Suggestion:
If you have 20 levels in your favored class, you may take an FC bonus in any class thereafter.
I'm beyond ok with that.
Yup, that's cool with me as well.
Kryz, I'm sure you'll be fine. I have faith DT will be a badass.
Alrighty. Let's proceed then :)
What about combining the two? The suggestions from Vagabond are added to the list of Legendary Gifts we can then purchase via the extra points we get for levels 23-25?
Perhaps each epic gift would require two(3?) gifts per 1 bonus? and I'm thinking mythic feats instead of epic. Let's try to stay away from 3.x epic as much as possible. With the massive number of feats from both Mythic Adventures and Hero's Handbook, we should have no shortage of feats to choose from, period.
Yeah. Making 2-5 cost extra gifts, combined with 1, might be fun. Currently Bane and Furious are our only methods for getting past DR/Epic (I don't know how easy we *want* it to be to get past DR/Epic)
Yeah, might be a good idea to not let us get past +5 (which is still good for overcoming DR/alignment).
Do our cohorts follow auto-bonus progression for a 20th-level character, or just use the 500k for regular gear? (And are we keeping cohorts gestalt?)
Unless I'm missing something, aside from class features and spells, none of us can bypass epic DR.
Not sure that's the best idea, considering we're epic and mythic.
Our cohorts will indeed be gestalt, otherwise they won't be all that effective at our level. Not saying we all need to bring our cohorts with us on all our adventures(doubling our party size), but occasionally this is going to be a good idea.
Need to discuss the ABP for cohorts with my bro. Maybe?
The Inquisitors are trucking Bane for a limited number of rounds per day. If anyone's playing a rager (I'm not sure if anyone is), that's another way past DR/Epic. It's hard enough to overcome that we can't all do it automatically, but it's also usually pretty minor on the creatures who have it.
I'm all for an extra 10 legendary points. Keep it simple...
Anyone who can smite can also bypass DR epic...
I also should say I'm open to suggestions on DT's build...
I liked the idea of replacing psionic critical with dazzling assault, and I'm also trying to free up a spot for agile maneuvers, which uses DEX instead of STR for CMB...
Hard to find things to free up...all those choices seemed important at the time :P
Maybe legendary gifts should include Bonus feats? :P
That would seriously save me some feats
That article's suggestions are approved! My brother and I both like them!
sweet
say no to feat taxes!
Also...Kirthfinder (if you havent seen it) does something very, very similar. He eliminates feat chains period.
You take TWF? You add off hand iteratives when you gain them with your main hand. No 3 feat nonsense.
Just one example.
I mean we do have tons of feats this level, but fair enough, I'm fine either way.
@DT: You don't need Agile Maneuvers unless you want to Grapple/Dirty Trick (since you can use Finesse for Trip, Disarm, and Reposition)
Well, its a diff of +10 and +4 for CMB...
Oh,and yes its for grappling. He gets a size bonus for being a half giant, but that's it atm.
That article's suggestions are approved! My brother and I both like them!
Article?
Keep in mind that some feats can be crafted, typically for around 20k gold.
PF specifically tries to avoid this, though.
Hmm. Can't decide whether to make my cohort focused on throwing, or crossbows (it's a pretty cosmetic decision, tbh, but one option has him as a master of throwing things and the other he uses bows to launch all his healing potions).
ok so with those changes...I don't need improved TWF...or combat expertise. Agile Maneuvers comes with weapon finesse, so...
I took Dazing Assault (DC 33).
That leaves me at least one free feat. I'm open to suggestions.
Also, on the extra points for Legendary Gifts...are we going with 10 more points, or following the progression?
19th 3
20th 5 (total of 8)
21st 7 (total of 15)
22nd 8 (total of 23)
23rd 9 (total of 32)
24th 10 (total of 42)
25th 11 (total of 53)
I'm still not a fan of Psionic Critical (with your crit rate, it increases damage by an average of less than 1 point per hit). If you want to fit with the theme of "accurate, psionically-augmented critical strikes," you could consider replacing Psionic Critical with Critical Mastery, then use your last feat to grab something like Blinding Critical or Staggering Critical.
If you want to throw a few extra feats into it (or we get extra feats with gifts), consider getting both + Critical Mastery and maybe Stunning Critical.
Staggering Critical means every time you score a critical hit, an enemy is *guaranteed* staggered for at least one round even if they save (plus one round on additional saves). With TWF+Haste, you're critting at least once almost every round, and thus whoever you're fight is incapable of making full attacks to retaliate (and when added to dazing assault against standard mooks, there's multiple save-or-suck effects piled on). Casters can't 5' step out of your reach and teleport either, because staggered.
Blinding Critical, on the other hand, is just murderous when it succeeds, but doesn't have as good an effect if they make the save (Staggering or its upgrade, Stunning Critical, work well even against enemies that can always make a DC 33 fort save).
Basically, either of those feats mean the only things that can retaliate against you are undead, constructs, oozes and the tarrasque—they're pretty much the best two "assassin feats" I can think of
I'm all for each of those epic gifts costing more each time you buy them. Same with fests(mythic and normal).
Feats should definitely go up by more than +1 cost each time but unsure what would be fair. Want to make getting several appealing but not make it really easy to get a crap ton of extras.
Feats should definitely go up by more than +1 cost each time but unsure what would be fair. Want to make getting several appealing but not make it really easy to get a crap ton of extras.
How about doubling? First extra feat is 2 gifts, second is 4, third is 8, fourth is 16, unlikely anyone will get more than that.
* * *
And I anticipate my cohort being mostly a character who handles things when my main character *doesn't* want to be around. But either I make him a potion thrower (with harrow cards, daggers, or thrown shields as a main weapon) or he's a crossbow guy who uses fun potion-launcher crossbows to heal/buff allies while also firing arrows at people with his other hand.
I updated my copy of DT (spreadsheets make things so much easier...)
assuming we had 53 legendary points to play with.
I took 3 extra feats:
Expanded Knowledge: Planar Travel (5th level Dread power)
Extra Blade skill: Full enhancement
1 to be determined
added more inherent bonuses to stats.
From one of the freed up feats i took Persistent Focus for my Warrior's path ability from Psi Warrior. Always considered focused, even when it's spent.
I think I'm going to ditch the "staff saber" concept, and just dual wield.
Not really worth a feat to be able to emulate a two bladed sword.
23rd level gestalt cohort...
He'd basically be DT, two levels lower. Hmmm...might mix that up a bit.
Might do mind knight path and ascetic path for him. Forgo the soulknife aspect and have him focus on called weapons. He'd still qualify for the dark tempest PrC that way...
Fill the rest of it out with psion telepath...make him the thematic jedi to my sith.
Are there formal organization building rules?
He should have plenty as a psion...
Nope. No psionics here. My cohort is a Sorcerer/Oracle.
Which reminds me, houserule:
The disadvantages for Crossblooded Sorcerer no longer apply.
I realize this likely has no affect on you all, but it does benefit my buddy in our RL game as well as my cohort.
Reason: The archetype doesn't actually give much in the way of straight benefits. It just allows you choices as you level.
Thus I feel, and my brother agrees, that penalizing you for taking the archetype isn't really fair.
Weee psions!
Eh? No you're not. You have to choose which bonus spell you get at each level. For example if one bloodline grants you Fireball as a bonus spell and another grants Ligthning Bolt, you pick one of them.
How is adding a second list of possible spells known 'effectively doubling their spells known' ??
Also the penalty of one less spell *known* per level is pretty harsh, just in general.
Also, not a psion.
Nor I psionic. My cohort is a Chirurgeon Alchemist/Far Strike Monk on one side, and TBD on the other side (either Bolt Ace Gunslinger, Card Caster Magus, or Shield Champion Brawler, though I'm having trouble picking which)
Reason: The archetype doesn't actually give much in the way of straight benefits. It just allows you choices as you level.
Eheheh. It gives you *insane* benefits, at least at low levels. Since most bloodlines have less than half their powers/bonus spells as useful ones, you're effectively doubling these. By this level, it doesn't matter much, since Pages of Spell Knowledge and Arcane Heritage feats are a more powerful option.
(There's a reason why Crossblooded Bloodragers up the will penalty from -2 to -4, and it's because Bloodragers take the effects to an even greater extreme. But it matters more for reflexive min-maxers like myself, probably).
It's still 100% a choice however. Sure in some cases you get a solid or much better ability or spell, but that's not always the case. Sometimes they both are good or they both suck.
All depends on your bloodline choices and if people are going to min max vs choosing thematic pairs, then I have no problem saying no.
My cohort is Celestial/HyperBorean(Deep Magic) going for a whole angel/light theme.
Most bloodline arcana (the good ones, at least), are worth about 1-2 feats in terms of power. Again, absolutely a boon, but a much smaller one at level 20 with bonus feats.
I personally don't care. No dog in that fight.
Nothing will convince me that the benefits outweigh the loss of spells known.
Spells per day, sure, there's a bunch of archetypes that reduces them.
I don't have a problem with the penalty to Will saves as that kinda makes sense.
But I guess the real question is this:
At 25th level, gestalt, mythic, with a unique minor artifact you custom build, coupled with the ABP and the Legendary Gifts granting extra feats and templates and custom races, and anything I may have forgotten that's apart of this game,
Is it really that overpowered and game breaking for this specific game if Crossblooded lacks any drawbacks or at least just the Will save penalty???
Can I ignore inconvenient mechanics?
I kinda hate the focus stuff...
EDIT: This is meant as playfully absurd sarcasm, not a real request. :)
But seriously, if we want to say "these guys are so top of their field that they can bend the mechanical features of their classes" then I'm OK with that. We just need to define where the line is.
I'm still not a fan of Psionic Critical (with your crit rate, it increases damage by an average of less than 1 point per hit). If you want to fit with the theme of "accurate, psionically-augmented critical strikes," you could consider replacing Psionic Critical with Critical Mastery, then use your last feat to grab something like Blinding Critical or Staggering Critical.
If you want to throw a few extra feats into it (or we get extra feats with gifts), consider getting both + Critical Mastery and maybe Stunning Critical.
Staggering Critical means every time you score a critical hit, an enemy is *guaranteed* staggered for at least one round even if they save (plus one round on additional saves). With TWF+Haste, you're critting at least once almost every round, and thus whoever you're fight is incapable of making full attacks to retaliate (and when added to dazing assault against standard mooks, there's multiple save-or-suck effects piled on). Casters can't 5' step out of your reach and teleport either, because staggered.
Blinding Critical, on the other hand, is just murderous when it succeeds, but doesn't have as good an effect if they make the save (Staggering or its upgrade, Stunning Critical, work well even against enemies that can always make a DC 33 fort save).
Basically, either of those feats mean the only things that can retaliate against you are undead, constructs, oozes and the tarrasque—they're pretty much the best two "assassin feats" I can think of
Very good suggestions BTW...I'm still looking into them. Do you think Critical Mastery and the others are worth replacing Dazing Assault? it works on non-crits...
Can I ignore inconvenient mechanics?
I kinda hate the focus stuff...EDIT: This is meant as playfully absurd sarcasm, not a real request. :)
But seriously, if we want to say "these guys are so top of their field that they can bend the mechanical features of their classes" then I'm OK with that. We just need to define where the line is.
Except this is the *only* example I want to do this with. And really, its just losing spells known, which are already limited for Sorcerers.
Note, the Dual Cursed Oracle, which is the only other archetype that comes kinda close, only penalizes you via one non improving curse. Which isn't really that big a deal. AND they actually get 2 more revelations, which aren't limited at all.
"Your vision is limited, so have two extra awesome powers, on the house. Take your pick of which ones ya want" .
That's very close to an automatic choice for an oracle.
Well, not being able to see beyond 10 feet or whatever sucks for a caster in general, unless you use all touch spells...
I'm OK with it, really. Just saying in case someone else has something they'd like to bend a little, it should be an option for others also.