Probably they just forget. But I have a problem with abilities linked to shield spell. Now we have 2 shield spells available (Shield and Glass Shield) and over time we may get more.
So in the same way that we can complain about Shield spell is not into Shields Up! The same could be sair for primal casters that normally get access only to Glass Shield. Similar situation could be said to parry too.
Probably the current situation is enought once that its works for ongoing spells like Fire Shield and Kineticists impulses that given a Shield to allow be used with Raise a Shield than simply was adding abilities similar to shields to the tactics that may always miss something that can act like a shield or become full of things inside.
Hi,
would it be that hard to add a sentence to this tactic which specifies that someone, who has the Shield spell can cast it as a reaction as part of this tactic? Casters are already neglected enough as is, why not add simple things like this to help them out a bit?
I see a significant difference between a Shield and the Shield spell: A Shield takes your hand whether you use it or not. So a Shield user will tend to raise their Shield by default and the Commander is just helping them with a tactic they already use. On the other hand, the Shield spell doesn't cost much (it's trivial to grab a Cantrip) so it can be seen as a one-action way of giving +1 to AC to the whole party (there's the question of the reaction cost but the Commander can aleviate that and many characters don't care about their reactions).
I feel that Shields Up! is hard to balance between too weak and too strong.
My problem with restricting it from the Shield spell is you just force your caster buddies to run around with a shield, no matter how anti-flavor that might be.
I 100% understand why you made this discussion. It's an issue that is general to the Commander: It pushes the whole party to commit to specific strategies even when they are rather weird for their class.
For example, if you allow to use the Shield spell, you now force all 2-handers and 2-weapon users to grab the Shield spell which is as much anti-flavor than having to use a Shield on a caster.
Well some sacrifices need to be made and I feel allowing allies to cast the Shield or any other shield like cantrip would be fine. Ready, Aim, Fire! already lets Casters shoot Cantrips of 30ft or more as a Reaction. Sure this would make 2-handed martials want the shield cantrip but that's like saying trip and Reactive Strike is just a go too. Besides it is a feat dip in you want to do it, which should be fine.
Commander has a issue working with Casters and Kineticist which is just making it more playable in a mostly martial game. Which is not a fun thing to promote. Oh you want to command your allies? Hope they can benefit from all the movement and offensive tactics before Ready,Aim,Fire! Tactic
My counter argument to that would be most, if not all dual weapon users already have easy access to Twin Parry or something similar, and 2-hand weapon users already had access to the Shield spell, so the only thing that would change here would be swapping 1 action for 1 reaction to raise it.
All casters have a much easier access to a Shield. It's available right from level 1 at the cost of 2 gp.
Martials have to take feats that many won't take because it costs an action they don't want to use on defending themselves. But when it stops costing an action it becomes a no-brainer. Also remember that the Commander gives free reactions, so it doesn't cost a reaction if the Commander says so (and clearly, they will on some martials).
My problem with restricting it from the Shield spell is you just force your caster buddies to run around with a shield, no matter how anti-flavor that might be.
To me this is good.
"Merlin! Knock off the whining and pick up that shield, you're in the army now! If you want it to be different get in the rear with the gear or get good enough that you're helping this unit out by holding some wands, scrolls, or a staff instead."
Even if there is only one person in the party with a shield, this tactic is neutral action cost wise, and probably still beneficial as other classes that might have shields are likely to have more need of the action, or the commander can just use a different tactic/talk to the GM about retraining.
In larger parties Shields Up! Does have the potential to get pretty wild in action compression.
I agree with Bidi that the biggest issue with it working with the cantrip isn’t casters, it is 2 hander martials. As I have seen with my Ars Grammatica wizard, the ability to provide a free +1 AC to many allies is a massive buff that reduces crits and hits substantially. It already combines well with this ability but limits weapon useage at least
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We already know that the devs are aware of the class interaction problems. At least regarding Kineticists not casting spells.
I feel like the Shields Up ability not working with the Shield cantrip falls into the same type of category. Possibly it wasn't put into the playtest simply because it wasn't considered.
Or it could be because they didn't want to spend the time to find wording of mechanics that would work properly at this point (before the ability is even tested and approved for inclusion in the final release).
Even if there is only one person in the party with a shield, this tactic is neutral action cost wise, and probably still beneficial as other classes that might have shields are likely to have more need of the action, or the commander can just use a different tactic/talk to the GM about retraining.
In larger parties Shields Up! Does have the potential to get pretty wild in action compression.
I agree with Bidi that the biggest issue with it working with the cantrip isn’t casters, it is 2 hander martials. As I have seen with my Ars Grammatica wizard, the ability to provide a free +1 AC to many allies is a massive buff that reduces crits and hits substantially. It already combines well with this ability but limits weapon useage at least
One person with a shield isn't really action-neutral, because you need to be after them in the same initiative group or they're getting less blocking done. Even if the whole party has shields, you're getting less of an effect on about half of them.
It's one of the most initiative-order-dependant options around.