Ring of Rat Fangs might be worth noting on the magic items anyways. A decent number of forms have heads without bite attacks.
Will try and remember to do so. Though I'm not 100% sure it'd actually apply when polymorphed, as arguably the granted bite attack is a function of your original form. Any official calls on that?
It's a passive magic item that isn't armor or a shield. Not sure why it wouldn't apply. The only thing that might not apply is the becoming more ratlike, which is generally a benefit.
Essentially the question being whether the polymorph form would count it as part of your original form and thus effectively overwrite it as under:
While under the effects of a polymorph spell, you lose all extraordinary and supernatural abilities that depend on your original form (such as keen senses, scent, and darkvision), as well as any natural attacks and movement types possessed by your original form.
Probably not, but I could see a GM ruling against it, particularly in the case of silly levels of use.
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to be honest, magical beast shape probably isn't worth it. it seems cool, but being a 7th level arcane only spell puts it out of reach of 3/4 or higher bab classes (without putting in some work and/or cheese)
new abilities: see in darkness, blood drain, blood frenzy, fast healing 5, a bonus to resisting posion
breath weapon is technically weaker than it was before, in beast shape iv it has no cap but with magical beast shape it's capped at 12d6 damage
going over the bestiaries quickly
the pipefox is the only diminutive magical beast I could find
dv 60, llv, land 30, climb 20, bite 1d2
hydra has pounce, fast healing, and five bites
abia from b4 is a fast swimming eel with a 3d6 bite, and a 2d6 tail slap, both with grab, and constrict
behir has bite with grab, constrict, a bunch of rakes, and a breath weapon
there doesn't really seem to be a flier worth a damn, at least for the purposes of flying fast
the thrasfyr from b2 has 7 natural attacks (gore, 2 bites, 4 claws), is fast, has a couple resistances (fire, sonic and electricity 20), and has a high damage fire breath with an 80 ft cone, but it's weak to cold
that's about it
It's a passive magic item that isn't armor or a shield. Not sure why it wouldn't apply. The only thing that might not apply is the becoming more ratlike, which is generally a benefit.Essentially the question being whether the polymorph form would count it as part of your original form and thus effectively overwrite it as under:
While under the effects of a polymorph spell, you lose all extraordinary and supernatural abilities that depend on your original form (such as keen senses, scent, and darkvision), as well as any natural attacks and movement types possessed by your original form.
Probably not, but I could see a GM ruling against it, particularly in the case of silly levels of use.
it should still apply, because your original form doesn't have a bite attack, it goes away the moment you remove the ring. if you're in a form that can wear items, putting the ring on would give you a bite attack (assuming the form doesn't have one already), just like how you can use draconic sorcerer claws while polymorphed, but not, say, an alchemist tentacle
I'll include the ring. I can just see some GMs treating another attack on top of some combinations as too much.
Have gone through Bestiary 5 and 6 for the spells I've already covered, in the process of getting that all formatted and into the guide. When that's done, I'll probably go through all the Aquatic forms for Beast Shape I left out the first time (slightly self-serving, as I'm in a Skull and Shackles game at the mo), then Magical Beast Shape, then Fey Form, then the Exotic/Alien Dragons, then any new items, feats and going through Boons.
Bestiary 5 & 6 added for existing spells, partway through sorting Aquatics and Magical Beast Shape
to be honest, magical beast shape probably isn't worth it. it seems cool, but being a 7th level arcane only spell puts it out of reach of 3/4 or higher bab classes (without putting in some work and/or cheese)
That's a pretty narrow point of view. I'm having a massive amount of fun with my Arcanist, who's combining Brown Fur Transmter, the Shapechanger Bloodline elements (through Eldritch Heritage) and the Multimorph Arcane Discovery (through the Exploit that lets you get a Discovery as a Wizard half your level).
As such, my forms can be shifted within that spell for 1 minute of duration, which is nothing given they last hours/level, and they give an extra +2 to a stat. As do the four uses of Adjective of the Animal spells I cast each day - who needs stat buff items when I can get +6 for hours from just a 2nd level spell and a pool point.
Is it the nastiest build ever? Nah, there's a bunch of feats I don't qualify for because of not enough BAB.
But it's fun!
Aquatic/swim-focused forms added, as is the Diminutive and Huge portion of Magical Beasts. Going to have a quick check for any candidates of other sizes with any of the new abilities that Magical Beast Shape gives.
I wonder, could you use MBS to imitate a diminutive familiar? It's not a template or exactly an advanced form, and basic familiars have the magical beast type.
I wonder, could you use MBS to imitate a diminutive familiar? It's not a template or exactly an advanced form, and basic familiars have the magical beast type.
But they're a natural animal that's become a Magical Beast. And arguably you can't become a familiar without a caster/whatever who you're the familiar of.
I would tend towards no because I like the idea of spells having weaknesses, even high level ones — Magical Beast Shape is all about the more unusual forms, and whilst there'll be a few forms that let you get close, that limitation makes things interesting, retains a use for the lower level spells.
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Apologies for repeat posting myself so much, but logging progress as I go - Magical Beast Shape added, both the Huge and Diminutive, and a bunch of forms that gain new abilities from it.
Was going to do Ooze Shape next, but just re-read it and realised it's akin to the Dragon shapes in that it tells you exactly what it gives you, thus it's low priority.
Time to jump into a massive pile of Fae I guess…
Advanced warning - once I've done main pass through the Fae, I'll be asking for suggestions for any monsters I've missed — given the Pathfinder Community website spreadsheet of creatures is no longer being updated, I don't have a simple way to go through everything that might have a cool form in it – so tell me if you know any that are worth adding.
Can't wait to see all the new entries!
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*Climbs off a massive pile of neatly arranged Fey*
It's nice to be loved!! Updated with Fey, though I've not yet compared them to all the other forms - I may well leave that 'till after I've done the Oozes and two new dragon form spells.
Which I'll be working on whilst I wait for people to come up with a list of cool forms I've missed (I'll make a separate post for that).
But all that can wait until later, as I need a snooze.
Let me know if you spot any mistakes in my listings; been quite busy recently, so stuff may have slipped through.
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Small trick I noticed recently, Giant Form I specifies humanoid creatures with the giant subtype, but Giant Form II loses that distinction, merely specifying giant subtype.
That might not seem like much, but RAW it lets you turn into a Gegenees with better stats than with Monstrous Physique III/IV (which you have noted in the guide), and it should also let you turn into Oni. Not sure how good they actually are, but it's something.
after reading your awesome handbook, and seeing that it is being updated recently, i had a couple questions...
- were you planning on adding Naga Shape I-III to it?
- i noticed that a couple basic polymorph spells, like Baleful Polymorph and Polymorph Any Object, weren't listed near the end. were you planning on adding those?
check out Flesh to Ooze, basically the ooze version of Baleful Polymorph
- maybe add Elemental Attunement to the list of feats?
Approved and approved!
the guide of forever . . . 2 questions:
1. is the move speed considered? (you list Beast Shape 1 that eagle is a good flyer, but you only get flight of 30 from the spell)
2. for undead anatomy, it specifically calls out corporeal undead. you list incorporeal choices . . . is there an errata that mentions this?
mind you, I'd prefer the way you did it, but I think RAW has other ideas unless I'm missing something. Fantastic guide!
If you are making updates....
Infuse Self might be worth including.
Under Monstrous Physique the Vouivre is a strange creature Image that might be worth mentioning - looks like it can hold a shield and a reach weapon or a wand and still get a bite/2 claws/2 wings from it's dragon half.
For Beast Shape the Hydrus has a paralyzing poison.
the Giant Lake Octopus is a potential option once Huge animals are available - mostly for it's eight 30' reach tentacles - (unfortunately only grab, no constrict)
The Tullimonstrum is a stirge for underwater.
What about polymorph and paternity?
IIRC there have been some modules that explain this is how half creatures like half dragons are made. Said dragon changes shape to something more "compatable" for relations.
Would you folks say that a monster race polymorphed into another race considers it's birth race for what genes it provides? (And whether or not a couple are compatible to breed?)
If so, would a creature made from an inanimate object using polymoroh any object be infertile?