Curse of the Crimson Throne

Game Master Whack-a-Rogue

While the optimizer in me says that you are 100% correct, Torsten is too focused on not aging to spend that kind of cash now. And yes, Ril is a good influence on him on not being too mercenary

Said the guy who'll live to be 400 easy. :P

Yeah, I'm just trying to make sure I can do it as soon as I hit 7, which is when I'm getting that feat.

Is it totally nuts that RIl has been doodling little hearts on her Trapper folders inside which is "Prodigy Magus"? I'm legit thinking of switching the Ranger side over to take levels in that instead (maybe after level 8), if I can figure how to work around the Intelligence thing.

As I looked at the Prodigy, I noticed an odd interaction there. The Martial Path, Path of the Duelist, makes several references to spell combat abilities, but Prodigy eliminates spell combat (I think it was that Imbuements replace it). Either 1) this is intentional and the Prodicy won't get the path abilities that refer to spell combat, or 2) the Martial Path needs some wording that works around that.

Even if I don't go here, another proofreading victory. :)

Good find! I'll need to consider my options in that regard. Prodigy is a "Champions" base class that I thought made more sense as an archetype - just like the Brawler, Paladin/Champion, and Warpriest. As such, there's bound to be some awkwardness.

I don't think I've actually explained my take on Ril's version of 'Witness the City.' Since it's magical instead of mundane, I've decided it's supernatural in origin. More specifically, the information's coming from your shared connection to the evils in the city: Zellara.

OK, cool. It was very clear that whatever was happening, this version of the spell isn't "off the rack." :D

EDIT to add: so do I know it's Zellara? Or at least something using her likeness? #paranoid

Whether Ril knows or not is up to you. Zellara's also the originator of each book's Harrow bonus and can assist with the identification of magic items.

I think Ril thinks this might not be Zellara, but rather something using her likeness to communicate with her. To Yhrrilka's thinking, Zellara should have gone on to the Boneyard.

GM, if I decide to run up some Prodigy levels, would you be amenable to my using the "original recipe" Prodigy? I'd use your version that's a Magus archetype, but that version is Int-focused, and the original allows a choice of ability scores to use for caster ability.

EDIT TO ADD: how long does it take for the Extensive Wardrobe Tattoo to change one's outfit? Asking for a friend.

Yes, and a Standard Action.

Cool, good to know. (Prepares to spend 175 gp as soon as we have downtime.)

One last question. If (and only if) you would like to see some 'test drive' miles on your version of the magus, could I use the Prodigy archetype, just with Charisma casting? I'll be happy to just not use any incompatible features, until you've got something you want to try (like the way the Magus Path of the Duelist doesn't quite work with Prodigy because they don't have spell combat, so I just don't use the Path, it's not what I'm there for anyway). LMK which way you'd prefer.

That's perfectly acceptable. USoP allows for flexible casting attributes, and while I don't use it by default, it's always an option if it helps a player better match their concept. If you're envisioning a "blue mage"-esque Prodigy, Charisma casting makes perfect sense.

My initial thought is for the Prodigy to not gain a Magus Path or spell combat. That's the simplest fix. Plus, like you've alluded, the entire point of the Prodigy is to play with sequences and combos.

OK, thanks! I'm going to do some number-wrangling, see if I like what a Ranger|Prodigy/Sorcerer bring to the table. At first glance, the removal of Path and Spell combat works fine, at least for this use. We'll find out, right? :) I figure I've got a little time, we're probably far enough from hitting 7 that I'll have plenty of time to chew on this.

"Blue mage" Sorry man, I've gone 404 over that one.

I'll have to go back and look, I think at some point early in the process of putting together Ril, you might have actually suggested the Prodigy for her. But a year ago, I was in a different place with my level of understanding of Spheres material. XD

To the spreadsheets!

Blue Mage: a class from 'Final Fantasy' that can replicate the abilities of monsters via observation.

As a way of explanation for that post: in my head canon, many of T’s runes accelerate natural healing via magic. Before he crafted the runes which allow him to heal, he did indeed have to learn how the body heals. And to craft the Rune of Purity (ie: as a monk he is immune to disease) he had to learn how the body fights disease. So it isn’t really bluffing when he talked about that.

The actual bluff is that his knowledge is purely theoretical. He understands, and he has read up on all of this, but he has never actually treated a patient. His studies, and magic, is very selfish in that regard.

Anyways, long story short: it’s a bluff to call himself a physician, even though he has the knowledge.

Blue Mage: a class from 'Final Fantasy' that can replicate the abilities of monsters via observation.

So Taskmaster in fantasy form. (And not this newfangled movie version, either. I remember him back when Val Cooper had him giving John Walker shield lessons in exchanged for reducing his sentence.) /so_old

As a way of explanation for that post: in my head canon, many of T’s runes accelerate natural healing via magic. Before he crafted the runes which allow him to heal, he did indeed have to learn how the body heals. And to craft the Rune of Purity (ie: as a monk he is immune to disease) he had to learn how the body fights disease. So it isn’t really bluffing when he talked about that.

The actual bluff is that his knowledge is purely theoretical. He understands, and he has read up on all of this, but he has never actually treated a patient. His studies, and magic, is very selfish in that regard.

Anyways, long story short: it’s a bluff to call himself a physician, even though he has the knowledge.

Contrast that with Ril, who has a decent amount of, what I guess one would consider "frontier medicine" knowledge (a few ranks in Heal as a class skill), backed up by her magic, her stubborn "I want you to be better damnit" form.

So I think I could make changing Ril's martial side to Magus (Prodigy) work pretty well. I'd lose the following:

• Future BAB increases are on the 3/4 track (mildly distressing, but I'm thinking the insight bonuses from Inspired Sequence will probably make that back up?).

• No more good Reflex save progression (Dex is still her best score and I've got 6 levels under my belt of good saves, so not dreadful).

• I net -2 skill points/level (Okay that hurts, but I'll make it work. Can the Cunning feat be taken multiple times, like Toughness can?) I don't gain any new class skills out of the Magus, oh well. :)
  

I think that's all pretty workable. Now, on to reading about Gestalt Spheres characters:

* I seem to use the better Caster level from either side of the gestalt, which will always be the Sorcerer. Rock on. (There are some things, like Sequence imbuements, that specifically say they use class level, that seems pretty in line, not a problem.)

* I get Talents from both classes as usual, and you don't double-dip on the +2 Talents from casting tradition.

* Do I get Spell pools from both sides? And the bonus SPs from Casting Tradition apply to each total? Man, that's a hell of a lot of spell points! At 7, as R6|Mg1/Sor7 with 18 Cha, that shakes out as: Magus 1 (1 level + 4 Cha + 1 bonus) = 6, plus Sorcerer 7 (7 level + 4 Cha + 4 bonus) = 15, 6+15 = 21, do I have this right?

I don't think I'm missing anything else. If I am, LMK and I'll note it accordingly. Thanks!

I'm really not sure how good of an idea that is. Losing out on BaB, sneak attack progression and studied target progression? That's alot. While you'd get insight bonuses, it doesn't make up for all of that, especially as it means power attack levels up slower as well.

On top of that losing skill points and reflex saves? Personally, I'd stick with Ranger/Sorcerer. And given that ranger gives spell points too, I'd personally switch out sorcerer before I switched out Ranger.

Actually, Ranger does not give spell points (YBD's version isn't a caster). As for Power Attack, I haven't used it yet (to be sure, I probably should be using it more, but it's felt like the bulk of my damage has been coming from other sources, to the point where I'd rather have the to-hit; I've got to do a little more homework on that).

I'll chew it over more, because you raise some valid concerns, but I think (what I get) approx. = (what I give up).

EDIT TO ADD: I think MCing the caster side of the gestalt would be a worse mistake than what I'm planning, as BAB stacks but CLs don't.

Just a quick heads-up that I'm not particularly "with it" today. Work was rough, and I'm crashing pretty hard. As such, I can't guarantee a post today and might have to push it back to tomorrow.

That's fine man. Feel better, that's the most important thing. We'll be here.

I have returned! Taking the day off from posting was exactly what I needed. XD I'll update Gameplay shortly.

Like Torsten brought up, replacing your Ranger levels with Prodigy results in losing a lot. In my opinion, the biggest ones are Studied Target and Favored Community.

To answer your questions, I don't believe either Cunning or Toughness can be taken multiple times. When gestalting spherecasters, I believe you gain a spell pool (with bonus SPs) from both sides. It seems to be the equivalent of a gestalt Wizard//Sorcerer having a bazillion spell slots.

I like what Ranger has done for me so far, it's laid a nice base, but I really don't feel like taking (m)any more class levels. That Proficient practitioner progression feels like it's bottlenecking me. Another option I'd considered was, instead of Magus, have Ril take up Fighter levels on that side (maybe she swallows her terrasque-sized pride and goes to Vencarlo to see if he can teach her anything worth knowing). At least that way I'm not losing BAB in the process.

That Proficient practitioner progression...

(re-reads post)

As it looks like we're at an impasse, I'll mention that this is the point in the AP where the party has to decide how far they're willing to go to help their city. Taking unsanctioned action that involves city officials is a decidedly unlawful act and a step toward vigilantism. Are you mild-mannered tattooists? Or are you the next Blackjack? XD

Tattooists!

…right?

<looks at Ril with worry>

<_<

>_>

I, uhhh, LOOK OVER THERE!

(throws smoke bomb, runs)

(comes out forgetting she's still wearing Darkwing Dove mask)

"Okay, I think I've got a plan, but you may not like it..."

Gameplay post coming later, I'm still mulling over ideas.

Torsten has +2 Stealth. He has a bright orange beard, is covered in tattoos, and is built like a brick house. Despite being unarmored, he is not stealthy. And all of his magic is geared towards making other people explode and to keep himself from exploding.

I fear that this is going to be one of those it counts as stealth if nobody is alive to tell about it moments.

"I GOT A 4!"

My worry here is as much about being recognized as it is being seen, that's why I'm also keen on the disguise other potions. I'd like to avoid escalating into slaughtering the entire joint if it can be helped.

Good idea on disguise other. If we are certainly going to be seen, they might at least see someone else.

Plus, that end of things will last for 30min in potion form, and doesn't get cut short by attacks. Just don't do anything too... signature.

(Ril looks at Energy Strike, cries)

Well...I've never used cold energy before. Alter Self. Pale dwarf, almost blue skin, with an ice white beard, who freezes people when he hits them. How could that be Torsten? He's got a bright orange beard, is covered in tattoos, and has only been seen using electricity and fire!

#best disguise ever

I will repeat, Disguise Other I think is the spell of choice, based on longer duration (Alter Self is another 1 min/level option). 30 min vs 3 min. Is there a downside I'm missing?

Hmmm....

If you're disguising yourself as some sort of Rime Dwarf, maybe I lean in the other direction and disguise as an Ifrit, make us out as some sort of wacky themed villains?

This is where I miss having Disguise as a class skill!

Serious question: if we find evidence of wrongdoing, what are we doing about it? Jailbreak? Get folks out, and get them to the Marshal?

EDIT TO ADD: I'm still thinking that before we get caught up in that, the first thing we have to do is figure out whether there's anything to find there, and if so, where it is. Reconnaissance before infiltration.

In the Batman themed adventure we have here, being a pair of tacky villains is perfect.

And yes…reconnaissance, with the goal of getting evidence to where it needs to be. Unless something happens that makes T or R so murderously angry that we decide that a killing spree is the lawful good choice.

I'm sensing a real desire to see the "killing spree" option happen. /curious

I've played City of Heroes/Villains on and off since 2004, this is what I was made for!

The wording isn't perfect, but hopefully you get the gist. XD
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Insert Ritual Name Here*
Sphere: Divination; Ritual Level: 4
Casting Time: 1 hour
Components: V, S, M (obsidian shards coated in gum arabic, collectively worth 50gp)
Description: You imbue one of your eyes with limited sentience, so you can pluck it out and allow it to move on its own. While detached, the eye has 4 HP (subtracted from your own HP), is invisible, and has a fly speed of 30ft (perfect). It sees exactly as you would see if you were there.

While your eye is detached, you are dazzled and cannot deal precision damage. If you close one of your eyes (once per round), these penalties are negated, but you lose vision in that eye until you open it again.

The ritual ends when your eye is destroyed or returns to your body.

I am now armed with enough information to do something really gross! XD

I like "Wandering eye" as a name for that ritual. What's it going to cost me to acquire that?

Gameplay post coming ASAP, tonight at the latest.

EDIT TO ADD: ugh, I just realized I can't do that until level 8 (as it's a level 4 ritual). Is there a way around that?

I'll be ignoring ritual prereqs for the most part during this campaign since neither of you is a spellbook user. Instead, like the one above, I'll make something custom that I'm comfortable with at your level. XD

I'll be ignoring ritual prereqs for the most part during this campaign since neither of you is a spellbook user. Instead, like the one above, I'll make something custom that I'm comfortable with at your level. XD

Much appreciated. That said, I would 100% be okay with trying it as a scroll (level check vs scroll's caster level +1, so in this case 1d20+6 vs DC 9). The idea of Ril putting a series of ritual ink marks around her eye that amount to "cut here" is kinda cool, if gross. :O

That is fine as well. XD

Take that and possessed hand feat tree. Send your hand and eye on a buddy-cop scouting mission.

I'm imagining it'd look like Thing from the Addams Family with a little backpack for the eye, sneaking around to the tune of Harold Faltermeyer's "Axel F."

So thanks for that. :P

EDIT: "We're not gonna fall for the eyeball in the tailpipe..."

Given what Ril was doing, I just had to give a shout-out to Gruumsh, who I imagine as like a Jason Voorhees of the Golarion Orcish pantheon.

oD

^a one eyed smile

Before I update Gameplay, approximately what time is it? Due to the shopping trip and ritual time, it's completely up to you.

Hmm, dunno for sure. Time to shop, an hour for the ritual, mid to late afternoon? Torsten, got two cents to throw at this?

Shopping for expensive potions on foot and doing it in a discrete way
Performing a ritual that involves taking your own eye out

...I'd say that this is late afternoon or later. Perhaps dinner time by the time we are ready.

I, for one, would take a long, long time ensuring that this ritual was being done perfectly, and that is after making sure that I was confident it would work. Hence why I'd think that this would be later.

TEMPORARILY taking out my own eye! I feel that's worth emphasizing. :)

But sure, that makes sense. Let's say early evening, then. That's reasonable.

EDIT TO ADD: I have had Axel F going through my head most of the past 24 hours since I posted that. Did myself in there.

Just waiting for an official "We're heading out to do the thing" post. XD