Has anyone noticed how you never actually meet a Rum addict? Apparently because they're all -dead-.
Why is everyone on the Wyrmwood not dead already? After being reduced to a 1hp wreck by con damage from drinking the mandatory rum rations (1d3 con damage, unresistable, every night) the player fails a single check, takes his whipping, and is dead as a stone in a single strike of two lethal damage. That's one hit point, and -1 = -Con. Dead.
Looks like the inner sea is safe forever from piracy! All pirates die within two weeks of boarding a pirate ship and swilling their rum.
Same goes for anyone who tries Pesh even a single time, only a hundred times worse because you can't resist addiction.
Without magical aid, these drugs are lethal. How is anyone supposed to survive them?
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Ah: From Rob McCreary
The rum ration is designed to be pretty hard-core - it should be something the PCs probably try to avoid, as soon as they realize its negative effects (either with the relatively easy Stealth check to pour it out or by choosing to take more easily-healed lashes instead). In addition, it provides yet another reason to hate the Wormwood and its officers. The rum ration also gives PCs a difficult choice to make: if they drink the rum, they get the Charisma bonus that can help them influence other crew members, but they'll suffer the negative effects of the rum.That said, if you want to keep the rum ration but reduce its negative effects, WampaX provides a good alternative with his "watered down" rum. Alternatively, you could reduce the rum's Con damage to 1d2, thereby making it easier for a PC to heal the Con damage overnight, but still be dangerous. You could further reduce the compounding effects by allowing the PCs to heal 1 point of Con damage overnight, and an additional point of Con damage during the day while they work. A PC can drink the rum ration some nights, but he might want to "sit out" the rum ration occasionally to heal some accumulated damage.
In our office campaign, as soon as the PCs realized the danger, they tried to avoid drinking the rum at all costs - except for when they wanted that Charisma bonus, that is! :)
But the rum ration is mandatory. The big powerful clumsy barbarian with the -1 dex modifier is going to fail that Sleight of Hand check more than 50% of the time, and even his big hitpoints are going to dwindle, healing 1hp a day and taking cats and lashes at level 1.
Worse, the RP aspect: Pirates have -mutinied- for not being given their rum rations. It's a huge deal in the Pirates of the Inner Sea book. Not feeding your crew their rum causes strife and bickering. Pirates -want- their booze. They want to get drunk and unwind. This isn't a naval vessel. Players, particularly those who have taken the Piratical Legacy trait, are going to be playing pirates, and a big part of that is the swilling rum of it all. If you drink rum every night, you die.
How come Tilly isn't dead? She's a rum addict, right?
This came up in the GM Reference thread. You can see Rob McCreary's comments on the rum here. But in general, you are right. Straight ability damage isn't a great way to deal with recreational drugs. I assume it is to keep players from abusing them for their bonuses then easily stopping when they get addicted, but you end up with a situation where addicts won't last more than a couple weeks.
EDIT: Shoot, ninja'ed. Anyway, I agree, it is a problem. It also affects the "Heave" game: there is no way to win without somebody dying of alcohol poisoning.
Right, just noticed that as well. Seems to me like it wasn't playtested well. It's one of those sticking issues we have since, in the Carrion Crown game (my weekly sessions) my character has become addicted to a constitution depleting drug on his first puff. A DC20 drug. Pesh.
He doesn't know what it is, but with his low-to-middling constitution, he has about a 5% chance of succeeding on resisting the addiction, and is going to suffer those penalties until he can get the expensive spell cast, or is just going to have to -suck up- the constant 2 points of unhealable con and wisdom damage and the -2 penalties to strength and con until... you know... he levels three or four times.
Still not as bad as failing a swim-check while being hit by a leech swarm.
But we have this situation with drugs where they are instantly addictive and incredibly lethal. If presented with the opportunity to do a drug again, an addict should not be refraining, they should be indulging. And once they realize their bodies are wasting away, and they stop, they stay in their horrible withered state until they die. Moderate addictions are -horrific-.
At least with rum you can have the shakes for a few days until you take another drink after healing up some con damage... assuming you're allowed not to drink. Or you don't want to drink.
After two days of drinking rum you should be coughing like you gargled ground glass. -Six- con damage is more than half of most NPCs health.
That's one hit point, and -1 = -Con. Dead.
Ability damage to Constitution do not reduce a character's death threshold - penalty from ability damage apply to specific things and in case of Constitution it's Constitution checks, Fortitude saves and maximum and current hp.
Worse, the RP aspect: Pirates have -mutinied- for not being given their rum rations. It's a huge deal in the Pirates of the Inner Sea book. Not feeding your crew their rum causes strife and bickering. Pirates -want- their booze. They want to get drunk and unwind. This isn't a naval vessel. Players, particularly those who have taken the Piratical Legacy trait, are going to be playing pirates, and a big part of that is the swilling rum of it all. If you drink rum every night, you die.
However, RW sailors were rarely given straight rum, they were served a 4/1 water/rum mix, usually with some kind of citrus juice and/or other spices mixed in called Grog. This was because the fresh water carried on ships became stale and filled with algae on longer trips, so the rum and spices were used to cut the foul taste of the moldy water.
Life on a ship of any kind, especially during the Age of Piracy, is difficult and dangerous enough under the best of circumstances. Crews of the period were far less inclined to put up with a crewmember to drunk to carry out his duties than a modern ship.
I also thought it would not fit to have an bunch of pirated running around trying everything they can to avoid drinking alcohol.
I actually used "normal rum" for most nights, but one of the PCs wanted to impress Grok of his drinking capabilities. So I used this rum for a game between the two. He actually took 8 points of constitution damage in that drinking game, which still wasn't healed when they met the reefclaws. But as he really played well and took the damage and never faltered, he was able to befriend Grok.
In my game the rum ration is watered to 'Grog' which only does a single point of con damage. Anyone who wishes can ask for their ration unwatered and Heave is always played with unwatered rum. I made a point of showing Tilly always drinking her ration straight and gave her a bonus feat to boost her fort save to cover her from the ill-effects.
So what we have here is a criminal waste of good rum, and a horrific poison that's being foisted off on the crew. It's too much. And it doesn't need a 'change it for your game' patch, it needs a full-up company adressed Errata.
There needs to be a Fort-Save to avoid the negative effects of ALL drugs, like there is for the negative effects of poisons, which this essentially is.
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If you just change the damage to 1d3-1 Con, it works fine.
It'll still eventually kill everyone, but it at least takes much much longer to do it. Besides, if you have 2 or 3 bad rolls in a row, it gives you an incentive to dump your drink and take a breather from the stuff (assuming you don't get caught!). It also makes the game of heave a bit more fun since everyone isn't dying after a couple drinks.
Based on some back of the napkin computations, in a party of four, it would be unlikely for some character not to accumulate at least 5 con damage over the 20 day voyage if they drank the rum every night. I think that would give any PC pause without being immediately fatal. You can also expect at least two of them to develop an addiction, even if they only failed the save on a 1.
For me, that's penalty enough. The only change I think I'll make is that the DC to ditch your drink will be upped to 15 which is more in line with the guidelines on page 25 for the DC of various stealthy actions.
That small change does a number of things:
1. The pirates for the most part actually drink their rum.
2. There is still incentive to ditch your drink now and then.
3. There is a real risk in attempting to ditch the drink since very few will be able to take 10.
1d3-1 isn't a bad idea. It still has a chance of being bad, but isn't guaranteed to accumulate.
15DC is harsh. Remember the second offense gets you 6 lashes with the cat: 1d4 lethal ~15 hp. Probably won't kill most 1st level characters, even on good rolls.
Actually, it is guaranteed to accumulate (from a mathematical standpoint), even though the average net effect is 0 (1 damage and 1 heal per day).
Regarding the DC15 - remember that you only get caught if you fail by 5 or more. Failing by 4 or less just means you're interrupted and can't carry out the action (meaning you have to drink it).
For any character with a rank in stealth as a class skill only needs a 12 DEX to succeed by taking 10. For other characters, with a suitable diversion (+2 from an aid another) and a decent DEX (16+), they *might* be able to succeed with taking 10, but probably not for most.
The real danger comes from addiction. Even though the DC is low, once you're addicted it's hard to shake since ditching your drink for two consecutive nights could be tough. As it's currently written, ditching the drink is easy so it's just an inconvenience to be addicted.
Oh - and lashes from the cat are actually 1d4+2 a piece (average of 4.5)so 6 of them would be 27 damage. Even though it's non-lethal, this will still take most 1st level characters into the negatives (though not all). Heck, 6 lashes from the whip for the *first* offence averages out to 24 damage which is still quite severe if you ask me.
Does 1d3-1 give at least 1 pt of damage? That would accumulate: Average net 1/3. Otherwise you should heal on the 0 days as much as you get on the 2 days.
No, 1d3-1 means 0, 1 or 2. Even still, in the long run, you would expect characters to accumulate con damage thanks to probability and the law of large numbers. Try a simulation and you'll see what I mean.
Regarding the whip and lash, in the AP they are both listed as +2 damage (from a strength bonus from the wielders) and both are listed as non-lethal damage (even the cat). The PRD seems to back up that the cat-o'-nine-tails is supposed to be non-lethal damage.
As for the Con damage, it's not so much accumulate as sometimes you'll have runs of 2s that build up. You'll also have runs of 0s that'll take you back down. In the long run, you'd eventually get a run of high numbers that would kill you.
Is that what you meant?
Yup. By my estimation, if the crew drank their alloted portions each and every night, within a couple months there wouldn't be enough left to sail the ship.
In the long run, you're guaranteed to accumulate enough con damage to kill you regardless of your initial con score. The big difference is that by using 1d3-1, it probably won't happen in the span of 20 days so it feels more realistic for both the PCs and the NPCs aboard.
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But we still have the issue where a newbie GM runs things as presented in the book (ie: My Wife), and kills us all and doesn't know why, and has a panic attack trying to figure it all out. APs are meant to be accessible to the player base, from vet all the way down to first time GMs.
This is like saying that saddlesores give 1d3 dex damage in a cowboy game, and anyone who rides more than four hours a day gets them. No save allowed to resist.
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Ha, I just eddited the rules. damage part of the rum was ignored if you made the fort save.
The 'keeping the crew docile' effect is done by the fatigue part of the effect, which always happens. Easily makes people want to get the charisma ( or aren't sneaky enough) but still pacifies them, especially if they were already fatigued to begin with. So some slip it away, most drink it.
If you fail the fort save, you may also become addicted (second save +2, but will). If addicted and you don't use the drug regularly, you immediately take the damage again, but can't heal it until you either a) resume the drug, or b) break the addiction.
So, this way an addict kind of wants to keep using it, regular users don't rapidly degrade, but you can in fact still OD on it.
Variant of heave: same thing, only damage when failing fort save. After three fails immediately make a will save vs current DC to avoid falling unconcious. Quick d6 roll, 1 you vomit all over yourself before falling down, 6 you keep going but will not remember anything the next day beyond this point.
Sidenote: anyone else notice that mister Plugg's cat is nonlethal in his stat block? Makes me annoyed every time I see it.
Ha, I just eddited the rules. damage part of the rum was ignored if you made the fort save.
The 'keeping the crew docile' effect is done by the fatigue part of the effect, which always happens. Easily makes people want to get the charisma ( or aren't sneaky enough) but still pacifies them, especially if they were already fatigued to begin with. So some slip it away, most drink it.
If you fail the fort save, you may also become addicted (second save +2, but will). If addicted and you don't use the drug regularly, you immediately take the damage again, but can't heal it until you either a) resume the drug, or b) break the addiction.
So, this way an addict kind of wants to keep using it, regular users don't rapidly degrade, but you can in fact still OD on it.
Variant of heave: same thing, only damage when failing fort save. After three fails immediately make a will save vs current DC to avoid falling unconcious. Quick d6 roll, 1 you vomit all over yourself before falling down, 6 you keep going but will not remember anything the next day beyond this point.
Sidenote: anyone else notice that mister Plugg's cat is nonlethal in his stat block? Makes me annoyed every time I see it.
I like this version of rum of yours and will likely go with it when I start of the AP tomorrow.
And btw: Pluggs's cat actually does nonlethal damage, because the Cat o' nine Tails is listed with "nonlethal" both in the Player's Guide and the Pirates Companion.
I'm still banging this around i my head, I think the Wis drain instead of Con makes sense. I'm also thinking that a heal check maybe DC 15 will bring back 1 or 2 pts for successfully nursing a hangover. That will help explain why the crew isn't really impacted heavily and the party will have to figure it out.
I considered changing the damage from CON to something else, but I decided against it. My reasoning was as follows:
1. The effects that most people associate with being drunk are typically loss of coordination and clarity of thought. These effects go away once the drunkeness wears off. I feel that the fatigued condition is a pretty good model for this. If you really wanted to, you could impose -2 to wisdom for the duration of the fatigued condition.
2. The long term effects of drinking alcohol to excess is a toll on your health including reduced energy, a weaker immune system and eventually liver failure. I feel that the con damage (reduced to 1d3-1) models this reasonably well.
Am I making it too easy on my group by letting them use "Purify Food and Drink."
Am I making it too easy on my group by letting them use "Purify Food and Drink."
Have them make the roll while hiding it. Otherwise Scourge, Plugg or whoever accuses them of poisoning the drink etc... some lashing etc.
Having a small caster standing behind larger folks might help in this (stealth, or simply cover), though - which would be another "clever" way to circumvent the dosage.
Myself, I changed the rules by causing the characters to be automatically fatigued on the following watch from alcohol withdrawal/hangover. Which became pretty brutal when hit with another fatigue = exhaustion, but was not quite as deadly as the rum-spiking along the drug rules. You could of course "slack" to work off the fatigue, but suffered a penalty to your skill for .it
Otherwise though, some players might have started to wonder how Kroop and Grok were still alive...
Scourge and Plugg (and their cronies) made spot checks as to who actually drank the stuff (or made someone drink the pint before the assembled crew ).
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Alcohol does not instantly deal Con damage.
Nothing you would drink without going blind, anyways.
It does make you fatigued. It might even nauseate you or knock you unconscious, and alcoholism will kill you.
What about the damage being in nonlethal?
For example:
Type Ingested; Addiction Minor, Fortitude DC 10
Price N/A
Effects 2d4 hours; +2 bonus on charisma-based skill checks, fatigue
Damage 2d4 nonlethal
Special A character may have a number of rum rations per week up to double his constitution modifier (Minimum 1) before incurring additional detriment. After this limit, the character takes 1d3 points of con damage, and a further 1d3 if he exceeds three times his constitution modifier (Minimum 2). Cut these limits in half for small characters. Any character that drinks a number of rum rations greater than his constitution modifier in one day must make a fortitude save DC 15 or be sickened until his nonlethal damage is healed.
My intent is to house rule it so that every 5 days, the damage goes down by 1 until it's just a 1. And that's 5 days of doing it right, until their bodies get used to it. If they drink more than a ration, then they'll take the full damage. That's probably closer to something that makes sense. If anyone has create water, I'd likely let them water it down, but won't count towards their days.
I also intend to have them have a -1 penalty to Wisdom and Dex, but it's only a penalty that wears off overnight. Just for giggles when they freak out.
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I don't know about you but I feel like the person who invented the rum ration hates booze. In fact DnD and pathfinder make all drugs poisons harming people up to 1/3 of their stats for one use. For me I felt a pirate crew ditching their rum detracted from the setting and harmed Roleplaying. Would it sound right for Jack Sparrow to be glad the rum is gone.
I reworked it to not hurt the players but you could abuse rum become sick and not awake in time for roll call and be punished. It is optional to drink but not drinking will be seen as not being part of the group and that player will have a -2 to interactions that night. Every PC is granted 2 rations a night more can be bough these can be sold back to the quartermaster, raitions may also be gifted to gain a +1 max +2 to interactions with a crew member. It is also worth more out to sea because of the restriction of supply.
If you like the idea that a captain is poisoning his crew you could always change it from the rum killing people to an additive in the rum. But to make a crew more controllable damaging their Int or Wiz makes more sense then weaking their body's, effectively harming the ships ability to sail and fight.
The Fact that this poison is so readily available and cheep has another consequence a rouge Poisoner can change the type and put it into a contact or inhaled poison and give another dose every round.
To combat this you could also say it is an additive, poison makers would have to distill it out with out destroying the poison using craft(alchemy)skill. You could then deduce that the cost of this poison would be something like "Nitharit", Making it hard to produce and abuse, not to mention limiting it to the Wormwood.
Nitharit
Contact, dc13 1d3 Con 1 save 650 gp
Rum Ration
Type Ingested; Addiction Minor, Fortitude DC 10
Price 2cp in port 5Sp out to sea
Effects 2d4 hours; +2 bonus on charisma-based skill checks, fatigue, sickened
Damage Fatigued until resting 8 hours the following day
Special
For the PC to receive the +2 bonus he must fail the fort save and gain fatigued condition the next day, failing by 5 or more the PC is sickened 2d8 hours and fatigued until resting 8 hours the following day. The morning following a Will save equal to 10 + 2 per rations consumed + any additional modifiers is need for the pc to rise in time for roll call. Failure means you miss roll and will be summarily punished. Party members can attempt to assist the slumbering PC granting one 1 reroll. No matter what action taken by party members no additional roles or bonus can be made short of the slumbering PC spending a hero point.