For the general rule of a high jump i would say yes. Then the specific rule of powerful leap changes it
I 100% agree with what you are saying, but perhaps not the vocabulary. I don't think we should say that it sets the "Maximum Distance Travelled" if we are then going to allow other things to increase the distance. But we both agree that we have a general rule that sets a value and a specific rule that modifies the value.
Subordinate Actions wrote:
An action might allow you to use a simpler action—usually one of the Basic Actions—in a different circumstance or with different effects.
Lava Leap allows me to use the leap action, changing the distance (from 10 or 15) to my speed. This is exactly like the subordinate action example of Stride. We both agree that this is a subordinate action. This becomes the general rule and sets my leap speed to my land speed.
Subordinate Actions wrote:
This subordinate action still has its normal traits and effects,
I am making a leap, as the subordinate action, and that should follow all of the rules of leap. It is a move action and would provoke attacks of opportunity, would benefit from Guarded Movement, etc.
LordPretzels wrote:
Because normally outside the move 15 can leap 10, move 30 can leap 15, and you can't leap further than you speed
There is no restriction in the Leap action that defines you can't go farther than your speed. That is, however, mentioned in the success conditions of the Long Jump action that require you to make skill checks.
I still contend that I am making a leap action, as part of the subordinate action rules, and subordinate actions have all of their normal effects. I leap, feats that effect leap are part of it's normal effects. So we have a general rule of move 45 in lava leap and it is modified by the specific rules of +5 when you leap. This follows exactly from your high jump example in the previous post...
there are definitely some decent arguments for your case. I just think the arguments against it are better. I would accept an errata or some sort of official ruling against my position and follow it even though I wouldn't agree with it.
Lava Leap sets the Maximum distance traveled with this ability to your movement speed.
High Jump wrote:
High Jump
Skill Athletics (Untrained)
You Stride, then attempt a DC 30 Athletics check to jump vertically. If you didn't Stride at least 10 feet, you automatically fail. This DC might be increased or decreased due to the situation, as determined by the GM.
Success: You Leap up to 5 feet vertically and 5 feet horizontally.
Do you believe that High Jump sets the Maximum distance travelled with a success to 5 feet?
For the general rule of a high jump i would say yes. Then the specific rule of powerful leap changes it, increasing what distance can be traveled. Then there is also boots of bounding, which only change the vertical distance on a high jump but not the horizontal, making it "up to" 8 feet vertical while 5 feet horizontal is unchanged.
Lava leap seems to change leap to a subordinate action to the ability itself, redefining how the distance is determined. Its like a leap but now its Lava Leap. And Lava Leap follows its own rules setting movement to set its upper limit. Because normally outside the move 15 can leap 10, move 30 can leap 15, and you can't leap further than you speed, movement speed has no affect on upper leap distance. Then long jump uses movement to set the cap on how far can be jumped as long as you succeed at the DC. So far I'm happy with the up to your ground speed and horizontal leap distance modifiers not applying. If something said increase distance traveled with Leap by x amount "including Lava Leap", that's a differnt story.
Juddimal, nothing you said matters. "Leap up to your Speed." That's it. This is a specific new rule for this action. Everything else is a general rule, which gives you only 30 ft. That's all there is. Specific rule trumps general one.
You really should stop searching for exploits in this way.
Is 45 not enough for you? Really? Is 55 or 75 feet with spells not enough? What's even the point?
LordPretzels wrote:
I think the player is calculating it this way, the base leap is being set to 45, as per lava leap. Then all the +leap distance is being stacked on top of the new base of 45. So far, from what everyone has stated here, lava leap changes what applies to leap, removing +horizontal leap distance from the equation and applying only movement speed. I'm fine with the investment into fleet step and tailwind increasing it.
I said it above, it's not a "base". It's new everything, there's nothing else at all. You "Leap up to your Speed", full stop. This is the new rule. If there were something else, it must have been written there. But this game probably never works in this way: when it overrides something completely it doesn't allow anything on top.
"Base" is definitely the wrong phrasing, "Maximum" would be more accurate. Lava Leap sets the Maximum distance traveled with this ability to your movement speed. In this case up to 45, allowing for a lava leap of 0-45 feet horizontal distance traveled.I hope you have a better day then when you posted this response, your tone sucks and is not conducive to discuss rules clarifications. I came here to get clarification on what does or doesn't apply to be sure a player gets the most out of their build within the bounds of the rules, not to be berrated. Go to 4chan or redit to do that.
I'm hitting an issue at my table with leap feats+ boots of bounding, and lava leap. I had a player insist they could Leap (as a part of lava leap) 60 feet with no check.
Lava Leap specifically changes the Leap action by setting the maximum distance to your land speed. There is no check, as Leap doesn't involve one. Since Lava Leap sets a maximum distance, those other feats and items mentioned can't exceed it. So the character could Lava Leap for 45 feet, like you had ruled.
No, I don't see how it could be 45 feet. I also count only 30 feet at all, as LordPretzels does. Where does even 45 come from (let alone 60)? [Well, the speed is 45, yes. But I don't see how it adds up to it and more]
Ah, yes, I see. "Leap up to your Speed." Yes, then, 45 feet it is. But nothing else matters as everything else gives just 30 at max.
P.S. Well, I don't see any status bonuses, so with Tailwind it would be 55 feet all day and with Fleet step ...75 feet for a minute.
I think the player is calculating it this way, the base leap is being set to 45, as per lava leap. Then all the +leap distance is being stacked on top of the new base of 45. So far, from what everyone has stated here, lava leap changes what applies to leap, removing +horizontal leap distance from the equation and applying only movement speed. I'm fine with the investment into fleet step and tailwind increasing it.
I'm hitting an issue at my table with leap feats+ boots of bounding, and lava leap. I had a player insist they could Leap (as a part of lava leap) 60 feet with no check. The player has 45feet of movement (boots, fleet, nimble elf), powerful leap, dancing leaf, and boots of bounding. I told them they couldn't leap more than their movement and allowed them to leap 45 feet with no check to keep things moving, but their entire build is around Lava Leap and I am trying to sort out what it is they can actually do. As far as I can figure out with those feats and the boots, the max leap that can be made with no check is 30 feet.
Does the text "You can choose any ancestry" allow for uncommon ancestries to be chosen in PFS? I'm curious because the Steadfast Refugee boon is expensive and you can only purchase it once.
As In Life, So In Death
Specific memories of your old life are hard to hold onto, but you know things without remembering why. You gain the Adopted Ancestry feat. You can choose any ancestry, but it is likely to be one that matches both your skeleton heritage and who you were in life. As long as your body is completely covered by armor or clothing, you do not have to attempt Deception checks against a creature's Perception DC to successfully Impersonate yourself as a member of that ancestry. This is a non-magical disguise that doesn't protect against divination. This disguise doesn't provide any benefit against a creature actively attempting a Perception check against you.
Ancestral Adoption Boon:
(Slotless): Whether you grew up with an unlikely family or have since been adopted into an uncommon culture, you have a powerful connection to an uncommon ancestry’s techniques. When you gain the Adopted Ancestry feat (Pathfinder Core Rulebook 258), you can choose either hobgoblin, leshy, or lizardfolk in place of a common ancestry. The following are the ancestry feats you can select from these three options.
The ancestral adoption boon is very specific. is this a case where the specific text of As in life so in death override the common requirement of adopted ancestry? Does the PFS boon Ancestral adoption limit As in life so in death to common ancestries instead of all ancestries? I'm leaning toward the boon limiting As in life so in death, but curious to if A solid argument stands allowing for uncommon choices.
I'm pretty excited to see Iruxi getting a remasterr. No specifics have been announced as far as I know, but I was curious what kind of changes the community might be interested in for paizo's scaled astronomers?
For me, I never thought the Aquadic Adaptaion (breath control) quite fit Iruxi in 2e. Why can desert Lizard men hold their breath for so long? From what i know most lizards arnt particularly well suited to aquatic life aside from marine iguanas. I feel like its one of the hold over aspects from DnD. In addition to Paizo was doing a really neat thing by emphasizing ecological variation with the sandstrider, wetlands, and woodstalker heritages. It represents the diverty that lizards have evolved to better thrive in their environments. I hope to see the remaster really dive into those environmental variations.
I always thought that Aquatic Adaptation was for all those wetland dwelling Iruxi.
I'm pretty sure that is what its ment for as well, but all Iruxi have it. It should probably be added to wetlander heritage alongside the 15ft swim speed. Not sure what Iruxi would have baseline if paizo went that direction maybe add the claw attack in its place?
PossibleCabbage wrote:
I think the Iruxi are not just supposed to represent "Lizards" (who usually don't spend a lot of time in the water) but also large semiaquatic reptiles like crocodiles, alligators, caimans, and gharials.
Iruxi are definitely ment to represent a variety of aquatic reptiles and also chameleon, gila monster, gecko, and a whole host of other non-aquatic reptiles. Only a couple of the heritages would lend themselves to aquatic while the sandstrider is generally for an environment lacking water, yet it still has aquatic Adaptation.
I'm pretty excited to see Iruxi getting a remasterr. No specifics have been announced as far as I know, but I was curious what kind of changes the community might be interested in for paizo's scaled astronomers?
For me, I never thought the Aquadic Adaptaion (breath control) quite fit Iruxi in 2e. Why can desert Lizard men hold their breath for so long? From what i know most lizards arnt particularly well suited to aquatic life aside from marine iguanas. I feel like its one of the hold over aspects from DnD. In addition to Paizo was doing a really neat thing by emphasizing ecological variation with the sandstrider, wetlands, and woodstalker heritages. It represents the diverty that lizards have evolved to better thrive in their environments. I hope to see the remaster really dive into those environmental variations.
#1 gunna look into this, im not familiar with deep backgrounds. Was set on it being fetching, I know human is always the catch all for how to get some weird builds.
It would still be a fetchling, just one that was adopted by humans: you're just using your skill feat [from background] and your 1st level ancestry feat on human.
On deep backgrounds, it's just an expanded was to do backgrounds where you make a series of rolls that gives you multiple options your stat bonus, skill and feat.
Oh! I see where you're going now. Thanks again for the great suggestions.
Is this a npc? If so, raw is what you want it to be as npc's don't have to be built like pc's. There isn't a way for to make a spiked chain a monk weapon, but you said you'd changing monastic weapons to fit, so what are you asking for? Is it a scaling proficiency? if so:
#1 use Variant Rules [Deep Backgrounds] one roll allows you to get he Adopted Ancestry feat [Table 4-6: Homeland/Another Ancestry’s Settlement]. Take human and for your ancestry feat, take Unconventional Weaponry, allowing it to use simple weapon proficiency.
#1a as above but adopted a 3rd [general feat] and Unconventional Weaponry a 5th.
#2 take Archetype Gladiator and at 6th take Performative Weapons Training
#3 str 14 and mauler at 2nd
Like I said, I am looking for is a way, raw, to make this concept by level 3 or 4 that i may have missed.You do make a good point that it won't work raw even with mauler.
#1 gunna look into this, im not familiar with deep backgrounds. Was set on it being fetching, I know human is always the catch all for how to get some weird builds.
#2 worth a look
#3 Mauler will allow it to scale but, as you and gestalt originally pointed out, thats it.
Thanks, I think you likely covered every possible odd way to try and get this concept to work. It appears that only with GM house rule powers this will work. Which is a bit of a shame.
Im running the Bloodlords AP and was adding a side quest that delves into the Empty Threshold. I wanted to add a fetchling Kuthite monk who uses a spiked chain (zon-kuthon's weapon), my current plan was to just lump it in with monastic weapons and call it a day. Rarity isn't the issue for this setting. What I am looking for is a way, raw, to make this concept by level 3 or 4. Best I can come up with is having 14 strength and getting mauler dedication. I'm curious what other options I may have missed.
Armor-Rending Bite [two-actions] The ankhrav makes a mandibles Strike; if the Strike hits, the target’s armor takes the damage and the acid damage bypasses the armor’s Hardness.
This just made me wonder how item hp scaled. I could see the damage later creatures destroying pc items very quickly.
Does adding the +1 increase the items hp? The only info I can find is on table 11-4. Which puts leather armor at 4 hardness 16hp/ 8bt and steel 9 hardness 36hp/ 16bt.
You forget about the most important description that is in your goblin (and all others) ancestry:
Quote:
Additional languages equal to your Intelligence modifier (if it's positive). Choose from Draconic, Dwarven, Gnoll, Gnomish, Halfling, Orcish, and any other languages to which you have access (such as the languages prevalent in your region).
In general (with some noticeable exceptions like focus spells) rarity rules like uncommon only exists to help the GM and player to notice that something is not common in the Avistan region or that can used as warn to players and GM that some spells and abilities that could be used to try workaround some mystery stories (ex.: Spells like Detect Alignment, Detect Poison, Magic Aura and many other are classified as uncommon as way to alert the GM and players to take attention to this spells. To GM because they can be used to try to detect some evil shapeshifted creature or some poisoned item/consumable that you don't want the players easily detect. To players to help them to know when they take spells that they need to first consult the GM. This try to avoid inadvertently spell bans or to know that they can suffer some restriction during the game).
That said to you know some uncommon language you just need to talk to your GM asking if it allows it! Usually you just need to explain why this make sense to your char build is sufficient to most sensate GM to allow.
I intended for"Your ancestry entry states which languages you know at 1st level." to coverthat.
Cordell Kintner wrote:
In society play, all versatile heritages gain access to their associated language. So Oreads can learn Terran, Tieflings can learn Abysal or Infernal, etc. I believe the boons have been updated to reflect this.
I was not aware of this, definitely going to look into that.
I'm trying to figure out if my oread goblin from oprak (scav background) and elemental lore (earth plane)qualifies to learn the Terran language at level 5 with a bump to Intelligence and not have to take multilingual.
So far I can't solidly justify gaining the uncommon language, but I feel there may be some wiggle room with oread being an "earth elemental creature". Did I miss anything that could grant access to Terran? Also, oread in the Beastiary know Terran but Beastiary rules =/= pc rules.
These are all the things I could find on language and accessibility
uncommon trait (crb 13):
"Uncommon items are game element, it is of common rarity. Uncommon items are available only to those who have special training, grew up available only to those who have special training, grew up in a certain culture, or come from a particular part of the in a certain culture, or come from a particular part of the world."
intelligence modifier(crb 31):
"If an ability boost this adds 1 Hit Point per level). If an ability boost increases your character’s Intelligence modifier, they increases your character’s Intelligence modifier, they become trained in an additional skill and language."
[spoiler=ancestry(crb 33)]"This tells you the languages that members of the ancestry speak at 1st level. If your Intelligence modifier is +1 or higher, you can select more languages from a list given here."
languages and ancestry(crb 65):
"Your ancestry entry states which languages you know at 1st level."
languages(crb 65):
"Other abilities and effects might grant access to common or uncommon languages, as detailed in their descriptions."
traits(crb 637):
"Often a trait indicates how other rules interact with an ability, creature, item, or other rules element with that trait"
Giant crawling hand has its attack listed as
Melee [one-action] claw +15, Damage 2d6+7 slashing plus Grab
Grab in the bestiary says
"The creature is grabbed by whichever body part the monster attacked with, and that body part can’t be used to Strike creatures until the grab is ended."
What I am wondering is, what happens once the giant hand grabs?
Am I right in thinking that since it is the "body part" that it can't strike until the grab is ended?
No it does not - the Order Explorer feat does not state that you get an extra focus point so you would only get one if the feat you picked said that it does.
Even the order spell feat only says that it gives you a focus point if you don't already have one.
Thats what I thought, just crossing t's and dotting i's before I reported a bug on pathbuilder.
Since Aura of Courage & Marshal's Aura interact with feat in different ways, they both do stack.
Thats the impression I was under. Those abilities synergies really well to help against fear. Not sure if it's worth the investment in both unless it's like, a spooky campaign.
Overall concept, a Goblin liberator champion of Cayden Cailean. All about power to the people and being buzzed while doing it. Also needs to be PFS legal. Planning out to 5 here. I'm flexible on all the various class/dedication combos.
I have two builds in mind. An agi build takeing swashbuckler dedication with bon mot. The other could be str or agi with the marshal dedication.
I was wondering of there was any big difference between buckler expertise and dueling parry when choosing to go down either feat path for swash?
The only big trade off I can find is duelling parry leaves you with a tint bit less bulk while buckler expertise gives the the option of special materials for buckler/buckler attacks (which can be covered by carrying a light mace or even a gauntlet). I also didn't find any magical bucklers. Thanks for any insights!
I made a goblin twisting tree magus with 12, 12,8,18,16,12
That's a really weird stat array for a goblin magus though?
Generally speaking Strength is going to be your main stat. Unlike a wizard you don't need Intelligence to be at its peak because you use weapons to hit with spells, not spell attacks. Intelligence is nice to have because it's a bit of extra damage with cantrips, but it's very much in second (or third or fourth) place.
I donno how I got the stats so out of order. I intended to use 12 str, 18 dex, 12 con, 16 int, 8 wis, 12 cha. But since there is no way to use dex with a staff I would flip str and dex.
If you think about staff fights they are fast paced and involve a lot of mobility, not some beefcake conan-ing their enemies. Still seems weird that staff isn't finesse, but thems the rules.
For some reason I was under the assumption that twisting tree was intended to be dex based. Am I forgetting something that makes dex a preferable stat for using a staff over str? Is it monk that gets to use dex that I'm mistakenly mixing in?
Just for context I was playing with pathbuilder and (under the above assumption) I made a goblin twisting tree magus with 12, 12,8,18,16,12 and they had a +4 to hit with the staff at level 1. Which seemed atrocious for a melee even at lvl 1. I know the hybrid study added the agile trait to staff, but for some reason I keep thinking it should have finesse.
Check out the "being stealthy sidebar" on 251. It may help. I think that the degrees of detection apply here.
Sneak
Failure
A telltale sound or other sign gives your position away, though you still remain unseen. You’re hidden from the creature throughout your movement and remain so.
Since you are hidden
HIDDEN
The creature knows your location but can’t see you.
This still allows a blind attack, or some other disadvantage, so standstill can still apply.
As a gm, I'd allow the player to start moving then interrupt. Describing, the creature with standstill noticing something amiss (its head tilts to the side, ear twitch, suddenly tenses up) and throwing a blind swing in the sneaky pcs direction halting the player as it makes contact.
The short answer is gm flourish of the discription I guess.
Thank you for all the contact information that has been provided and places to go to show support. Id just like to say overall im pretty impressed with the responce from the community here on the forums.
I think unionization would be a great idea. There is too much of a conflict of interest in corporate HR departments. It Essentially allows companies to police themselves which hardly ever proves effective.
After reading the Twitter posts, the only thing giving price any credibility is that some of what she stated has been corroborated. Frankly her posts were, at first read, an angry outburst of baisless claims from a jaded ex employee. With that said, the accusations are very concerning, and even with the questionable trustworthiness of the accuser and with or without ratifying comments, they need to be investigated thoroughly. Out right dismissal of the accusations based on Prices's past public dealings is not appropriate, but neither is immediately assuming guilt on the part of paizo and those accused.
#paizoaccountability has a connotation of complete guilt on the part of the accused. I do no agree with that. Its far more likely this ends up somewhere in the middle, with portions of Prices statements being true, some being embellished, and others being false.
The Familiar ability masters form, requires manual dexterity and speech and is listed as a granted ability for shadow familiars but speech is not granted. I'm guessing since its a granted ability shadow familiars get master's form whether they have speech or not. Is speech intended to be a granted ability for shadow familiars?
IMO, it's given to the familiar bypassing the prerequisite [you only need the prerequisites to pick one, not be granted one]. Seems like they are going for the 'shadow puppet' vibe here, so the lack of voice kind of fits.
This is what I was thinking as well. Definitely fits thematically.
The Familiar ability masters form, requires manual dexterity and speech. Masters form is a granted ability for shadow familiars but speech is not. I'm guessing since its a granted ability, shadow familiars get master's form whether they have speech or not. Is speech intended to be a granted ability for shadow familiars or does the familiar get master's form without speech?
The Familiar ability masters form, requires manual dexterity and speech and is listed as a granted ability for shadow familiars but speech is not granted. I'm guessing since its a granted ability shadow familiars get master's form whether they have speech or not. Is speech intended to be a granted ability for shadow familiars?
In secrets of magic, the Familiar ability masters form, requires manual dexterity and speech and is listed as a granted ability for shadow familiars but speech is not granted. I assume that since its a granted ability shadow familiars get master's form whether they have speech or not. Is speech intended to be a granted ability?
This is the Errata thread for the Lost Omens Product line. You'd be better served posting this question in the Secrets of Magic Errata thread here.
Much appreciated, but all those threads look to be closed.
In secrets of magic, the Familiar ability masters form, requires manual dexterity and speech and is listed as a granted ability for shadow familiars but speech is not granted. I assume that since its a granted ability shadow familiars get master's form whether they have speech or not. Is speech intended to be a granted ability?
All I'm hearing is more reasons PF1 was better than PF2, lol
If what you want is unfettered freedom to make any character, yeah, PF1 is probably better. If you want to actually play a functional cooperative game, PF2 is better. If I am reading your post correctly, you don't have a game lined up to play the character-- it is the building itself which you're gonna use to process feelings. So yeah, PF1 will probably serve you better.
That said... You're asking for a really really specific option that was published 8 years into PF1's life cycle. We are two years into PF2-- we don't even have the magus yet. I don't think it is reasonable to expect PF2 to have EVERYTHING PF1 has yet, especially when there's already something so close to the concept in existence. And there will be a soul linked option by the end of the month with the summoner.
Also, there is a 10th level spell that can turn your familiar and 9 other creatures into a herd of mastodon, which is pretty cool.
Throwing the whole system out over such a small thing, with everything else it has to offer, is just silly.
I know it has been stated but it needs repeating. Other options, that are functionally the exact same, exist and summoner is out at the end of the month. Just flavor an animal companion a little differnt.
I cant find anything that elaborates on what is North/ northeast of the Castrovian Sea. I still suspect Kalady is that central part and may be extends north.
After reading into The reign of Winter AP I have theories, but thats it. In all likelihood it was part of the Koloran Emipire, maybe even the bulk of it. Artrosa makes me think maybe Baba Yaga started the plagues or something in Koloran and placed the maiden, mother and crone there to warn people off. It seems like it all would have a vary similar environment to Dvesda Marches, on the west side of the Myrfrus River.
The map of Iobaria was made available in a blog post here Iobarian Timeline
I was getting distracted with some of the details around Tian Xia so I scraped all but labeling the continent.
Thanks for all the help and to @vagrant-poet for the map! It cleared up some of the Kelish/Vurda layout that I wasn't clear on.
Still not sure how far east Grass Sea goes, but pathfinderwiki lists it as being between Kelish/Vudra/Kalady. That seems to fit geographically if
kalady trades by sea. Kalady is confusing, its described as north east of the Castrovian Sea. I could be putting to much emphasis on natural barriers. Also Starting to think that a lot of that eastern part of Casmaron hasn't been identified.
If anyone was wondering, I'm using the world map form the 2e core book, a lot of info from Lost Omens World Guide, and the pathfinderwiki.
Also, new map Updated based on all the great help!
I love all the Windsong Testaments. It would be great if these get picked back up. I've reread this one in particular several times since it was posted.
I've been tryin got sort out where exactly various countries are in Casmaron based on descriptions from pathfinder wiki, the lost omens books, and maps from APs. Is this looking about right? a couple areas I'm not 100% sure how far Iobaria continues east over the Castrovin Sea or what exactly is between the Windswept Wastes and Iobaria/ Castrovin Sea. Is it more of the Wastes? Any help would be appreciated!
On the topic of alcohol, I recently ran a quick one shot for some friends while on vacation and, of course, the heathens wanted to immediately get tanked before venturing off to murderhobo a dungeon. The issue was, I started them at level 5 leaving the lowest fort save of the bunch at +11.
I know 1e had a rule about poison dcs going up with multiple exposures, but as far as I can tell that didn't continue into 2e. The only info I have found so far is on p458 of crb and the section on addiction on gmg.
Is it raw that pcs of a high enough level (which doest seem to be all the high) could drink enough booze to effectively replace all liquid in there body and be just fine?
I just house ruled that they got what they wanted and stumbled through the dungeon thoroughly intoxicated. The rules seem super lax on binge drinking to the point that I question why there are rule on it at all? Was there something I missed?
Earlier in the thread it discussed that. I had a question about specific familiar cost vs number of granted abilities while using the familiar master archtype with a class that doesn't grant a familier. I added more restrictive parameters.
Here is the original post I had with the particulars of my inquiry.
LordPretzels wrote:
Just double checking, in case I missed it. In the case of a familiar master (base class doesn't grant a familiar)
2)familiar master dedication
Gain familiar with 2 abilities
4) enhanced familiar
Familiar goes up to 4 abilities
6) improved familiar
Lowers specific familiar cost by 2
10)incredible familiar
Familiar abilities go up to 6
At 10 you could then qualify for the imp. You are granted 6 abilities but qualify for 8.
Does the imp still get its 7 granted abilities + unique abilities? Or does one need to be dropped?
Imps granted abilities are
(1)darkvision, (2)flier, (3)manual dexterity, (4)resistance (fire and poison), (5)skilled (Deception), (6)speech, (7)touch telepathy
Not sure how you reach 7 when all the feats grant abilities in increments of 2 (mix up with # of imp granted abilities?). You have 6 total abilities imp comes with 7, then you have none left after but retain all 7. Cordell kintner confirmed how I was interpreting things pretty succinctly.
Cordell Kintner wrote:
When you buy a specific familiar you get all the listed abilities. It doesn't matter how many the specific familiar has, what matters is how many abilities it costs. Also, the feat lowers the cost of specific familiars, so 8-2=6, which is the exact amount of abilities you have, so you can get an Imp with all the listed abilities.
It looks like my initial interpretation is correct. Even though the pc(in the circumstance I used) has 6 abilities, improved familiar would allow them to gain an imp that would retain all 7 granted abilities.
Why it was decided to muddy things up on a straight forward system I can't say. The only thing I can think of is limiting the versatility for people with specific familiars. If improved just granted 2 abilities instead of reducing cost, imps would have 1 free ability for the pc to pick.
Just double checking, in case I missed it. In the case of a familiar master (base class doesn't grant a familiar)
2)familiar master dedication
Gain familiar with 2 abilities
4) enhanced familiar
Familiar goes up to 4 abilities
6) improved familiar
Lowers specific familiar cost by 2
10)incredible familiar
Familiar abilities go up to 6
At 10 you could then qualify for the imp. You are granted 6 abilities but qualify for 8.
Does the imp still get its 7 granted abilities + unique abilities? Or does one need to be dropped?
Imps granted abilities are
(1)darkvision, (2)flier, (3)manual dexterity, (4)resistance (fire and poison), (5)skilled (Deception), (6)speech, (7)touch telepathy
When you buy a specific familiar you get all the listed abilities. It doesn't matter how many the specific familiar has, what matters is how many abilities it costs. Also, the feat lowers the cost of specific familiars, so 8-2=6, which is the exact amount of abilities you have, so you can get an Imp with all the listed abilities.
Cool! I was thrown off by how much you get. With 6 abilities you end up getting a familiar with 7+2 unique. That just bordered on too good to be true and the specific familiar section in apg talked about if you have more granted abilities than the specific familiar has but not if you have less like in this case with the imp.
Just double checking, in case I missed it. In the case of a familiar master (base class doesn't grant a familiar)
2)familiar master dedication
Gain familiar with 2 abilities
4) enhanced familiar
Familiar goes up to 4 abilities
6) improved familiar
Lowers specific familiar cost by 2
10)incredible familiar
Familiar abilities go up to 6
At 10 you could then qualify for the imp. You are granted 6 abilities but qualify for 8.
Does the imp still get its 7 granted abilities + unique abilities? Or does one need to be dropped?
Imps granted abilities are
(1)darkvision, (2)flier, (3)manual dexterity, (4)resistance (fire and poison), (5)skilled (Deception), (6)speech, (7)touch telepathy
I hope so, that would be awesome. They have to have their own legendary heros that saved the world from threats long before earthfall and dwarves quest for sky (maybe thats what Erux is?). What about villians? We hear so much about humans becoming these godlike lichs, but humans are a super young ancestry, others had to have done so. Part of the reason Vordakai is so cool is because of the "lich of a lost empire" aspect.
I've been curious about the relationship between Lizardfolk and Pharasma. Its been very exciting to see that Lizardfolk and their culture has been greatly expanded on with the Lost omens Character Guide and Ancestry Guide, the latter introducing heritage feats like Bone Magic(45) and Consult the Stars(46) and the side bars about Droon and the origin of the name Iruxi
Iruxi:
While most lizardfolk permit humans
and others to refer to them by that
moniker, they call themselves iruxi.
This ancient word arose from the
Draconic tongue, though its exact
etymology is unclear. In Droon, iruxi
astronomers point to the jagged
constellation of the Maw and the
starry figure who stands against it.
Today, while this constellation is called
the Lone Mother and features in fables
about environmental conservation, she
once had another name in dragon lore:
Erux, meaning “defiance.”
What caught my attention was this side passage on page 47, specifically what is bolded.
Iruxi Ancestors
Ancestor worship is central to
iruxi spiritual life. Lizardfolk keep
their elders’ physical remains
close, incorporating them into the
architecture of their settlements.
The bones of deceased iruxi shore up
protective walls and fill great vaulting
ossuaries. Preserved and suffused
with ritual veneration, these bones
become magical reservoirs of power.
It’s rumored that in times of great need,
iruxi ancestors will reanimate their
bones and fight for their descendants.
Pharasma was the first of the gods, and the Iruxi are one of the most ancient peoples on Golarion, predating the Azlanti making them as old or possibly older than even the cyclopean empires, but so far I haven't been able to come across any interaction or lizardfolk followers of her. What is their relationship with the goddess? How would an Iruxi cleric or champion of Pharasma react to ancestors reanimating their bones to defend their descendants? would it be anathema for a Pharasmin lizardfolk to ask an ancestor to reanimate? Also, has that "unspecified betrayal" by the elves brought up in classic monsters' revisited been revealed?
I do see how Gozreh would take the spot as most widely venerated by the Iruxi but I'm very surprised at lack of/ nonexistent engagement that they have with The Lady of Graves. The cultural identity of the Iruxi has only just started be be fleshed out but I would love to hear any additional information or insights others have to contribute. Originally posted this to Advice but here seems like a better fit.
Cool short story on Pharasma
https://paizo.com/community/blog/v5748dyo6sgzu?The-Windsong-Testaments-The- Three-Fears-of
I've been curious about the relationship between Lizardfolk and Pharasma. Its been very exciting to see that Lizardfolk and their culture has been greatly expanded on with the Lost omens Character Guide and Ancestry Guide, the latter introducing heritage feats like Bone Magic(45) and Consult the Stars(46) and the side bars about Droon and the origin of the name Iruxi
Iruxi:
While most lizardfolk permit humans
and others to refer to them by that
moniker, they call themselves iruxi.
This ancient word arose from the
Draconic tongue, though its exact
etymology is unclear. In Droon, iruxi
astronomers point to the jagged
constellation of the Maw and the
starry figure who stands against it.
Today, while this constellation is called
the Lone Mother and features in fables
about environmental conservation, she
once had another name in dragon lore:
Erux, meaning “defiance.”
What caught my attention was this side passage on page 47, specifically what is bolded.
Iruxi Ancestors
Ancestor worship is central to
iruxi spiritual life. Lizardfolk keep
their elders’ physical remains
close, incorporating them into the
architecture of their settlements.
The bones of deceased iruxi shore up
protective walls and fill great vaulting
ossuaries. Preserved and suffused
with ritual veneration, these bones
become magical reservoirs of power.
It’s rumored that in times of great need,
iruxi ancestors will reanimate their
bones and fight for their descendants.
Pharasma was the first of the gods, and the Iruxi are one of the most ancient peoples on Golarion, predating the Azlanti making them as old or possibly older than even the cyclopean empires, but so far I haven't been able to come across any interaction or lizardfolk followers of her. What is their relationship with the goddess? How would an Iruxi cleric or champion of Pharasma react to ancestors reanimating their bones to defend their descendants? would it be anathema for a Pharasmin lizardfolk to ask an ancestor to reanimate? Also, has that "unspecified betrayal" by the elves brought up in classic monsters' revisited been revealed?
I do see how Gozreh would take the spot as most widely venerated by the Iruxi but I'm very surprised at lack of/ nonexistent engagement that they have with The Lady of Graves. The cultural identity of the Iruxi has only just started be be fleshed out but I would love to hear any additional information or insights others have to contribute.
Cool short story on Pharasma
https://paizo.com/community/blog/v5748dyo6sgzu?The-Windsong-Testaments-The- Three-Fears-of
you're not following my point: by the stated reading of intent you agreed with, they'd be 100% justified in thinking creatures are perfectly fine and NOT "clearly violating rules". I think it'd be unfair to point at a player and say they where being disruptive when they wouldn't be the ones to open that door: once you're fine violating intent in any ways, it's hard to quibble over which violation is too far.
I think you misunderstood my initial post. I agreed that soup is a liquid and ingredients for soup, fit the "ingredients for potions and other liquids".
I also brought up a separate point that someone could claim that soup can be made of people, specifically a goblin in my example. That i brought up was a possible example of abuse, or what I wouldn't fault a gm for disallowing, but that I, personally, may allow it at my table because its funny and not game breaking (no gear though, just the gob and some water or pickle juice). Both of which are my opinion. If you would find it hard to discern what "violatin" is to far thats on you. I haven't had issues there at my tables.
graystone wrote:
It would be a notable advantage to a familiar that starts with swim Speed as there is NO current way for them to gain a land speed: a little bit of water and your goldfish is good to go and as a bonus, it'd have cover and/or blocks line of sight/effect. Even better it's only a single action to keep it following you, unlike a familiar that requires every round attention.
If thats the best "advantage" you can come up with, we are fine. Since specific supercedes general, this specific item states "its ungainly movements are too imprecise to predictably direct in a combat encounter or other situation where seconds and precise locations count." Even though this doesn't explicitly mention cover or los, this sounds like its ungainly movements are enough to negate any cover or los one could gain be being in a cauldron.
I guess I'm a very benevolent gm, because I would allow a degree of cover to the poor sap who chose Nemo as their familier. But I would have a bandit run up, grab the cauldro, dump its contents, and try to run off with it. The disadvantages of picking a water bound familer don't even break even with this item. Just spend 5g for the famlier satchel instead of 12g on this.
Soup is a liquid.
Therefore, things that are ingredients for soup are "Ingredients for other Liquids"
Therefore, mise en place for making soups or stews (a category of soups) should be fine.
I 100% agree with you here, but this opens up some room for a shenanigans. Like for a cannibalistic goblin to possibly use it as a vehicle. As long as they fit the 2 bulk rule.
I personally would think that entertaining as hell and allow it as long as they arent trying to turn it into a pack mule.
I'd 100% disagree as you can use the exact same argument to let familiars and other creatures ride in it. Creatures have blood so they are an ingredient of blood soup [it's a real thing].
Honestly, if you start down this road, there are really very few things that you can't use as an ingredient for a liquid: I mean, iron ore or iron bars are an ingredient in molten iron after all and things like wood can be turned into charcoal and added to drinks [said to absorb toxins]: the limitations ends up having no meaning.
K, then don't do it at your games. As long as players arnt being disruptive or clearly violating rules as intended, I see no need to be a tyrant about it.
Its not like throwing some onions in it or even letting a small creature ride in it would give any kind of advantage. It would be garbage for travel time and "its ungainly movements are too imprecise to predictably direct in a combat encounter or other situation where seconds and precise locations count" would be more likely to make it a liability to players as a vehicle. Be a funny liability though.
Soup is a liquid.
Therefore, things that are ingredients for soup are "Ingredients for other Liquids"
Therefore, mise en place for making soups or stews (a category of soups) should be fine.
I 100% agree with you here, but this opens up some room for a shenanigans. Like for a cannibalistic goblin to possibly use it as a vehicle. As long as they fit the 2 bulk rule.
I personally would think that entertaining as hell and allow it as long as they arent trying to turn it into a pack mule.
