|
I asked a question about why you, Hannar, initiated lethal force against people who hadn't yet attacked us. Answer it or don't, but there is no cause to accuse me of bullying.
I expressed an opinion about the impact of killing people on our mission's success. Namely, that it can cause complications and hurt the Society's image. Do what you want, but I'm not going to stop offering that opinion if I think your actions will sabotage our mission.
Saying "That course of action is not likely to help us" is neither bullying nor being a jerk. It is perfectly legitimate for characters to have discussions and disagreements about the right way to proceed.
Murder has consequences.
Pathfinders do not have license to kill.
And while I don't know the laws of Trollheim, using lethal force is still using lethal force even if you don't go all the way through to killing them. At this point, after we initiated lethal force, they are responding in kind. So it may be we have no choice - but Kavor Doan is heavily armored and has a ton of HP, so he can't really claim he's in fear for his life.
I do appreciate your comments and I am not trying to be a jerk. I am doing my best to Explore, Report, Cooperate. To me, the Cooperate part means doing what I can to ensure we succeed at our mission. Unnecessary murder seems to reduce that chance of success.
|
Hannar will continue to take 5' steps until he can exit the building. He will not be attacking anything along the way. I don't care if he makes it out or dies in the process.
Feel free to bot me until I am done either way, then remove me from this game. I don't care if I don't get credit.
I will not let another player tell me what I can and cannot do. Goodbye.
|
|
My two cents and me trying to be neutral.
If you can't have her deal NL, have her get out of the fight. We've got this.
Could be seen as telling another player how to play his character. Not saying that it how it was meant, but with play by post/text format, tone does not always translate.
Aside from that, I do not see anyone else telling anyone how to play their characters. He was questioning tactics and has a right to do so, just as anyone else.
Now, Kavor is right, lethal actions can impact a mission. And if we started using lethal force, they would respond, which I am not sure if they had. Been busy playing catch up, hence why Darven just socked a guy in the jaw instead of drawing steel.
Hannar, has a point that if they have lethal and non-lethal, they can drop quicker and are able to be stabilized and recover quicker with the cushion. If we do drop one and they are dying, I am pretty sure we have the means to stabilize them.
Now if you choose to step away, I wish you best and hope to game with you again. Either way, let us move on and have fun. This is only part 1 of 3.
|
|
Yeah, Darven, I can see that. I probably didn't phrase that as well as I could have. I tried to make my Discussion posts more reasoned and level-headed.
I understand Loni's predicament and limited options and am not going to raise a fuss if we end up leaving them all unconscious with a mix of lethal and NL damage. While it might have caused less complications had the boar just sat it out or just used Aid Another and flanking, I also understand that everybody wants to participate. So we'll muddle through as best as we can.
Hi everyone. I think the problem here was that Kavor's advice was interpreted as a command. Because written text is hard to interpret, it is important to be clear when you want to discuss tactics, because it's all too easy to miss subtle cues we take for granted in face-to-face conversation.
"Should we really use lethal damage in town during a bar brawl? Well, they do intend to kill us. Okay, you use lethal and I'll use nonlethal damage so we can KO them faster." Something like this will give everyone a chance to contribute to the conversation, rather than feel they need to defend their actions.
A quick look behind the curtain, here: The scenario, as written, has these enemies use lethal force (the Gorum priest's greatsword isn't for show.) It was clear they were going to attack you, and this bar has a bad reputation for constant brawls.
Hannar, you'll get full credit for Shades of Ice 1, I'll PM you when I send the chronicles. If you change your mind and continue before part 2 begins you are of course welcome to continue playing. But if you don't think it's going to work out, then I hope you continue to have fun playing Pathfinder.
I'll give you all an extra day to post actions before we move ahead.
|
|
Chadius, thanks for your reasoned thoughts here. There probably isn't much more that needs to be said, other than that it sucks that we had this misunderstanding, but that I think this was just a misunderstanding, and I think we can move past it.
Hannar, I hope you stick around and model the kind of good player behavior that you want to see.
|
...Aid Another and flanking...
Small mechanical note... as written, in Core there is no way I can issue an Aid or Flank command to an animal companion without using a Push (which is the DC 25 I'm trying to make for nonlethal too), as neither of those commands exist in the Core rulebook.
Now, for flank, I could have the animal companion stand there and other people can move into position, but it really doesn't make much sense in-character to have a boar just stand there for flanking purposes.
(Back to the situation at hand, I was pretty sure it was a misunderstanding on parts of all parties... usually is ;) )
No worries, everyone. I've been in situations where a written message doesn't convey the meaning I meant to write, or only I understood what I wrote. Sometimes I was able to get forgiveness, and sometimes it was just better to walk away.
I've also been in situations where the GM disappeared and all the PCs were put on edge as a result.
The important part is that everyone here has fun, whether they continue playing with the team or go elsewhere.
|
|
Small mechanical note... as written, in Core there is no way I can issue an Aid or Flank command to an animal companion without using a Push (which is the DC 25 I'm trying to make for nonlethal too), as neither of those commands exist in the Core rulebook.
I actually have a slightly different opinion about this, and it's up to Chadius how this gets interpreted in our game.
My opinion is that, since the CORE ruleset doesn't include Aid and Flank as tricks, that these are included in the options one can use with the Attack trick. I.e. any combat tactic not specifically called out as a trick can be used via Attack. In the non-CORE ruleset, you have to take the Flank trick to instruct your companion to flank, but in CORE, you can do that with the Attack trick.
In other words, it's not that Aid and Flank tricks are choices that you can't choose, it's that they don't exist at all in this particular multiverse, so their actions aren't excluded by the rules.
I'm kind of not a fan of them being tricks at all in Standard, tbh. (I mean, a pack of boars instinctively knows to flank their prey. They don't need to be taught this.)
|
|
I admit to being a bit hot-headed.
In a past game one of the "Core" characters was a Paladin of some "Deity" that I had never heard off, thus being a Non-Core character, that started the session off by informing the rest of us that "If any of you want me to heal you, you have to do a favor for me at a future time that I will decide at the time.". I considered this to be Blackmail as did another player, but the GM thought it was amusing and allowed the player to continue.
As a result, I get shorty tempered when I think someone is ordering me to play my character the way They think I should.
I am sorry in my part of this misunderstanding. It is usually not my nature to do so. Anyone who has played with me before should tell you the same.
|
|
Hannar, I have both played with and GM'd for you. Same goes for Kovar and pretty much, if not everyone at this table. Lets leave this in the past and finish this.
Chadius, thanks for your patience and insight.
Loni, on the CORE rules not containing those tricks. I would do exactly as you did and "push" per the handle animal, to eventually get the boar in position.
By the way, is Shades of Ice part of the Gameday? We'll definitely have part 1 wrapped up before the end.
1) I'll be busy on Friday up until Tuesday morning. I should have some free time Sunday night and Monday afternoon, so apologies if I slow down next weekend.
2) This is the final encounter of Shades of Ice part 1. Please double check your character information that you posted or PMed me with, that's what I will submit unless you post corrections or updates.
3) It looks like this game was part of gameday. Please roll a 1d20. If you get a 19 or 20, you get a boon. Roll 1d4 after that to see what you get. I'll roll mine first.
4) It sounds like you want to continue through the entire trilogy. If you're not continuing to part 2, feel free to PM me.
Kavor, can you PM me the email address you want the boon sent to? Thanks!
Thanks for the reminders, folks.
As a side note, my posting will be slow over the weekend. I'll probably be busy making your chronicle sheets for part 1, anyway. So we'll pick up on Part 2 next week (unless you all miss this guy)
I have some free time, so I made the chronicles. Once we finish the battle I'll submit boons.
CLICK HERE to download your chronicles. Please check for any errors before it's submission time.
Also, congrats to those who leveled up.
I have submitted you for PbP Gameday. Those who won boons should expect an email in a few months (once Gameday is over, usually.)
I'll give you a day or two to level up your characters, and then we'll start part 2.
Carini, where are ya?
We will start Part 2 in a few hours. I guess the caravan information is the start of part 2, but you'll know what I mean soon.
I have updated the Slides link to point at a new document. Make sure you can open it and move your characters around. If you want to change marching order, you can also do that now.
Slides should be updated.
Since I'm not the creator of this thread, I can't update the "CORE Shades of Ice" link atop the campaign.
THIS should be the correct link. You should be able to edit it now and move your icons. I already swapped Darven and Hortensia.
Yeah, it's fine if you see the slides. I'm certain you guys will play honest.
So there is also a bug which prevents even the thread owner from editing the header. Even if I did take control of this thread, I wouldn't be able to edit it. This leaves us with a few solutions:
1) Ask customer service to transfer ownership and edit the thread header for me. You know how overwhelmed Paizo's customer service is, this will take forever.
2) I create a new thread, we switch to that one, and continue from there. If people don't mind this thread staying active for 3 months before it automatically turns inactive, AND we all switch to the new thread we should be OK.
3) We truck along on this thread. It will linger on for 3 months after we finish using it but at least the damage is contained to one spot.
If you want to do options 1 or 2 I can certainly do it.