Maghara

K-kun the Insane's page

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6 years, 3 months, and 8 days ago, I played my first game of Pathfinder. It was a special adventure for Pathfinder Society called Master of the Fallen Fortress. I played a Draconic Sorcerer with more DEX than CHA and ran headlong into battle wearing no armor with only a 10 CON. 3 years, 7 months, and 9 days later, the character was officially retired from PFS upon reaching 12th Level. (Sorcerer4/Fighter1/DragonDisciple7) During that time, I learned so much about Pathfinder and TTRPGs in general, that I doubt that a lot of decisions I made for him back then would be made by me now. (He had no less than 5 deaths during his career) Or maybe I would, I seem to have a knack for killing my own characters...

I became quite invested in the character and even developed quite the head-canon for him despite the disjointed nature PFS play brings to character development. One of my characters became his wife (Fighter7/Brawler2), and I eventually made a time-travelling daughter from the future (Bloodrager2/Monk6). I've become very attached to these characters. I intend to dust off his character sheet and bring it to the Grand Convocation my lodge is holding during the last weekend in August and play him in the final special of Pathfinder 1E.

With all that out of the way, let's get to the meat of this thread. I intend to bring these 3 characters over into Pathfinder 2E. For the most part, I have things figured. He will be a Sorcerer again, though with some Rogue MC to express his nimbleness and his love of skills. His wife will be a Fighter, though I don't know if MC Monk fits since she only ever had 2 levels of Brawler in 1E. The daughter, though is more interesting...and more of an issue.

This past week, she reached level 8 in 1E, taking her second level of Bloodrager, becoming Bloodrager2/Monk6. The key thing there is that her very first level was as a Bloodrager. She's spent 6 levels in another class before returning to her favored class. And I've had a blast playing her this way. It fit with my concept of someone with vast draconic power that she tried to control with discipline. (Her archetypes are Urban Bloodrager, Hungry Ghost Monk, Qinggong Monk, and Scaled Fist Monk) She was created and planned out to 12th level to be Bloodrager6/Monk6.

Recreating her in 2E has lead me to realize that now there's a difference between the order of classes. A Barbarian/Monk is quite different from a Monk/Barbarian. My purpose for this topic is to glean some advice on whether I should make her a Barbarian/Monk/Sorcerer or a Monk/Barbarian/Sorcerer.

The former gives her all of the Draconic Instinct abilites from Barbaian, both Dragon Style feats from the Monk, and even all Bloodline Focus spells from Sorcerer by 20th level. She'd be stuck with only a couple Cantrips as far as actual spellcasting goes, but 2E cantrips are much better than in 1E. This aligns well with her concept of using a Monk's discipline to keep her wild tendencies in check.

The latter gives better unarmed and unarmored proficiencies and improves Unarmed strikes and movement a great deal, but she loses access to the specialization and resistance powers from Draconic Instinct. It also aligns more with what I've played her in 1E: She uses a Bardiche, sure, but most of her class levels are monk and she does quite well with her kicks.

TL;DR What works better in 2E (both mechanically and thematically) to capture the concept of someone who uses both a polearm and her feet in combat while struggling to maintain control of the wild draconic power within her?

Barbarian/Monk/Sorcerer -OR- Monk/Barbarian/Sorcerer?


Gisher wrote:
Partizanski wrote:
ikarinokami wrote:
its in the sidebar, which is part of the rulebook. monks use wisdom
What page? I have looked up and down the monk chapter and not have not been able to find this.
I don't see it, either.

Page 162. It's kinda a hot-button-issue on these forums at the moment, but the Sample monk on this page says "...Wisdom empowers your Ki Spells..."

Apparently this is something that's supposed to be in there explicitly, but was somehow forgotten during the editing process.


Blave wrote:

Agreed. I didn't expect the spell chapter to have a different/more precise description for bardic spellcasting than the actual class description. My bad.

Playing an instrument does indeed count as Focus Component so you can furiously play your fiddle to cast spells in the middle of combat, I guess.

While at first, I imagined Devil Went Down to Georgia being played furiously, I couldn't help but remember this video that perfectly shows some furious playing. And this one is just completely out of control. I don'y think there's a more perfect example of "Bardbarians" than these two.


Monks become trained in Divine/Occult Spell Attacks and Spell DCs when they select a Ki Spell.

I also wondered whether Wisdom or the Monk's Key Ability Score was used to calculate those in this thread here.

TL;DR

Wisdom is used to calculate Monk Spell attacks and spell DCs.


Well, you can't use anything with the concentrate trait. Spells themselves don't have that on their own, but they can get it via the spell components used to cast them.

Somatic components add the Manipulate trait. So do Material and Focus components. Verbal, however, adds the Concentrate trait, so spells without verbal components should be fine. How many spells require verbal?

EDIT: NINJA'D


Monks are able to get Ki spells, a kind of Focus Spell. If they do, the choose wether to be Divine or Occult and become trained in spell attacks and spell DCs for that magic tradition...But what ability is used for their spellcasting ability when calculating their spell attack modifier or spell dc?

Part of me wants to say WIS simply because Monks have traditionally required WIS for abilities.

Part of me wants to say CHA simply because CHA is often used for SLAs for innate magic.

PArt of me wants to say whichever was chosen as their Key ability score, simply to keep things simple. But how would that work, for say a Barbarian that multiclasses as Monk? What about if that Barb/Monk splices in some Sorc at higher levels?


*Bump*


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I think it makes little sense in those two cases, though. In Nidal, you have to worship Zon-Kuthon, it's the law. And they're very serious about the laws in Nidal. So a lot of people worship him even if they themselves aren't evil. It's the law afterall. As for Urgathoa, neutral worshippers are probably hard to find ever since the Whispering Tyrant reemerged. They were either scared off, or fully comitted.

As for Asmodeus...That one I don't get. The Hellknights were always a very lawful group who admired just how lawful Hell was run and tried to imitate it. They didn't care about good/evil/neutrality, they only cared about law and order. But now...


Not sure if this goes here, in Advice, or even General Discussion.

On the Character Sheet, page 2, the Inventory area is split into 3 main sections: Worn Items, Readied Items, and Other Items. I can't find any references to these in the CRB, so I ask you: What do these mean?

I'm finishing up my sheet for the character I wish to use during the 2E games at Convocation in my area near the end of the month. I'm around step 8 & 9 of the character creation, and have my items purchased and remaining Gold calculated. My weapons have been recorded in the Melee Strikes area on page 1, and I figure my other items go somewhere here.

For reference, it's a Dwarf Fighter who will multiclass Bard.
My items are:

Breastplate
Steel Shield
Pick
Battleaxe
Warhammer
Adventurer's Pack (Backpack, Bedroll, 2 Belt Pouches, 10 pieces of Chalk, Flint & Steel, 50ft Rope, 2 weeks Rations, Soap, 5 Torches, Waterskin)

This brings my Bulk to 8, just at my limits, so I can still move my 20ft speed unless I carry even L more Bulk. I'm thinking of Hefty Hauler for my 2nd level Skill Feat.

So, yeah, what counts as a Worn item? Armor and Shield? Backpack and Belt Pouches?
Are weapons Readied? What about Torches? Or are these all Other?


Eltacolibre wrote:
Lanathar wrote:
Doesn’t this literally only apply to clerics with regards to converting characters . Anyone other than clerics and champions can worship any deity they like

Of course, just like usual. The within one step rule even in 1e never applied to anybody but people getting divine powers.

Not so much. On page 437 of the 2E CRB, it says:

"Each deity below has their alignment listed in parentheses after their name, followed by a short description of their edicts, anathemas, and the alignments permitted for followers. Following that are benefits available to the most ardent devotees of the deities. You get these benefits only if you're a cleric of the deity or if some other rule specifically gives you a devotee benefit."

This says that the only characters of those alignments are followers of those deities.

The Player Basics – Pathfinder Society (2nd edition) document has the following section for Religion:

"Characters can worship any deity listed in the table of gods on page 437 of the Core Rulebook or any other source listed in Character Options , so long as their alignment matches one of the deity’s listed follower alignments. Champions and clerics must choose a valid deity, though other classes can worship one of the faiths and philosophies presented on page 440 of Core Rulebook or another legal source. Characters can also be agnostic or atheist.

Some characters may revere deities they do not worship. Revering a deity means that your character may do things like wearing the deity’s holy symbol, attending the deity’s religious services, or performing other acts of obeisance that aren’t rewarded with spells or divine powers. For example, many druids revere Gozreh a deity of nature, but their primal magic is granted by Nature itself and does not come from Gozreh. A character may revere as many deities as they wish, but can worship and receive power from only one."

Granted, this is for PFS, but we can infer a similar attitude for Golarion as a whole.

One way to get a similar character from 1E who was a neutral cleric of an evil deity no longer available to neutral characters is 2E, is to choose a Divine Sorcerer bloodline and simply revere said deity. Diabolic for Asmodeus, Demonic for Lamashtu, Undead for Urgathoa, etc. Admitedly, it becomes more difficult to select one for a diety like Gorum, since he's neither diabolic, demonic, nor undead. Angelic is the other divine bloodline, but...he's no angel. He may live in Elysium, but he certainly isn't of it.
The biggest problem I've found with this method, is that there're many divine spells that mention "your deity" and that you can't cast these spells if you don't worship a deity. And remember, revere does not equal worship.


Not sure if this goes here, in Rules, or even General Discussion.

On the Character Sheet, page 2, the Inventory area is split into 3 main sections: Worn Items, Readied Items, and Other Items. I can't find any references to these in the CRB, so I ask you: What do these mean?

I'm finishing up my sheet for the character I wish to use during the 2E games at Convocation in my area near the end of the month. I'm around step 8 & 9 of the character creation, and have my items purchased and remaining Gold calculated. My weapons have been recorded in the Melee Strikes area on page 1, and I figure my other items go somewhere here.

For reference, it's a Dwarf Fighter who will multiclass Bard.
My items are:

Breastplate
Steel Shield
Pick
Battleaxe
Warhammer
Adventurer's Pack (Backpack, Bedroll, 2 Belt Pouches, 10 pieces of Chalk, Flint & Steel, 50ft Rope, 2 weeks Rations, Soap, 5 Torches, Waterskin)

This brings my Bulk to 8, just at my limits, so I can still move my 20ft speed unless I carry even L more Bulk. I'm thinking of Hefty Hauler for my 2nd level Skill Feat.

So, yeah, what counts as a Worn item? Armor and Shield? Backpack and Belt Pouches?
Are weapons Readied? What about Torches? Or are these all Other?


Have you ever been hit by a rock? That sucker is gonna leave a bruise that stings for days!


I've loved the Draconic Bloodline since I bought the PHB for 3.5 (but didn't have anyone to play with).

My first character in Pathfinder was Sorcerer/Fighter/Gold Dragon Disciple

In the Kingmaker game by Owlcat, my primary save is a Slayer/Sorcerer/Black Dragon Disciple.

In PF2E, I will make a Draconic Sorc at some point. I still love the abilities and spells it has access to.

But now I'm really looking at the Undead Bloodline. able to heal/harm with the Harm spell is nice, and I just love the idea of slamming my palm on the ground and using Grasping Grave. My only issue is that a lot of Divine spells are diety specific. If my character doesn't worship a diety, these spells can't be taken.

And in PFS2E you can revere a diety without worshiping them, but this means you gain no spells from them. Divine Sorcerers are the closest we can get to clerics of evil dieties who can no longer be worshiped by neutral characters, but we can't take spells like Spiritual Weapon because those require you to have a paton diety.

Multiclassing as a Divine Sorc without a diety is even worse, as not only can you not take such spells, but you don't get signature spells to heighten, so if you want to harm/heal, you have to know the spell at each level, and you only get a couple known spells per level.

/offtopic rant

So, yeah, I like Draconic and Undead. I want to like Imperial, the only other Arcane bloodline, but I really wish it got Silent Spell.


andreww wrote:
He is which I have always found more than a little bizarre. But then I find clerics of Urgathoa a weird inclusion as well.

To be fair, she was a Cleric of Pharasma (even had a birthmark of Pharasma's holy symbol on her forehead) until I realized that that wouldn't jive with my intention of bringing back Mommy via the Shadowdancer's Summon Shadow ability.

So after she died and was raised, she found that the afterlife wasn't at all like she thought and went through a crisis of faith before being taken in by Urgathoa, who actually encouraged Serenity to bring her mother back as an undead shade` who will always be with her. Serenity seemed to cast two shadows on the ground wherever she went from then on.

Hm, actually, now that I think about it, I think that one of the players I often played in the same core games with Serenity alternated between a scorched earth druid and a Cleric of Lamashtu.


The other thing to keep in mind when multiclassing and grabbing class feats from your multiclass is you'll never be able to get higher than 10th level feats unless your campaign goes beyond 20th level.

I'm running into that conundrum in deciding if I want my main class to be Undead Sorcerer so that I can get Grasping Grave at 10th level or Fighter to be able to grab Spring Attack/Whirlwind Strike at all but push Grasping Grave back to 20th level.


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Hilary Moon Murphy wrote:

The religion chapter of the 2E core rulebook defines what alignments PF2 gods accept in their followers, and there were some surprises there for me.

Abadar -- Only lawful alignments, which makes sense, given how that deity interacts with the world. I like this change, since I don't think Abadar is impressed with neutral people.

Asmodeus -- Lawful Evil only. This was my biggest surprise. No more lawful neutral Asmodean Advocates in PFS for now. (I'll miss them, because they were always interesting to have at the table. Barristers, go apply to Abadar and Torag!)

Lamashtu -- Chaotic Evil only. No more mother of monster midwives in society, folks. Take your midwives and go apply to Pharasma.

Norgorber -- You want an evil god in Society? This is one of your two options. He accepts N followers in his Reaper of Reputation aspect.

Urgathoa -- The Pallid Princess only accepts evil followers now.

Zon-Kuthon -- The other evil god still legal in Society play, provided you are Lawful Neutral.

I was honestly heartbroken by Urgathoa's shift to pure evil as my favorite 1st ed character is a Cleric of Urgathoa (Fighter/Cleric/Shadowdancer/Barbarian) and is a Core Campaign character. I had wanted to recreate her in 2E, but with Urgathoa no longer accepting Neutral followers and a lack of Shadowdancer, I'm looking to retire her by switching to Standard Campaign and taking part in the final Special.That said, mere moments before noticing your thread, I think I found a possible way...

Pathfinder Society (2nd edition) Player Basics wrote:

Characters can worship any deity listed in the table of gods on page 437 of the Core Rulebook or any other source listed in Character Options , so long as their alignment matches one of the deity’s listed follower alignments. Champions and clerics must choose a valid deity, though other classes can worship one of the faiths and philosophies presented on page 440 of Core Rulebook or another legal source. Characters can also be agnostic or atheist.

Some characters may revere deities they do not worship. Revering a deity means that your character may do things like wearing the deity’s holy symbol, attending the deity’s religious services, or performing other acts of obeisance that aren’t rewarded with spells or divine powers. For example, many druids revere Gozreh a deity of nature, but their primal magic is granted by Nature itself and does not come from Gozreh. A character may revere as many deities as they wish, but can worship and receive power from only one.

While Serenity couldn't be a Cleric of Urgathoa, or even a follower of Urgathoa, she could still revere her or be an adherent of The Whispering Way. A neutral Undead-bloodline Sorcerer multiclassing as a Rogue (or vice-versa, though that means no Greater bloodline spell until 20th level) while revering (but not worshiping) Urgathoa might be doable. She'd have to switch from Scythe to Elven Curve Blade if she wants to deal sneak attack, though. Or, I suppose Barbarian with the Spirit Instinct multiclassed as a Sorcerer would work with her general attitude and the whole "summoning her own mother as a Shadow and losing it whenever someone hurts it" thing. I'll have to think long and hard on this...


So for the longest time, I've had an idea for a Bard and when the announcement for 2ed came, I decided that my first character would be this Bard. Now that I have the CRB, it seems like I can rather easily do what I want, but one new thing seems iffy, so I figured I'd ask about it. IT's no big deal if it doesn't work, but it would be interesting.

My Dwarven Bard (gasp, a Charisma flaw!) will be a sword (or more precisely, as pick) and board combatant who sings his songs to inspire his allies, thumping his weapon into his shield like a drum. For the most part, casting is fairly simple, since Somantic components can now be done while holding something in hand. But Bards are able to substitute Somantic components with playing an instrument. Can I beat on my shield for this, or will I have to rely on waving my pick and shield around while casting?


Meirril wrote:

You know, all of that would work...if there wasn't a hard limit to the number of undead you can control.

Uncontrolled undead naturally attack the living. What is unnatural is when they don't. Why are necromancers 'evil'? The same reason Demonologists are considered evil, because their chosen subject matter is dealing with and exploiting evil creatures.

Is every necromancer evil? Well, no. Much like dragons not every single one strictly follows the general mold. After all, they aren't Paladins, or even barbarians. They are spell casters that have access to certain spells and use them.

If you keep pushing further and further into the field of necromancy you will eventually become evil. Once you start creating and controlling intelligent undead they will eventually start preying on the living. Control spells only act like a charm, not like dominate. Eventually some poor sap wanders into the wrong place and gets made into a snack. And its very difficult to react in a way that doesn't make your character more evil than he was before this happened.

Also you're keeping the company of evil creatures. Creatures that want to destroy the living. That have twisted and extreme emotions. Obsessions that fuel their undead existence. How do you stay clean in the evil environment you are creating?

It isn't impossible to be good, or neutral. Just, difficult. Difficult to the point of being unbelievable.

And hanging out with kindly old Chancellors will make you kill a bunch of children...


Do the whole Priest of Rathma thing and explain that they are a necessary tool in maintaining The Balance. Seriously, the Diablo 2 Necromancer was the first class I played for a reason, and it went on to be my most used/powerful/favorite one to play. I'm really disappointed that I don't have the space on my Tablet to download D3 and try out the Necro there. (I have it RoS on 360, but there's no Necro ToT)

And I'm REALLY disappointed that so many people think "Oh, you're a Necromancer, aren't you? You're EVIL, die!" Next thing you'll tell me is that Red and Black Dragons are both evil as well!


Keep in mind that after OoT, Ganon had practically gone from being a Human Fighter/Sorcerer/Eldritch Knight to being a Demon Fighter/Sorcerer/Eldritch Knight.

Oracle of Ages/Seasons has link fight through over 14 dungeons, each with a miniboss and a boss, take on a Dragon Fighter and a Fairy Sorceress before battling a pair of witches who are in fact the split personalities of an even more powerful witch. And after all of that, he still must take on the demon king, though granted, the demon is just a mindless raging monster due to a botched ritual.

Depending on which game and version of Link/Ganon(dorf), Ganon could very well be CR20.


Jeff Morse wrote:
if you create darkness, how will this effect the rest of the party? I have seen this tried and fail because no one else can see.

It requires tactical thinking and perfect timing. Two examples I've personally done:

Core Fighter/Cleric/Shadowdancer/Barbarian casts Darkness on one end of the room, engulphing one enemy creature, and dives in alone to hold it off while her Shadow and the rest of the party deal with the other enemy. Once that's done, she would have led the thing back out so that her party could finish it off. Unfortunately, she forgot that the room was pitch black inside before the party brought their light with them...the enemy also had darkvision, and so she died cold and alone in the dark.

On a better note, a party member was on a stair landing with an enemy who had concealment from them while they had no such luck. Because of the way the stairs were set up, no one else could get in there to help him and were forced to shoot into melee with a creature with concealment. Not going well. Then it dawns on someone to return the favor and the Pregen I was playing at the time, Harsk, had just the right item for the job: A Smokestick. Toss it onto the landing. Sure the party member is blinded by the smoke, but that's no different than what he had before. But now the enemy can't fully see him either, so they both had concealment from each other. It was a very long fight on that staircase, but we emerged victorious partially because of Harsk's timely Smokestick.

Temperans wrote:
Well if the party hasn't made counter measures for darkness by the time its lv10 I see a lot of problems happening; and it's not just from the Shadowdancer.

The problem with most of those countermeasures is that they COUNTER the Darkness, making it a waste to have even put it up in the first place.


Secret Wizard wrote:
Is the Gloomblade Fighter part negotiable? It's not really pulling a lot of weight here. I feel like you'd get much more mileage from other archetypes or classes.

Admittedly this is still very much a work in progress, but yes, I wish to play a Vishkanya Gloomblade. I'll also admit that Shadowdancer is more for flavour than anything. They can already create weapons out of Shadowstuff, now they can create (un)life.

Perhaps pure Gloomblade would be better...I have a difficult time staying pure, I love multiclassing.

The character themselves will almost never be serious. They're going on these ridiculous missions and putting themselves in harm's way for the lolz. Pulling a sword out of their pocket or, if female (I haven't decided yet), a halberd from their bosom is all part of the fun.


So, I'm thinking something like this, going for Scrolls/Oils/Wands of Darkness/Deeper Darkness. The character basically dances around the battlefield being as much of a pain-in-the-ass as possible with darkness, poison, and a shadow companion.

Shadow Weapon means I don't have to carry anything too cumbersome except if I choose to forgo Shuriken for a better Ranged Attack. It also lets me change from Bludgeoning to Slashing, to Reach, to Piercing, etc. whenever I need to. It also frees up a bunch of Gold to go elsewhere. The main downside is that it's always a Move Action to make them.

I do realize my Will Save is terrible, so not only will I need to invest in a Cloak of Resistance early, but I may swap out Improved Initiative for Iron Will.

Vishkanya Gloomblade (Fighter)/Shadowdancer

Poison Resistance
Keen Senses Sensual
Limber Deceptive (If I'm reading this correctly, I keep Stealth)
Low-Light Vision
Poison Use
Toxic
Weapon Familiarity

Reactionary (Combat)
Dangerously Curious (Magic)

STR/14
DEX/16 (14+2)
CON/14
INT/14
WIS/6 (8-2)
CHA/14 (12+2)

1st: Fighter1 - Shadow Weapon, Power Attack, Weapon Finesse
2nd: Fighter2 - Bravery+1, Combat Reflexes
3rd: Fighter3 - +1 Shadow Weapon, Sleep Venom
4th: Fighter4 - Dodge, +1CON
5th: Fighter5 - Shadow Weapon Training+1, Mobility
6th: Shadowdancer1 - Hide In Plain Sight
7th: Shadowdancer2 - Evasion, Darkvision, Uncanny Dodge, Blind-Fight
8th: Shadowdancer3 - Assault Leader Talent, Shadow Illusion, Summon Shadow, +1CON
9th: Fighter6 - +2 Shadow Weapon, Bravery+2, Improved Initiative, Two-Weapon Fighting
10th: Fighter7 - Dual Shadow Weapons/Special Abilities
11th: Shadowdancer4 - Shadow Call, Shadow Jump 40ft, Extra Rogue Talent (Cloying Shades)


After waffling back and forth on how to use a recent Race boon, I've finally settled on a Vishkanya Gloomblade (Fighter) / Shadowdancer. Aside from being an unusual style of Fighter, Stealth is highly emphasized, but the way I see it, that's more of an out of combat thing unless you have Sneak Attack.

So from my original plan of 7 levels of fighter and 4 levels of Shadowdancer, is it worth it to dip 1 level in Unchained Rogue to pick up Sneak Attack (and perhaps grab Accomplished Sneak Attack at some point)?


Ferious Thune wrote:
The boon does not give you XP. You get to check off boxes on the boon based on whether or not you earned XP by playing each of the scenarios from those seasons, and depending on how many you have checked off, you get another benefit that is much smaller than a free 30XP.

Okay, that seems a bit more in line with previous boons I've recieved.

RetroCon III (2019) Boon #6 wrote:
Check the box below for each of the Pathfinder Society scenarios below that you have played with any character or run as a GM, earning 1 XP in the process. If you have checked at least 10 scenarios, the character which this boon is assigned gains the basic boon reward associated with that season. If you have checked at least 20 scenarios, they also gain the elite boon reward.

The way it's worded and punctuated, it seemed like in the process of checking boxes you earn 1 XP.


So at my last Con, I won a boon chronicle that let's me give the character I apply it to 1xp per scenario that I've played/run from seasons 4 & 5 during my career. I thought this would let me start a character around level 5 or 6, but as it turns out, I have a total of 30xp available from this boon, enough for level 11. PFS typically retires once reaching level 12. What's more, re-reading the boon, it makes no mention of gold, so this 11th level character would only have 150gp to spend on equipment.

Thus, I'm going to save the character I'd originally planned to use this on and just play them from 1. That still leaves the question of what to do with this boon?

Should I apply it to a 10th level character to boost them to 20 and not worry about it? Or should I create a new character and just wing it?

And if I do the latter, any suggestions?


Temperans wrote:

If I remember correctly from the old thread on the Gloomblade, Advance Weapon Training (AWT) feat does not function for any AWT that uses a specific weapon group.

You can definetly get things like Abundant Tactics, Trained Grace, Armed Bravery, etc.

******************
The problem is that Shadow Weapon Training does not create a Shadow Weapon group. So all the weapons keep their regular group.

Okay. That's too bad, it would have been nice, but luckily for once it's not a deal breaker for me. I was already looking at a stat spread of 14/16/14/14/6/14 after racials, and would have liked to reallocate some STR to DEX/WIS, but this'll be fine.


Shadow Weapon (Su):

A gloomblade can create a shadowy weapon in a free hand as a move action. This can take the form of any melee weapon with which he is proficient. A gloomblade can have only one shadow weapon in existence at a time; creating a new shadow weapon causes an existing shadow weapon to vanish.

At 3rd level, the shadow weapon acts as a magic weapon with a +1 enhancement bonus; this bonus increases by 1 for every 4 levels a gloomblade has beyond 2nd, to a maximum enhancement bonus of +5 at 18th level.

At 7th level, a gloomblade can create (and maintain) two shadow weapons at a time as a move action; if he does, each weapon has an enhancement bonus 1 lower than normal. If a gloomblade creates only one weapon, it gains a weapon special ability of his choice (chosen upon creation); the ability must be valid for the shadow weapon’s weapon type and must be chosen from defending, flaming, frost, keen, ghost touch, merciful, shock, thundering, or vicious. (Additional special abilities might qualify, at the GM’s discretion.)

At 11th level, a gloomblade’s shadow weapons each gain their full enhancement bonus if he creates two weapons. If a gloomblade creates only one shadow weapon, it gains additional weapon special abilities; the total effective bonus of these abilities cannot exceed +3. The gloomblade can now choose from the of anarchic, axiomatic, flaming burst, icy burst, holy, shocking burst, unholy, and wounding weapon special abilities as well as those from the list above.

At 15th level, a gloomblade’s shadow weapons each gain magic weapon special abilities with a total effective bonus of +2 per weapon. If a gloomblade creates only one shadow weapon, its magic weapon special abilities cannot exceed a total effective bonus of +5. The gloomblade adds brilliant energy, dancing, and speed to the options he can choose as weapon special abilities for his shadow weapon.

This replaces the fighter’s armor training and proficiency with heavy armor and shields (he retains proficiency in light and medium armor).

Shadow Weapon Training (Ex):

At 5th level, a gloomblade gains weapon training, except that he does not select a weapon group; instead, the bonus applies to the shadow weapons he creates. A gloomblade does not select additional weapon groups as he gains levels.

At 9th level, whenever a gloomblade creates one or more shadow weapons, he can apply any one of the following shadow effects (chosen upon creation) to one of them.

During the gloomblade’s turn, he can increase his reach with that weapon by 5 feet.
The gloomblade can increase a thrown shadow weapon’s range increment (if any) by 20 feet.
When he hits a foe with a melee attack with the weapon, he can use it to perform a reposition combat maneuver against the creature hit as a swift action. This does not provoke attacks of opportunity.
Attacks made with the weapon ignore hardness equal to or less than the gloomblade’s fighter level.
For every 4 levels he has beyond 9th, a gloomblade can apply an additional effect to his shadow weapons, to a maximum of three effects at 17th level; these effects can be split between multiple shadow weapons as a gloomblade desires, but they don’t stack with themselves.

This alters weapon training.

Advanced Weapon Training (Combat):

You are specially trained to use your weapon skills in new ways.

Prerequisite(s): Fighter level 5th, weapon training class feature.

Benefit(s): Select one advanced weapon training option, applying it to one fighter weapon group you have already selected with the weapon training class feature.

Special: This feat can be taken more than once, but at most once per 5 fighter levels.

Special: Fighters that have the weapon master archetype can select this feat beginning at 4th level. The benefits of a weapon master’s advanced weapon training options apply only to his selected weapon rather than all weapons in the same fighter weapon group, and he can’t select the weapon specialist advanced weapon training option. A weapon master can select this feat as a bonus feat; if he does so, it doesn’t count for the purpose of the requirement that it can be taken at most once per 5 fighter levels.

FAQ:

If an archetype replaces a class ability with a more specific version of that ability (or one that works similarly to the replaced ability), does the archetype’s ability count as the original ability for the purpose of rules that improve the original ability?

It depends on how the archetype’s ability is worded. If the archetype ability says it works like the standard ability, it counts as that ability. If the archetype’s ability requires you to make a specific choice for the standard ability, it counts as that ability. Otherwise, the archetype ability doesn’t count as the standard ability. (It doesn’t matter if the archetype’s ability name is different than the standard class ability it is replacing; it is the description and game mechanics of the archetype ability that matter.)

Example: The dragoon (fighter) archetype (Ultimate Combat) has an ability called “spear training,” which requires the dragoon to select “spears” as his weapon training group, and refers to his weapon training bonus (even though this bonus follows a slightly different progression than standard weapon training). Therefore, this ability counts as weapon training for abilities that improve weapon training, such as gloves of dueling (Advanced Player’s Guide), which increase the wearer’s weapon training bonus.

Example: The archer (fighter) archetype gets several abilities (such as “expert archer”) which replace weapon training and do not otherwise refer to the weapon training ability. Therefore, this ability does not count as weapon training for abilities that improve weapon training (such as gloves of dueling). This is the case even for the “expert archer,” ability which has a bonus that improves every 4 fighter levels, exactly like weapon training.

Fighter’s Finesse (Ex):
The fighter gains the benefits of the Weapon Finesse feat with all melee weapons that belong to the associated fighter weapon group (even if they cannot normally be used with Weapon Finesse). The fighter must have the Weapon Finesse feat before choosing this option.

I'm thinking of making a Gloomblade/Shadowdancer for Pathfinder Society, and was thinking of grabbing Fighter's Finesse so as to keep my DEX high and spread what would have gone to STR to other abilities.

The idea is that they dance about the battlefield with elegant movements, drifting in and out of sight, often with a different weapon in hand. At low levels, they'd create things like rapiers/daggers/light hammers, while at higher levels they'd create things like Earthbreakers, Battleaxes, and Spears.

From what I've been able to research, it seems it should work, but the topics tend to be about Advanced Weapon Training in general and folks are divided, so I figured I'd just ask about the only one I actually care about. (Okay, not true, I'd love to toss Effortless Dual-wielding on as well, but the character likely won't reach high enough Fighter levels to get a second AWT.)


I woke up to this...

I'd also agree that it's a Dirty Trick Maneuver.

I'm thinking that maybe this would be better in the Rules board...Right next to the Succubus in a Grapple.


Magda Luckbender wrote:
Dave Justus wrote:

Pike and Shot was of course some pikemen and some firearm wielders, not a switch hitter. Historical pikes of course are not even a weapon in Pathfinder, usually being 15-20 feet long. They are utterly unsuitable for a single person vs. another single person (or even a small team like an adventuring group) and only effective as a formation weapon.

Reach tactics as seen in Pathfinder are different. The idea of ranged attackers being protected by a line is similar of course, but the actual way that a reach weapon works is largely an artifact of the one turn at a time nature of the simulation, not a defensive wall standing shoulder to shoulder.

Every word Dave says above is true. I didn't explicitly say it, but I was making analogies. E.g. A single switch hitter is not the same as a unit of combined spearmen and gunslingers, even if they are functionally similar. Like Dave says, pikes aren't even a thing in Pathfinder, although longspears are. It's true that pikes are only useful in formation, not one on one.

The same is not true of spears! All else being equal, a spearman will typically dominate a swordsman. This is true both in real life and in Pathfinder. This because spears are better than swords [Youtube: Fight Camp]. This should surprise no one, as spears are Primary Battle Weapons while swords are typically sidearms and secondary weapons. I'm half joking, so please no one take me seriously and start a flame war. Truthfully, of course, it's all about context [Youtube].

Pathfinder developers probably [incorrectly] gave reach weapons an adjacent 'dead zone' for game balance reasons. Otherwise reach weapons would be superior across the board. The main disadvantage of the spear is that it's impractical to carry a spear while living your life. Developers wisely understood that most GMs are unlikely to enforce encumbrance, and probably won't...

As someone who prefers lances in games like Fire Emblem, I have to agree with you. Lances/Spear trump swords, but everyone imagines being a hero with a sword. (Got sucked into that fight camp video)

I once wanted to make a character who used shield and spear, but for some reason I forgot about the Shortspear and assumed it couldn't work in Pathfinder as Spears/Lances are two-handed weapons. The closest I got was my Paladin, Jehanne D'Light, using a Ranseur and swapping to Longsword in the off-hand when enemies got past her reach.

That dead zone is indeed unfortunate as someone who loves lances/polearms. My personal favorite weapon is actually a Guandao, primarily because of it's reach and appearance, but also because of a certain pointy-headed shaman.

The best way I've gotten around that problem are the Monk's Punishing Kick, and the Dragonkin having the Vanguard right next to him.


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Scott Wilhelm wrote:
Quote:
K-kun the Insane]Spontaneous caster that runs more martial

I hate to be a nudge, but if Inquisitor is something new, then isn't Solo Tactics something new?

If Tactics is the thing you want to go with, maybe you should go with Paladin. That's a good match for a Dwarf-loving Aphorite. Paladin is also a spontaneous spellcaster that is more martial than Cleric. You get the good weapons that you are hurting for in Inquisitor. You don't get Bane, but you do get Smite starting at level 1. The Holy Tactician Archetype gets Tactician at Level 3 same as your Inquisitor, but Paladin Tactician is better: Inquisitors only get to use Tactician with their Bonus Teamwork Feats. Holy Tacticians get to use it with any of their Teamwork Feats. The other thing about Paladin is that Paladins get to wear Heavy Armor, Inquisitors don't, and your character has a Dex of 10.

I have a Core Campaign character, whom I sadly don't get to play anymore since no one plays Core anymore, who played a lot like what I see typical of Inquisitors. She was all gung-ho about killing the enemies of Pharasma and by 5th level she was Cleric3/Fighter2 and she had (or was close to having, I don't recall) a blast Spring Attacking / Whirlwind Attacking everyone with her Scythe. She only buffed herself and was sometimes doing her own thing rather than helping the party. By 8th level she'd had a crisis of faith and converted to Urgathoa, using her newfound powers as a Shadowdancer3 to raise her mother as a Shadow. She was very touchy about anyone harming "Mommy" and when I last played her, she'd added 2 levels of Barbarian to actualize that rage.

Hm, I reminisced a bit there... My point being that Inquisitors seem very much solo sources of divine wrath. Something I've done before, and had a blast with, but at this point would feel like I'm just recreating a character outside of Core. Jaethal from Kingmaker doesn't do much to dismiss this idea either.

I decided on Tactician because I got the Aphorite boon during a Con where I played an Unchained Barbarian/Ranger (Sea Reaver, Pack Rager/Freebooter) who handed out Improved Disarm Partner while raging. True, it doesn't come up often (not at all during this con), but the idea that a Barbarian can be tactical leader during combat was something I hadn't thought of before I gained access to the archetype. Admittedly, his primary tactics are either disarming the enemy of their weapons, or using his Freebooter's Bane ability and shouting "Everyone, group up and hit it 'til it dies!"

I had tried a Cavalier a long time ago as a companion character when I was trying to get my brother to play PFS with me. While my character and his APGSummoner made it to level 2, he stopped playing before we reached 3rd and mine was such a mess of confused character sheets, that the only reason I have fond memories of him is the story of how his Greatsword became known as Contraband and because his horse is Amazing!

As for Paladins...I have a personal hatred of these that spans various media and interpretations. That said, I DO have one who I enjoy playing, but that has more to do with her being based on Jehanne D'Arc than anything inherent to Paladins. I have a personal love of Jehanne that spans various media and interpretations.

TL;DR...I wanted something that fits the Aphorite's abilities but didn't want to play the same solo combatants I've seen/played over and over. Combined with their ability to provide concealment when needed, Tactical Leader Inquisitor fit that need, though I'm not 100% sold on it. Also, I HATE Paladins.

Magda Luckbender wrote:

@Scott: You're describing historical Pike and Shot tactics, which dominated Earth battlefields for centuries. Pikes and spears were eventually replaced by the bayonet. Here's a video of this tactic in action, during the 1643 Battle of Rocroi. This is the historical era of Pathfinder. Notice how the Spanish Tercio (pike and shot unit) sees off a much larger cavalry formation that would have overrun and utterly crushed a unit lacking pikes. Horses are averse to taking AoOs and will not impale themselves on a sharp point. The pikes function like a mobile fortress. Notice how only melee opponents who also have reach (the opposing pike formation) can match them on even terms. There's even an example of a guy who makes his acrobatics check to avoid AoOs.

Unfortunately, this is very much a cooperative teamwork style of combat. It usually requires two or more characters plus decent movement discipline. The only way this approach works well solo is for spell casters or with thrown weapons. Alternately, as you say, one can invest multiple feats. Casters can release one hand from weapon (free action), cast a spell, then grip weapon again in both hands (free action) and continue to threaten at reach. No feats required. Archers generally can't do this.

I play in one party (2nd level) that includes both an archer and a gunslinger. They quickly learned to work with their pikeman. They always make a point of standing slightly behind and to the side of the guy with the longspear. As a result they are virtually immune to melee mooks, unless there are so many mooks that the longspear guy (with 3 AoOs) gets overwhelmed.

That was an interesting video. I was wondering why the calvalry would charge so close if they have guns of their own, but then they kinda look more like sawed-off shotguns. I was tempted to make this character a Swashbuckler based off that last scene, but then I remembered the DEX penalty. Also, I do have a character who works somewhat like this: She's currently Monk6/Bloodrager1 (Scaled Fist, Hungry Ghost, Qinggong/Urban) using a Bardiche for Reach and AoOs, with Punishing Kick to keep them there.

This is also how I play my Starfinder character in a campaign of Dead Suns. My Dragonkin Blitz Soldier2/Overlord Mystic1 has 10 DEX, so he attacks with his Pike from behind the Vanguard while protecting the Operative and Biohacker. A large-sized character with natural reach and a reach weapon...who can fly. We're on book 2 now, and I've traded my pike for a Dragonglaive. I look forward to being outside instead of those cramped corridors.

The boon that grants me the Aphorite also has 2 other races: Ratfolk and Vishkanya. I already have a Ratfolk (Cavalier/Gunslinger), but I don't have a Vishkanya. I always imagined Vishkanya would make an excellent Ninja with focus on poison and appearing human, but I actually have a Kitsune Ninja who focuses on poison and appearing human...I passed over the Vishkanya because I didn't want to recreate the same character under a different race, and I couldn't get past my preconceived notion of what Vishkanya character I would play.

I'm going to have to explore what's out there besides Rogue/Ninja for a Vishkanya...


Scott Wilhelm wrote:
K-kun the Insane wrote:
When I said you were wrong, it had nothing to do with your on-going argument about Broken Wing Gambit and being your own ally.

Fine. Thank you for clarifying that.

K-kun the Insane wrote:
It had everything to do with you saying I'm using Solo Tactics.

My mistake. I saw Inquisitor, and I thought Solo Tactics. I did not read what you wrote closely enough. My advice about Thunder and Fang still applies if you are thinking Hammer. If you are going for Attacks of Opportunity, I think you should go for a really big weapon. Since you are thinking lumberjack, I was thinking really big axe, Executioner's Axe is about the biggest axe you can get. That about sums up my initial advice.

I do have reservations about taking that Archetype that trades away your Solo Tactics for Tactician. Meirril and I don't agree about much, but we agree about that! Like I said earlier. If I really wanted Tactician, I'd either go Paladin, because that Tactician is better, or I'd go Cavalier, because it only costs 1 level. But that's your call.

From the perspective of optimizing a character that uses Outflank, I'd want a weapon with a high crit threat range in addition to high damage, maybe Elven Curved Blade, but that doesn't say "lumberjack" to me.

I'm not at anyone's throat. I'm giving my best advice in good faith according to what the rules say, but I sure did call it about their civility not lasting long!

The lumberjack will be a Half-Orc Barbarian of the Dreadnought archetype, and he will indeed use a giant axe.

This character here, though, is an Aphorite Inquisitor of the Tactical Leader archetype. I chose the archetype because it felt more of a team player than the normal lone wolfishness of typical Inquisitors. It makes me think the character is a soldier in an extraplanar army come to Golarion as a sort of learning experience. I'll admit, the only real reason I thought of a Hammer is because Inquisitors have terrible proficiencies and I can't use Abadar's crossbow when I have no DEX.

As for why I chose Inquisitor in the first place...Meh, it's something new. I hate Prepared casters, and the race gives a bonus to STR/INT and a penalty to DEX. Meaning melee is the way to go, but I don't feel like trying Magus again. Inquisitor is a Spontaneous caster that runs more martial than Clerics, and has extraplanar ties that fit with the race. Between Torag, Abadar, Erastil, Irori, Iomedae, and Sarenrae:

  • 1. Abadar and Erastil give ranged weapons
  • 2. Irori give Unarmed Strike but it doesn't scale
  • 3. Iomedae and Sarenrae are extremely common and come off as zealots
  • 4. Torag is worshipped by Dwarves, who have a particular fondness of Aphorites


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Scott Wilhelm wrote:
K-kun the Insane wrote:
Scott Wilhelm wrote:
And anyway, none of that matters because in the thread you linked to, the OP was using Tactician or something to make sure they did, in fact have a Team, which means no RAI was being molested. In this Thread, the OP is using Solo Tactics to make sure he gets the benefit of a Team even if he doesn't have one, and anyway, in this thread, The OP is planning to take Paired Opportunist anyway

You sir, are flat-out wrong, and should not use other people's threads to push your religion.

I AM NOT using Solo Tactics, I'm using the Tactical Leader archetype's Tactician. I've mentioned it a number of times now.

Well, the fact that you are using Tactician makes Gray Warden's objection even less relevant. You will be having allies that have the Feat, there's no problem: even less problem than I thought.

My religion? Dude this is a game. You asked for advice. I am giving you my best counsel in good faith according to what the rules say. The rules really do say what I said they say. Anyway, Meirril was the one who first pushed the controversial advice on you. He is the one who first started "pushing religion." I just corrected him.

Gray Warden's notions about what everyone else does has nothing to do with what the rules say, and it's a completely unsupported assertion.

When I said you were wrong, it had nothing to do with your on-going argument about Broken Wing Gambit and being your own ally. It had everything to do with you saying I'm using Solo Tactics. In the very first post of this thread, I said I was putting my Lumberjack Dreadnought Barbarian on hold and making a Tactical Leader Inquisitor (with possible Student of War levels), but was having some issues choosing equipment.

Magda, Darigaaz, and Meirril gave advice about that.

Gray Warden gave an interesting build I hadn't thought of.

You gave another build, but assumed I was playing a base Inquisitor and that this was still a lumberjack trying to use a hammer.

The pair of you then went after each other's throats.


Scott Wilhelm wrote:
And anyway, none of that matters because in the thread you linked to, the OP was using Tactician or something to make sure they did, in fact have a Team, which means no RAI was being molested. In this Thread, the OP is using Solo Tactics to make sure he gets the benefit of a Team even if he doesn't have one, and anyway, in this thread, The OP is planning to take Paired Opportunist anyway

You sir, are flat-out wrong, and should not use other people's threads to push your religion.

I AM NOT using Solo Tactics, I'm using the Tactical Leader archetype's Tactician. I've mentioned it a number of times now.


Meirril wrote:
K-kun the Insane wrote:
Meirril wrote:

For Teamwork feats let me suggest:

3: Intercept Charge

6: Paired Opportunists

9: Outflank

Since you are an AoO based build, and more than occasionally reach, these should allow you to get more AoO. Intercept Charge can be pushed back further, but I believe it will generate the most AoO out of these feats. Paired Opportunist gives a solid +4 to hit if you can find another reach build player around to partner with. Outflank lets you get a +4 to hit while flanking, and the rare extra AoO if your partner crits.

Special mention for Broken Wing Gambit as it would be great to have around...but someone else would need to actually have it. If you use your solo ability to pretend your allies have it, you could generate no AoO for your allies, and your allies have no option to provide the situation that generates AoO without actually having the feat.

Also Seize the Moment could be brillant...if you can manage to get the prerequisites. It is interesting, but probably not something you'd actually qualify for ever.

Broken Wing Gambit sounds excellent! I'll have to grab that one ASAP.

Why are you picking up the only one you can't use solo?

If you give your opponent a bonus to hit and damage, nobody gets the AoO. None of your allies can give you AoO unless they actually have Broken Wing Gambit.

Inquisitors treat their allies as if they had the teamwork feats, you don't give them the feat like a Crusader does.

The Tactical Leader archetype trades Solo Tactics for Tactician, allowing me to give my allies access to the feat.


Meirril wrote:

For Teamwork feats let me suggest:

3: Intercept Charge

6: Paired Opportunists

9: Outflank

Since you are an AoO based build, and more than occasionally reach, these should allow you to get more AoO. Intercept Charge can be pushed back further, but I believe it will generate the most AoO out of these feats. Paired Opportunist gives a solid +4 to hit if you can find another reach build player around to partner with. Outflank lets you get a +4 to hit while flanking, and the rare extra AoO if your partner crits.

Special mention for Broken Wing Gambit as it would be great to have around...but someone else would need to actually have it. If you use your solo ability to pretend your allies have it, you could generate no AoO for your allies, and your allies have no option to provide the situation that generates AoO without actually having the feat.

Also Seize the Moment could be brillant...if you can manage to get the prerequisites. It is interesting, but probably not something you'd actually qualify for ever.

Broken Wing Gambit sounds excellent! I'll have to grab that one ASAP.


Sorry, what sources are those traits from? I don't know them.
I already need the Plane-Hopper's Handbook for this character, and now Divine Anthology. Should I grab anything else? (already have Blood of Shadows)


Sadly, Aphorites have a -2 to DEX (+2STR/+2INT) so 10 is about the best I can do without dropping be elsewhere. I'll admit, I hadn't thought of the other weapons Inquisitor gets, aside from knowing that a Ranged weapon isn't going to be my focus. A reach weapon does guarantee an AO on anyone running up to me, and I can always ditch it for the hammer once they're in close.

Tactical Leader (Inquisitor Archetype):
Rather than pursuing their holy missions alone, some inquisitors see the inherent value of working with like-minded allies to accomplish mutual goals.

Leader’s Words (Ex)
Tactical leaders are skilled at speaking soothing words that keep the peace and bolster allies’ resolve. A tactical leader receives a morale bonus on all Diplomacy checks equal to half his inquisitor level (minimum +1).

This ability replaces stern gaze.

Tactician (Ex)
At 3rd level, 9th level, and 18th level, a tactical leader gains a teamwork feat as a bonus feat. He must meet the prerequisites for this feat. As a standard action, the tactical leader can grant one of these feats to all allies within 30 feet who can see and hear him. Allies retain the use of this bonus feat for 3 rounds plus 1 round for every 2 inquisitor levels the tactical leader has. Allies do not need to meet the prerequisites of these bonus feats.

The tactical leader can use this ability once per day at 3rd level, plus one additional time per day at 6th, 9th, 15th, and 18th level.

At 12th level, a tactical leader can use the tactician ability as a swift action. At 18th level, whenever the tactical leader uses this ability, he grants any two teamwork feats that he knows. He can select from any of his teamwork feats, not just his bonus feats.

If the tactical leader also has cavalier levels, these levels stack for determining the number of uses of this ability per day.

This ability replaces solo tactics and teamwork feats.

Battle Acumen (Ex)
At 14th level, a tactical leader can grant his judgment benefits to a single other ally within 30 feet who can see and hear the tactical leader as an immediate action. These benefits last until the beginning of the tactical leader’s next turn. A tactical leader must have a judgment active to use this ability and the benefits granted are the same as those selected by his judgment. A tactical leader can use this ability a number of times per day equal to his Wisdom modifier (minimum 1).

This ability replaces exploit weakness.

Protection Domain:
Your faith is your greatest source of protection, and you can use that faith to defend others. In addition, you receive a +1 resistance bonus on saving throws. This bonus increases by 1 for every 5 levels you possess.

Granted Powers

Resistant Touch (Sp): As a standard action, you can touch an ally to grant him your resistance bonus for 1 minute. When you use this ability, you lose your resistance bonus granted by the Protection domain for 1 minute. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.

Aura of Protection (Su): At 8th level, you can emit a 30-foot aura of protection for a number of rounds per day equal to your cleric level. You and your allies within this aura gain a +1 deflection bonus to AC and resistance 5 against all elements (acid, cold, electricity, fire, and sonic). The deflection bonus increases by +1 for every four cleric levels you possess beyond 8th. At 14th level, the resistance against all elements increases to 10. These rounds do not need to be consecutive.

Domain Spells: 1st—sanctuary, 2nd—shield other, 3rd—protection from energy, 4th—spell immunity, 5th—spell resistance, 6th—antimagic field, 7th—repulsion, 8th—mind blank, 9th—prismatic sphere.

Defense Subdomain:
Associated Domain: Protection.

Replacement Power: The following granted power replaces the resistant touch power of the Protection domain.

Deflection Aura (Su): Once each day, you can emit a 20- foot aura for a number of rounds equal to your cleric level. Allies within the aura gain a +2 deflection bonus to AC and combat maneuver defense.

Replacement Domain Spells: 1st—shield, 2nd—barkskin, 7th—deflection.

Aphorite Racial Traits & Alternates:
+2 Strength, +2 Intelligence, –2 Dexterity: Aphorites are strong and intelligent, but move and react somewhat stiffly.

Native Outsider: Aphorites are outsiders with the native subtype.

Medium: Aphorites are Medium creatures and have no bonuses of penalties due to their size.

Normal Speed: Aphorites have a base speed of 30 feet.

Darkvision: Aphorites can see in the dark up to 60 feet.

Skilled: Aphorites gain a +2 racial bonus on checks with a single Craft skill of their choice.

Spell-Like Ability: Aphorites can use protection from chaos once per day as a spell-like ability (caster level equal to the aphorite’s class level).

Aphorite Resistances (Ex): Aphorites have electricity resistance 5 and a +2 bonus on saves versus poison and mind-affecting effects.

Crystalline Dust (Su): An aphorite can manifest a haze of crystalline dust that forms into indistinct runes and glyphs surrounding its body. This effect grants the aphorite a 20% miss chance against melee and ranged attacks. Activating this dust is a move action, but it can be maintained each round as a free action. The effect cannot be disrupted, but it ends immediately if the aphorite is killed, paralyzed, stunned, knocked unconscious, or otherwise prevented from taking a free action to maintain it each round. An aphorite can use this ability a number of rounds per day equal to its Hit Dice, but the rounds do not need to be consecutive.

Languages: Aphorites speak Common and either Celestial or Infernal. An aphorite with a high Intelligence score can choose from the following as bonus languages: Abyssal, Aquan, Auran, Celestial, Ignan, Infernal, or Terran.

Aphorite Alternate Racial Traits

PFS Legal Share Knowledge
Source Plane-Hopper's Handbook pg. 14
Certain aphorites have a sliver of their creators’ ability to combine their collective intellect and solve problems they could not solve on their own. When an aphorite with this racial trait successfully uses the aid another action to aid a character on a Knowledge check the aphorite is trained in, the character receives a +4 bonus instead of the normal +2 bonus. As a result of this increased openness, aphorites with this racial trait don’t receive a +2 bonus on saves against mind-affecting effects. This racial trait modifies aphorite resistances.

PFS Legal Planar Envoy
Source Plane-Hopper's Handbook pg. 14
Reflecting their original role as translators and intermediaries, some aphorites are especially skilled at communication. Aphorites with this racial trait begin play speaking Common and either Abyssal, Aquan, Auran, Celestial, Ignan, Infernal, or Terran. Aphorites with this racial trait and a high Intelligence score can choose any languages at character creation (except for secret languages, such as Druidic). They learn two languages rather than one each time they gain a rank in Linguistics. This racial trait modifies languages and replaces skilled.

Eternal Smith
Source Plane-Hopper's Handbook pg. 14
Some aphorites retain knowledge of the techniques axiomites used to create arms to defend Axis. Aphorites with this racial trait choose either Craft (armor), Craft (bows), or Craft (weapons). When crafting items with the chosen skill, aphorites with this racial trait use the item’s gp value as its sp value when determining crafting progress (they do not multiply the item’s gp cost by 10 to determine its sp cost). This racial trait replaces the spell-like ability racial trait.

PFS Legal Urban Memories
Source Plane-Hopper's Handbook pg. 14
With vague memories of the Perfect City resting somewhere deep in their minds, aphorites with this racial trait gain a +2 racial bonus on Knowledge (local) checks and can cast urban grace once per day as a spell-like ability (caster level equal to the aphorite’s character level). This racial trait replaces the spell-like ability racial trait.

Artful Dodge:
You are practiced at avoiding attacks when outnumbered.

Prerequisite(s): Int 13.

Benefit: If you are the only character threatening an opponent, you gain a +1 dodge bonus to AC against that opponent.

Special: The Artful Dodge feat acts as the Dodge feat for the purpose of satisfying prerequisites that require Dodge.

You can use Intelligence, rather than Dexterity, for feats with a minimum Dexterity prerequisite.

I intend to take the Planar Envoy alternate racial trait, and at somepoint I also need the Artful Dodge, Combat Expertise, and Skill Focus (any one knowledge) feats so that I can qualify for Student of War.


I'm putting my plans for a Half-Orc Lumberjack Dreadnought on hold to focus on a boon I got at a con midMarch.

I have most of the character set, I'm just unsure of weapon loadouts.

I'm making an Aphorite Inquisitor (Tactical Leader) of Torag with the Defense Subdomain. I was initially going to do either Tactics or Chivalry Inquisitions, but they didn't seem to fit right. I'm also thinking of taking a couple levels of Student of War.

That all said, I can't decide whether to two-hand my Warhammer or to go Hammer n' Board.

Stats I'm looking at are: STR/16, DEX/10, CON/13, INT/14, WIS/14, CHA/13


I'm not terribly familiar with Paladins, but would a Divine Hunter with the Animal Ally & Boon Companion feats be viable for you?


Secret Wizard wrote:

Sounds pretty fun!

I think it could be cool to run it with a CHA casting class instead to have disgustingly high Disguise, and make people wonder why that damn Goblin is so damn charming.

What's not to love about Goblins?!

I feel I should also point out that when Pathfinder 2.0 launches in a few months, Goblins will be a playable race in the core rulebook. That said, I suppose it's possible that PFS would lock them behind boons still.

I have played 2 disguise-based characters, and can say that it's a lot of fun, provided something comes of it. Having redonkulus disguise checks is a must, but if no one can break through it, no one will appreciate just how good it is. My Kitsune Ninja claims to be 100% human, and has great Disguise/Bluff for level 2, but she still needs to sleep alone so that noone sees her true form. This and a couple other clues allow at least her allies to realize something is strange about her. My Halfling Spellslinger/Spellspecialist has it a little easier in that she doesn't need to use a special ability to appear human; she's very childlike already. But a child walking around with full-grown pathfinders, drinking liquor, and carrying a musket raises a few eyebrows.


Toolbag wrote:

Gotcha!

According to those links, you might end up with multiple Attacks of Opportunity...Your disarm fails so you've shared Improved Disarm Partner with your allies who now get to make disarm attempts as an AoO...the disarm portion provoking an AoO from the enemy.

This would be broken if your allies also have Improved Disarm which specifically says that the characters disarm attempts do not provoke.

That scenario would be...Your disarm fails so you've shared Improved Disarm Partner with your allies who now get to make disarm attempts as an AoO...however your allies also have Improved Disarm which keeps their disarm attempts from provoking. Bad guy gets nothing but bad news.

The best part is that unlike my initial disarm attempt, where if I had succeeded I'd only get to disarm, the AOs do damage and disarm.

I'm also wondering if I should swap my Con belt for a Str belt and then once I have enough saved up, make it a +4 Str belt instead of the +2 Str/Dex/Con belt I was originally looking at.

hp would drop by 11 and I'd lose a round of rage, but I'd be more accurate and damaging.


Toolbag wrote:

I think you are correct here. Your lower STR is really causing you a problem. And what's worse, I think Power Attack will only make this worse in your current state. I would definitely look into some boost to STR.

As for AoO's in the scenario you described:
I think it will all depend on what Improved Disarm Partner says. If it is like Improved Disarm, then your allies making a disarm attempt would not provoke attacks of opportunity.

I presume Improved Disarm Partner is a teamwork feat that may have Improved Disarm as a prerequisite?

Disarm Partner

Improved Disarm Partner


Well, I did consider Break Guard the last time I got a Feat, but went with Cosmopolitan instead to make Nobility a Class Skill (he can make day job checks with Nobility thanks to the boon that made him a Blackros)

The penalty from Power Attack does indeed apply to my Disarm checks, but remember that Disarming typically forgoes damage.

Feats @ level 10:
Two-Weapon Fighting
Combat Expertise
Disarm Partner
Improved Disarm
Quick Draw
Tengu Wings
Improved Disarm Partner
Cosmopolitan (Diplomacy, Nobility)

Thanks to the Pack Rager's Raging Tactician ability, I give my allies IDP while I rage and if I happen to fail to disarm the enemy (uncommon) my allies get AOs and if those AOs hit they get a free Disarm attempt. They hit, do damage, and disarm. I'm not sure if one can make an AO against an AO, so I don't know if their free AO disarm will provoke, but even if it does, we've just baited out their AO.

The dagger is primarily used for Disarming, though it has been helpful as a desperation move against DR/Adamantine for obvious reasons.

Really, I'm already pretty good at disarming, but I fall behind abit against monsters with natural attacks, DR, and/or immunity to Bleed. Power Attack may be the best way to deal with that. And rather than turning Mighty Con into a Con/Dex belt, I could make it a Con/Str belt to boost accuracy/damage slightly.


ekibus wrote:
Your math is way off. Looks like you are adding 6 from power attack, that is only if you are two handing a weapon. You actually suffer -50%... so 1 damage for 1 accuracy.. clearly just no. Best you could do is put down a weapon and 2 hand a sword to bypass dr. Maybe hammer the gap but not sold on it with your accuracy.

You are right about the 50% with my off hand weapon Power Attack, but notice that I'm not actually including damage for that attack since I'm using it to Disarm. But at +11 BAB, Power Attack is still at -3/+6 for my main hand weapon. If I were using it 2-handed, it would only be 3 attacks instead of 4, but Power Attack would be at -3/+9. It seems you missed the part about Kalas being level 11.

Power Attack wrote:

You can make exceptionally deadly melee attacks by sacrificing accuracy for strength.

Prerequisites: Str 13, base attack bonus +1.

Benefit: You can choose to take a –1 penalty on all melee attack rolls and combat maneuver checks to gain a +2 bonus on all melee damage rolls. This bonus to damage is increased by half (+50%) if you are making an attack with a two-handed weapon, a one handed weapon using two hands, or a primary natural weapon that adds 1-1/2 times your Strength modifier on damage rolls. This bonus to damage is halved (–50%) if you are making an attack with an off-hand weapon or secondary natural weapon.

When your base attack bonus reaches +4, and every 4 points thereafter, the penalty increases by –1 and the bonus to damage increases by +2.

You must choose to use this feat before making an attack roll, and its effects last until your next turn. The bonus damage does not apply to touch attacks or effects that do not deal hit point damage.


I'm leveling up a character at the moment in preparation for a convention this weekend, and seeing as he'll be level 11, he gets a feat. As a very unorthodox build, I'm fine with him being unoptimized, but seeing as he had a hard time with DR last game (last October) and that it ended with his second career death, I thought I'd take a look at the go-to-feat for boosting damage.

Kalas is a Tengu Barbarian/Ranger (Unchained, Sea Reaver, Pack Rager 9/Freebooter 2 who fancies himself a Noble Privateer (former pirate but he's married into an influential family).

For a Barbarian, his Strength is quite low, and he went for a Two-Weapon Fighting style that specialized in Disarming opponents and making them bleed. Even his Belt is only a +2CON belt, though I think I was saving up for Physical Perfection +2 before having to pay for the Raise. Most of his money has been spent on his weapons and armor, with ability boosts being more of an after thought.

His abilities are 14/16/16/13/12/10
His weapons are a +1 Wounding Blood Crystal Rhoka Sword and a +1 Adamantine Swordbreaker Dagger that's kept in a Scabbard of Bleeding Edges (variant Keen Edges that applies Wounding instead of Keen)
His armor is a +1 Electric Resistant (10) Sea Drake Hide Mountain Pattern Armor

Typical tactics are to disarm the opponent before stacking the heck out of the Bleed damage.

Before the level up, a full-attack looks like this:

Calculations:
BCRS = Blood Crystal Rhoka Sword
ASBD = Adamantine Swordbreaker Dagger
Rage = On
Powerful Stance = On
Freebooter's Bane = On
Improved Disarm = On

BCRS +14 (1d8+9 +1bleed stack), ASBD Disarm +18 (+20 vs swords), BCRS +9 (1d8+9 +1bleed stack +1 Blood Crystal)

After leveling and choosing Power Attack:

Calculations:
BCRS = Blood Crystal Rhoka Sword
ASBD = Adamantine Swordbreaker Dagger
Rage = On
Powerful Stance = On
Freebooter's Bane = On
Improved Disarm = On
Power Attack = On

BCRS +12 (1d8+15 +1bleed stack), ASBD Disarm +16 (+18 vs swords), BCRS +7 (1d8+15 +1bleed stack +1 Blood Crystal), BCRS +2 (1d8+15 +1bleed stack +1 Blood Crystal)

The damage certainly goes up enough to bypass DR10 but my accuracy takes a hit when it already has a penalty due to TWF.

The other option I can think of is to get more attacks in general. If I use what gold I have now, I can turn my Mighty CON belt into a Physical Might Belt. If I make it DEX, I'll have enough to get Improved Two-Weapon Fighting.

Calculations:
BCRS = Blood Crystal Rhoka Sword
ASBD = Adamantine Swordbreaker Dagger
Rage = On
Powerful Stance = On
Freebooter's Bane = On
Improved Disarm = On

BCRS +15 (1d8+9 +1bleed stack), ASBD Disarm +19 (+21 vs swords), BCRS +10 (1d8+9 +1bleed stack +1 Blood Crystal), ASBD +10 (1d4+8 +1bleed stack), BCRS +5 (1d8+9 +1bleed stack +1 Blood Crystal)

Less damage per hit, but more attacks per round with the lowest at +5 rather than +2


HammerJack wrote:
I do not know if your GM is running any kind of special requirements about what is available for purchase in your campaign and what is not. What I can tell you is that there is a significant amount of equipment in the back matter of Starfinder AP volumes that is not found in the adventures, but just tied thematically to the setting info being covered in the back of that book.

Doesn't seem to be anything special. In PFS you can normally buy items upto your level +2, but when the Biohacker asked what the limit on purchases was, the GM said "if you can afford it, you can buy it."


Some nice ideas here. Our session today was shorter than usual, and we spent a good chunk of it using our new wealth to re-equip/upgrade our items. (Half of the session was 1 space combat...I'm not a great captain...)

Our Vanguard has obtained a shield and a one-handed weapon and is looking to be a tank. I've upgraded from a Pike to a Dragonglaive and, after learning that armor check penalties only really apply when I try hovering or something, I upgraded from the lighter Iridishell armor to Defiance Squad armor (looking at Kyokor Plating next). The Operative got a number of Library chips and a Sniper Rifle, and the Biohacker got a 4000 credit light armor, giving him the highest AC (Zeizerer Diffractor II is erroneously listed as 1200 on Archives of Nethys).

We didn't actually get into any combat, but it seems we'll be more in the open, allowing easier formation movement. The Vanguard has suggested that he and I form a kind of 2-part unit. He's in front taking the hits while I'm behind him smashing face. I think that'll work well, especially since I'm part Mystic and can heal him if necessary. (Though I'd prefer to use Command or Fear)

I'll have to look into these Falcon Boots. It seems they're from the AP itself, so I'm not sure if I'll have to find them, or if they're available for purchase.


Playing a homegame of Adventure Path 1 and we're starting part 2. As this was my first experience with an RPG homegame (I mostly play PFS/SFS), I jumped on my chance to play a race that I'd otherwise be unable to, in this case Dragonkin.

Party consists of:

Dragonkin Soldier(Blitz)/Mystic(Overlord) (me)
Lashunta (Damaya) Operative
Ysoki Biohacker
Vesk Vanguard

It's been fun and we're really enjoying the roleplaying as a bunch of wannabe Starfinders thrown together with people we've never met before we're even officially members.

However, one thing I can see getting old quickly is that I'm just too damn big. Lashunta and Vesk are Medium, Ysoki are Small, but Dragonkin are Large. I don't mind squeezing into places not built for people of my...girth...but I often find that I'm making it difficult for the Biohacker and Operative to hit anything as I'm so large that I provide cover to everything. And of course it doesn't help that I rush forward with my melee reach weapon (+4STR, -2DEX means I'm not great with ranged weapons).

So, moving forward, I'd like to try and be less of an obstacle (literally) for my allies. Any advice on how I can go about this?