcerers.

Tiny sized: A tiny creature receives a +2 size bonus to armor class and attack rolls and a +8 size bonus to all Stealth checks. They must use Tiny sized weapons and equipment and can lift and carry only half as much as Medium characters. Despite being Tiny, the long limbs and wide base of the Abavath cause them to occupy a five foot space and threaten the areas around them and do not need to enter another’s space to make a melee attack.

Very slow: Abavath base speed is 10 feet.

Aquatic: The Abavath can breathe water as if it were air, can act and move in water as if on land and enjoys being submerged. However, if an Abavath is not submerged in water to sleep, it becomes fatigued as if it had slept in armor and cannot heal or recover naturally.

Underwater Blindsight: The Abavath can sense creatures in the water around it within 30’ as if it had blindsight, however an Abavath receives a -5 to perception checks relating to creatures not in the same body of water the Abavath is in (or when the Abavath is not in water).

Demonology: The Abavath gain +2 to Diplomacy and Knowledge (The Plains) checks that deal with chaotic evil outsiders. In addition chaotic evil outsiders receive a -2 penalty to the DC to break free of a Planar Binding spell or similar effect.

Three Arms: The Abavath have three arms fully functional arms and hands in addition to their many stubby legs. This gives them one more free hand to use for spellcasting, or wielding or holding items and equipment. This also makes them eligible for the Multiweapon Fighting feat (MM1) if they meet the prerequisites. Without this feat, a creature attempting to attack with a weapon in each of it’s three hands suffers a -6 penalty on their primary hand and -10 on attacks with it’s other two hands. An Abavath who gains natural attacks for it’s arms by some means (Through magic, or from a bloodline ability or template) gains three natural weapons instead of two.

Languages: Abavath begin speaking Abavath and Common. A Abavath with high intelligence may select Draconic, Abyssal, Infernal and Elemental as bonus languages.

Favored Class: The Abavath’s favored class is Wizard or Sorcerer. This choice must be made at 1st level and cannot be changed.

Iaguni - Children of the Gods

The Iaguni have the interesting position of being birthed directly by their gods, but being mortal, though odd. Each Iaguni is brother (or sister) to the others, and do not procreate. Instead, each is birthed (or created, none can be sure) directly by their gods, who then ignore them. The Iaguni are not truly male or female, but may during their lives choose their outward appearance through an interesting metamorphosis is process that involves six months of comatose sleep. Iaguni do not consider themselves adults before this process, and thus conceal themselves in the remote home of their gods (who still stridently ignore them, strolling through the icy landscape so large as to perhaps be completely unaware of their "children"). None have knowingly witnessed a underage Iaguni, but due to their interesting death situation, there are definite theories.
Upon death, a Iaguni fractures open and a burbling, hissing mass creeps from their body, and proceeds to attempt to seep away into some crack or another, directly away from their corpse. If this is not possible, they will grow extremely hot to attempt to escape their confinement, eventually melting through steel. If this is not possible, the strange animate puddle of hissing protoplasm will begin to pipe and shriek in a completely horrible manner and will continue to make this terrible sound until released or until it violently explodes, leaving burnt, terribly crispy pieces of itself splattered around the immediate area. None have managed to communicate with a dead Iaguni, nor have any seen one return from wherever it escaped to after seeping away into some crevice.
A typical "adult" Iaguni stands about eight feet tall on average, and has well proportioned, statuesque features. They look in many ways like a large, strong human with ruddy, tan skin, light, warm eyes in greens and light browns, thick red hair. Both male and female Iaguni tend to wear their hair long and often tie it up in complicated designs, sometimes incorporating sticks or other jewelry. The Iaguni are well known for their penchant for water and spend a great deal of time swimming.

Iaguni racial traits:

+2 str, +2 cha, -4 dex - The Iaguni are stronger than standard humans due to their size and they have great force of personality, but are clumsier than smaller creatures.

Large size: The Iaguni are large sized and suffer a -1 size penalty to attack rolls and armor class and a -4 size penalty to stealth checks. A large creature can used large equipment without penalty and has higher carrying limits than Medium creatures.

Endure Cold: The Iaguni are able to withstand cold environments without penalty, but take normal damage from cold energy.

Artistic Craftsmen: The Iaguni may choose either craft weaponmaking or craft armorsmithing to always treat as a class skill. Any item crafted by a Iaguni well sell for 25% more than it’s usual price due to the intricate detail that Iaguni put into their work. (Note that this applies to the mundane value of an item only. Any price increase due to an item being magical or masterwork is not increased.

Natural Swimmers: The Iaguni may take always take 10 on a swim check and do not double the armor check penalty for swimming in armor.

Inhuman: The Iaguni feel a much closer connection to the gods that ignore them than any other mortal race. Because of this, they have a difficult time socializing with non Iaguni and receive a -6 racial penalty to Diplomacy, Bluff, Intimidate and Sense Motive when dealing with humanoids. Iaguni do not suffer this penalty when dealing with non-humanoids or other Iaguni. In addition, Iaguni can never treat bluff as a class skill, the Iaguni simply do not understand lies and lying. A Iaguni who loses bluff from their class list may replace it with a Craft skill. Iaguni tend to work harder and lose themselves in their projects when unsure of themselves.

Living Afterlife: The Iaguni change into another creature entirely when they are killed. This creature appears to be mindless: It cannot be communicated with or compelled in any fashion and ooze puppet has no effect on a "dead" Iaguni. Because the Iaguni is not dead, only a Miracle, Limited Wish or Wish can return the Iaguni to it's previous form and restore it's previous personality. Thankfully, the "dead" Iaguni doesn't need to be present when the spell is cast, one need only phrase the request on wish, limited wish or miracle properly in Iaguni (linguistics DC22). It is currently unknown why exactly this functions the way it does.

Languages: The Iaguni begin speaking Iaguni and Common and may select: Elemental, Giant, Orc or Dwarven as bonus languages.

Favored Class: The Iaguni favor the Bard or Paladin class. This choice must be made at 1st level and cannot be changed.

Tremaine wrote:
I have read the rules, but have not used them in a campaign, and don't understand how they apply to a living situation. However, I am able to read the spell lists and notice that if a spell caster were to prepare and use the exact correct spells for a situation every single time, they would be able to potentially save the party if they didn't get hit more than perhaps once.

I noticed you noticing. To everyone out there who's insistent that holy hell, caster is the only way to go, caster is SO broken, caster caster caster, play a campaign. See the way it goes. "But we have! We did! In our campaign, the caster often cast FIREBALL and or CURE SERIOUS WOUNDS and it was HORRIFYINGLY POWERFUL. ONE TIME THE CASTER FLEW SOMEWHERE AND A MONSTER WASN'T ABLE TO HIT HIM, THEN THE DM CONGRATULATED US FOR WINNING DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS AND WE ALL HAD YOOHOOS."

Situational. Everything is situational. If the casters are in a favorable position, they may well manage to carry off a "ranged victory" just like a few archers might be able to carry off the same type of keep them at bay situation. But next time it isn't your turn, and your nancy "I had to play the best character or I would refuse to play" drow psionic warlock monk with vow of poverty "the invincible" is sharpening his spiked chain or something and it's the fighter's turn, take a look. Pay attention to him and see that just because he isn't levitating and making dc37 bluff checks while firing infinite ranged touch attacks he still retains a logical and essential party function. Or ignore it because it isn't your character and come online to complain.

LogicNinja wrote:
I told you why, for example...

Actually, you simply listed your personal griefs against the way those base classes work mechanically without taking into account that they have the potential to come in handy in completely different ways than the base classes.

I have absolutely no need to "prove" that tome of battle was a blatant attempt to one up the other classes, or that warlock is a clear violation of universal game constants (up to that point) simply because it was someone's personally favorite idea. The math is sitting right there for you to view. While you're waving your arms in the air complaining that wizard has the ability to cast invisibility six times a day but warlock ONLY has the ability to make 5d6 ranged touch attacks each and every round you're missing my original point, that you can b*$!% all day about the classes mechanics if you refuse to look at the fact that many of them were designed from a role playing/role players perspective. You far too often seem to confuse what you would and wouldn't play because you're unable to stack the numbers a certain way with what will actually happen in any given game session. Wizard and Cleric certainly have spells that give them situational advantages, but you poo poo the situational advantages of Fighter and Barbarian, saying that unless they can iron heart surge, have the highest hit dice and refresh their "spells per day" constantly they "are unbalanced". This and this alone is why I continually feel your reviews are made "from the bench" so to speak and that you simply haven't experienced playing a high level fighter or barbarian, or perhaps just haven't had situations where the casters didn't prepare sixteen castings of time stop that day, and fighter saved the day again. Situational advantages are the name of D&D. If you sit there complaining that "Well, if the barbarian is on the other side of the field and needs to approach the wizard for four rounds, and the wizard specifically has all his will save spells prepared and manages to get them off THERES NOTHING THE POOR BARBARIAN CAN DO" you're missing every single time the barbarian dives into the lake to fish out his friends and the treasure with his mighty STR and CON, or is the one who fights on despite being blinded and poisoned to crush the evildoers, or simply is the first one into the room and rips into the enemy cleric with a full attack, causing him to need to heal instead of casting miracle sixty five times. Perhaps the wizard, properly prepared, could have potentially known and cast the correct spells to get his friends out of the jam. Perhaps not. But if you don't consider these situations, you won't have an accurate picture of the game as played and will be complaining about the potential outcome of a rule without testing it.

And in response to the future "I HAVE TOO TESTED IT!!" I'd simply say "Sorry man, the barbarian in my game kicks ass. Not sure why you can't make it work."

Edit: This is coming from the point of view of a PFRPG barbarian, by the way. I've heard you complaining about the "needless complexity" of the rage points system and how you "don't see how paizo is adding more options" and yet again, I suggest you actually come play in the mud with us before you chastise us from your ivory tower. The point mechanics are easy, and allow many benefits to the barbarian that he lacked before, including your ever lauded tome of battle-esque situational abilities (without the purely mathmatical one up-manship that the 4.0 beta book of nine swords offered). But of course, you don't have to take my word for it. Just ask anyone else who's used the rules in a campaign.

LogicNinja wrote:
Point by point response that's wildly incorrect

Thanks for sharing your opinions. Yet again you've gone to great lengths to claim that you have a valid point and failed to produce anything other than your opinion to back it up.

Please, take a minute between cries of "nerf spellcasters" and "tome of battle is really balanced" and go back and actually read or god help you play the game you're talking about.

You're a big fan of complaining about class balance based on a level 20 build. I suggest you take a level five character and run him around Golarion for a few sessions and see what actually happens, not what's possible via crawling through the rulebooks on your stomach weeping about time stop and force cage.

I think that the base races needed the boost. Before the best race to play hands down was human, now all the base races are viable.

Here's the 3rd LA0 Race I've finished for my campaign. Enjoy!

Dbesk - The Well Rested Folk

The first time a person witnesses a Dbesk, they usually come away with a fairly amiable impression of them. This, and this alone might explain why these extremely lazy creatures have remained unconquered and relatively unmolested thus far through history. Friendly, well mannered and eager to please, the Dbesk seem almost too relaxed and forgiving to most who encounter them. In truth, a Dbesk would really rather sleep all day every day (and doze for the four hours or so it finds itself unable to sleep in any 24 hour day) then do anything else. Unfortunately, do to the natural magnetism of the Dbesk, many humanoids consider Dbesk they truly know little about to be their great friends, and the Dbesk are often far too lazy to argue semantics, simply seeking as much sleep as they can between whatever adventures their companions so excitedly chatter about. Because they are simply too easy going to argue or attempt to do anything but be friendly to others a few slow words at a time, the Dbesk are commonly NG.

A Dbesk stands 5'5"-6'5" on average, and tends to weigh at least 300 pounds. Although they eat and drink very little, the Dbesk are omnivores and can digest nearly any type of food into usable sustenance. Dbesk often seem to go entirely without food and water for weeks, simply sneaking a snack or a drink here and there while everyone assumes them to be asleep. A Dbesk has thick, dark grey hide that is usually mottled with brown or green markings that give them the vague appearance of a sleepy mossy rock. They have small, cool colored eyes that range from light lavender through blue and into a nearly white blue, and seemingly tiny mouths and large, flexible hands and feet, tending to curl them beneath their bulk as they sleep.

Dbesk culture is that of trees among birds, they are ponderous, and their government goes to extremely odd lengths to keep an accurate census of the Dbesk population on record. This is the only thing the Dbesk World Bureaucracy (as it is called) actually achieves, as it often takes upwards of sixteen years for any governmental function to occur besides the yearly world census. Dbesks are often seen being roused from their slumber in the corner of a common room by a Dbesk census officer (Easy to spot because they, unlike every other Dbesk seem to enjoy walking places) only to be asked a couple of questions, given their yearly Dbesk stipend (six silver pieces) and urged to return to their sleep.

+2con, +2cha, -2dex: The Dbesk are sturdy and tend to be rotund in an extremely endearing way. They're quite clumsy however and are always causing slightly comical accidents.

Medium Size

Slow Speed: 20'

Feelin' Lazy: Dbesk get a +2 racial bonus to saves vs compulsion and receive a racial -4 str penalty for the purposes of carry weight and encumbrance.

Attractive Pheromones: The Dbesk get a +4 to all charisma based skill checks made against any humanoid person within 10' of them.

Well Rested: Dbesk get a +2 bonus to saves against sleep effects and can fall asleep instantly as a free action while remaining standing, leaning, etc. A Dbesk suffers no penalties to perception for being asleep, highly trained in the art of cat napping as they are.

Friendly: A humanoid creature always treats a Dbesk as Indifferent or better unless the Dbesk has harmed the creature or it's companions (such as but not limited to forcing them to make a save, attacking them in melee or at range, or being noticed attempting to steal or stealing from them)

Slothful Metabolism: Due to it's extremely slow metabolism, a Dbesk requires 1/16th the amount of food and water a creature it's size normally requires. Dbesk also get a +2 bonus to save vs poison and a -2 penalty to save vs disease.

Natural Camouflage: A Dbesk who isn't wearing clothes receives a +4 to disguise checks when curled up in a natural environment attempting to be a large rock. A sleeping Dbesk without clothes automatically receives a 14 on disguise checks when curled up.

Dbesk armor proficiency: Dbesk are always proficient with Dbesk Quilted armor and consider Dbesk Quilted armor as no armor for the purposes of any class abilities, nor do they suffer arcane spell failure while wearing Dbesk Quilted armor. A Dbesk may always sleep in any light armor without becoming fatigued, though armor must be specifically crafted to suit the rotund bodies of the Dbesk and costs +50%.

Dbesk Quilted (Light Armor)
Cost 42g Bonus +1, Max Dex Bonus +8 Armor Check Penalty +o, Arcane Spell Failure 5%, Speed 30', Weight 8lbs

This padded armor is specifically wrought for the Dbesk, suiting them in every way. from comfort to mobility to warmth granted and quality and durability of fiber, the Dbesk Padded is the ultimate protection for the aspiring Dbesk... slumberer. Dbesk Quilted is simply too loose hanging and odd fitting to provide protection to a non Dbesk. Due to the extremely, utterly lazy nature of Dbesk craftsmen, only between one and four masterwork Dbesk Quilted armors are produced per year and they are only sold (usually for several tens of thousands of gold pieces) to personal friends of the craftsmen. These masterwork pieces of armor are probably the most comfortable garment in the entire world even to non Dbesk, and would most likely go for upwards of fifty thousand gold to a collector of decadent finery. Unfortunately for the common Dbesk, a piece of Dbesk Quilted that hasn't been made by one of the Dbesk master craftsmen just "doesn't feel right" and counts as light armor for the purposes of class features despite the Dbesk special proficiency. It is for this reason the Dbesk Quilted costs so much more than standard padded armor.

Languages: Dbesk begin speaking Dbesk and common (albeit slowly). A Dbesk with high intelligence modifier may learn Halfling, Elf, Gnome and Fey.

Favored Class: A Dbesk's favored class is Sorcerer or Monk. The Dbesk Bureaucratic Census Division produces 100% of the known Dbesk monks and stands out amongst Dbesk society as a whole as the only lawful organization the Dbesk have saw fit to put the effort into.

Hello again!

I've finished up the second of my LA0 races. As usual, feel free to post or PM me with comments or suggestions, and most of all feel free to use these races in your game, or rip off the idea and change them around! Hopefully this one is as fun to read as it was to write, I love me the Vancar.

Vancar - Manticore Erectus

The Vancar are a constant sore reminder to the forces of law that chaotic and evil creatures sometimes gain power far in excess of what should be allowed by Order. Twisting the boundries of time and the veils between one world and the next through arcane and divine means, a dungeon was caused to be seeded with creatures from an alternate future where most of the sentient races have been replaced by a cruely efficient creature called the Vancar.

The Vancar is a highly evolved Manticore, shedding it's wings and tail and growing bipedal, much like the human's ascension from lower creatures. Unlike humans however, the Vancar have a biological peculularity that allows them to breed with nearly any sentient creature, and yet the offspring of those unholy unions will always be pure blooded Vancar, utterly without fail. Because of this, the world of the Vancar is nearly completely devoid of non Vancar

When brought into Golarion by the forces of chaos and evil, the Vancar immediately set about inhabiting the entirety of the ancient, long abandoned dwarven ruin that they were summoned into, subjugating the goblinoid and giant races that had made lairs within and corrupting them, keeping many in disgusting breeding pits and enslaving the rest with a sacrifice driven forced worship of the Vancar. Eventually, sensing the pain and madness the Vancar were bringing upon the
monster races, Lamashtu appeared before them, plucking the name and form of their hermaphrodidic goddess from their prayers and minds and using it to subjugate the Vancar into her service.

In return, the Mother of Monsters granted the Vancar clerics divine powers, though the Vancar appitiude for divine magic is limited. Most Vancar find themselves following the path of the hunt, infiltrating and attempting to destroy other races from within as is their way. The few that take up arcane studies find solice from their more hot blooded siblings in the path of the Wizard, devoting great amounts of time to the sciences of the arcane arts.

Vancar racial traits:
+2 Strength, +2 Intelligence -2 wisdom: Vancar are strong of arm and sharp of mind, but their hot blooded nature often blinds and distracts them with emotion.

Medium Size: Vancar are medium sized.

Normal Speed: Vancar have a base speed of 30'

Keen Senses: Vancar receive a +2 racial bonus on smell and taste based perception checks

Vie for Supremacy: Vancar receive a +1 racial bonus to damage on all attacks versus Humans.

Infiltrate and Destroy: Vancar recieve a +2 racial bonus on Disguise checks and a +1 racial bonus to attack flat footed opponents.

Languages: Vancar begin speaking Common and Vancar. Vancar with a high intelligence bonus can choose any of the following languages: Goblin, Giant, Dwarven, Gnome, Abyssal.

Favored Class: The favored class of Vancar is Ranger or Wizard, this choice must be made at 1st level and cannot be changed.

James Jacobs wrote:
Perhaps I'll revisit it in a few months once the playtest has moved on to domains, though?

Thanks JJ!

Here is a group of Motugitl NPCs I've created to use in my campaign. Feel free to use them in your campaign as a mid/high level encounter, or to use the idea in any way you'd like!

Eight Yards Commission
This group of slightly elderly Motugitl approach the party members, seeking to gain and use the Dire Amulet of the Otherworldly Incantation of Splendor to contact their insane god Groetus. They have tracked the Amulet through researching the gibbering history of the Motugitl, hearing the psychotic and maligned whispers of Groetus calling, bidding them take up his Voice and using it to rend the land. As all Motugitl, they delight in the creation of blatant lies and great tales, the more conflicting and chaotic while still retaining a shred of believability the greater. After all, what good is deception if immediately discounted by the deceived?

Alphonse Joly, Minstrel
Alphonse is what you'd call a murderer, but he believes in killing them with kindness, indirectly, usually by convincing them to do something foolhardy or to attack/betray their friends. He stands slightly tall for a Motugitl and has dark red/brown skin. His hair is a twisted, oddly growing mass of the usual Motugitl dull black, and his small eyes and wide, terrible maw are lined heavily from constantly smiling. Alphonse seems to always be enjoying himself especially when times are at their worst.
CE, Medium Motugitl, Bard 12
14 16 16 13 12 22
94 hp,speed 30' (run 180'),BAB +9/4
AC22=8(armor)3(dex)1(ioun stone)
Saves: +5/+9/+9
skills: perform (strings)+21,perform (Motugitl dirge mumbling)+21,stealth+18(19 standing in shadows, 11 moving) heal+13,Knowledge arcana+4,knowledge history+4,knowledge religion +4,knowledge theplains4,knowlege nature4, UMD 19,bluff19spellcraft +13,sense motive 4
feats:toughness,run,spell focus enchantment,greater spell focus enchantment, fleet of foot, combat casting
class abilities: bardic knowledge,bardic performance (12),distraction,facinate,inspire courage +3,Well versed,inspire competence,lore master 2/day,suggestion,dirge of doom, discordant performance,inspire greatness,song of freedom, soothing performance
spells per day 7/7/6/5
spells known 6/6/5/4/4
0:lullaby,mage hand,prestidigitation,dancing lights,read magic,summon instrument
1:alarm,charm person,cure light,expeditious retreat,hideous laughter, feather fall
2:heroism,hold person,hypnotic pattern,suggestion,locate object
3:charm monster,confusion,glibness,haste
4:dimension door,hold monster,modify memory,cure critical
+6 cha headband
lyre of building
+4 chain shirt
handy haversack
boots of striding and springing
luck stone
dusty rose ioun stone
wand of cure moderate wounds
motugitul healers kit
ten days motugitul mushroom rations
waterskin (2)
silk rope 100'
hammer and pitons (10)

Nerpest Barker, Minstrel
Nerpest is a fine example of a picturesque Motugitl. Nearly all of the Motugitl sorcerers are Aberrant bloodline, but not even many among the Motugitl delight in the abuse of their powers as Nerpest does. Known to eat living creatures simply for enjoyment, this Motugitl is a truly terrible person. His skin is a very dark, non-reflective black, rubbery and disgusting looking in bright light, but blending well in the dim. His limbs contort and stretch hideously as he moves and he seems to very much enjoy Motugitl Dirge Mumbling.
CE,Medium Motugitl, Sorcerer12
14 20 13 11 13 22
HP67, AC19,(bracers of armor 4,dex 5), speed 30'
feats:weapon finesse,quicken spell,toughness,weapon focus (touch attack),run,fleet of foot,improved initiative
skills: spellcraft15, bluff20, perform (motugitl dirge mumbling) 10
spells per day:8/8/9/7/6/4
spells known:9/5/5/4/3/2/1
spells 0:acid splash,detect magic,bleed,touch of fatigue,light,read magic,disrupt undead,prestidigitation,detect poison
1:shocking grasp,true strike,chill touch,reduce person,expeditious retreat, enlarge person
2:scorching ray,invisibility,touch of idiocy,darkness,ghoul touch, see invisibility
3:fireball,fly,vampiric touch,haste,tongues
4:bestow curse,contagion,enervation,black tentacles
5:cloudkill,teleport, feeblemind
+6 cha item
+6 dex item
boots of striding and springing
ring of counterspells (disintegrate)
ring of counterspells (disintegrate)
bracers of armor +4

Zeb Puno, Minstrel,
Zeb Puno is the "brains" of the Eight Yards Commission applying his limited natural intelligence far more directly than the two more sadistic minstrels. He even came up with the delightful (to him) pun for their name. He is short, stout, and always wears a knowing half smile on his wide mouth, often showing all his uneven, sharp teeth. His eyes gleam with mirth, and though not as bloodthirsty as the other two minstrels, he definitely can and will do whatever it takes to make sure the commission achieves it's goals. More than one potential threat has been eliminated by the wicked Censer of Groetus "Lick" he nearly always carries, relying on it's toxic vapors to drive his foes to expose their weaknesses. His extremely blatant disregard for socializing is obvious, as he often commits the vilest of Motugitl sins, to call a Motugitl out on a lie. It vastly amuses him.
NE Medium Motugitl, Rogue 12
16 18 18 12 16 6
hp106, BAB 9/4, saves:8/12/9
AC32 8(armor)5(shield)4(dex)3(nat)2(dodge)
6d6 sneak attack(7d6 w/lick)
Lick: +1 blurstrike, deadly precision Censer of Groetus
+13/+8 1d10+4 19-20x2
skills acrobatics +16,bluff+15,stealth+19,sense motive+18,perception+18,perform+13,escape artist+19,slight of hand+19,disable device+19
iron will, toughness, shield proficiency, run, fleet of foot, dodge
Rogue Tricks: Bleeding Attack, Resiliency, slow reactions, weapon training, combat reflexes, improved initiative, improved evasion
Class abilities: Evasion, Trapsense4, uncanny dodge,imp uncanny dodge
Lick, +6 str item, +4 chain shirt, +4 buckler, Amulet of Natural Armor +3

Wimda Mibbinock, Doomsayer
Like all "Doomsayers" Widma is nearly completely psychotic. Sharing her god's extremely entropic and fatalistic viewpoint (All will end, but when and why, that is up to the fractured chaos) She alternates between bouts of prophetic doomsaying and an almost cheerful chaotic whimsy, humming along with the minstrels as she wades into the fray, bringing a little chaos into reality with each divine distortion of reality. She absolutely loves the concept of healing injuries, her own personal rebellion against her god, who cares not at all what she does.
CN Medium Motugitl, Cleric 12
14 13 14 10 21 17
HP115 AC27 BAB 9/4, saves 10/5/16 speed 15'
skills spellcraft15, bluff22
feats:selective channeling, extra turning, run, eschew materials, fleet of foot, power attack
channel 6d6 8/day
spells per day 4/6/5/5/4/4/2
spells 0:create water,virtue,stabilize,detect magic
1:divine favor,sanctuary,shield of faith(4),bless
2:spiritual weapon (5)
3:blindness/deafness (2),cure serious wounds (2) Deeper Darkness
4:Divine Power, spell immunity (4)
5:Breath of Life (2), righteous might, greater command
6:Dispel Magic: Greater, Blade Barrier
Domains: Destruction, Madness
destructive smite full round, +6 damage, auto confirm 1 round
inflict light 6/day
shatter 1/day
30' aura destruction 12 rounds/day, +6 damage, auto confirm
inflict critical 3/day
vision of madness: melee touch, +3 to either attack,saves,skills -3 to other two. 3 rounds.
Lesser confusion 6/day
touch of idiocy 1/day
aura of madness 30' 12 rounds/day, confusion, dc 19 will
phantasmal killer 3/day
+6 cha item
+6 str item
+2 censer of Groetus (+11/+6, 1d10+4 19-20x2)
+4 Full Plate
+4 buckler

What follows is a little flavor text for the Motugitl. Keep in mind that I've removed the immunity to gnome and fey innate supernatural abilities and replaced it with a +4 to save vs those abilities. I believe this helps bring the Motugitl further within the range of the Pathfinder RPG base races.

The Motugitl are race of Gnomes with an extremely sordid history. Once worshipers of the goddess Calistria, these gnomes grew increasingly dishonest and psychotic over the years in her "care", eventually becoming completely chaotic, and more than a little evil, flying from passion to passion and whim to whim sometimes within days or even hours of each other. They began to honor lies and liars as great Storytellers of their people, competing to see who could craft the finest lies, and learning the secrets of herbology to produce a number of terrible chemicals for a myriad of uses, recreational and otherwise. On a date remembered and reviled in their history as the time of Damnation, their highest of priests, out of his mind with intoxication from Feyblue Mushroom dared insult Calistria's form as "Fraught with terrible symmetry". She flew into a blind rage, transforming the Motugitl into a six legged, degenerate form and stripping them of their aptitude for magic and supernatural abilities. She promised them that no right thinking god would listen to the pleas of a degenerate race, and bid them to join the children of Lamashtu, if they dared. The Motugitl galloped from her rage, as one stumbling, hideous mass far from their tunnel homes and into a deep cavern. Finding their new form resistant to heat and comforted by the nurturing feeling of the mountain closing in around them, they descended further and further into the blackness, into poisonous, ancient caverns that even the deep gnomes shunned as unholy, all the way to the fiery pits where the blood of the mountains flows. Ever fearful, even in their chaotic madness, they slowly took up the worship of Groetus, pleased with the fact that he responded in no ways to their prayers and delighting in creating stories of his great powers and lies to "prove" their close connection to him. They spun great tales of their god conquering and destroying the upper races, leaving only a barren shell for the Motugitl to take as their own, basking on the shores of the fire lakes and breathing deep of the toxic fumes of his wrath. Eventually, to their own surprise, the Doomsayers (Motugitl clerics of Groetus) eventually began to receive divine abilities, and were able to spin even finer lies with the powers of a psychotic god behind their efforts. Taking his power as a sign that the time of burning has come to the lands above, the insane, mutant Motugitl have began to move upwards, taking secret ways to the damned surface to spread their great lie... Creating entropic truth in raging fire, unbeknownst to even themselves.

The Motugitl's form is that of a gnome which has sprouted four additional legs, with a bizarre hip and knee arrangement to grant them mobility, though of a disjointed, terrible variety. They retain the standard two arms, and their thick, hardened skin ranges in coloration from black to a ruddy deep red with no highlights in skin or hair. They have naturally sharp, crooked teeth and a mouth that opens disturbingly wide, complete with a thin, elongated and writhing tongue. The Goddess Calistria viewed this form as monstrous and unredeemable, but it has served the Motugitl to keep them alive in their hidden warrens. The Motugitl commonly go without shoes, using their thick skin and tough feet to gain purchase on the unworked terrain of the lava flows.

Censer of Groetus - Motugitl Heavy Flail - Two Handed Martial Weapon: 1d10 19-20x2
Special: Any creature hit by the Censer, or any creature that ends it's turn in or adjacent to the square the Censer is in is exposed to the poisonous vapors it releases.
The Censer is a heavy flail which houses a chamber to burn incenses and poisons. Unlike a normal Censer however, this morbid object is shaped like the holy symbol of Groetus, a waxing moon with a skull formed in the craters, and when filled with the long burning mixture of poisonous mosses, herbs and a terrible bubbling tar and set alight, terrible toxic vapors that cause hallucination and madness pour from the eyes and mouth of the symbol and flickering firelight and the sound of sparks and guttering pitch from within stay with many victims long after the effect of the poison has lifted.
Most commonly, the Censer is filled with Saulargi and functions poorly with non-long burning poison mixtures.

Saulargi: Level 7 poison, inhaled; Save Fortitude DC 16 Frequency: 1 round(10), Effect: 1 wis damage, shaken, sickened. Cure: 2 saves.

Motugitl Healing Kit: The Motugitl rely on the flora and fauna of their hidden refuge not just for food, but also medicine. With few clerics of Groetus psychotic enough to actually channel positive energy or heal diseases and poisons despite their god's tendency to completely ignore the plight of their people (though a fully healthy creature is often capable of far greater chaos than a sick or wounded one), they have developed a strange but potent series of anti-toxins and disease fighting unguents that are commonly used by their healers. A Motugitl Healer's kit is a portable example of this practice and provides a +4 circumstance bonus to heal checks. In the hands of a non Motugitl, this strange bundle of twigs, dried mushrooms and powders wrapped in leaves is impossible to use safely without a dc20 Heal check. On a failed check, both the healer and the patient are poisoned with Black Lotus Extract (PFRPG 391)

LogicNinja wrote:
nickname rage

Cool post brother.

I've recently been attempting to design a race with zero level adjustment. Both to prove it can be done, and to add a little spice to my weekly game.

Here's what I've done so far, the Motugitl. Six-legged mutant gnomes, cursed by Calistria and now frightfully worshiping Groteus from "Deep caverns where the blood of mountains flows".

Racial Traits:
+2 con, +2 wis, -2cha: Motugitl are hardy and keen of senses, but are vicious and anti-social.

Medium Sized

Speed 20', Runs at x5 (x6 with the run feat). Is not hindered by difficult terrain. Has double the unpenalized overland speed of a human.

Sees normally in darkness/magical darkness.

Always treats Bluff and Sense motive as class skills.
+4 to bluff checks
-4 to diplomacy checks
-10 circumstance bonus to disguise checks.
-4 penalty to stealth while moving (more feet, more footsteps) +4 to stealth while standing still in shadows or torch/firelight (coloration).

Resist fire 10, immune to inhaled poisons.

+2 to saves vs fear and other mind effects.

Stability: +4 dc to overrun, trip or bull rush.

Immune to innate supernatural abilities of gnomes and fey.

Only get one language per 2 ranks in linguistics. Start speaking Motugitl only.

Treats the Censer of Groteus (Special Heavy Flail) as a simple
weapon. Armor must be custom made (2x price).

Favored Class: Rogue or Cleric (must choose at 1st level)

I'll follow this up with the flavor text, as well as some Motugitl goods (such as the Censer). Please lend me your thoughts!

Maveric28 wrote:
My group's fighter was also disconcerted about the whole "adjacent" factor

It's based on the fact that you're cutting through the enemy into an enemy beside him. Thus, you couldn't do it against someone who's on the other side of your body from the first target, otherwise it'd be whirlwind attack.

Thanks for the suggestions.

houstonderek wrote:
LogicNinja wrote:
a bunch of condescending and insulting stuff

There's a reason he's widely referred to as "sh*tninja" on every board he's ever posted on.

Jal Dorak wrote:
I've always taken 3 to be the absolute minimum for PCs even after racial ability scores are applied. I can't remember where I got this tidbit, so it may or may not be the official rule.

Creatures with less than 3 int cannot take classes.


Been running PF since Alpha 3, and so far we're having a great time. I must ask, however, about critical hits. Other than the blurb under sneak attack, we have no real information about who and what is immune to sneak attack and if those differences apply to critical hits or not.

This has come up several time and this is the first time I've managed to remember about it between games.

Any information regarding this out there somewhere?

Evanta wrote:
Who agrees with me that the base classes are too complicated?


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