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For those who don't have the Dragon Compendium Volume I, there is a race in there (the Dvati I think) which is one soul in two bodies. Thus, each set of Dvati twins has one xp total, one shared class, one player, one mind and two separate bodies (they aren't siamese twins). The twins share each HD but get to apply their Con bonuses separately (so, each body of a fighter dvati gets d10/2 + Con mod in hp). If one twin is hit by a mental spell, both are effected. Both bodies must act to cast a spell (so you can't use them to cast 2 spells per round like 3.0 haste) - however, there is no similar limitation on full attack actions. They have some other minor abilities, no stat bumps, and are LA +1.
On the one hand, this strikes me as exceptionally cool. On the other hand, it seems terribly unbalanced. You've always got a flanking buddy, you can make multiple full attacks each round, and if you are a rogue...well, let's hope you have a high enough con to make up for the low hp, but boy will you ruin someone's day.
What does everyone else think - are these suckers balanced? Has anyone played them?
what hapens if one of the twins dies?
isn't there a warning in the book suggesting to DMs that the dvati may not be balanced? :)
what other abilities do they have?
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Boz - there is a warning of just that sort, which is why I didn't post "DVATI - TOTALLY UNBALANCED GARBAGE, WTF!!!!1!!" ;-)
Mostly it is such an interesting race that I really wanted to discuss it with the other posters on the boards. I figured asking if it was balanced would be the best way to spark a discussion. And, with most threads, I'm hoping the author or paizo will step in and provide a professional analysis of why they think the class is (not) balanced. It's really a weird beast.
As for additional abilities, they really pale in comparison to what I've already posted (and I can't remember them off the top of my head). I think they get a +3 bonus while flanking and they can make a perform check to get an additional flanking related bonus. I don't think they get darkvision or anything else major.
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I really don't see the problem. They split their hit points, they don't get any extra abilities or classes, they can't cast more spells per round or prepare extra spells. I guess it's maybe an extra attack or some kind of extra action, like maybe if you're a cleric you can have one of yourself fight while the other one runs to the party member with cure wounds or something. Which is good, but not serious, I mean half my group gets cohorts and animal companions and crap and does the same thing.
The cohort/animal companion is a really good point I hadn't considered. I suppose that a rogue could have a rogue cohort and therefore always have a flanking buddy with sneak attack. Still, the cohort is generally so much weaker than the mainline PC that it's not a perfect comparison.
Which also makes me think of another strike against the race - outfitting it properly would be a pain in the butt. You'd need twice as many magic weapons, twice as much magic armor, etc. The disadvantage is similar to the mystic theurge where a significant (and frequently overlooked) disadvantage of the class is that you have to have two high stats.
I don't think that the dvati are at all unbalanced in the long run. A 2nd-level pair or dvati fighter/rogues is clearly not the same issue, balance-wise, as a pair of 18th-level dvati sorcerers, but either way, I believe that the limits imposed on dvati are sufficient that I would even consider removing the LA, depending on what concept the player wanted to play.
I guess it's maybe an extra attack or some kind of extra action, like maybe if you're a cleric you can have one of yourself fight while the other one runs to the party member with cure wounds or something.
Just a clarification, when one dvati casts a spell, both of them must spend the actions nessesary for the spell. So if one cast cure light wounds both would spend the stadard action.
One cannot cast spells while the other fights.However, I think it would be possible for both to use spell completion items, like scrolls, at the same time.
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IMHO the dvati feel balanced, however ... I believe that their might be something out there, that if combined with the dvati, might make them more powerful than they should be. One possible example is the Leadership feat. Since both dvati would get the feat both, in theory, should get a cohort. (Although this might just become annoying rather than broken as the player would be controlling four characters in combat, and more if he insists on dvati cohorts.)
My biggest concern about this race though is if the player playing the race will take up much more time doing so, which is more likely if they take a class that gives an animal companion or mount.
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IMHO the dvati feel balanced, however ... I believe that their might be something out there, that if combined with the dvati, might make them more powerful than they should be. One possible example is the Leadership feat. Since both dvati would get the feat both, in theory, should get a cohort.
A dvati would only get a single cohort as despite outward appearances they are still a single creature. Since each half of a dvati has access to the same feats it is safe to infer that each half would have access to the same (single) cohort granted by possessing the Leadership feat.
However, I think it would be possible for both to use spell completion items, like scrolls, at the same time.
Since spell completion items are tied to the ability to cast spells I would still hold the dvati to the normal spell casting restriction. It takes attention and focus of will even to use a wand or scroll it would be the same as letting a wizard two wade into combat blasting away at foes with two fireball wands each round—Just because he can put one in each hand. Having a free limb is not the same as having the focus to activate the item.
If you want to break the dvati, make a Warlock or Spellthief. Warlocks "spells" are just attacks, and flanking dvati could steal spells with constant sneak attacks. Of course, a dvati flanking an enemy is dangerous because of each body's low hit points. Other than that, it's perfectly balanced.
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If you want to break the dvati, make a Warlock or Spellthief. Warlocks "spells" are just attacks, and flanking dvati could steal spells with constant sneak attacks. Of course, a dvati flanking an enemy is dangerous because of each body's low hit points. Other than that, it's perfectly balanced.
Warlock invocations (as described on page 7 of Complete Arcane) are spell-like abilities that “require him to focus the wild energy that suffuses his soul.” Since the dvati has but a single soul and the invocations require a standard action to use a dvati could only use invocations from one body at a time. The same logic that governs spell casting would cover invocations as well.
If you want to break the dvati, make a Warlock or Spellthief. Warlocks "spells" are just attacks, and flanking dvati could steal spells with constant sneak attacks. Of course, a dvati flanking an enemy is dangerous because of each body's low hit points. Other than that, it's perfectly balanced.Warlock invocations (as described on page 7 of Complete Arcane) are spell-like abilities that “require him to focus the wild energy that suffuses his soul.” Since the dvati has but a single soul and the invocations require a standard action to use a dvati could only use invocations from one body at a time. The same logic that governs spell casting would cover invocations as well.
You're right. I didn't catch that. Well, two bodies with eldritch blast as a range touch attack isn't bad either. although it does say that an eldritch blast is the equivalent of a spell with a spell level equal to half the caster level (rounded down).
do the dvati pair act in the same round?
do the dvati have separate character sheets or do you just use one and just keep track of the difference in hp, weapons and armor and other stuff between the two dvati twins?
if i have a dvati ranger and go the archery path does that mean i can have both of my dvati fire a shot in the same round?
theres no real clarification of how been two seperate bodies effects your character turns, rounds and other important stuff, please can someone help because i love the race and want ot play it!
how about starting gold, should i get more?
Actually, it's very clear. It's one character, one soul, and two bodies, and they act on the same turn. no extra starting gold. Character wealth for the dvati (pair) is the same as any other character. Two character sheets might help with keeping track of armor, weapons and other possessions. I would just have one character sheet with all of their detailed stats and a photocopy on which you make changes for equipment.
i am changing my class to rogue now, do you think thats a good thing to do? I was reading the players handbook and sneak attack and having all the skills rocks but my twins will only have 5 hit points each. This is my first character in dungeons and dragons so i want it to be cool and have some rep over the over guys in my brothers group, they have played the game for years and always show off so i want to be something that makes them thrill me.
Don't plan on being a frontline fighter, or even a fighter at all. Be the handy man for purposes of finding traps and getting into places other typically cannot. Emphasize tumble, jump, balance, and climb skills. Make sure your Dex is high, and use ranged weapons. If you do find yourself in combat, use the Total Defense combat option or Fight Defensively. Consider at least one or two levels of fighter for bonus feats and more hit points. Feats you'll want definitely include Toughness, Dodge, Mobility, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, and perhaps Shot on the Run. Spend lots of skill points in Tumble, too, so that you can move through crowds of enemies without provoking attacks of opportunity.
The idea is for you to keep moving and never get hit.
Other classes you might want to consider instead of Rogue are Spellthief from Complete Arcane or Scout from Complete Warrior. If you want a really cool character, consider the Warlock from Complete Arcane, too.
do the team work feats like *dual strike* from sword and fist (which require two allies to have the feat) work for a dvati, because the dvati pair both *have* the feat so it should work right?
theres a feat like this in the dragon compendium called *double team* should i take them?
i like exotic weapons and want to use something that stands out for my dvati, are there any good ranged weaons i should look out for? should i get a reach weapon like a longspear or simply stick with the rapier and try to get weapon finesse as soon as i can or just keep focused on ranged attacks?
If I were your DM, I would rule that any feat that requires another character to have the same feat would not work for a single dvati "character." Just remember that the concept of a dvati is to play witht he versatility of two bodies, not break the rules concerning "a" character. Consider also that the bodies of a dvati pair do not each take the same feats, they share single feats.
A reach weapon would be really good for you to use; they keep you out of harms way, but still let you flank from a distance. There's an exotic weapon called a duom that is a reach weapon that allows you to also attack adjacent foes. It's in Dragon Compendium as a martial weapon, but it's supposed to be an exotic weapon.
Wow, I have to admit, this is cool. I love that not only has paizo updated my "Beastly Research" entry (something I JUST learned about, like, 20 minutes ago), but its generating real discussion on the boards. Thanks, all for giving them due consideration and not just blasting them as the creation of horrible cheese-monkeys!
Unfortunately, I had absolutely nothing to do with their conversion to third edition, so I can't really answer your questions regarding their balance. I will admit that the balance issue was something that I struggled with even back in the day. My solution back then was to split the pair up between players, letting the set be played as separate characters by separate players. That's how they were originally intended; as separate, but tightly connected characters. Whether they were played by two people or one was really left up to the DM.
I don't have the Dragon Compendium yet (as evidenced by my total ignorance of the Dvati's return), and I'm very excited to learn that my creation was chosen to appear in the first volume. I'll have to make an effort to pick up the book now. Way-cool. :-)
Are they balanced? Well, I can't say, since I don't know the new rules yet. I will say this: like most things in D&D, I'd imagine that their "balance" has a lot to do with party and campaign dynamics. In other words, they're as balanced as the DM makes them. d20 is a rather flexible system and has a lot of room for interpretation. Every campaign is different and one DM's balance is often another's munchkin. It really sounds to me that the d20 Dvati walk a delicate balance (tee-hee!) between these two extremes. Heed the warning, play them with caution and try to enjoy the roleplaying opportunities they provide.
Earlier tonight, I posted a reply to another thread on this forum regarding the Dvati's ecology and (ahem) mating practices (hey, she asked). I guess since the race's development is out of my hands, you can take anything I said there and here regarding their personality with a grain of salt (indeed, when I made that post, I had yet to figure out that they'd been converted and thought we were talking about the AD&D version). You should definitely fall back on the "official" rules and information published in the Compendium and in Dragon #271. But if I can be of further help, please don't hesitate to ask me. I can be reached at everwho@comcast.net.
Anyway, thanks again for giving the Dvati your consideration, and thanks to Paizo for including them in their apparently cool book. Obviously, they have great taste! :-)
-Talon
hmm one character right? Do you get two initiative rolls? If not I think this would answer many of the questions (as might my reading of the actual race, which I havenae done). A companion, cohort or even a summoned monster can act independantly and could even roll their own initiaive if the PC was say... unconcious. This would not be the case for a single character with two bodies anymore than if you had a dancing sword. (You have to concentrate to change its targets right?)
That being said can you "threaten" if you do not have an initaive? No? No flanking bonus/no sneak attacks. Without an initiative the player would have to decide which body acts each round.
Reminds me of memorable character I had in high school. Remember the assissin/cleric from AD&D? One half of me was 'assassin' and the other half 'cleric' The hp were in a common pool so one character could get to 0 and they would both drop. hmmm I wonder if Talon ever taught HS chemistry...?
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If you play a Dvati, you almost need to take a couple of levels of rogue just for evasion. The low hit point total is absolute killer. At 5th level a fireball does an average of 17.5 points of damage. On a successful save, the average fireball does 8 points of damage. A normal rogue has 20 hit points at 5th level. A Dvati rogue has only 10 hit points at 5th level.
Be afraid. Be very afraid.
They're very fragile. I would not expect most Dvati to survive well with a low hit point total. Trying to make sure that you have as many hit points as possible is a very good idea (such as through a high Con and perhaps Improved Toughness as a feat.
Considering how easily killed a single Dvati is relative to other classes, they're balanced.
As a note, a Dvati fighter doesn't have the hit points to front line. A Dvati rogue/ranger combination might be the best possible combination, offering the ranged combat feats and good support skills in addition to tracking.
There have been some pretty intresting comments on this Thread....but now I will be bold and propose what no one else has yet to do?!? What do you think would be the cheapest munchkiniest (is that a word?) class to be when your a Dvati? This might get intresting....
~Love The Flabulator!?!
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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There have been some pretty intresting comments on this Thread....but now I will be bold and propose what no one else has yet to do?!? What do you think would be the cheapest munchkiniest (is that a word?) class to be when your a Dvati? This might get intresting....
~Love The Flabulator!?!
As I posted above, I think the thug variant from UA has the most degenerate potential. You get more hp than a rogue and can wear heavier armor, but you get to keep that juicy sneak attack damage. Use your feats to focus on the two weapon fighting tree and you are going to be dishing out stupid amounts of sneak attack damage.
I like the idea of the Dvati, though I'm a bit curmudgeonly about letting them both be played by one character. Personally I'd probably handle them as NPCs, pretty much the same way I would if it was any other character who had an identical twin.
Unlike a lot of the trend of this thread I tend to see the Dvati more in terms of their dramatic potential. The idea of two characters with one soul who constantly take their corners and debate out every angle of each issue they come across until they understand both it and one another relative to it seems to go way beyond dungeony hack-and-slash and introduce the rare philosophical and psychological material that really boots the D&D game up a notch.
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I like the idea of the Dvati, though I'm a bit curmudgeonly about letting them both be played by one character. Personally I'd probably handle them as NPCs, pretty much the same way I would if it was any other character who had an identical twin.
Unlike a lot of the trend of this thread I tend to see the Dvati more in terms of their dramatic potential. The idea of two characters with one soul who constantly take their corners and debate out every angle of each issue they come across until they understand both it and one another relative to it seems to go way beyond dungeony hack-and-slash and introduce the rare philosophical and psychological material that really boots the D&D game up a notch.
That's a good point, but they're pretty weak if run individually. Each character has a lot of mechanical disadvantages (only one can cast a spell each turn, they have to take the same levels in classes, if one gets knocked out/held the other gets knocked out/held, half hit points) for relatively few mecahnical advantages (slightly better flanking). Unless your players are really hard core roleplayers, they're probably not going to choose such a weak race.
If you want to have each person play one, you would probably want to juice them up individually. At the very least let them take independent actions. It probably wouldn't hurt to give them full hp and an extra feat or some other benefit to compensate for all the disadvantages.
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I like the idea of the Dvati, though I'm a bit curmudgeonly about letting them both be played by one character. Personally I'd probably handle them as NPCs, pretty much the same way I would if it was any other character who had an identical twin.
Dvati are not twins. A single dvati is not a pair of individuals it is an indivual in a pair of bodies. In short, they are one being, and should be played by a single character. Dvati speak as one, act as one and are never in disagreement with themself. Not only are the characters weakened by splitting each half between two players (or player and DM)as has been pointed out already, but you are interferring with the way the race is designed for roleplaying.
I studied it further and noticed this sentence:
"These two creatures move and act seperately, but have..."
which means they get a full-round action each and seperate initiativ checks, but when one cast a spell, both needs to focus, but not when using a spell-like ability or supernatural ability. Remember this: Just because they are twins doesn't mean that they are the same places at the same time.
Cheers
Xonnit
Forget my last post i was totally wrong:
On May 21, 2006, at 2:43 PM, Thomas sørensen wrote:
I have some questions about the Dvati from Dragon magazine #271(updated in Dragon compendium vol. 1):
And I have some answers. :)
Do they share a full-round action together or do they get seperate full-round actions?
A dvati's twins share all of their actions. Between the two of them they get one standard action and one move action (although they can both move in the same move action), two move actions, or one full-round action.
Such as a dvati fighter could get two full attack actions?
No. The dvati twins share a single full-attack action.
But they should share the max. character wealth between them, right?
Yes.
And do a dvati warlock have to focus at the same time when using invocations and eldritch blast or spell-like abilities?
Yes. Only one spell-like ability per round between the two of them.
It's easiest to think of a dvati character as a single character who just happens to have two bodies. The bodies either work together to do the same task, or one body does something and other just watches.
I hope that helps!
Mike McArtor
Associate Editor
Dragon Magazine
If one was to allow a player of dvati twins to let each twin take a set of actions independant of each other (like one player playing two normal characters) but while still requireing the dvati having to both ''concentrate'' to cast spells and spell like abilites and allow the dvati twins to gain hitpoints normally (not have to share them between the two twin bodies) but still share class and xp/level gaining, what sort of level adjustment would you give this ''new and improved'' (IMO) version of the dvati? You see this is how we have been doing things and now the player will be seriously fed-up with these ''changes''.thank you
Non really... Because that needs alot of agreement.
but it could be a funny roleplaying factor: Twins in reality and twins in the game... hehe.Cheers
Xonnit
Can you please point to the thread where Mike clarified that the Dvati only get one full round action the two of them. Is this errata? I'm somewhat surprised that someone hasn't pointed this out before.
I asked him per mail...
Cheers
xonnit
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Can you please point to the thread where Mike clarified that the Dvati only get one full round action the two of them. Is this errata? I'm somewhat surprised that someone hasn't pointed this out before.I asked him per mail...
Cheers
xonnit
Thanks Xonnit.
Am I crazy in thinking that the Dragon Compendium does not have that restriction? I know that I looked for it when I first read the race because the ability to have two full actions seemed so powerful (thus this thread). I figured the balancing element was the low hit points and cost to equip the two bodies. The dvati are pretty weak if they don't get separate actions.
Thanks Xonnit.Am I crazy in thinking that the Dragon Compendium does not have that restriction? I know that I looked for it when I first read the race because the ability to have two full actions seemed so powerful (thus this thread). I figured the balancing element was the low hit points and cost to equip the two bodies. The dvati are pretty weak if they don't get separate actions.
welll maybe just a little... but rogues make great dvaties, but my favorit is the binder dvati. And the changing of origin when casting spells and the like is great too. but when i come to think about it: it would have been more balanced with the two full-round actions, but still it couldn't because then you could blast a creature to death with 10 or more strikes(as monk) but giving them a bonus move action(or maybe even standard action) would be quite balancing. And they gain a second chance, when one of them is petrified the other one knows that as a full-round action; litteraly warning them of danger ahead.
Cheers
Xonnit
Well, in my mind, the race is very balanced. My standard for comparison is, even though it was mentioned before, the Leadership Feat. Imagine in case A we have a Human Wizard, who takes leadership as his 6th HD feat. He attracts a Human Fighter Cohort two levels lower. In case B we have a Dvati Wizard. For the sake of argument I think it's reasonable to say that an ECL X character with an ECL X-2 is on the *approximate* same level of power as two ECL X-1 characters (Note the Dvati have LA of +1). So in case A we get: Separate different actions, full hit points for each class total, no codependency upon death (The Case A Wizard could attract another cohort if his first dies, be it at a penalty), etc etc. Also the feat the Case A Wizard spent to get a cohort is (somewhat) marginalized by the human bonus feat.
Given this analogy I find the Dvati to be vastly underpowered if anything.
On tales of dvati balanced-ness, I find them to actually be pretty on par with other races. I played a dvati rogue once, hoping to use me two-man team to flank and sneak attack everything that moved. I did succeed exceptionally well on this task, but otherwise, I found my character to be on the same level as the others in my party. One of my dvati twins was killed, and it caused the other one to wither away and die eventually too, so I don't see any broken-ness in the separate HP totals field.
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Well, since if the Dvati wants to cast a spell, he needs to stop what he's doing with both bodies to cast it, even the "fight & run off to the other party member with a cure spell active" trick doesn't work. Where you'd really want to be careful is with something like a TWFing nightsong enforcer. Now THAT would be scary. He can flank with himself, has close to full BAB and dishes out twice the number of sneak attack-augmented attacks per round. That would be an incredible villain, though. Especially if you're a somewhat stingy-with-XP GM. Give him a high CON score and make the PCs fight two bad guys and only get XP for one. My inkling is that they'd be okay, but that you'd probably want to be careful with them.
What would be really fun, at least for me, to do with these guys would be to make an arcane trickster type who specializes in infiltration. You can then do the "gimme a boost" team climbing stuff you see in stealth games, etc.
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I created a 20th Level Dvati Rogue just to see what would happen.
By careful selection of feats, I designed a character that could flank from any two adjacent squares, and deal a total of 200+ points of regular damage, 2-4 points of CON and STR damage, and reduce the speed of their victim by half.
It was easily the most lethal non-spellcasting character I've ever built.
Dvati are a one-trick pony. With sneak attack, they can super-flank and do insane amounts of damage, but they need more babysitting than a roomful of 3-year-olds with ADD. As mentioned, couple of hits kills one of them, and then you've lost 'em both. Nix dvati fighters for just that reason, and because you could never afford to buy them both gear. Spellcasting dvati are even worse, because all you've really got then is a single spellcaster with two targets for enemies to choose from. I'm not clear on the need for a +1 LA, to be honest.
There are alot of issues with the Dvati that I'm curious to see solved.
Things like:
How to you treat wear slots?
If one is in plate does the other have an AC of +8 without the dex limit?
If not- do they both wear armors?
What about rings, amulets, etc?
I can see it going both ways- one way makes alot of sense but is aVERY expensive limitation.. The other tracks the wealth guidelines better but can make for some very silly situations.
For example:
They share ability scores.
What if one wears gloves of dex and the other an amulet of con?
Not to mention the cost of the dual TWF that folks are talking about. Weapons alone are some of the more expensive things out there.
I think the Dvati are a Very nice concept, but the article really created more issues than it answered with them.
and Myst:
Any class abilities that say you can only use one of at a time, you'd probably stilll only be able to use one. (both would wear the same mask, I would wager) but it'd depend on how your DM viewed magical item effects too.
Most of you seem to be going the route of- separate bodies = separate magical items and such. Have any of you come across the problem of each individual side not being as powerful as a normal character? (due to the increasing cost of magical items and the need of the Dvati to have two of everything?)
-S
I would treat them as one character in all respects. Allow them one slot for both bodies, not each, but with shared effects. It's really the simplest approach.
The key thing to remember is that it really is just one character with two bodies. When adjudicating certain rules, keep that in mind. For example, I wouldn't allow a Dvati to activate a magic item twice. I also wouldn't allow them to use the aid another option for skills with itself, but maybe for combat, if mechanically possible (I'd need to review their actions per round per body).
Amaril: that makes great sense for all things magical, but what about the mundane?
If one is, for instance, wearing fullplate using a longsword and shield and the other is dual wielding daggers unarmored:
Do they both get the armor bonus? Do they both get the max-dex penalty? the movement speed penalty?
If the answer is yes then you have one humanoid terribly encumbered while being practically naked but if the answer is no you have to buy gear for them separately.. (non magic stuff is cheap, but enchanted armor isn't).
I agree on principle that they should share wear slots but it does lead to some rather bizarre (and interesting) thematic issues.
Weapons at least are easy to adjudicate, but they aren't typically seen as "wear slots" either.
For magic things (bracers of armor and all other magical items), the "shared body slot" idea works great. It just falls apart with actual armor.
Edit:
Don't the Dvati rules explicitly allow for aid-other on itself, with a higher bonus for doing so? Or is my memory faulty?
Addressing other things:
The article on the Dvati is glaringly mute on how the twins interact Except for spell casting. When spell casting both have to stand still. You can't cast two spells in a round, or attack/cast. Both twins have to "concentrate" so to speak. The Dragon Compendium is silent about how to handle skills or melee combat (or non-spell ranged combat).
This leaves us to assume one of two things:
1)it was a mistake, and that both twins must concentrate to do anything.
or
2) it was intentional, and that spell casting is mentioned since it's different, but that since melee wasn't mentioned then the twins can operate normally in melee. i.e. two full round actions.
Option 2 seems somewhat OP when given the typical rogue TWF business.
Option 1 however neuters the class to absolute and total uselessness. Given the heavy handed penalties for taking the race in the first place, using option 1 is really just telling your players you don't want any Dvati in the group.
Mysaelf, I am of the option 2 crowd. I believe that since it wasn't mentioned then common sense prevails. Two bodies equals two sets of attacks- but I can see both sides of the argument.
That is where some folks get the idea that the Dvati only get one "full round" to split between them. The rules sort of say it, but they also sort of don't say it. The actual answer falls on whether or not you want Dvati to be played in your group.
Lets face it- it'd be an interesting RP race but at some point 7 tons of mechanical penalties override interesting RP.
-S
Amaril: that makes great sense for all things magical, but what about the mundane?
If one is, for instance, wearing fullplate using a longsword and shield and the other is dual wielding daggers unarmored:
Do they both get the armor bonus? Do they both get the max-dex penalty? the movement speed penalty?
They obviously don't get benefits from mundane equipment. I think the thing to keep in mind is that it's assumed that Dvati are support casters, not front-line fighters. Look at their favored class. They're supposed to be in the back weaving magical effects. Most such characters don't typically wear heavy armor or depend on AC from mundane items.
I agree but you can't say they aren't supposed to and then assume no PC will ever try to do it.
Gnomes and halflings aren't front liners either, but give 'em a lance and a riding dog...
My point isn't to debate your specific conclusions: the point is that neither way you go makes alot of sense.
Ok: so they share wear slots. But not body slots? So all magical items are shared except for armor? What about them wearing armors of different types or different enchantments?
One wears studded leather +1 and the other wears leater +2 with a buckler.
The point is: no one rule makes sense. The Dvati are a great concept but somewhat lacking in execution.
what would the real rule look like?
Dvati share wear slots, excepting the Body/Armor slot. Each twin has his own body slot that only effects his personal body. Any bonus or penalty derived from the item worn on the body slot only effects the twin who wears it.
Example:
One twin (A)wearing full plate +1
One twin (B)wearing Robe of the Archmagi (White)
B gets +9 armor bonuses and the corresponding skill penalty checks and maximum dexterity.
Twin B gets the bonuses derived from the Robe of the Arch Magi, including SR (that twin A doesn't get) +4 resistance bonus to saves (that twin A doesn't get) and +2 enhancement bonuses on CL checks (that twin A doesn't get).
-S