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Dracovar's page

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber. 111 posts. No reviews. No lists. No wishlists.


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How about a pseudo GMPC?

Build a support character you think your group needs. Hand it to them. Tell them the character is just like a 3rd PC, but let both of the players help manage that character - giving them an opportunity to learn about another class without the burden being totally on one or another person. Have them take turns each session being the decision maker/die roller for the GMPC. Help them out a bit as needed, exerting a bit of GM persona as needed, but leave most of the decisions to the players.

Sort of like a common property cohort, in a way. Just don't let them turn the character into a sacrificial lamb in order to save their own hides, eg/ the wizard holds off the troll for a round or two while we run for our lives...

EDIT - read TacticsLion's two linky's above. He makes lots of good observations. If you are new to the game, you'll hear stories both good and bad about DMPC's. Try avoiding pitfalls that others have encountered, and you may have a better experience, as will your players. If you fall into one of the pitfalls - learn and move forward. You'll never know if you are good or bad with a GMPC unless you go down that road for yourself.

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A summooner and his abilities are intimately intertwined with his Eidolon. Your guy is just taking this both figuratively and literally. Weird? Probably. Evil? I'd go with no.

If it creeps you out, tell the *player* to tone it down, or boot him (I'm assuming you're the DM?). He isn't a regular, so why tolerate it? If it's not a big deal, roll with it.

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Ask the question - where is the city's water supply coming from? Perhaps it's a river? Sure, they might have a wall over it, but underneath? Perhaps a portcullis/metal grate?

So - army infiltrates via Water Breathing (perhaps cast off of a few wands). A couple of Rusting Grasp spells quietly take out any hindrances under the water. If the blockages are stone, well, that's what stone shape or rock to mud can deal with.

Sneak in the entire army underneath the water. At night. Y'know, Pirates of the Caribbean style...(turning your army into undead is a matter of personal preference. I'd leave that part up to you.). Works great if the city is a coastal/port city too.

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Get a flying ship (no, don't ask me how, I'm not the details guy...).
Arm troops with featherfall items.
Fly over city with flying boat under cover of darkness and air drop your army in paratroop/halo style - Death from Above!

Then ask yourself why you just didn't purchase a scroll with Teleportation Circle on it and teleport them into the city's central square in the first place. Heheh.

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Sneak up on the wall under cover of Deeper Darkness (Cleric 3). Neutralize guards w/sleep, etc. Cast Passwall (Wiz 5) on the wall. Or Rock to Mud (Wiz 5), though it's a bit more obvious. Walk through the hole in the wall into the city.

Do it at different points on the wall and hit the city simultaneously from multiple areas.

Lots of easy ways to defeat walls if you have some decent magical backing.

The Mansion idea won't work - the entrance doesn't move. It creates a doorway/portal. Skull and Shackles note - the doorway doesn't move with a ship. So, pretty sure it ain't moving with a rock, either.

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Thomas Long 175 wrote:

Limited Miracle.

Sounds like the deity is recovering from a hangover from that winter solstice festival and just isn't performing up to snuff.

So, let's call it a domain spell for Cayden's followers, eh?

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Having played a few clerics, I'd have to say that at 7th level, barring any circumstantial specific reasons for taking a particular spell from the cleric/oracle 7th level spell list, I'd load up on nothing but Minor Miracles.

Access to 6th level cleric/oracle? Great - lots of useful spells there. Access to all others from 5th level/lower - awesome. Packing a couple of these around makes my cleric pretty much ready for almost anything and there is no great material component cost involved.
If the spell is so good that you'd take it in favor of almost all the other spells on the list for that level - it might have a balance issue.

Maybe that's why they left Miracle for the 17th level casters - and as a 9th level spell, there are other good contenders on the 9th level list. A 17th+ level cleric would probably keep at least one Miracle at the ready, but might also have Mass Heal or other spells prepped too.

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(and all the old school modules that came with it - some of which have been Pathfinderized by some fine folks here on the message boards).

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The All Seeing Eye wrote:

3. You probably are done with the AP at this point. As written at the very least. Certain beats moving forward *might* happen but the narrative in those stories assume a certain level of mischief not something like this. I think you best contemplate considering how you can take what has been laid and looking with broader eyes at the world. Your players escalated things to another level so true challenges, at this point, will happen well outside what Kingmaker was originally calibrated to offer.

Oh I think the AP could still be a blast. But it will definitely have changed.

The big N is smart and powerful. Her erstwhile ally just got nuked, and she has to know that those sorts of things await her Bloom armies and her plans for the Stolen Lands. So, time to strike.

First, she ensures she's placed sleeper agents as "Joe Trooper" type guys in every PC army. Armed with a lead lined backpack and a 18th level Control Winds one shot item (Craft Wondrous) set to trigger instant Tornado. Those are really, really bad news - look up tornado under Environmental Effects.

Second, she places sleepers in every major town and city in the PC's Kingdom. Also equipped with the Control Winds nukes.

Then, she triggers her Blooms. PC's mobilize the armies which are promptly destroyed by the sleeper agents. The cities brace for catastrophe as the Bloom armies approach but then more Tornados wreck the cities. Loss of life will be massive. The Bloom armies then crash into the already mangled cities. The PC Kingdom is in shambles. They might counter nuke some Bloom armies, but it won't be enough - the Stolen Lands get stolen.

But, the AP continues. The PC's must rescue and restore their Kingdom and defeat the big N. Tell them all gloves are off - do what they can to end N and her armies of the First World. Let them run rampant. Try out their new and deadly ideas. It all happens off Golarion, which can be handy in a way. And maybe they end up winning too.

The Stolen Lands return to Golarion. Sure, they are a mangled wreck and the PC's get to retire and rebuild from the ruins. And Rulers near and far simply nod their heads sagely and say "THAT's why you don't go full retard with magical armageddon weaponry".

"The purpose of their lives was to serve as a warning to others..." can be on the monuments commemorating the PC's...

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Regardless of the other stuff - allowing Delayed Blast Fireball beads to be Teleported via Teleport Object is not a good precedent to set.

Consider - Pathfinder is the evolution of the 3.0/3.5 rule set. If we want to consider precedent from the past, consider that DBF beads were actually named specifically as an example of a magical force that the spell cannot teleport (quick Google search found that for me). However, Pathfinder dropped that little example in their spell description. Let's consider that they 1) thought that it was self evident that DBF beads were clearly magical forces, having been created by a magic spell, and thus have no need for being singled out or 2) they really approve of DBF beads being teleported around. Possibly a 3) it was an oversight that this bit of text was omitted eg/ they made a mistake. I'll go with 1) or 3), frankly.

But, lets say you really like 2). That's ok - everyone's campaign can be whatever they want it to be, rule zero being what it is. So, for those creative players, consider this: Other high level wizards aren't dumb. The PC's shouldn't have been the first to figure this one out, and even if they were, they won't be the last (anything otherwise simply defies all logic). Ask your players how much they want to be on the receiving end of this Scry and Fry tactic. If you let it stand, let them have this instance of a freebie, but after that, word gets out and THEIR enemies might do the same to them, or their followers, or their structures/buildings, etc. They have a Kingdom, and that means loads of vulnerable targets that can be DBF'd and bombed out of existence just as easily.

When the players get cute with the rules, I always ask them - do you want my NPC's to use the same tactics on you? Because my NPC's will. Don't expect to get a free pass on logical repercussions of what you've just done. Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you should.

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I think a lot of this needs a retcon, as mentioned earlier.

1. Teleporting into thin air, wrong.
2. Teleporting a bunch (8 !!) of Delayed Blast Fireball beads? Only if he went with them. Note - Teleport Object clearly stats you can't teleport magical forces - which is exactly what a DBF bead is. So, total fail on the rules there.
3. Originally mentioned 8 DBF's cast? How, with Time Stop? Max delay is 5 rounds. By the time Mr.Wizard is casting #6, the first one should be going off, right? Another fail on rules, it looks like to me. At least as described by the OP.
4. The major creation stuff - are you serious? Lets say 10 castings at max 20th level. You get 20 cubic feet per casting. That's 200 cubic feet of gold. Or, in practical terms, a 10x10 foot slab of gold only 2 feet high. Gold is 1204 lbs/cubic foot - so, you have a bomb of about 120 tons. Not bad. But, terminal velocity is far, FAR from the impact speeds of a meteor - which tend to begin at 11 km/s. That's PER SECOND. Terminal velocity is about 56 m/s, sayeth Wikipedia. I suggest you see the following website: I dropped a 3m Iron Bomb at orbital velocity of 11 km/s (your gold bomb is exponentially much, much slower) and put my distance from impact as 1 km. Guess what? Little seismic, air pressure nothing more than loud traffic, etc. Allowing this to nuke a city is ridiculous. You've now got a real world physics fails compounding the RAW fail.

I'll give your guys 10/10 for creativity, but 0/10 for actually satisfying RAW (we won't even talk about RAI). I don't think the "real world" calculations for your bomb are even remotely close to reality either.

However, I'd say that Gold Bomb would do major destructive damage to a castle - that would be entirely fair. I wouldn't want to be too close to it when it hit, either. Probably lots of flying stone shrapnel, etc. You could still pull that one off with some tweaks - for example, create those 200 cubic foot of gold on a Treasure Stitched item - then FLY above the castle and release the treasure. That might work just fine.

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I'm going to guess (or campaign for...)

Return of the Crimson Throne! Or some variation thereof to bring that classic out of 3.5 to current levels. It's been a few AP's now that we've been away from Varisia, hasn't it? For AP #100 it would be a nice touch to return there...

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Turn into a tapeworm.

Sure your exit "strategy" might be a tad unpleasant, but I'm sure trolls have all sorts of intestinal parasites that they never even give a second glance at...y'know after they've done their "business".

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Well, lets try a cheap security measure for starters - Arcane Mark. It's permanent. It costs nothing in material components. It's easy to do because it's a cantrip! Why is it so good?

You make the mark invisible. If it gets hit with a Detect Magic - it glows and becomes visible - a clear sign to any guard that someone is doing some preliminary recon divinations on the prison. You can cast a Detect Magic through a Scry sensor (5% chance of success/level) but even that should still light up an invisible Arcane Mark.

So, you riddle your dungeon/prison with these things. If one lights up - trouble might be on it's way! A sure fire alert for the guards that something is amiss (or about to be). And it's pretty much a freebie given that it's a cantrip.

I'll typically have my smarter NPC's have a ring or something similarly innocuous Arcane Marked in such a way that if it glows, only they are likely to see it. Serves as an alert that someone is pinging them with a Detect Magic (and it's time to be on your guard).

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Seconds on using the Feather Token - Oak. Although in one game (where the industrial revolution was kicking in and trains/railways were running) I thought about using a couple to derail a train...planting it in the track just enough ahead of the train that there was no way it could stop...then the entire item got banned outright, heheh. Also great for decorating your city when you don't want to wait decades for nice big trees to grow along your boulevard.

Feather Token - Anchor. A key (and cheap) component in my "destroy the navy" strategy. Invisible flying spellcaster flies over and lands on a ship and triggers it. Ship grinds to a halt for no apparent reason. While the crew starts wondering what's going on, spellcaster flies up a couple hundred feet and opens up his Treasure Stitched piece of cloth, triggering the command word...

Which then releases a 9x9x9 piece of stone (read 50 ton block of doom) to plummet onto the stationary ship below.

For a relatively cheap investment, you can "Pearl Harbor" an entire fleet.

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Sounds like you really want to do a Way of the Wicked campaign. Which, incidentally, is very well reviewed. Covers all the wonderfully evil things your group might want to do.

Having read it, I would highly recommend it.

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Sounds like it's a bit old school - the DM has to do some work integrating the dungeon into his/her campaign world. Nothing wrong with that, unless you've never ever done it - then you might find yourself at a bit of a loss.

I'm awaiting my copy (just recently ordered). So, what will I do with it?

Well, first I'll read it through see what the various challenges are, etc. Then, I'll see where in my campaign would make a good location to place the dungeon, preferably near where my PC's are active (if they aren't actively working through an Adventure Path).

After that, use NPC's, found maps, and other plot hooks to get them to start investigating the level(s) of the dungeon. Use those quests, factions, etc to build some backstory to the dungeon and the surrounding area where I've placed it.

You might find a read through Ultimate Campaign to be helpful.

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James Jacobs wrote:
Dracovar wrote:
I'd love to see a kind of "Against the Giants" style AP for Pathfinder / Golarion. Back in the "good ol days" beating up giants was one of our favorite things to do. Getting beat up by the giants, not so much (that happened too).
As it turns out, we'd love to see that too.

Excellent. Shaddup and take my money. Again. <grin>

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I'll take 300K in simulacrums of really useful monsters, decoys of myself, etc, etc, over a golem any day of the week.

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I'd love to see a kind of "Against the Giants" style AP for Pathfinder / Golarion. Back in the "good ol days" beating up giants was one of our favorite things to do. Getting beat up by the giants, not so much (that happened too).

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James Jacobs wrote:

We've showed the first cover for Iron Gods, so I guess the secret is out at least somewhere...

The Iron Gods iconics are:


Nice lineup. Forgot about the Alchemist - that sounds like a really good fit. Now, I have to go find that cover...(I just bought the Numeria product, so I figured at least Amiri would be a lock...).

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My guesses, and I like some of the guesses Samas had above...

Lirianne - we've got tech here and that means tech weaponry in all likelyhood (futuristic firearms and who knows what else). Also, she hasn't featured yet. This would probably be a perfect path to introduce her. She'll need to be a bit of a tech skill monkey to complement the gunnery - lets just hope she doesn't tinker with any nukes...

Amiri - for reasons described above. Also, it looks like she is on one Numeria product cover now already. Probably a taste of what's to come?

Seoni - blast those bots with electricity. She's a popular iconic but her using lots of evoc magic vs the bots might be key to her making the roster.

Lini - for clerical spells/healing as well as a nature vs machine dynamic. Might play very well if interacting with tech averse barbarian tribes. Nature might very much abhor a vacuum...cleaner, so it would be cool if she got the nod to help defend Golarion from these metal monstrosities.

Edit - just realized all my choices were female - so, that would probably not fly (though it would be cool). So - maybe nix Seoni and put in Ezren (he can do evoke spells almost as well). An INT based caster might be useful for figuring out technology puzzles.

Edit Edit - was editing and Set spotted my all female team. Ninja'd. Do I have to add Reiko now? Or was she already there to round out my Fox Force Five?

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Upon first glance at the illustration I couldn't help but think...

"The Protoss are coming to Golarion?" Followed promptly by.."Can the Zerg be far behind?"

StarCraft meets Pathfinder. Hmnnn...

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Orfamay Quest wrote:
Dracovar wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
icehawk333 wrote:

Purchase a speck of diamond from a friend for 25000 gp.

You now have 25000 gp worth of diamond dust.

Funny thing is this is Technically correct.

Which is what always drives me nuts about the whole "diamond dust worth x", "rubies worth x", etc. etc. It makes no sense to me and ruins a certain sense of verisimilitude.

I think the components should be based on "x carats of diamonds" or "x carats of rubies". The value of a carat can fluctuate due to market conditions, rarity, etc, but the DM should never set it below a minimum requirement for the spell (unless he has a good reason to).

So, say one carat of diamonds is worth 1000 gp.

Well, this creates its own problems of verisimilitude. Diamonds and other precious gems aren't valued per carat. Aside from the fact that gem quality is a key issue (a flawless diamond is worth a lot more than one with a noticeable flaw, and even color has an effect), a two carat diamond is worth substantially more than twice what two similar one-carat diamonds would be worth.

Case in point: You need 25 carats for the Miracle spell.

I can buy diamonds at -- literally -- 4 cents (US) per carat. So that's a dollar.

Now try giving your girlfriend a dollar's worth of sandpaper-quality diamonds and you'll see why I can get them so cheaply.

I think the notion of diamond dust worth x is rather silly, since diamond dust is practically valueless -- but the idea that a ruby that is brightly colored, well-cut, flawless, &c is more magically powerful makes sense. So I need at least 500gp worth of gem quality in order to power my magical spell.

Good points, true enough. Obviously the game dynamic is meant to make those spells harder to cast, due to cost and supposed rarity of the material component.

From more practical perspectives, I think just making it 25k in "rare" substances to cast a spell (but not so rare that you can't find them) - essentially putting just a GP cost on it - might be more reasonable. Then treat the material components availability the same way you'd treat a magic item - small settlements just won't have the necessary stuff to cast the spell...

Just tossing ideas out and musing out loud...

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Draco18s wrote:
Tiny Coffee Golem wrote:
icehawk333 wrote:

Purchase a speck of diamond from a friend for 25000 gp.

You now have 25000 gp worth of diamond dust.

Funny thing is this is Technically correct.

Which is what always drives me nuts about the whole "diamond dust worth x", "rubies worth x", etc. etc. It makes no sense to me and ruins a certain sense of verisimilitude.

I think the components should be based on "x carats of diamonds" or "x carats of rubies". The value of a carat can fluctuate due to market conditions, rarity, etc, but the DM should never set it below a minimum requirement for the spell (unless he has a good reason to).

So, say one carat of diamonds is worth 1000 gp. You need 25 carats for the Miracle spell. But, lets say diamonds are in short supply - and the average going rate for a carat is 1500 gp. Well, then that Miracle spell is going to cost you more. Conversely, if there is a glut of diamonds on the market, maybe it might cost you less (!). And the DM gets to be the arbiter of what that cost is going to be.

It does require the DM to change up treasure a bit - so, instead of getting 1000 gp worth of diamonds as treasure, you get a 1 carat diamond.

Also, mining companies should be stinking rich with all the spellcasters depleting the non-renewable resources (unless you are mining the elemental plane of earth, I suppose).

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You could Poly Any Object the phylactery into just another copper coin. Put some high powered anti-divination spells on it. Then cast Magic Aura (1 day/level) on the coin so that it doesn't radiate magic. Hide in a treasure trove with 100,000 other copper coins.

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Travelling from town to town attached to a wandering merchant who needed a few extra goons to help protect his cart(s) on the roads between towns/cities. NPC could serve as a mentor / source of info for the party - he was the first to appreciate Gregor's ability to be ready for trouble at any time. For Gregor, the merchant was the first to give him a role and feel valued, and who didn't judge him too harshly when his anger flared. Maybe said NPC has a level or two of spellcasting (just a dabbler), but encouraged Gregor that he too could dabble in the path of magic, or more, if he had the will.

The NPC merchant is in Sandpoint for the Festival - Gregor's got the day off to go to the festivities and...

<queue the curtain to rise>

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Propsken wrote:

Permanently polymorph it into a common rock. Drop it in the local equivalent of the Mariana trench. Take a six-day power-nap. Demand payment.

EDIT Go anachronistic. Polymorph it into an old Nokia phone. GIVE it to the crusaders. Laugh diabolically/uncontrolably/maniacally.

Probably the only reason I worry about dropping it somewhere "hard to get to" is that it cedes the initiative to the opposition (read: DM). So now, instead of having to contend with the active defenses of a party, he just has to solve a problem - how do I find and get to the phylactery? And magic has a way of making the impossible very possible.

As an unattended item, couldn't it just be "wished" into your hand? Or something equally easy?

So, I'd keep the phylactery close and "attended". I want a character to save against an effect, not an unattended object. Makes it harder to find and destroy, I think.

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Get the witch to swallow it. Edit - use Poly Any Object to make it super small (not Imp sized as OP mentioned in a later post).

Ensure witch has a Mind Blank and other protective spells active (contingencies, etc). Ensure all the companions of said witch are Mind Blanked too. Keep the group as untrackable as possible.

Then, enchant some small glass orb to make it *look* like a phylactery and act like that item is the one you are protecting at all costs (lead lined box, etc). Make a decoy device, heck, make a few.

Trying to get to the swallowed glass bead should prove to be difficult. Although there are certain practical issues involved (digestion being what it is...), at least you know where it is at all times.

Alternately, and playing upon Insaneogeddon (great handle, BTW) idea of the bunny - use Poly Any Object to turn Glass Orb INTO a creature, say, a bunny, and then Imprison the bunny (perhaps after casting Mind Blank on the bunny too). People will be looking for an Orb - not a creature. Heck, Poly Any Object the orb into "Bob the Commoner", put a Mind Blank on him, and keep him around in the biggest city there is. Security through obscurity. Just stay close by. Also, you'll have to refresh that Poly Any Object on a regular basis.

Edit again - ok, Bob isn't viable (20 minutes isn't too good). But, Poly Any Object into a creature, Mind Blanking the creature and THEN using Imprisonment would work very nicely, I think.

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On the off chance that Mythic rules get into the mix...a Mythic Magic Missile, especially when Augmented at Tier 4, can be pretty brutal. Maximized, and with 2 Mythic points, the spell can hit for 90 points of damage, a Line of Sight range, and pretty much *NOTHING* can stop it. Not SR, not Spell Immunity, not Shield.

But, that does require a particular rules set that lends itself to a lot of Rocket Tag tactics.

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I think your spellcasting side is seriously underpowered. By later in the AP the party won't have access to the kinds of high level spells they are going to need.

Paladin is a good choice for sure. Gunslinger or Ranged Inquisitor - pick one. Dump the monk and the range expert you didn't choose for two full casters - some arcane and divine firepower (Wiz/Sorc/Cleric/Druid/Witch).

The party needs some healing and decent spell variety. The party at present has very little healing and spell variety to deal with different situations/scenarios.

If you are going full on Mythic you will want/need some of that mythic spellcasting provided by some full caster classes.

You do get some significant potential boosts by bringing NPC's, (who can come with you), but they are not substitutes for a good selection of PC classes.

The counter point may be that the Mythic Rocket Tag, coupled with essential 4 martial classes, just might overpower/overwhelm the opposition. But sooner or later, I suspect the party will really miss not having some serious healing skills, as well as high level Wizard spells.

Have you thought about how to replace those capabilities with your current idea of Pally, Slinger, Monk and Inquisitor?

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Bah - go with a witch. Or a Magus/Hexcrafter. Take the Sleep HEX. OP said he's got a tier of Mythic too - so, take the Mythic Hex as part of your first tier load out.

Archmage = Wild Arcana (so, you don't have to worry that your familiar is missing spells). First path ability = Mythic Hexes.

Against non-Mythic targets - Mythic Sleep Hex. There is NO SAVE for one round. Carry a Scythe for the coup de grace, or let the party meat shield handle that. Timing, of course, is important, but you can drop and chop one target a round.

And Mythic Hex does NOT require the expenditure of mythic points (you'll have precious few at Tier One), which is great, you can use this all day.

How's that?

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What about having a Protection from Evil up and running? Geas/Quest is an Enchantment (compulsion) effect. If currently under a Geas/Quest, those effects would be suppressed during the spell duration. If NOT under a Geas/Quest - I'd go with what is written: "While under the effects of this spell, the target is immune to any new attempts to possess or exercise mental control over the target" - so, Geas/Quest goes "poof" when you try it on a target with Prot Evil running (assuming source was evil, in this case).

The long casting time doesn't make the spell very combat effective, unless you're facing the Miracle -> Geas thing, at which point, you've probably got bigger problems anyways...

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Tim Statler wrote:

Treasure stitching is a great way to haul lots af treasure easily.

Oh so close - but, I prefer to use Treasure Stitching for it's offensive potential.

Place a 9x9x9 foot square cube of solid stone onto the cloth and store that. Then, while flying over say, a castle or perhaps a ship (conveniently rendered immobile by a Quaal's Feather Token - Anchor while I'm invisible and flying) then from a decent height, unfurl and release the content of the cloth.

9x9x9 = 729 cubic feet of stone. Lets say it's a bit harder than sandstone, but not actual granite, and give it a rough 150 lbs per cubic foot. You are dropping a 50 ton block of stone on your target. Do it from a few hundred feet in the air.

You can hit even harder if you find a use for those left over Wall of Iron spells (at 450 lbs/cubic foot).

Bombs Away!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Perhaps Paizo should get their networking guys to take a look - maybe they can block the IP address (assuming there is just one and not an entire block that could block legit users and that it doesn't turn into a game of 'whack-a-mole').

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As many point out - your problem is your GM. That's gotta be some of the most questionable LG interpretations I've seen since Iomedae decided it would be a brilliant move to smack around some mythic heroes because they answered her questions incorrectly...(WotR path).

Since other players in the group decided to play LG, presumably KNOWING that this is how your GM interprets that alignment, well, leave to *them* to figure out how to get into the building. In the meantime, have your character go have an ale at the local taphouse.

If you do actually have 4th level divination spells, well, use them to provide the proof the party needs. If not, see my note about going to have a beer (perhaps literally and figuratively speaking).

I'd chalk this one up to "hey guys, you all are LG, so, figure out what our next move is. It's your alignment that's on the line, not mine."

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LazarX wrote:
Dracovar wrote:

Various kingdoms should have a couple of bag of holding/portable hole combos in strategic reserve - for when that pesky Tarrasque or <insert uber monster here> shows up to cause havoc.

Deployed and triggered by dimension dooring Simulacra who aren't going to disobey or question your orders.


The Tarrasque is simply too big, too awesome, too Arnold, to be sucked in by tiny planar vortex.

I'd read the vortex as RAW - if a creature is close enough to the effect, it gets sucked in. But, ya, I can see your point.

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Various kingdoms should have a couple of bag of holding/portable hole combos in strategic reserve - for when that pesky Tarrasque or <insert uber monster here> shows up to cause havoc.

Deployed and triggered by dimension dooring Simulacra who aren't going to disobey or question your orders.


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@Alleran - that's some fine work there. But, just a note, I rather doubt a single nuclear event at Starfall would seriously irradiate all of Avistan. You wouldn't want to be downwind, obviously, but even if it was something on the scale of Tsar Bomba there is only so much damage it could do. I merely point that out because, well, we on Earth have triggered a few nuclear events of our own. Like 2000+.

Check out this fun timeline of nuclear testing, 1945-1998:

Starfall is a hiccup compared to the Kyonin Event. I've been trying to figure out what might work for calculating the damage as described in the AP using this site:


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The Purity of Violence wrote:

Seriously doesn't anyone look at the OP other posts????

Back in Feb this year he started a thread titled "how to deal with a half arsed paladin" complaining about his paladin player. The OP came across as a control freak who wanted the paladin PC to fall because he had been gambling. The thread eventually got locked with multiple posts deleted.

He forces to the paladin's player to sign up to a code where the paladin will fall if "he every murders a child" (first on a list of you WILL fall if you...).

Lo and behold a few months latter he introduces into his ROTRL campaign, after four levels of goblin slaughter, a "good" tribe of goblins which plenty of NPCs know about but strangely failed to mention to the PCs. He then sets up the party to attack the goblins and BAM there falls the paladin.

Then he starts trolling here to get support for what has to be some of the worst DMing I have every seen.

So Mulet, to go back to your original post

Mulet wrote:
I need this post to make sure I'm not bullying Justin.

you've totally failed your group.

Am I being harsh? Maybe this wasn't a trap? It sure smells like one - exactly what is the stealthy good tribe of goblins adding to ROTRL? Of course here's Mulet's opinion on 'whoever' wrote ROTRL - he knows better

Mulet wrote:
Both us DM's re-process the atrociously laid out contents. (Seriously, the dudes that write up campaign stuff need to be slapped.)
from here.

Requoting, because frankly, Purity nails it. So does Shadowkire

@Mulet - I've read the other threads of yours too. You freely admit back in February that you like to make things hard. Ok, so congrats, you trapped your Paladin (much like I suspect you always wanted to) and got the result you wanted. So live with it. Paladin has fallen, don't even try the whole "redemption" route. Because, if history is a judge, you'll just do it to him again (and by extension, the party) again.

You previously posted that your party had a goblin to interrogate for 3 sessions (and this good aligned goblin tribe never came up, it seems). An NPC, presumably a trustworthy one (Shalelu), gave them a strategic briefing and never mentioned a "good" goblin tribe (why not? That's pretty important stuff when goblins around Sandpoint are generally "kill on sight" pests Heck, in another AP Sandpoint reinstitutes a "per ear" bounty on goblins!! That goblins are evil is a pretty reasonable line to take for a PC party). Then, another NPC managed to "trick" them into wiping out the tribe. Wouldn't take much, you've intentionally set the table for the party to go in, guns blazing, given intentional, on the DM's part, omissions to information that the party really should have had. Final straw - Paladin never got a hint of warning after the first couple of goblin kills that perhaps this was a big mistake, y'know, like losing his powers, feeling a disconnect with his god, etc.

If you wanted to mess with the Paladin (and lots of your other postings rather suggest this, I'd say), then congrats, you succeeded. But then, any DM can lay a trap for players, and Paladins are especially vulnerable to DM shenanigans. You can add me to Purity's camp regarding bad DM'ing.

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Was the player aware of your earlier interaction with the NPC? If so, his actions appear questionable - he should be sticking up for you, not the NPC. Ask him what is he possibly thinking and does he ever want another Cure spell during the rest of his career?

If not aware of your history with this NPC, make him aware of those earlier interactions and explain to the player you acted like that towards the NPC for very good reasons. And to butt out. Unless, once again, he doesn't feel he'll ever need a Cure spell again.

Tell him outright that you don't expect him to pull this again, and if he does, you fully expect the rest of the party to rally to your defense. Make sure you have buy-in from your fellow players on this, before playing the card.

If he persists, go full murder hobo on his character. Or, perhaps just carry through with your threat to not heal him.

Of course, the best thing to likely do is coach this "young and fairly new player to PF" about some of the basic, unwritten rules of party interaction - for most groups Player vs Player conflict is frowned upon (or outright banned). Then go full murder hobo on his character.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Axial wrote:

Obviously, the most amusing thing to do after closing the Worldwound is to scour Cheliax from the Material Plane.

Watch out, Abrogail...we're coming for you.

Perhaps the world has a way of balancing things. Perhaps, with the emergence of these Mythic Heroes, some Mythic Devils show up to ensure that Cheliax isn't scoured from the Material Plane. Or a party of Mythic Adventurers that aren't exactly on the side of the angels that have interests of their own arise independently from another part of Golarion. Perhaps for every Sherlock there is a Moriarty.

I'd see the victorious Mythic party as being semi-retired. They are now the "behind the scenes" movers and shakers. They are the ones now "employing" new generations of adventuring parties and using proxies to conduct business. They are the Circle of Eight/Harper Leaders/whatever of the world. But if they start sticking their fingers directly into things - well, equally powerful challenges will appear (leading to a Mythic Adventure, perhaps, but something that likely plays out on a plane, rather than Golarion).

So let em fade into semi-retirement, much like Sprain Ogre suggests.

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Scavion wrote:
Oh yeah and a Simulacrum template.

Agreed. But since I'm impatient, I went and made one of my own, heavily cribbed from some excellent Simulacra threads on the boards here.

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Thanks Erik - I've sent you a PM. Murphy's Law - I got home later in the day and my package arrived! Please cancel the replacement and thanks for the prompt and excellent service!

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Hi Paizo Customer Service,
I'm starting to think that my shipment - for Part 6 of the Wrath of the Righteous adventure path - has gone missing/astray. It was supposedly shipping on Feb 21 and we are now well past the 7-11 business days for shipping.

Should I wait a bit longer (the shipment is going to Canada) or raise the issue now?

If it has gone astray, what are my next steps/remedy? I have all the order information handy if needed...


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Hi James, after searching the Boards I've come up blank on this:

Divine Source from Mythic Adventures. Say a character has 10 character levels, and 10 Mythic tiers, and (s)he has selected Divine Source at 3rd, 6th and 9th tier. By RAW, he can cast 1st through 9th level spells from a number of different domains/sub-domains.

But, what is his caster level? Is it 10 (his HD), is it 10 (his Mythic Tier) is it 20 (double Mythic Tier)?

My players argue for double Mythic Tier, that is, by the time you hit Tier 9, you can cast 9th level spells (and double the Mythic Tier would indicate a 18th level caster, which seems to make sense).

And, what stat would determine the saving throw? Wisdom? Charisma? The character's main stat (Int, or perhaps Strength if it was a fighter)?

thanks in advance if you can help clarify!!

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
I am planning a Clone Master alchemist who is basically a pimp; he provides permanent simulacrums depending on the clients tastes. Lesser ones are samples.

Try sims of Dopplegangers - they should be able to read your client's minds for their ideal companion, and then provide just what the client well as perusing their thoughts for other tidbits of information that they could report back to you..

Pimp and Spymaster rolled into one...

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Upon getting the Core Rulebook, oh so many years ago, one of the very first things I house ruled was that Simulacrum does require a piece of the creature to be copied. Still makes it an immensely useful and abusable spell, but does put the brakes on some game ending things like - hey, lets just sim the end boss monster and find out his evil plans...because why wouldn't you (not considering meta-game considerations like, "whelp, there goes another AP down the drain").

Now, once you require a piece of the creature as a spell component, this can also lead to some reflection on just who/what you want to sim. In my campaign, the best sims are the ones of yourself, or also of creatures not likely to have lots of allies (or infinite numbers of allies - like Outsiders might have). Once word gets out that you are building Solars/Pit Fiends/Efreeti wish machines, you ARE going to get a visit from some appropriate representatives. At a CR level you will not be able to survive. As an object lesson to the next wizard who gets a little too cute with abusing the spell.

If we believe that a sim has some degree of knowledge, etc, you best make sure you "program" it - a Solar without explicit instructions on what he can/cannot do WILL follow your every order. But the second you aren't looking, he's going to find a way to tattle on you to the Upper Planes...and then you'll be getting that aforementioned visit...

But Crafting Sims are a fine use for the spell. And scouts. Magical firepower platforms, sure. But, if you want to maintain some versimilitude to your campaign world, you best think about how the world is going to look once Sim-usage becomes popular. What's good for the PC's is also good for the BBEG, I always say...

Of course, the availability of ruby dust could slow things down. Considering the value/cost, etc. My PC's can't just assume that Bob's Jewelry shop in Backwater Berg is going to have 5000 gp worth of rubies. Unusual material components should NOT be readily available. And if you go nuts with Simulacra, why wouldn't governments clamp down and declare rubies to be a "strategic resource" and proceed to corner the market. And a mine that produces rubies? Talk about a target worth taking (and that would be extremely well protected)! I'm sure there may be other magical means around this, but still.

Where this unfortunately breaks down is when you add the Alchemist into the mix. Their sims are much, much cheaper to build - and only require unnamed reagents. Perhaps you can limit those too, just like ruby dust.

Edit: Of course, Blood Money is the most logical way around the Ruby issue, as has been mentioned. But, that spell came out of the Rise of the Runelords - so, what if the events/AP never happened? Would you make that spell available to your PC's anyways?

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Orthos wrote:
Odraude wrote:
To be fair, she is the goddess of paladins. I shouldn't be surprised that the Queen of Paladins is everything that is Lawful Stupid.
I'm just going to link the rant I already did on this wretched, flimsy, and pointless excuse for an excuse.

To be fair, you forgot that I later mentioned my glaring omission of /sarcasm ON and /sarcasm OFF...

Although I do feel a perverse amount of pride in the table flip mode comment in your rant. That was gold.

But, I'm still totally in agreement with you and chuckg (whose newsletter I believe I need to subscribe to...) /GRIN.

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Actually, as a GM you can have a lot of fun with this while at the same time letting your player scratch that itch to make extra money.

First, you need to be clear with the player that you won't allow it to unbalance the WBL guidelines. So, what is your business (run by cohort and followers) doing with the money? Reinvesting. Buildings, equipment, wages, etc all need to be attended to. Let this be the PC's eventual retirement plan - running his successful company as an NPC. It might be a satisfying conclusion to an adventuring career, to retire as the head of a influential merchant house, temple, or whatever.

Second, allow a little trinket now and again. Reward creativity and effort. Don't let the bonus overshadow the other players WBL, or perhaps the player might gift something to everyone - keeping all the PC's on an equal footing (and giving them a reason to help support this business endeavour). I like having players really into the game, if this helps for this player, go for it. And the little extra trinkets now and again make up for what I'm going to do to them...

Finally, why do I not mind this kind of thing? Well, cohorts and followers that are being pimped out for work create a vulnerability for the PC. Lots of potential for plot hooks. Lots of targets if a BBEG gets away and wants to extract some revenge. Who knows, maybe the cohort gets tempted to siphon off a bit for himself and the PC finds himself trying to reign in a wayward cohort.

So, I see it as an opportunity for lots of fun and additional challenges to pose to the PC(s). As far as the wealth goes, well, I see that as more of an "endgame" reward. Once their retired, does it really matter if their WBL is somewhat out of whack? Not to me. Because they are no longer adventuring and it ceases to be a consideration.

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