Bloodrager Monk in 2E


6 years, 3 months, and 8 days ago, I played my first game of Pathfinder. It was a special adventure for Pathfinder Society called Master of the Fallen Fortress. I played a Draconic Sorcerer with more DEX than CHA and ran headlong into battle wearing no armor with only a 10 CON. 3 years, 7 months, and 9 days later, the character was officially retired from PFS upon reaching 12th Level. (Sorcerer4/Fighter1/DragonDisciple7) During that time, I learned so much about Pathfinder and TTRPGs in general, that I doubt that a lot of decisions I made for him back then would be made by me now. (He had no less than 5 deaths during his career) Or maybe I would, I seem to have a knack for killing my own characters...

I became quite invested in the character and even developed quite the head-canon for him despite the disjointed nature PFS play brings to character development. One of my characters became his wife (Fighter7/Brawler2), and I eventually made a time-travelling daughter from the future (Bloodrager2/Monk6). I've become very attached to these characters. I intend to dust off his character sheet and bring it to the Grand Convocation my lodge is holding during the last weekend in August and play him in the final special of Pathfinder 1E.

With all that out of the way, let's get to the meat of this thread. I intend to bring these 3 characters over into Pathfinder 2E. For the most part, I have things figured. He will be a Sorcerer again, though with some Rogue MC to express his nimbleness and his love of skills. His wife will be a Fighter, though I don't know if MC Monk fits since she only ever had 2 levels of Brawler in 1E. The daughter, though is more interesting...and more of an issue.

This past week, she reached level 8 in 1E, taking her second level of Bloodrager, becoming Bloodrager2/Monk6. The key thing there is that her very first level was as a Bloodrager. She's spent 6 levels in another class before returning to her favored class. And I've had a blast playing her this way. It fit with my concept of someone with vast draconic power that she tried to control with discipline. (Her archetypes are Urban Bloodrager, Hungry Ghost Monk, Qinggong Monk, and Scaled Fist Monk) She was created and planned out to 12th level to be Bloodrager6/Monk6.

Recreating her in 2E has lead me to realize that now there's a difference between the order of classes. A Barbarian/Monk is quite different from a Monk/Barbarian. My purpose for this topic is to glean some advice on whether I should make her a Barbarian/Monk/Sorcerer or a Monk/Barbarian/Sorcerer.

The former gives her all of the Draconic Instinct abilites from Barbaian, both Dragon Style feats from the Monk, and even all Bloodline Focus spells from Sorcerer by 20th level. She'd be stuck with only a couple Cantrips as far as actual spellcasting goes, but 2E cantrips are much better than in 1E. This aligns well with her concept of using a Monk's discipline to keep her wild tendencies in check.

The latter gives better unarmed and unarmored proficiencies and improves Unarmed strikes and movement a great deal, but she loses access to the specialization and resistance powers from Draconic Instinct. It also aligns more with what I've played her in 1E: She uses a Bardiche, sure, but most of her class levels are monk and she does quite well with her kicks.

TL;DR What works better in 2E (both mechanically and thematically) to capture the concept of someone who uses both a polearm and her feet in combat while struggling to maintain control of the wild draconic power within her?

Barbarian/Monk/Sorcerer -OR- Monk/Barbarian/Sorcerer?

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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

I don't think you need both Monk and Sorcerer to fit your character concept. In fact, I would warn against too many multiclass feats, as you'll be left without many strong feats from your base class, but lots of weaker feats from all your multi classing.

I'd suggest Barbarian as your base class, as it will allow you to get most of the powers you're after, and flavoring your rage as some latent bestial nature that you fight against is even a suggested way to play a Barbarian. Barbarians also have unarmed proficiency that's as good as a Monk's, so you're not losing any unarmed accuracy.

A monk multiclass is probably a better choice than sorcerer mechanically, as your higher level Dragon Instinct feats are going to be better than anything Sorcerer can give you, while still giving you some supernatural flavor.

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Barbarian start looks the best way to recreate that character. Here the class feats that I think that fits.

Lvl 1 Free
Lvl 2 Monk Dedication
Lvl 4 Dragon Kick
Lvl 6 Rage Dragon Breath
Lvl 8 Free
Lvl 9 Ancestry Feat Multitalented Sorcerer
Lvl 10 Flurry of Blows / Basic Spellcasting
Lvl 12 Dragon Wings / Expert Spellcasting / Dragon Roar

Use the general feat Adopted Ancestry to get Multitalented if you are not human.

Level 10 you pick if you want to kick more or if you want some spells, Terrifying Howl is a good way to emulate a dragon roar if you wish.

Lvl 12 have too many cool stuff and probably the hardest to pick because have so many thematic feats for your concept.

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Alternative solution to these builds, and one which I am using with one of my favorite all-time characters...

Wait for the Bloodrager class. I know, I know, it's not one of the classes named to be in the Advanced Player's Guide for July 2020. Yes, it may take TWO years to get that class out. S%&%, it may never come. But you know what will? Ways to "cheat" into some spellcasting or whatever other feats. Or prestige classes that might mimic what you wanna do with that character. Both Magus and Bloodrager haven't been announced yet, but they're very well-liked classes; they're going to be represented in PF2 at some point.

You sound like you've done errything right with your characters so far. Who cares about numerical optimization? At the end of the day, it's how much you, the player, enjoyed playing those characters. If you liked them well enough to build out the first, then a wife, then a child... you done did the thing the right way.

And how long did it take you to get all three characters rolled out? To play them through? A few years, right? Why try to jam all that character building into the instant that PF2 releases? You get a rare chance to play the growth of your characters all over again. Take the slow road, man. It's about the ride, not the destination.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

I think a character must start in the class that best fits their fundamental concept, that which is core to their identity.

For your character, I think that is the wild draconic power, hence start Barbarian and MC in Monk. Also not sure Sorcerer MC is needed.

As opposed to PF1, you should not use MC chronologically, but in a concept-centered way.

What will work best is what most fits your character's final concept. Not what would model its path through life.

Because you cannot retrain your class. And MC is a spice that alters the flavor. It does not change the base of the brew.

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