Magus Spellstrike Thread

Greetings Fellow Gamers, I recently asked James Jacobs a question on his Ask James anything thread. He replied that I should ask the same question on the rules forum and hit FAQ!

So here is the Link to the Question: CLICK HERE

I have determined a better way to ask the question so here goes.

How does the magus ability spellstrike interact with the rules for spells with a range of touch?

• One: The function of Spellstrike is to allow the touch component of the touch spell to be replaced by a weapon component. This allows the following benefits: You may take your move before casting the spell, after touching the target, or between casting the spell and touching the target. If you don't discharge the spell in the round when you cast the spell, you can hold the charge indefinitely.
  

• Two: The function of Spellstrike is to allow the opportunity for a combination of spell damage and weapon damage, however all benefits beyond spell effect of a touch spell are negated. You must cast the spell and strike with no movement, you cannot hold a charge if you miss, touch spells that give multiple charges do not give multiple charges in conjunction with spell strike.
  

• Three: Something in the middle of the two above options, like the Spell Channel ability out of 3.5 except that it only allows touch spells to be channeled . However you can hold a charge if you miss but you do not get multiple charges from spells that provide such. You can also move before, in-between, or after the casting of the spell.
  

Of Course it could be none of the above, but a FAQ from the designers would be greatly helpful.

Thanks in advance for hitting the FAQ, and thanks to the Designers for their consideration.

Here are my questions in regards to Spellstrike:

1. If the caster fails to discharge his touch spell on the round it is cast he may hold the charge. It is discharged if he touches anything by the rules. What does anything include? Is this poorly written? What about items the Magus may be holding? By definition, he is touching his sword. Please clarify.

Personally, I like the idea of the caster who has to be careful what he touches, holding his hands out in front of him like time bombs waiting to go off. I'm fine with having to have empty hands to hold a charge. Others prefer to have their cake and eat it too.

If the caster is allowed to be touching any number of things, and hold a charge all the same, what is the point of not allowing the caster to touch anything, even unintentionally?

***

2. Touch spells in combat allow a caster to:
a) take your move before casting the spell,
b) after touching the target, or
c) between casting the spell AND touching the target.

Casting a spell provokes an attack of opportunity. It is defined as something in Pathfinder. Normal touch spells via option "c" above allow the caster to cast the spell and then deliver the spell effect.

Spellstrike on the other hand says that the caster gets an attack as part of the casting of the spell. That is saying that the attack happens congruently with the casting of the spell. Which means that the Magus is not allowed to cast the spell, move, and THEN get his free melee attack.

Please clarify.

Greetings Fellow Gamers, I recently asked James Jacobs a question on his Ask James anything thread. He replied that I should ask the same question on the rules forum and hit FAQ!

So here is the Link to the Question: CLICK HERE

I have determined a better way to ask the question so here goes.

How does the magus ability spellstrike interact with the rules for spells with a range of touch?

• One: The function of Spellstrike is to allow the touch component of the touch spell to be replaced by a weapon component. This allows the following benefits: You may take your move before casting the spell, after touching the target, or between casting the spell and touching the target. If you don't discharge the spell in the round when you cast the spell, you can hold the charge indefinitely.
  

OR

• Two: The function of Spellstrike is to allow the opportunity for a combination of spell damage and weapon damage, however all benefits beyond spell effect of a touch spell are negated. You must cast the spell and strike with no movement, you cannot hold a charge if you miss, touch spells that give multiple charges do not give multiple charges in conjunction with spell strike.
  

OR

• Three: Something in the middle of the two above options, like the Spell Channel ability out of 3.5 except that it only allows touch spells to be channeled . However you can hold a charge if you miss but you do not get multiple charges from spells that provide such. You can also move before, in-between, or after the casting of the spell.
  

Of Course it could be none of the above, but a FAQ from the designers would be greatly helpful.

Thanks in advance for hitting the FAQ, and thanks to the Designers for their consideration.

I'm thinking One, primarily because of the Pool Strike ability the Magus can get later. It lets him create a charge (like most touch spells) purely using his Arcane Pool however) which is usuable with spellstrike.

"He can use this ability with the Spellstrike class feature. If he misses the attack he can hold the charge for up to 1 minute before it dissipates." Which indicates to me that holding a weapon/shield/wearing rings/gauntlets does not automatically release a charge, so long as you were holding/wearing the item before hand.

I think the Spellstrike rules are clear.

However, based on the number (and duration) of question threads on the subject, there really needs to be some clarification.

Thus, I will hit the FAQ, and I encourage everyone else to do the same, even if you feel (as I do) that you understand how the rule works.

Everyone benefits by having the rules cleared up. (Even when it turns out I'm wrong!)

Bump

I think the Spellstrike rules are clear.

However, based on the number (and duration) of question threads on the subject, there really needs to be some clarification.

Thus, I will hit the FAQ, and I encourage everyone else to do the same, even if you feel (as I do) that you understand how the rule works.

Everyone benefits by having the rules cleared up. (Even when it turns out I'm wrong!)

Good point. FAQ clicked.

Bumb

Greetings Fellow Gamers, I recently asked James Jacobs a question on his Ask James anything thread. He replied that I should ask the same question on the rules forum and hit FAQ!

So here is the Link to the Question: CLICK HERE

I have determined a better way to ask the question so here goes.

How does the magus ability spellstrike interact with the rules for spells with a range of touch?

• One: The function of Spellstrike is to allow the touch component of the touch spell to be replaced by a weapon component. This allows the following benefits: You may take your move before casting the spell, after touching the target, or between casting the spell and touching the target. If you don't discharge the spell in the round when you cast the spell, you can hold the charge indefinitely.
  

OR

• Two: The function of Spellstrike is to allow the opportunity for a combination of spell damage and weapon damage, however all benefits beyond spell effect of a touch spell are negated. You must cast the spell and strike with no movement, you cannot hold a charge if you miss, touch spells that give multiple charges do not give multiple charges in conjunction with spell strike.
  

OR

• Three: Something in the middle of the two above options, like the Spell Channel ability out of 3.5 except that it only allows touch spells to be channeled . However you can hold a charge if you miss but you do not get multiple charges from spells that provide such. You can also move before, in-between, or after the casting of the spell.
  

Of Course it could be none of the above, but a FAQ from the designers would be greatly helpful.

Thanks in advance for hitting the FAQ, and thanks to the Designers for their consideration.

This came up recently. I don't know if it inspired your thread or not, but even those of us on opposing sides agreed that the "touch anything" clause is not to be taken literally. The other thread received FAQ's also, but I will also FAQ this one.

Yes, in a large part the thread you speak of did inspire this thread. It seem that no matter where we go in life we must be faced with the issue of letter of the law vs. the spirit of the law. The big difference between here and real life is that maybe we can get the two to be the same.

BUMP

BUMP

This is one of those attention grabbing posts cause I'd love to get an answer to these questions as I have two magi.

40+ FAQ presses not good enough for answer? =/

Bump. Hello?

We are over 50 now . . . Is it that hard to work out how this should be handled?

I'd love some clarification on this too...this question has been bugging me for quite a while now.

I play a Magus at our table. The way we've been handling it is to say that my character can hold the charge indefinitely. Casting another spell discharges the original spell.

Perhaps there should also be a rule that says that you can't hold the charge beyond a given encounter. This has come up in cases where I cast shocking grasp, miss with my spellstrike, and the combat ends before I have the opportunity to use it. The next encounter might not be for an hour, or several hours, in game time, and it seems unreasonable to allow me to hold the charge that long.

1

yhea! need clarifications!
-does spellstrike work with two handed w.?(to cast a spell with s. almost one hand free is necessary but to wield a 2h 2 hand are necessary too , and also to make one attack with this kind of weapon)
-can move or not between casting and hit roll?(i think no because with spellstrike the cast is no more touch)

neeeeeed please!! ^^

FAQ!

Thanks Sean!

Also, I could have sworn there was a thread about the interaction of Spellstrike and multiple touch spells like Chill Touch and Frostbite (i.e. can you discharge one 'charge' per hit or only one per round?). I can't find it however.

And of course there's the hot topic of arcane mark with spellstrike that would be really nice to have FAQed just to quell the arguments!

thanks! what about 2 handed weapons?

thanks! what about 2 handed weapons?

You can extrapolate from the FAQ, that if drawing a new weapon doesn't discharge the spell, neither will using a two-handed weapon. So Spellstrike with a two-handed weapon is fine. (Spell Combat is not)

Also, I could have sworn there was a thread about the interaction of Spellstrike and multiple touch spells like Chill Touch and Frostbite (i.e. can you discharge one 'charge' per hit or only one per round?).

That's not a Spellstrike question, it's a Chill Touch (and/or Frostbite) question. However it works with touches/unarmed/natural is how it works with Spellstrike.

IE:
1 zap per round will be the same with a weapon.
1 zap per hit will be the same with a weapon.
(CL) free attacks as part of casting will be the same broken cheese with a weapon.

Talon Stormwarden wrote:

Also, I could have sworn there was a thread about the interaction of Spellstrike and multiple touch spells like Chill Touch and Frostbite (i.e. can you discharge one 'charge' per hit or only one per round?).

That's not a Spellstrike question, it's a Chill Touch (and/or Frostbite) question. However it works with touches/unarmed/natural is how it works with Spellstrike.

IE:
1 zap per round will be the same with a weapon.
1 zap per hit will be the same with a weapon.
(CL) free attacks as part of casting will be the same broken cheese with a weapon.

True, true, I get focused on my current characters I guess, the one to whom this question applies currently is a magus.

The question still stands though, as to exactly how multi-touch spells interact with iterative attacks. The only answer I recall seeing is an unofficial one from James that, iirc, came down on the 1 per round side.

That discussion doesn't belong in this thread however.