GM Michael's Ironfang Invasion

Game Master Dread

Roll20 Iron Fang Invasion

EXP:2640/Next Level: 5000 (3rd)
Provision Points:78

When The Ironfang Mercenaries Invade, who has the will to survive!

Date: Desnus 17th 4712 AR. 4:00 pm


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Much of the crunch is complete for Tarrow Harfoot (alias of Therenger). Will finish up spit and polish tomorrow.

Tarrow is a melee Rogue and I may develop him as a Trip specialist, which will inform weapon choices. Traits are the campaign trait plus Helpful and Reactionary.

Went with Craft (Alchemy), but stopped short of committing to Investigator. Feats will be Weapon Finesse and Combat Expertise as the freebie from GM.

Personality: Harrowed by his experience as an Ironfang Survivor, Tarrow is eager to build strong personal bonds and help those he trusts whenever they are in need. He exhibits bravery to the point of foolishness, determined never to cower in the face of evil.


GMMichael wrote:

I was more wondering Universalist/evoker/etc...

on and question marks next to Human indicate that mild curiousity over sub ethnicity....Varisian, Kellid, Taldan, Shoanti, etc...

Ah. I believe most Humans of Nirmathas are of Cheliaxian and Varisian stock. As Hollin is Nirmathas born, I'd say a mix but if I had to pick one, let's go Varisian


Severina is a mongrel and proud of it, but "Taldan" is the closest ethnicity to correct.


pad300 wrote:

...

A Q: If you already have one of the bonus feats (scribe scroll) from your class do you get a replacement?

I think you missed this...


Oh wow, this really exploded quickly. I was hoping to submit a cavalier idea I've been wanting to play in this campaign, but there's already such a large pool of characters and of martials specifically.


I have not begun to choose. Im only compiling info right now.


pad300 wrote:
pad300 wrote:

...

A Q: If you already have one of the bonus feats (scribe scroll) from your class do you get a replacement?

I think you missed this...

I did...No. you dont get a free replacement.

Those feats are to help with feat tax in pathfinder and to give feats that I feel most with the requirements wouldnt need to learn.

a fighter who is strong should be able to decide how hard he wants to hit.

an archer who a decent dexterity should be able to decide where to shoot (more or less)

an intelligent opponent should be able to fight better

and all casters should be able to write a scroll.


Think I've got Barhador ready for consideration.

I hope you like him.

I notice he's the only one listed with his campaign trait . . .. Hunh? Hunh? <grin>


* How will you handle Age Categories?
* would you allow Young Characters?
* you mentioned 3rd party classes, could porting DnD 3.5 stuff be OK?


.age categories will be as normal. ie age effecting stats.

if someone wanted to run a young character they could, it wouldnt give them any other perks though.

nothing 3.5

just Pathfinder 3rd party classes only can be considered.


moving to next page.

1. Robert Henry- Brunner Hammerfall Dwarven Paladin {Stonelord of Torag} Kraggodan Castaway
2. Therenger- Tarrow Harfoot Halfling Rogue Ironfang Survivor
3. hustonj- Barhador Elf {Gyrgan-Wild} Hunter {Feral Hunter} Foxclaw Scout
4. rorek55- Xolen Zottenropple Gnome {Bleached} Sorceror {Fey} Blight Burned---???
5. Edilsmurge- Tenzo Human {??} Fighter {Gloomblade} Frontier Healer
6. Ridge-Hollin Silverteeth Human {Varisian} Bard World Weary
7. Delightful- Rue Woodkind Human {??} Ranger Blight Burned
8. avr- Pallando Brightriver Halfling Oracle {Pei Zin Practitoner} Frontier Healer
9. ythiel- Zinli Steelworker Gnome Gunslinger Ironfang Survivor
10. plasticdragon- Athrehon Human {Garundi} Wizard Unbreakable Survivor
11. CyberMephit- Andras Teoss Human {??} Magus {Staff Magus/Hexcrafter} World Weary
12. jovich- Hjorleaf Asvidrson Human {Ulfen} Fighter Ironfang Survivor
13. Linnea The Diviner- Vriska Galerider Half-Orc Cavalier {Beast Rider/Order of The Beast Chernasardo Hopeful
14. Torilgrey- Marvas The Younger Half-Orc Ranger {Nirmathi Regular} Ironfang Survivor
15. Dorian 'Grey'- Arkhan Silvinesti Half-Orc Druid {Storm} World Weary
16. RHMG Animator- Nate Goodknight Tiefling {Rakshasa Spawn} Cleric {Theologian-[Diety?]} Frontier Healer
17. Alcor Grimm- Therion Frostleaf Elf Arcanist Blight Burned
18. Patrick The Kid- Paulier Ovicus Human {??} Magus {Eldritch Scion} Ironfang Survivor
19. GeraintElberion- Seren Elberion Elf ?? Blight Burned
20. Flying Jenny- Severina Devil-Luck Human {Taldan} Skald {Boaster} World Weary
21. pad300- Mikhael Onstuckter Half Orc Skald {Urban Red Tongue} Ironfang Survivor
22.Hawthwile- Herman Human {??} Witch {Herb Witch} Blight Burned

MuaveAvengr- ??


I will go with chelaxian for nationality


A. Blothiq

B. Ratfolk

C. Psychic (discipline may vary depending on party composition)

D. Animal Whisperer

E. Blothiq is a traveling salesman, originally from Druma. Being from Druma, he grew up around the Prophecies of Kalistrade in his every day life. He got married, had a few kids, but felt itch of adventure. Though not a Kalistocrat himself, he took the mercantile practices to heart. Blothiq said goodbye to his wife, and left to go on an adventure. He recently was in Molthune and Tamran, working his way west to Korvosa, using his recently discovered psychic magic (perhaps from his Vudran ancestry) to guide him along. He's taking a week long break in Phaendar to sell some good, resupply, and enjoy the town.


I'll throw my hat into the ring:

A. Leland Hopkins

B. Human (Taldan)

C. Warpriest (Arsenal Chaplain)

D. Frontier Healer

E. Leland is in town selling his herbal poultices. After many years serving in the military keeping the wilds safe and patching up his allies, he's recently retired to enjoy a more quiet existence. Using the skills he picked up during his service, he now grows medicinal herbs and makes various ointments to sell the the townsfolk of Phaendar. Though retired, he continues to worship Our Lord in Iron and keeps his trusty bow near at hand in case Gorum requires his presence on the battlefield once more.


Thank you for the clarifications GM - that sounds reasonable with the Cauldron hex. As far as ethnicities go, Herman looks Chelaxian.


Here's Rue!

A Ranger focused on archery combat and killing fey. I've finished most of her mechanical stuff (though I'm still determining whether I should give her an archetype) and her fluff/backstory is not done yet.

Will post here again and when its done.

Sovereign Court

If Seren needs to be put in a role, it would be archer with 6th level arcane casting, regardless of whether we go with eldritch archer or arrowsong minstrel. That's probably filed under 'support'?


Got most of the character finished, and I think encumbrance could be an issue in the beginning, unless that is being hand waved.
Working on equipment and Background.


Barhador is a skilled outdoorsman, but not a primary combatant. Once he gets Wild Shape at Level 4, his primary combat contribution style should change pretty significantly. Thus the lack of archery feats . . ..


I'll throw Eilyne into the running. I'll have to make sure she is de-leveled as she was built for an Ironfang game that died off a while back. I really enjoyed the character so figured it would be worth trying again.

Eilyne is a human (I'm a dryad!) who thinks she is a dryad phytokineticist with unbreakable survivor.


Nate GoodKnight
Got most of it done, working a bit more on the fluff.


Updated List (with Links to Alias)

1. Robert Henry- Brunner Hammerfall Dwarven Paladin {Stonelord of Torag} Kraggodan Castaway
2. Therenger- Tarrow Harfoot Halfling Rogue Ironfang Survivor
3. hustonj- Barhador Elf {Gyrgan-Wild} Hunter {Feral Hunter} Foxclaw Scout
4. rorek55- Xolen Zottenropple Gnome {Bleached} Sorceror {Fey} Blight Burned---???
5. Edilsmurge - Tenzo Human {??} Fighter {Gloomblade} Frontier Healer
6. Ridge - Hollin Silverteeth Human {Varisian} Bard World Weary
7. Delightful- Rue Woodkind Human {??} Ranger Blight Burned
8. avr- Pallando Brightriver Halfling Oracle {Pei Zin Practitoner} Frontier Healer
9. ythiel- Zinli Steelworker Gnome Gunslinger Ironfang Survivor
10. plasticdragon - Athrehon Human {Garundi} Wizard Unbreakable Survivor
11. CyberMephit- Andras Teoss Human {??} Magus {Staff Magus/Hexcrafter} World Weary
12. jovich- Hjorleaf Asvidrson Human {Ulfen} Fighter Ironfang Survivor
13. Linnea The Diviner- Vriska Galerider Half-Orc Cavalier {Beast Rider/Order of The Beast Chernasardo Hopeful
14. Torilgrey- Marvas The Younger Half-Orc Ranger {Nirmathi Regular} Ironfang Survivor
15. Dorian 'Grey'- Arkhan Silvinesti Half-Orc Druid {Storm} World Weary
16. RHMG Animator- Nate Goodknight Tiefling {Rakshasa Spawn} Cleric {Theologian-[Kurgress]} Frontier Healer
17. Alcor Grimm- Therion Frostleaf Elf Arcanist Blight Burned
18. Patrick The Kid- Paulier Ovicus Human {??} Magus {Eldritch Scion} Ironfang Survivor
19. GeraintElberion- Seren Elberion Elf ?? Blight Burned
20. Flying Jenny- Severina Devil-Luck Human {Taldan} Skald {Boaster} World Weary
21. pad300- Mikhael Onstuckter Half Orc Skald {Urban Red Tongue} Ironfang Survivor
22.Hawthwile- Herman Human {??} Witch {Herb Witch} Blight Burned
23. Alcor Grimm - Therion Frostleaf Elf Arcanist Blight-Burned
24. MuaveAvengr- Blothiq Ratfolk Psychic (???) Animal Whisperer
25. Fanguar - Leland Hopkins Human Warpriest (Arsenal Chaplain) Frontier Healer
26. Drogeney - Eilyne human phytokineticist unbreakable survivor.

Souls At War - ??


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Simple Submission Breakdown

Race:

Human: 11
Elf: 4
Half-Orc: 4
Gnome: 2
Halfling: 2
Dwarf: 1
Ratfolk: 1
Tiefling: 1
Half-Elf: 0

Classes:

Arcanist: 2
Bard: 1
Cavalier: 1
Cleric: 1
Druid: 1
Fighter: 2
GunSlinger: 1
Hunter: 1
Magus: 2
Oracle: 1
Paladin: 1
Psychic: 1
phytokineticist: 1
Ranger: 2
Rogue: 1
Skald: 2
Sorcerer: 1
Warpriest: 1
Witch: 1
Wizard: 1

Unknown: 1


Marvas the Younger Crunch:

Marvas the Younger
Half-orc ranger (nirmathi irregular) 1 (Pathfinder Campaign Setting: Inner Sea Magic)
NG Medium humanoid (human, orc)
Init +1 (+2 in forests.); Senses darkvision 90 ft.; Perception +6
--------------------
Defense
--------------------
AC 15, touch 11, flat-footed 14 (+4 armor, +1 Dex)
hp 13 (1d10+3)
Fort +4, Ref +3, Will +2
--------------------
Offense
--------------------
Speed 30 ft.
Melee dagger +4 (1d4+3/19-20) or
. . glaive +5 (1d10+4/×3) or
. . spiked gauntlet +4 (1d4+3) or
. . warhammer +4 (1d8+3/×3)
Ranged shortbow +2 (1d6/×3)
Space 5 ft.; Reach 5 ft. (10 ft. with glaive)
Special Attacks favored enemy (goblinoids +2)
--------------------
Statistics
--------------------
Str 16, Dex 13, Con 14, Int 12, Wis 14, Cha 10
Base Atk +1; CMB +4; CMD 15
Feats Deadly Aim, Power Attack, Weapon Focus (glaive)
Traits brute (apg), fangwood insurgent (nirmathas), ironfang survivor
Skills Climb +5, Handle Animal +4, Heal +6, Intimidate +7, Knowledge (nature) +5, Perception +6, Profession (soldier) +6, Profession (trapper) +6, Stealth +3, Survival +6; Racial Modifiers +2 Intimidate, forest ghost
Languages Common, Goblin, Orc
SQ orc blood, track +1
Other Gear chain shirt, arrows (20), dagger, glaive, shortbow, spiked gauntlet, warhammer, backpack, bear trap[APG], bedroll, belt pouch, flint and steel, hemp rope (50 ft.), mess kit[UE], pot, torch (10), trail rations (5), waterskin, 6 gp
--------------------
Special Abilities
--------------------
Darkvision (90 feet) You can see in the dark (black and white only).
Deadly Aim -1/+2 Trade a penalty to ranged attacks for a bonus to ranged damage.
Favored Enemy (Goblinoids +2) (Ex) +2 to rolls vs. goblinoids foes.
Forest Ghost +0 (Ex) Gain +0 bonus on all Perception and Survival skill checks made while in forest terrain.
Orc Blood Half-orcs count as both humans and orcs for any effect related to race.
Power Attack -1/+2 You can subtract from your attack roll to add to your damage.
Track +1 Add the listed bonus to Survival checks made to track.

The background I'm thinking on is that Marvas is a survivor of the Ramsgate massacre, and escaped from captivity by the Ironfangs as a teenager, slipping back into Nirmathas and working alternatively as a trapper and soldier with the militias in the forest. I'll felsh that out more if selected, but like I said, work's crazy this week.


Ok here's my submission.

A. Linia Morgen
B. Tiefling (pitborn, Pass for Human trait)
C. Cavalier (Constable) 1
D. Ironfang Survivor
E. Linia is a local in Phaendar, a well-known and well-liked tavern wench. She may soon discover she has a talent for leadership and for staying cool in a crisis.

Backstory:

"By the way, sir... I want to thank you."

The man looked up at Linia with a puzzled expression, raising his mug to his lips. "If you're trying to preempt a tip, it won't work."

"Not that. The dagger on your hip; I'd recognize it anywhere. Thank you for taking it."

The man chuckled. "Not a fan of the Ironfang, then?"

"Is that what they call themselves? They killed my beloved last time they were in the area. Would've killed me too, probably, but I managed to hide. They're savages."

"You'll be happy to know there's a few less of them in the world," the man said, looking Linia up and down. "My regiment has run into them several times. They lost. But they're getting bolder, and if you ask me, I think they're recruiting. Or breeding." He took a drink. "Or some of both."

Linia shuddered reflexively. More hobgoblins loyal to the Ironfang would be to the sorrow of everyone. "Well I certainly hope not, for all our sakes. But whatever you did to them, they deserve it. Thank you."

The man drained the last of his mug. "Got any beds in here? You could thank me proper."

Linia smiled apologetically. "Sorry, I'm on shift. And no, we don't." She turned to find other patrons and to take her leave of the conversation. A few others in the tavern looked impatient, and she flashed them a smile.

The man grabbed Linia's hand. "A back room, then? I'm sure it's not your first time serving a customer 'on shift.'"

Damned soldiers, Linia thought. Put a sword in a man's hand and he thinks he owns the world. The barkeep moved toward her to help, but she gestured to him she would handle it. "I'm sorry, sir, I can't. Please let me go, I have other customers."

"Ah, they can do without you for a time. I'll buy a round afterward, they'll forgive you." He stood up, his hand still holding hers. "Now, where can we go?"

Quick as lightning, Linia jabbed the knuckles of her other hand into the man's throat. As he gasped for breath, she wrenched herself free of his grip and smashed her elbow into his face. He lost his balance and collided with the table. She hopped back a step to gain a safe distance. "I'll tell you where you can go, you worm. The hell away from here."

The man slowly got to his feet, shot Linia a furious look, and staggered out the door muttering curses. "I hope you don't make a habit of punching outsiders," said the barkeep from behind Linia. "The festival's in a few days."

Linia turned to him and grinned. "Don't teach a lady self-defense, and then expect her not to use it."

Silver Crusade

Actually, while it would be a minor downgrade, I may go for psychic instead. If I did, I'd probably take the Abomination discipline, and the wildepath archetype.

Note, its the same character, I'm just wondering about the best way to portray the flavor. And, I've not played a psychic before, so that is perhaps tempting me a bit.


Ok. I a huge amount of great characters to go through and choose from I will close this in 24 hours. Last entries by Saturday morning.

I'll have the team chosen sometime this weekend as time permits


Tarrow's Story:
"Have a look at this, lad. Now see how it turns from murky brown to clear amber?" The elder halfling plucked the glass carafe from a perch above a small coal fire, then swirled it with his gloved hand.

Tarrow watched his uncle work, astute to the process and mindful of his place so as nt to disturb the many bottles and containers of alchemical ingredients crammed onto every shelf and table.

"What is it?" asked the younger halfling.

Uncle Gannor elevated the concoction to the sunlight filtering through a crack in the shutter. It gleamed and bubbled, still very hot. Satisfied, he poured the contents of the carafe into a copper mug and set it to cool. "Beer, my boy! This one we can drink, but not yet."

Gannor settled into a wooden chair covered by a threadbare blanket and folded his hands. "Now, have you gathered the ingredients I sent you to look for?"

Tarrow unslung the sack from across his shoulder and opened it. A fluff of milkweed burst into the room. "Mostly. Dry rot had got most of the grape leaves over spring, and then there were the locusts."

"Ill omens," replied his uncle. The old halfling looked wistfully around his laboratory. "We are the last true craftsmen of our clan, Tarrow. And one day soon we may be forced to leave these plains which have been our home now for twenty summers. When that happens, you will need to be prepared to carry on the tradition as Master of Potions."

"Why are you telling me this, uncle?"

Gannor smiled at his nephew and turned his gaze to the shard of light which pierced the room from the window, dust floating in space. "We've been lucky. Twenty years on the Nesmian Plains is a very long tenure indeed. Eventually our luck will run out." The old halfling reached for the copper mug and tipped the warm beer past his lips. "Hmm," he mused. "Here, you try it."

--------------

The attack came at night.

Autumn fields of dried corn stalks burned with the ferocity of wildfire caught in the wind. The small community of halflings could do little but grab themselves up and flee with the few precious belongings which could be scooped up on the way out of their thatched hovels. But the raiders were on them before they could get far, monstrous goblins swinging hideous black blades, killing every one in sight.

Tarrow had fallen asleep beneath the big table in his uncle's lab when the screams of his clan roused him to the horror. Gannor was already at work, but instead of gathering the most valuable treasures in the room, he was mixing ingredients in small cistern and stoking coals beneath it, moving with frenetic efficiency that belied his years.

He kicked his nephew. "Now run lad! Run from this night, and do not stop until the sun breaks above the eastern hills. Go!" Gannor kicked him again, with terrifying urgency.

Tarrow obeyed, and burst forth into the inferno. Pillars of flame seared the sky, goblins raced around with blood-soaked blades, and halflings - young and alike - were cut down and torn to pieces. He could hear them coming for him, and he turned to face his death. He watched as a trio of goblins crashed into his uncle's hovel and two more raced toward him, blades held high to strike.

But then the lab exploded! A fireball billowed out, consuming everything within twenty paces. Goblins nearest to the blast turned to cinders, while others were thrown from their feet. The force of it knocked Tarrow backward half as far as he could throw a stone. With the last of his wits he gathered himself and ran for the hills, and he did not stop running until the first rays of the sun warmed his face.

Tarrow collapsed and raised his eyes back toward his home. All that remained was a thick plume of smoke rising out of the distance. Everything he had ever known was gone.


Ok, I am throwing my hat in the ring for this one. Hope I am on time!

A. Tessai
B. Tiefling
C. Paladin
D. Probably World Weary
E. In spite of sticking out as a sore thumb with her gray skin, and whipping tail, Tessai never felt unwelcome in Phaendar. Why a demon spawn ever came to live among humans was a matter surprisingly never really much brought to light, at least to her face - to her adopted parents she was a daughter, to other inhabitants she was a hard working girl helping out at the smithy, and to the kids who decided they wanted to measure their strength against the lean, beautiful tiefling, she usually was a nasty surprise. Adolescence brought some troublesome questions, but the answer was even more surprising when Tessai joined the church, leaving her homeland and following the path to become a Paladin, regardless of her heritage. Like many youngsters, she learned you can go far from home to look for something, but sometimes it has been sitting right next to you all along. Tessai has come to understand what it is she truly treasures - family, friends and her hometown, and that is why she has returned to Phaendar.


To help me in my choice I'm going to ask acouple of unorthodox questions.

1. If you're relatively new to pbp, what drew you in? And what makes you think you can stay the course for 2-3 years or longer that it takes for an AP?

2. If you've been on the site playing for a year or so and ate in a handful of games but haven't been playing pbp for multiple years, why do you think games fail? And why do people leave?

3 if you're a long time player and you know what it takes fora successful game why do you quit an AP? What keeps you 'into it'?

4. Finally look over your inactive games if you've applied for a lot and end up quiting or it fails ...why? In other words if there's a huge amount of inactive games whether started by you or applied for by you and there's very little played or finished...why?


Answers:

1. N/A

2. N/A

3. I've been playing Pathfinder for about a decade, PbP for six or seven years. In person I've played, and run, multiple Adventure Paths from start to finish; in PbP I mostly play Society games and don't have much experience with long-term campaigns. Of the few campaigns I've joined online, most of them stopped due to the GM leaving or ending the game prematurely. I'm currently in a Skull & Shackles game that hasn't been going long, but I love the AP (having run it myself in person) and I keep up with it avidly. What keeps me invested is lots of intra-party interaction, I like it when characters not only talk to NPC's but also each other.

4. The vast majority of my inactive games are Society games that finished. The others are mostly games that ended out from under me. The one time I quit a long-term game before it was over was a Shattered Star campaign; I left after about ten months (we had just finished book 1) because I didn't like my character. It taught me more about my own play style-- that character was meant to be light-hearted and a little zany, and I realized the shtick lost its appeal for me fairly quickly. It was the last time I've made that type of character for a campaign.


Why did I forget my towel?!:
I'm a gonna need my computer for this...lol.

Answering from #3 perspective:
I have on these boards PbPing for quite some years. I started playing D&D at age 9. I am extremely experienced, familiarity with the rules, and willing/eager to role-play my characters. I really like to see how they will end up!
I, myself, have only quit 1 PbP game. It was WotR. It started out a mess (with folks RPing in Recruitment), which forced the GM to take on 2 Tables, which suffered for it. I lasted until 3rd level (I believe); when we lost our GM. They were going to look for another, but, unfortunately, I was already pass disenfranchised.
Luckily, I am fortunate to be in another WotR game!

What keeps me engaged is an active Table and a GM not afraid to push the players a bit; when the most opportune moment comes...lol!

#4:
The majority of inactive games are PFS completed scenarios. Some, unfortunately, are games that the GM disappeared, suddenly called it quits, or the 1 I actually left.

Also, you are more than welcome to peruse my games/characters/nonsensical shenanigans!

Happy Hunting!


I play PbP exclusively, and have been on the boards for a few years now. In my experience, nothing kills an AP faster than player or GM apathy. We've all been there. Sometimes RL knocks a key player out or sometimes players or the GM simply lose interest. Posts get shorter and less creative, and it can be either a long slog to campaign death or a quick disbanding.

I have been selective in the games I've applied to, because I know players who spread themselves too thin and I prefer to spend my time developing a few characters, as opposed to just rolling dice more often. I got into a Dead Suns campaign that spanned several years and at one point I was the only active player, but the GM and I both wanted to see it through.

I post frequently. I have the luxury of a work at home job that offers many periods throughout the day where I'm waiting for a database query to execute or a reply on a project request, where I post to the Paizo boards. I can promise I will be one of the more consistent posters to any game I'm involved with.


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I have discussed this many times with others in the boards over the years GMMichael, mainly over PM - I am very happy to see you placing those questions.

I am answering from the 3. and 4. perspective, and I think there is a mix of reasons making PbP games fail. I count myself lucky for being in TWO games which actually reached their conclusion - one shorter module/mini campaign and an actual full AP - Carrion Crown (it is amazing by the way).

- The main reason I think is RL. Fact is, PbP is in the vast majority of cases much slower than your average tabletop, Friday night game. Also, you play it with strangers (apologies if the word is too harsh) instead of friends. In my case, my RPG tabletop group is the same I play card games with, boardgames, go out for drinks, celebrate our kid's birthdays, etc. So we are naturally close, as opposed to the players you meet only in the PbP medium. So for that reason, this amplified time it takes to complete a game in PbP grinds many games to a halt - it is just that: RL + this or that player's diminished availability to post (even worse if that is one of the players that drive the game 'forward' - there are always at least one or two if you are lucky);

- The effect above creates a sort of 'snowball effect'. This is a cooperative game. Players and GM sit together to tell, and play out/act a story all together. Once the driving forces begin dwindling, games start falling apart like decks of cards.

- I have also quit games, mainly because I felt the story was not being told by all. This is hard to put into words, and it has much to do with how my own ideas about being a GM and a player have evolved over many years as a GM/DM. But to summarize, I honestly feel there are many players out there (hope I do not get hate for this) who are simply going through the motions, going through the steps to complete a task. And the task is a game. To give you an idea where I am coming from - I was the GM for my group for many years, starting with D&D Basic Red Box, all the way to Pathfinder. And whenever we sat at the table to play, it was almost always sandbox - it did not matter if I was DMing modules from Forgotten Realms, brilliant adventures from Planescape, or delves like Night Below - we went where the game took us. We never OOC abandoned a task/quest that made sense to the characters because 'it was not part of the main plot' or because 'that is not the plan for the game'. Nope. We always followed wherever the game took us. And that makes for memorable games. Don't get me wrong, I love APs and self contained modules. But I also love flexibility. The game is the game - is it really relevant if you started o what you thought would be a pirate adventure, and yet finished embarking on a memorable adventure embroiled in the Blood War? For me, no. I joined the forums to play RPG, and that is my goal. I am already overextending on this one so I will just shut up - it is just close to home this one.

- Bottom line, and regarding successful games - I think what it takes is a group of like minded people, who understand the nature not only of PbP, but also of real life. If players A and B are usually the driving force of the game, yet they are going through a rough patch at work and cannot play that role, then player C steps up, then the GM, then player A is back to drive the game forward, then player Y, etc. I think a game where everyone understands this (and by 'this' I mean the commitment is from all parts), and also that a game NEEDS to move or it will die - will be a successful one. Couple that with players who (even if they do not have a lot of time to post) will acknowledge what other players and GM have posted, and react accordingly, and not only will you have a successful game, but you will have a GREAT one! Of course, RL can (and will) still happen, and some games will just fall apart because of an 'unfortunate series of events', but then everyone gave it a fair shot and you can just accept that such is life.

Eeeesh, damned wall of text. Sorry for just going on and on guys :P

EDIT: Tarrow nailed regarding apathy. I blame it on my difficulty in being succinct in some matters ;)


answers:

1. If you're relatively new to pbp, what drew you in? And what makes you think you can stay the course for 2-3 years or longer that it takes for an AP?

2. If you've been on the site playing for a year or so and ate in a handful of games but haven't been playing pbp for multiple years, why do you think games fail? And why do people leave?

3 if you're a long time player and you know what it takes fora successful game why do you quit an AP? What keeps you 'into it'?

4. Finally look over your inactive games if you've applied for a lot and end up quiting or it fails ...why? In other words if there's a huge amount of inactive games whether started by you or applied for by you and there's very little played or finished...why?

Answers:
1) Not New, been on the boards for about 10 years almost straight as I took a 5 month PBP break to recover from PBP burnout.

2) I've been in a number of games and I find some players and GMs over extend themselves (mainly the GM over extending), which can lead to PBP burnout for that GM or Player.
Also communication and interaction between players and GM needs to be good, as a player without good communication or interaction my start feeling left out and just drop. This may mean the GM poking the player in game with an NPC to help them feel included and becoming more active.

3) Most of the succussful games I've played in and run, are a blend of the right GM and the right players, with the right level of communication and intereaction from everyone. Reasons some fail is Burn out and the wrong mix of players (including among themselves) and the GM, wrong expectations, character isn't as useful as thought, wanning interest in the game, ... etc just to name a few reasons games fail.

4) When being a player, the game mostly failed when the GM disappeared/canned the game, that and once you get past level 10 things get broken fast and the problem increase exponentially with each new level. Also I find that some GMs and players do get slowly bored with the game and can't keep interest, which I believe is one of the big reasons APs fail, where modules don't. Since modules are smaller and can be wrapped in a year or two before interest wanes too much, where as an AP is a full commitment for nearly a full 20 levels and a long number of years depending on posting rate.
I know the reason for my inactive/failed games with me as GM is that I over extended myself earlier, and thanks to that, I now have a grasp of my PBP game limits, which is quite limited, but means I can be focused on the games I'm in or running since I know the limit and won't try to be in or run more games than the limit even if they are interesting ideas I'd want to try.

Yeah, Tarrow Harfoot and Albion, The Eye, nailed it as I was writing mine up.

It was also a reason I was hoping for a chance to vote on the Serpent's Skull AP, as you can wrap up the first book as it's own story, before interest wanes too much if signs of losing interest appear with the players or GM.


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RHMG Animator wrote:
4) When being a player, the game mostly failed when the GM disappeared/canned the game, that and once you get past level 10 things get broken fast and the problem increase exponentially with each new level.

This is a great point. Some systems just do not scale well once characters get a few levels of experience. I'm thinking 5E Adventures in Middle Earth, but also Starfinder, for the opposite reason.

I think 1st level adventures are usually the most fun. It's like when you're on your own for the first time in real life; everything is a struggle, but you enjoy the little things more.


1. If you're relatively new to pbp, what drew you in? And what makes you think you can stay the course for 2-3 years or longer that it takes for an AP?

I have never played an AP all the way through (though I am in a Ruins or Azlant one that has just started the last book). I rarely pull out of games unless I am just not enjoying it enough and am doggedly persistent in sticking around.

2. If you've been on the site playing for a year or so and ate in a handful of games but haven't been playing pbp for multiple years, why do you think games fail? And why do people leave?

N/A

3 if you're a long time player and you know what it takes fora successful game why do you quit an AP? What keeps you 'into it'?

A successful game requires keeping a decent posting rate. This can very group to group and has been a lot slower the last year or so due to COVID in my experience. Generally one post per/day or every two days seems to be a pretty decent rate for most group and an every other is usually a more reasonable expectation in my experience (combat is the number one killer of momentum so cutting them down somewhat is a very good idea, especially at higher levels where they take even longer). It is also important to not go too fast for everyone. Ideally, unless a couple of players are involved in something on the side, it is best to try and give everyone a reasonable timeframe to post before posting again. Finally use the written story as guidelines and don't be too strict on the rules. RAW/WAI are important but Rule 0 is more important as long as it doesn't ruin the fun for the others.

As an example of the can be seen with Eilyne. Basic Phytokinesis is very weak and not really good for anything much mechanics wise. As part of it in the past Eilyne uses it to make leaves and other plants stick to her to form clothing with. It does very little mechanics wise, isn't that broken since it isn't making cold weather clothes, fits thematically, and gives the chance for entertainment if the effect is somehow disrupted.

Generally when I quit a game, which is very rare, it is because of poor writing. I might be slow to post at times but I try to make quality posts and I expect the same. When I end up in a game where the writers are very bad, i.e. poor grammar, their posts constant one liners, etc, I can get frustrated enough to pull out. Sometimes a game or a character just doesn't work for me, it doesn't have to be the players/GM, the story can just not be engaging enough to me, If it is the character I will often ask to change characters to something I will enjoy more, if it is the story/players/gm I will just pull out.

4. Finally look over your inactive games if you've applied for a lot and end up quitting or it fails ...why? In other words if there's a huge amount of inactive games whether started by you or applied for by you and there's very little played or finished...why?

While a few of my games have completed (and one is entering the home stretch) those that failed have largely been either from player drop out or a GM pulling a disappearing act. Sometimes the majority just have to call it because of IRL changes and, in one case we all agreed to stop and start a new campaign since none of us were enjoying the current one. Overall though it is GM poofing that is the biggest killer IMO, players can be replaced but replacing the GM is much, much harder.


Tarrow Harfoot wrote:
RHMG Animator wrote:
4) When being a player, the game mostly failed when the GM disappeared/canned the game, that and once you get past level 10 things get broken fast and the problem increase exponentially with each new level.

This is a great point. Some systems just do not scale well once characters get a few levels of experience. I'm thinking 5E Adventures in Middle Earth, but also Starfinder, for the opposite reason.

I think 1st level adventures are usually the most fun. It's like when you're on your own for the first time in real life - everything is a struggle, but you enjoy the little things more.

Yeah, part of the problem with characters above level 10, is also the run-away HP problem which slows encounters to a crawl and makes them last much longer then they should.

To which I've been working towards a solution to fix the run-away HP issue and it is a simple one, that lets weapon attacks at least somewhat scale better with levels to keep combat rounds for an encounter in a more manageable count. While also keeping more of the weapon's feel as it did at lower levels


I'll add my name to the growing list.

A. Jarzik
B. Ratfolk
C. Alchemist
D. Frontier Healer (if it will apply to my extracts but it's not technically a spell so it may not) otherwise Ironfang Survivor
E. Peddling my alchemical wares

Answers:

I have been on the boards for 7 years now and played a variety of games - PFS, AP's, and old school conversions. I think my longest game has been about 2 years. I'm currently in an AP that finished the first book which is the furthest I've made it through an AP. The only other time I've made it that far was a tpk in the final fight of the first book. I have never quit a game although at times my posting can be sporadic. I do try not to hold a game up though. If I commit to something, I try to see it through. I like to see my character grow and like to be able to check an adventure off my list of ones to play. Of the 5 games on my campaign tab, 2 are inactive and am waiting for them to fall off.

Most of the non-PFS games have died due to players or the GM dropping the game. Sometimes people over-commit to the number of games they are in and realize they can't keep up. I find that trying to replace a player can work sometimes but rarely will a new GM successfully take over a game.


Thoughts:
3. I can't claim to know what makes a successful game, but I've been playing and running games on these forums for a few years now so I guess that puts me in this category. XD

I often find myself struggling in an adventure when I make a character that's nice and doesn't cause problems. I think I do this because I want to be a nice person to play with, and because I tend to be a quiet person in general. But this means that my characters don't want anything, or they only want it on paper rather than wanting it in practice. Herman is an excellent foil to these tendencies because he very much wants things and isn't afraid to let that be known. And when someone knows what you want, they can try to either help you get it or get in your way - and that's exciting and interesting and makes for fun gameplay. It was wonderful to play this character before and I hope he'll get to live again someday.

To be honest, the biggest factor behind why a number of APs I've participated in are no longer active is due to something coming up for the GM. Maybe life got busy, or maybe they're not having fun but don't know how to say it. I've not left an adventure that's still ongoing, so I don't have any experience there.

4. Like several others, the vast majority of my inactive campaigns are PFS scenarios that have been completed. There are two adventures where I was GMing that are no longer active - one was a module where my GM style and the players' expectations about dungeon exploration weren't a good fit and then one player had to withdraw due to IRL complications, and the other was the evil AP that I started as a favor for a friend but quickly discovered that I couldn't be the supportive GM I needed to be for evil characters and had to pass the campaign off to a friend. But very few of the campaigns listed as inactive died before coming to their intended conclusion.


GMMichael wrote:


3 if you're a long time player and you know what it takes fora successful game why do you quit an AP? What keeps you 'into it'?

4. Finally look over your inactive games if you've applied for a lot and end up quiting or it fails ...why? In other words if there's a huge amount of inactive games whether started by you or applied for by you and there's very little played or finished...why?

3. Over the years, I have only ever bowed out of 2 games. 1 was due to not being able to keep up with the pace of the game (the DM and one player were posting 5-10 times a day and it wasn't fun to feel like a supporting character in someone else's story) and another was due to the DM's posting style (poor formatting, spelling and grammar) that made it difficult to follow. All I'm looking for is a reasonable pace to keep me engaged (DM post every 1-2 days). DM guidance and direction also helps, as I find that PbPs tend to get bogged down when there is a lot of discussion on what to do next.

4. As a player, all but two (mentioned above) of the inactive games are due to the DM disappearing or quitting. As a DM, the games that I shuttered were due to players disappearing or losing interest, after a certain point it's easier to start something new than to just keep re-recruiting. My current longest running campaign is a Shattered Star campaign that started in 2013 and we're just about to start the final book. Same 4 PCs that started and they are about to hit level 16.


Answers:

One and two no longer apply to me I guess. So.. for the other two questions?

3. I think the most successful games I've been lucky enough to be a part of were that because of a mix of balance and luck (Luck largely because Real Life happens). I've been fortunate to have some great GMs and co-players who know how to keep the action flowing by example with openings for everyone to chime in ICly or what not. Speaking for myself personally, I react well to a sense of achievement, not for just MY character, but for the group. A sense that the setting is BETTER for the characters having been there.

4. I've had some great game masters who got HAMMERED by Real life just as they were getting a game going. Medical problems with them or their family members, sudden moves, legal woes, job demands increased without warning. If it happens to the GM, or enough players, it can have an effect. APs can be really tricky for this reason. They take a long time, so the odds are greater for player or even GM loss. There's also a matter of fun not being had. I've seen some Game masters and player groups that had different expectations but didn't realize it until it was too late. It stopped being fun for the GM or players, and what should be a game became nothing but a chore. It has to be fun for the GM or what's the point? And I quite understand when a GM or player has to say "Sorry, this isn't working for me " and withdraws

Sorry for the wall o text


Well said Ridge, I recall switching GM's twice (with both saying they were withdrawing at least instead of disappearing) within the opening of Kingmaker before we got a one that really clicked and got through Book 1 and into Book 2 before that game ended with the GM giving a withdrawal notice due to RL.

Oddly I re-read that Campaign just this past month.


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1. If you're relatively new to pbp, what drew you in? And what makes you think you can stay the course for 2-3 years or longer that it takes for an AP?

N/A

2. If you've been on the site playing for a year or so and ate in a handful of games but haven't been playing pbp for multiple years, why do you think games fail? And why do people leave?

N/A

3 if you're a long time player and you know what it takes fora successful game why do you quit an AP? What keeps you 'into it'?

Along with several other systems, I've been playing PF for about... 10 years? Somewhere around there. Most of it has been PbP, with a smattering of face to face. I haven't used the Paizo forums much, but I'm active on a couple other PbP sites, and I've been in quite a few games. It's rare for me to quit an AP. I've had a couple where real-world medical issues just made posting regularly an issue, and a couple where the GM turned out to be an unpleasant person. No gaming is better than bad gaming, in those cases.

What keeps me into a game is the people I'm playing with. Most of the APs tell good stories, and that's a definite plus, but if all I wanted was a story I could read a novel. Even just quiet RP moments, or the ways personalities mesh (or don't!) is fun and motivating for me. PC-to-PC roleplay is the real meat and potatoes of a game, and if that side of things is compelling I'll happily play for ages.

4. Finally look over your inactive games if you've applied for a lot and end up quiting or it fails ...why? In other words if there's a huge amount of inactive games whether started by you or applied for by you and there's very little played or finished...why?

In my experience, PbP games die like flies, and die quickly.

For example, I've been in five PbP Curse of the Crimson Throne campaigns. The most successful made it all the way to fighting Gaedren Lamm, the boss of part one of book one. I would love to have an AP actually be the years-long commitment people say they are, because 90% of the ones I've played died in a month or two, if that. It's a special thing to actually get a long-term game, but they're often lightning in a bottle and the result of a lot of behind-the-screen work. I'm running one long-term game myself, a homebrew world 5e game, and you really get a sense for how fragile PbP is when you're the one running things.

Almost all my unfinished games ended because the GM vanished, or had some real-world issue come up. The latter is just life, but the former are disheartening. Player attrition is a pain, but there's always someone willing to step in. I've never had a game die because we lost too many players, just paused to re-recruit (and re-re-recruit, and...).

If there are any specific weak points for me, really big dungeon crawls, the room-by-room, clear out the fifth bunch of random orcs, "hurray, onto the fifth floor!" "What's up there?" "More orcs!" type, absolutely kill morale and motivation. I've never quit a game because of one, but boy have I wanted to. I think they're a poor fit with PbP pacing, where being in combat for months at a time is a distinct possibility, depending on posting speed. I love a neat build and cleverness in combat as much as anyone, but making the XP number get bigger isn't a reason to play on its own. The characters and their story are.


Answers to unorthodox questions:
Hey there! Great, thought-provoking questions. I think many of the others summarized much of what I'd say, so I won't create a wall-o-text to muddy the waters further.

I've been in 4 APs which all failed for mostly the GM losing interest, and one from the players losing focus - I'll admit I didn't help as I was playing a character who had a lot of catching up to do, and chose poorly in character creation for the world the GM had built. I haven't quit on an AP, and I like to check the boards frequently during my work day, so I don't have problems getting involved in the game. But a good character, even just in mind, even if it doesn't fully materialize on paper is pretty important. Stats matter much less to me in PbP than the concept of the character, since that's what you are playing really.

I really think it is a social contract at work here. The GM wants to tell a story, and the players want to experience that story and add to it with their own characters; and I think that investment is the best part of pbp. I don't really have time in my life for IRL games anymore, and with my work schedule its been impossible (also thanks COVID). So the unstated social interaction and communal storytelling is the most important part of the durability of PbP games, and creating a 'can do' setting between players and GM.

k hope you enjoyed my thoughts...


answers:
1. If you're relatively new to pbp, what drew you in? And what makes you think you can stay the course for 2-3 years or longer that it takes for an AP?

A. I am relatively new to it and honestly it intrigues me how the pacing of a game goes like this but i can say it would take some effort to just keep at it for a whole AP

2. If you've been on the site playing for a year or so and ate in a handful of games but haven't been playing pbp for multiple years, why do you think games fail? And why do people leave?

A. Honestly i would say is because PBP requires a certain kind of person that has the patience and can engage with it, this means people unable to engage with it eventually grow bored or dissatisfied with the game and choose to leave.

3 if you're a long time player and you know what it takes fora successful game why do you quit an AP? What keeps you 'into it'?

A. It would honestly come to a combination of both Players and DM, even if the DM does an impressive job telling an engaging story and making the AP his own, if the rest of the group make the experience bad it can't be helped, the same is true for a DM that does a poor job and treats the game as a Videogame in which the NPC's don't feel like people and more like bad programmed AI that don't bother to interact with the players or if the DM actively tries to punish Player Agency to benefit the story both parties have to work together and if the dissonace is too great between individual players or between the players as a whole and the DM it eventually leads to the game failling

4. Finally look over your inactive games if you've applied for a lot and end up quiting or it fails ...why? In other words if there's a huge amount of inactive games whether started by you or applied for by you and there's very little played or finished...why?

A. I am really new to PBP, but i have mainly played through Discord and VTT and most of my games that haven't involved friends have collapsed horribly or i have quit due to DM's having commitment and/or scheduling issues, people constantly ghosting the group, DM being kind of tyrannical and punishing players that interacted with NPC's for clues or plainly some players being completely horrible and taking the enjoyment out of the game for me


Replies to GmMichael:

2. From what I see, games fail because the GM calls it. Looking at my history, there are currently 8 active campaigns. One of those (Rappan Athuk) is dying because we haven't heard from the GM in weeks. I think you can almost always recruit new players if someone drop (4 of the campaigns I'm in, I joined this way - RoW, SS, LoF, Rise...).

Looking at my inactive list, 12 games. 2 were me screwing around to see if I could get the system to set up a single game with multiple discussion and gameplay threads. Two more were thread switches (Lost Kingdom of the Linnorm > Yggsdreth's Fearsome Five and Against the Giants table two > ADQ Table 2), for board structure reasons. The other 6 were the GM saying they couldn't /Wouldn't continue... or simply dissappearing.

3. The one game I quit was Ruins of Empire. The campaign stopped because I called it, as the last player. We were not successful in recruiting more players... I am not a fan of GM and 1 player. Without at least 1 more player to bounce off of, it becomes... sterile.

Silver Crusade

Answers 3 and 4.

combined answer 3&4:

It varies. I have bowed out of a few games over my time here. For many different reasons, ranging from RL responsibilities taking up more time (and me being inexperienced at time management at the time), to just not being able to get into the story/feel of the game, to "burnout". A lot of my inactive games are merely ones where the GM disappeared, or that were concluded. Some are ones I had to leave due to life years ago, (I've been a member of the boards since about 2013, I think) I struggled with depression for a time several years back, during which I was away from the boards for a rather extended period of time and so left a few games. I've also left one game on the boards whose posting rate I just could not keep up with. So yes, I have left games, for one reason or another, though the majority of my inactives are due to other circumstances. I have also left one game some time ago because I didn't post in it for a period of time, and felt self-conscious about coming back to it after that. Thats perhaps silly I know, but it happened. As far as what keeps me interested? well, you can tell if a GM is putting in effort, and that certainly helps. I enjoy good characters and a decent flow of the story/narrative. I like some direction, flow, and narrative. I also see combat as a way to potentially further define characters and tell story. I enjoy the mechanic/combat side of the game as well as the RP/story side, though normally only when furthering the story. I also think pacing is important. I've always noticed higher activity in games after large "treasure" rooms, completing an "arc", and/or after leveling up. Perhaps it is merely the type of games I played when I was younger, but I enjoy progress I enjoy feeling like we are progressing the story/narrative and that our choices can have an effect on said narrative. I also have a drive to know, I haven't actually finished many APs, so I always have a drive to stick around and see the story. Which is perhaps why I could lose some steam if it feels like nothing is "getting done" so to speak. Though that is rarely an issue.

1. flow, the games that get bogged down, either in combat, or due to some other thing have a rough time keeping players from my experience.

2. Direction. Sandbox/openworld is all well and good, especially in an in person game, but I've noticed that PbP games where the GM has a more "hands off" touch, seem to struggle at times. Especially when you spend 1-2 weeks trying to hash out what you are going to do, not to mention actually starting and doing it. A small bit of rail-roading is healthy in PbP IMO to move things along or help direct a group.

3. Disjointed. I've left one or two games, largely because the entire feel of it was off. Either because the narrative was too choppy, seeming to skip, or just felt forced/contrived.

Sovereign Court

Unorthodox questions.

1. If you're relatively new to pbp, what drew you in? And what makes you think you can stay the course for 2-3 years or longer that it takes for an AP?

I am not new to pbp.

2. If you've been on the site playing for a year or so and are in a handful of games but haven't been playing pbp for multiple years, why do you think games fail? And why do people leave?

I'm in category three but I still think I know the answer to this: real life gets in the way.

3 if you're a long time player and you know what it takes for a successful game why do you quit an AP? What keeps you 'into it'?

I think the key things is both players (including the GM) and characters that work together.

The last AP I left was a Curse of the Crimson Throne campaign. The players were great but the other characters were evil/selfish types. I don't like playing that kind of game and had invested a lot into creating my PC. She achieved her aim (rescuing her adopted son) and then left the adventure. I turned her and her son into PFS characters because I wanted to keep on playing them.

In my longest running game (that reached book 5 of Kingmaker) we all enjoyed discussing and goofing in the comments together (by the end, we were making throwback comments to events from years earlier) and had found a way to gel our various characters. It probably helped that we had common goals and a common vision for what we wanted our kingdom to become. We also had a neat mix of very straight characters (our paladin and cleric) and characters who could goof at times (our ranger, mostly).

4. Finally look over your inactive games if you've applied for a lot and end up quiting or it fails ...why? In other words if there's a huge amount of inactive games whether started by you or applied for by you and there's very little played or finished...why?

I'm not in this category either but I have thoughts.

I have a long list of inactive games because I have played a lot of PFS scenarios to their conclusion.

Looking at homebrew, I have played some great little campaigns that reached a conclusion but sometimes that conclusion was inspired by the GM's need to reduce/end their time GMing PbP.

With APs, I have played in a few where the GM has just run out of time/energy/whatever and decided to call it quits.
I tried to take over one where the GM and a key player both left but that fizzled out.
I GMed the first book of Council of Thieves but then I got a new job and was really, really busy and had to stop. I couldn't justify the time.
I actually took a break from the boards for a couple of years at that point.

My overwhelming experience is that the GM does the most work, has the most pressure and is the hardest to replace. I have GMed modules on the boards and that is much harder work than being a player.

When PbP games fail, it tends to be because the GM has IRL reaons why they cannot commit the necessary time to the game. Players can leave and be replaced, usually for the same IRL reasons, but the GM is the key.


Answers:

I've only been on the boards for a little under two years now, but mostly started with playing the PACG (the card game) on here.

Like a lot of people have mentioned, I've noticed a lot of burnout. When COVID hit, all my gaming has moved online which is probably what most people did as well. When this happened, I think a lot of people overcommit or didn't realize the load they could handle. They don't respond for a few days, then the time between posts grows till its weeks between posts. It slowly spirals down, losing momentum, until the game finally collapses

Despite this, I'm optimistic and committed to a game once I start. I love telling stories, especially with other people. I have yet to complete an AP (furthest I've done is an IRL RotRL game where we completed two books). Currently in a WotR campaign on here and we're halfway through book 2. Though we've had some hiccups along the way, we're all committed till the end.

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