Welcome, Kingmakers!
I'm very happy with the group we've assembled. With luck, your characters will be able to explore and tame the Stolen Lands, and possibly rule a fledgling kingdom. Many have tried--and failed--to claim these lands as their own. Will you be able to accomplish what has previously been impossible?
I plan on using this thread as a place to discuss, plan, and comment on the IC thread (coming soon, after we iron out some things and when my wife relieves me of babysitting duties). Feel free to voice any opinions or questions you might have, either now or at any time as the campaign progresses. My goal is for all of us to have fun, so if something's not fun . . . please, by all means, let me know!
For the most part, I'll be using Golarion canon and PFRPG rules. If there's any differences between the way I want to do things and the way things are in the aforementioned canon and rules, I'll let you know (if I'm even aware of the difference). That said, I'll be personalizing Kingmaker for my own purposes; I think that that is an important part of running an AP. I won't be deviating so much that the AP will be unrecognizable, though. I love the AP as written, but I'd like to "fill in the blanks", if you will.
And with that, this thread is open for business! :)
Oh goodness. How much of a deviation? The game I was run out of deviated so much it was no longer Kingmaker, in my opinion. The GM had cabal of Zon Kuthon worshiping Oracles from Ustalav running around, added all sorts of outside interference from Brevoy and goodness knows where else by now.
Aside from that fear, I am excited, and thank you for picking Tityanna from among the host of Arcanists.
Yay. Thanks for having me, Rhys. Shadow has been dying to get into an AP for a long time now :).
I'm going to try and find a good way to present my moves in combat as I have a bunch of checks to make whenever I fight mounted. Other than that I'm excited and ready to go.
Oh goodness. How much of a deviation? The game I was run out of deviated so much it was no longer Kingmaker, in my opinion. The GM had cabal of Zon Kuthon worshiping Oracles from Ustalav running around, added all sorts of outside interference from Brevoy and goodness knows where else by now.
Aside from that fear, I am excited, and thank you for picking Tityanna from among the host of Arcanists.
Don't worry: I plan on using the AP as-written, but I may subtly alter the way some things are connected. For example, in my tabletop Kingmaker game . . .
. . . I linked some antagonists and events to the PCs, to keep it personal with them.
Does that help?
Yes. I'm sorry if I sounded ungrateful, but that game was one of the worst experiences I've ever had in gaming. If not the worst. The GM borked my cleric by forcing her to take a level of Oracle, then decided that he would sneak in an interior flaw that made her a living beacon for Evil courtesy of Zon Kuthon.
Essentially, he was using the guise of the AP to masturbate himself in a public forum with his misery porn, starring my character, and it disturbed me greatly.
But, I am going to put that behind me, and look forward to establishing a good group dynamic with you fine fellow adventurers.
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Oookkkaayyy. Very strange. Every time I clicked on the OOC thread link it kicked me to the PbP discussion parent forum and even showed the link to this thread as the parent forum...but it seems to have fixed itself.
My home game is a gestalt Kingmaker with a bunch of stuff from past campaigns that they players have participated in infiltrating the setting...so most things will probably seem pretty tame as far as deviations from my perspective.
Note to self: Don't anger the DM or Cavalier or my cleric might get "hurt". Don't piss off the sorcerer or my wizard might accidentally fall into a pit. On a more serious note I am happy to get a chance to play the AP and get a chance to interact with some of you folks in different roles than I have been playing with currently.
I'm glad to see at least three of you have managed to find your way over! It's a distinct possibility that at least one of us doesn't know he's been chosen, yet (GeraintElberion). I haven't seen Dragonborn3 here, yet, but he acknowledged getting picked in the recruitment thread.
One thing I am changing slightly: the Golarion calendar. With Kingmaker, years and years of game time can go by. In my tabletop game, I'd make yearly calendars for my PCs, but I'd have to change them every game year because it mirrors our own Roman calendar. Thus, I simplified it. Every year is 364 days per year; there are 30 days in every month, aside from Abadius (January) and every 2 months thereafter--these months have 31 days (that's Gozran, Erastus, and Lamashan). It sounds nitpicky, but this way each day of the year lands on the same day of the week, every year. This won't bother anybody, right?
Another thing I've changed: traveling on roads in the "Exploring the Stolen Lands" section of book one. Road travel-times were never taken into account; thusly, I've gone ahead and added travel-times for roads, as well. This won't really come into play for awhile, but it might be good to know, later.
I'll share any other minor changes as I think of them. Until then, please continue to work on your characters (unless you're finished, of course). Has everybody purchased all they need? Does everybody have a horse?
At any rate, we'll see who shows up! I want to wait until everyone makes an appearance (and still wants to play) before I start the IC thread. Groovy?
Question: May I buy a pack animal to haul loot?
Sorcs do not require much by way of items, but Tityanna is not a very strong gal.
Is there any one in party who can help manage a pack mule if I purchase one to haul the heavier items like bedrolls, blankets, etc?
Question: May I buy a pack animal to haul loot?
Sorcs do not require much by way of items, but Tityanna is not a very strong gal.
Is there any one in party who can help manage a pack mule if I purchase one to haul the heavier items like bedrolls, blankets, etc?
Sure, you can buy a pack animal. Do you want a draft horse, donkey, mule?
If you are keeping the calendar you can change whatever you want! ;-) In all seriousness though I don't see that being a problem unless someone's character is going to lose a major festival or something that will just ruin their concept or something...which is not a problem for me at least.
For road travel I'm just curious if you are using the overland movement notes from the Core Rulebook or are you utilizing a custom system?
As for a horse...I *could* have a horse...and no other real gear to speak of, being armed and armored is an expensive proposition...I guess I could buy a mule for 8 GP? But then again I have Endurance and a mule isn't much faster than that...so...I dunno.
By extension per Tityanna's request: I could LEAD a pack mule...heh.
Then the question becomes what rate of speed they move at. If a draft horse moves at the speed a regular horse might, I would prefer that. If a donkey does as well, I will go with the cheapest option.
Excellent, Hrask! Everyone let me know what manner of items the party needs that my sorc might be able to supply.
Are we starting with average starting gold?
If you are keeping the calendar you can change whatever you want! ;-) In all seriousness though I don't see that being a problem unless someone's character is going to lose a major festival or something that will just ruin their concept or something...which is not a problem for me at least.
For road travel I'm just curious if you are using the overland movement notes from the Core Rulebook or are you utilizing a custom system?
As for a horse...I *could* have a horse...and no other real gear to speak of, being armed and armored is an expensive proposition...I guess I could buy a mule for 8 GP? But then again I have Endurance and a mule isn't much faster than that...so...I dunno.
By extension per Tityanna's request: I could LEAD a pack mule...heh.
In my calendar revision, the only difference (as far as festivals/holidays go) is that the Night of the Pale takes place on Kuthona 30 instead of 31 (the last day of the year).
The Stolen Lands movement chart uses the numbers from the Core Rulebook, but rephrases movement to how long it takes to get through one hex, based on speed and terrain. All I've done is add an additional section for road-travel (which is anywhere to minimally to significantly better, depending on base terrain).
Does anybody have Handle Animal? If not, well . . . good luck with the animals! :P
ragathiel is a bit obscure. im on my phone but ill see if i can find out where info on him is.
ragathiel is a bit obscure. im on my phone but ill see if i can find out where info on him is.
Hold up; I found Ragathiel tucked away in the Inner Sea World Guide. He's an Empyreal Lord with a bunch of wings, eh? You can still venerate him! :)
*blank stare*
I. Was. A. Farmer.I thought you knew that?
Oops. Duh, I forgot! ;)
i have it as well. Here is where i got my info on Ragathiel: http://www.pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Ragathiel
I like him because he is lawful good and has the destruction and rage domains :)... his favored weapon is a bastard sword... and he is a guard in heaven.
if you dont like it ill find something else. no worries :)
Well if we get a pack animal it should be trained for "heavy work" which means it should have the "come" and "work" trick, which is only a DC 10 Handle Animal check to make them do a trick they know...but that is CHA based...so Tityanna! But day to day leading of an animal doesn't require a check (I think) so I could lead it and Tityanna could yell at it to come to her if it gets spooked.
Gods knows that I could probably intimidate an animal but what would that really do? ;p
Work animals aren't trained to ride so I am on foot (unless someone has so much gold they can buy me a horse to ride) which means at 20ft per round we are going slower than we -could- be...We could get a cart but I think they are no faster than I am on foot, and since I have endurance I am not worried about getting tired normally...so I could probably double time it off and on to keep up the pace but that might complicated if we need to roll out CON checks for that...
i have it as well. Here is where i got my info on Ragathiel: http://www.pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Ragathiel
I like him because he is lawful good and has the destruction and rage domains :)... his favored weapon is a bastard sword... and he is a guard in heaven.
if you dont like it ill find something else. no worries :)
Just to mention this, and I guess it would depend how it plays but Torag has a MAD hate on for destruction. Obviously Ragathiel is LG so I'm not sure how well they play in the same sandbox, there might be some antagonism though. I suppose Rhys could give us some determination how other collisions of said faith have played in his Golarion...
Does anybody have Handle Animal? If not, well . . . good luck with the animals! :P*blank stare*
I. Was. A. Farmer.I thought you knew that. I mean, you read my backstory...
[Dwarven Stereotype] I'm not sure what this has to do with Handling Animals...are there animals on farms? Where I come from a "farm" is where they keep all the barrels of ale that grow from the magic ale tree! ;-P [/Dwarven Stereotype]
Just to mention this, and I guess it would depend how it plays but Torag has a MAD hate on for destruction. Obviously Ragathiel is LG so I'm not sure how well they play in the same sandbox, there might be some antagonism though. I suppose Rhys could give us some determination how other collisions of said faith have played in his Golarion...i have it as well. Here is where i got my info on Ragathiel: http://www.pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Ragathiel
I like him because he is lawful good and has the destruction and rage domains :)... his favored weapon is a bastard sword... and he is a guard in heaven.
if you dont like it ill find something else. no worries :)
I always considered it to be a "Destruction of evil" point of view. As a paladin its more a state of mind than anything else. I will smite evil and see it uterly destroyed. If I do take a level of inquisitor at some point (no real plans to), i would probably take the law domain anyway. I don't think Torag will have a problem wih me, but who knows... that might be fun too ;)
Well, Tityanna needs to buy a backpack, a waterskin, a bedroll, winter blanket and 2 weeks worth of rations. That's under 12 gold of her "standard" 70gp spent.
If she buys a mule at 8 gp, and a pack saddle at 15gp she is just under half her starting gold, and she might afford a single 1st level scroll, but I do not see the point.
What value would we get out of a pony that we wouldn't from a mule?
Can't find the stats, but you can find the money in the equipment part of the SRD.
Unfortunately, my fellow adventurers, it is time for this lady to do some cookin'.
Enjoy your meal, Hu5tru!
As far as donkeys go, I'd probably just use the stats of a pony; just trade the Run feat for Iron Will (to reflect their stubbornness, and that I don't think they can run quite as fast as a pony).
Well, every girl wants a pony... Although, according to the site we're not allowed to have them in our avatars.
If you know what I mean, and I think you do.
And no, that was not a reference to Katherine the Great. *laughs*
Consider it pony, my fine fellows. That and a pack saddle or will we be buying our dwarven friend a riding saddle?
According to the PRD's "Unofficial Errata" section, James Jacobs had a particularly detailed post where he noted that donkeys should be stated as ponies and mules should be state as an "advanced" pony.
I always considered it to be a "Destruction of evil" point of view. As a paladin its more a state of mind than anything else. I will smite evil and see it uterly destroyed. If I do take a level of inquisitor at some point (no real plans to), i would probably take the law domain anyway. I don't think Torag will have a problem wih me, but who knows... that might be fun too ;)Just to mention this, and I guess it would depend how it plays but Torag has a MAD hate on for destruction. Obviously Ragathiel is LG so I'm not sure how well they play in the same sandbox, there might be some antagonism though. I suppose Rhys could give us some determination how other collisions of said faith have played in his Golarion...i have it as well. Here is where i got my info on Ragathiel: http://www.pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Ragathiel
I like him because he is lawful good and has the destruction and rage domains :)... his favored weapon is a bastard sword... and he is a guard in heaven.
if you dont like it ill find something else. no worries :)
I guess I could see that...I suppose we will see what Hark and Haldaval note as common cause or differ on as we play...I would insert an evil DM laugh but uh...I'm not DMing ;p
Okay guys, I have just about reached my capacity for even lesser maths for the day. I will look up stats for the Puck, the party pack pony in the morning, and put his stats on my profile.
Harsk, did you want to ride Puck? I need to know what type of saddle to buy.
DM Rhys, I fully expect you to, and hope you will play around with the mystery of who Haldaval's father is... but I wanted to suggest that this should be a long way off. If he found out any leads early in our game, he would want to go track the guy down immediately. Eventually, however, his loyalty to these companions and the newfound country they are developing would outweigh that concern.
At the beginning of our story he will have given up on the quest, and probably won't want to talk about it, so the rest of the PCs won't miraculously figure it all out for him anyway :). His ring will stay secret for a while, anyway.
Unless you have other ideas :). It's all up to you of course.
Ragathiel does have the Destruction domain, but I'd have to say that this is less random havoc and more the eradication of evil, like a holy crusader. In this respect, I'd see Torag's and Ragathiel's followers getting along okay (if Torag's followers have even heard of Ragathiel); after all, Torag and Iomedae get along swimmingly, and she's not all that different.
That said, I think any clashes that may come up between Haldaval and Harsk may be due to their individual personalities. Haldaval is a crusader, seeking to remove evil from the land; Harsk is a preacher, seeking to convert people to building a better society. Thus, where Harsk may seek to parley with "evil" in hopes of getting them on board, Haldaval may seek to punish them, and blot the evil from the land before it can get a foothold in their new society.
(If I'm wrong about my assumptions, please let me know).
Any word from GeraintElberion? We need our cleric! As an interesting note: throwing Sarenrae into the Torag-Ragathiel mix should be fun! ;)
Otherwise, it looks like the party's overland speed is 30, since Ray is hoofin' it (well, not literally, since he's walking).
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Any word from GeraintElberion? We need our cleric! As an interesting note: throwing Sarenrae into the Torag-Ragathiel mix should be fun! ;)
Because someone with silver symbols of Desna all around his arm who just also happens to summon demons wasn't enough?
Otherwise, it looks like the party's overland speed is 30, since Ray is hoofin' it (well, not literally, since he's walking).
If a Donkey is only 8 gold, I'll buy one.
Okay, updated my stats with Puck the Pack Pony in spoilers.
Will figure out how much he can carry once people tell me what they would like to carry on him.
Ray, I'm cool with footing the bill for the pack pony. It means that Tityanna doesn't have to carry anything save what she would on her person, which is really good for the party. Plus, if something really scary comes, you can order it to run the heck out of combat, whereas a donkey would not have that option.
I imagine Puck carrying all the heavy "essentials" like spade, pick axe, pot, as well as bedrolls and blankets.
Oh, Ray if you wanna buy something useful for the party, a tent would be very much appreciated.
Hello, sorry for the lag.
I'll get on great with Ragathiel worshippers, Sarenrae used to be an Empyreal Lord herself before she became a fully-fledged deity.
I'll post more soon.
Edit: Sarenrae actually gets on well with all of those gods, according to everything I could find (And I have every CS book, every AP and most Modules).
The only members of team virtue we're missing are Cayden and Shelyn.
Hey, there! I'm glad you found us, and congratulations on being picked! No problem about the lag; this PbP is not the only thread on these boards. ;)
I'm very happy that everyone's turned up. That means I can start the IC thread today, without worrying if the party's all together. :)
Does Malaswyn have a mount?
As far as maps and other game documents go: I'll be using Google Docs for maps (and things of that nature). If you'd be so kind, please e-mail me at the following address so I can allow you to view the contents. Do you all have a Google account?
I'll provide a document in awhile so I can test whether you all can follow links to my maps.
If you're wondering, I'm simply creating versions of the AP's maps using Hexographer and Dungeonographer.
Harsk, did you want to ride Puck? I need to know what type of saddle to buy.
While I'm not exactly the riding type I'll do it in the name of keeping our speed up. It hinders us a little in maximizing Puck's "pack" use, but until we really need to haul things around I am sure it will be fine.
Ultimately I believe in some organic skill and feat choices over time, so it might make sense for me to take ride at some point and get a war pony...hmmm.
Hello, sorry for the lag.
I'll get on great with Ragathiel worshippers, Sarenrae used to be an Empyreal Lord herself before she became a fully-fledged deity.
I'll post more soon.
Edit: Sarenrae actually gets on well with all of those gods, according to everything I could find (And I have every CS book, every AP and most Modules).
The only members of team virtue we're missing are Cayden and Shelyn.
Heh, that is why you need to check the other gods entries ;-)
Torag is opposed to destructive and aggressive deities as a god of protection and creation. He and his followers have battled Rovagug and other destructive forces since the dawn of time. However, despite this opposition to Rovagug, the followers of Sarenrae and Torag are rarely close, following different, almost alien codes of belief. Dwarves do not understand the worship of the sun, and see Sarenrae's willingness to forgive as folly and a sign of weakness.
[Dwarven Stereotype] You damn weak pansy elf! [/Dwarven Stereotype]
Actually that is one of the reasons I made an Inquisitor; knowing that the church can be a little...harsh, I think it fits that in this circumstance they send someone trained with a more flexible outlook. While not so simple you could basically boil Harsk's intention as "sell Torag Lite™" so that the church can get a presence at all. Hardcore conversion is for the second string and not Harsk's deal. :-)
Okie, I got 96 pounds on Puck the wonder pony. As I understand encumbrance, we can load him up for another 100 and he'll be traveling at the same rate as the party.
Gotcha, will update with that info now.
How difficult is it going to be to find grass/fodder for Puck to feed on so that I don't have to have more than 5 days of feed on him at any time?
Gotcha, will update with that info now.
How difficult is it going to be to find grass/fodder for Puck to feed on so that I don't have to have more than 5 days of feed on him at any time?
If anything like the Survival requirements for people its hours a day for a day of food, so not the best in the world.
Looking at your stats for my presumption is I am not riding him and that even if I was I would be too heavy and would drag his speed down.
Unfortunately I have to say that I am keeping the party at a lower general speed for the time being.
EDIT:
If anyone else who is on horse (base speed 40 or higher) has Survival they could probably regularly make the DC 10 for foraging for food while moving. To forage they would go half speed bringing them down to base speed 20, which would bring them down to my speed but keep us in food for the pony and lift his load a bit...I'm not sure how feasible that is.
[TEST:]
Can characters help train others in useful skills like handle animal and ride or would that just be disruptive?
I can see that Tityanna would likely ask for help while she's out and about rather than suffer in silence and suddenly "shasam" be great at everything come level 2, or at least passable.
But I like organic leveling in response to challenges in my games.
How difficult is it going to be to find grass/fodder for Puck to feed on so that I don't have to have more than 5 days of feed on him at any time?
I'd rule that as long as you're in either a plains or hills hex, your mounts/beasts of burden can graze without any problem (barring things like being in the dead of winter). In general, a party travels about 8 hours per day; it's assumed that things like eating, potty breaks, and setting up/taking down camp happen in between those hours at various points (during the daylight time not spent walking).
I'd probably allow grazing with no check (or speed penalty) in spring/summer in the plains/hills, but require checks (and half-speed) in winter or in any other terrain. Grazing grass is quite abundant in the Greenbelt (less abundant in the forests).
How does everyone feel about that ruling?
Can characters help train others in useful skills like handle animal and ride or would that just be disruptive?
I can see that Tityanna would likely ask for help while she's out and about rather than suffer in silence and suddenly "shasam" be great at everything come level 2, or at least passable.
But I like organic leveling in response to challenges in my games.
I've got no problem with PCs teaching other PCs skills, but keep in mind that it wouldn't be actualized until you get skill ranks to allocate (i.e., when you raise a level). If you'd like to describe what your characters are learning to reflect your eventual skill allocations, I'm all for it! :)
How does everyone feel about that ruling?
Sounds good. I've given my group the "since I recognize that you are stupid" ruling and don't force them to make checks that would disrupt the flow of an already slow game. I am fairly certain that most anyone with a lick of sense would know better than to pitch a tent right next to carrion, or the latrines, or in the midst of a breezeway, or right next to a dense clump of trees, but I dislike micromanagement. I figure they can find their own food and in the woods, godmod the guy with the greatest survival check scouting ahead for danger.
And yeah, I would not use any bonuses that I had not procured. I once had a character train with a Githyanki assassin and presume that she was "the poop" until she rolled less than five and hit absolutely nothing. She was pretty upset that that training was for naught.
Hey, there! I'm glad you found us, and congratulations on being picked! No problem about the lag; this PbP is not the only thread on these boards. ;)
I'm very happy that everyone's turned up. That means I can start the IC thread today, without worrying if the party's all together. :)
Does Malaswyn have a mount?
Nope. In fact, I may have too much value in gear, I don't really remember how we did gear in the last pbp.
Edit: I think I need to take Mala down to level 1, getting mixed up by different pbps which I applied to be in.
@Malaswyn: If you're wondering, starting gp value is average for this campaign. 1st level is where you should be (for now). ;)