Spell Research and writing a brand new spell

[Craig Irvin]

Hello all. I am playing a Magus Hexcrafter and loving it! However one of the things I was wanting to do is make my own spell that is similar to Shocking grasp but has a different flavor that fits my motif of being this scary person (Intimidate Int based build)

Suffice to say here is what I whipped up. My DM wanted me to run it through the brain trust in the forums to give some opinions on if the spell is balanced enough.

Boldin’s Dread Resonance
School evocation [sonic]; magus 1, sorcerer/wizard 1, bard 1
Casting
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Components: V, S

EFFECT
Range: touch
Target: creature or object touched
Duration: instantaneous
Saving Throw none;
Spell Resistance yes

DESCRIPTION
This malevolent spell harmonizes with the creature or object touched, unleashing haunting vibrations that only the target can perceive. Upon a successful melee touch attack, it inflicts 1d6 points of sonic damage per caster level (maximum 5d6). When delivering the dread resonance, you have the choice to gain a +3 bonus on attack rolls if the opponent is adorned in crystalline-based armor (or is carrying a crystalline-based weapon or is made of crystal), or to grant a +3 bonus to demoralize the opponent. The eerie vibrations of Dread Resonance strike fear into the touched individual, leaving a lingering sense of impending doom that only they can hear.

Some feedback from DM was that the "OR" part of the spell may be too much or that the +3 should be a +2 bonus to demoralize.

Thanks so much for the advice!

[zza ni]

sonic and force are rare elemental damage. that few are resistant to or immune to, as such spells that deal sonic damage are somewhat restricted (mostly to bards) and like force they tend to deal less damage. a lot of enemies are immune to the common elemental energies, like skeletons to cold, but meeting any that can even resist sonic\force is hard.

force and sonic spells of the same level tend to deal one dice lower so in this case it should be 1d4 per level (max 5d4) not 1d6 (look at magic missile for example).

and yes, sneaking in the intimidate bonus (and not even listing how long it last) is a cheap trick. you can tell it is, since it's mentioned as an after thought yet it would come way more often then enemies wearing crystal armor or made out of crystal. it should have been up front and the armor bit mentioned in an after thought. as the more common case is normally mentioned first.

to sum. i'd change the damage to 1d4 per level and drop the intimidate thing (or keep it for one round and drop the crystal bit)

[Craig Irvin]

zza ni wrote:

sonic and force are rare elemental damage. that few are resistant to or immune as such spells that deal sonic damage are somewhat restricted (mostly to bards) and like force they tend to deal less damage. a lot of enemies are immune to the common elemental energies, like skeletons to cold, but meeting any that can even resist sonic\force is hard.

force and sonic spells of the same level tend to deal one dice lower so in this case it should be 1d4 per level (max 5d4) not 1d6 (look at magic missile for example).

and yes, sneaking in the intimidate bonus (and not even listing how long it last) is a cheap trick. you can tell it is, since it's mentioned as an after thought yet it would come way more often then enemies wearing crystal armor or made out of crystal. it should have been up front and the armor bit mentioned in an after thought. as the more common case is normally mentioned first.

to sum. I'd change the damage to 1d4 per level and drop the intimidate thing (or keep it for one round and drop the crystal bit)

Sound Burst is 1d8 (2nd level). https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/sound-burst/

Ear Piecing Scream is 1d6 (1st level). https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/e/ear-piercing-scream/

Banshee Blast (6th level) does 1d4. https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/b/banshee-blast/

Resounding blow (4th/5th) does 1d6. https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/r/resounding-blow/

Shatter (2nd) does 1d6. https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/shatter/

D&D 3.5 Sound Lance does 1d8 as well. https://dnd.arkalseif.info/spells/spell-compendium--86/sound-lance--3564/

While I acknowledge the information provided regarding spells with sonic damage, their damage output appears to vary widely, ranging from d4 to D8s, with lower-level spells typically dealing d6 damage; Shatter being a very commonly used spell. I appreciate the clarification that the effect should only last for one round. Keep in mind I did say I had my DM look this over and he liked it over all but wanted to see what others would say; so there isn't any "sneaking it in" going on.

My thoughts on the crystalline piece is that at least in our campaigns it's very uncommon to run up against this so the spell itself 1:1 with shocking grasp is loosing some of it's power. The easiest way to address this would be to leave it with a +3 to metal and drop the intimidate.

I would love to hear from more people though so please keep them coming.

[zza ni]

sonic burst is 1d8 total for a 2nd level spell where the same level fire\cold spell do 4d6 and up to 3 times.
don't just mentioned the dice used also count the total damage it can do. same for the other spells you mentioned. compare to other spells of the same level.

ear piercing is 1d6 while shocking grasp can go up to 5d6. you see a method here?

in average sonic and force deal less then spells of the same level.

[Dragonchess Player]

Personally, I find the Words of Power optional rules a decent way to help benchmark new spells. Especially when combining damage with other effects.

The bonus to demoralize checks rider with no save on top of damage makes the dread resonance spell more powerful than shocking grasp. A "save partial" would make more sense: no save for damage, but a Will save to resist the mental effect of the "haunting vibrations."

[Diego Rossi]

I agree with zza ni that the appropriate damage would be 1d4/level, with a maximum of 5d4.

I would allow the Intimidate bonus, but only if the attempt is made during the same round and only by the character casting the spell.

[Pizza Lord]

I agree with all the others so far. The damage dice should be 1d4. Like mentioned, resistance and immunity is very rare and sonic is more likely to bypass or at least mitigate the hardness on many objects. While Pathfinder doesn't have an apparent general rule on energy types like 3.5 did (where acid and sonic bypassed it as a rule except for specific cases, and cold does 1/4th to objects), this has a lot more potential for blowing open doors and such depending on the GM.

Space saver:

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I agree that the spell should do more damage or have greater effect (probably the latter) on crystalline objects, but it does seem like an effect that was slipped in. I understand that shocking grasp has the +3 metal rider and you want something similar. This could be a +3 damage bonus, or +1 per die against crystalline objects. Or it could just be that it ignores half or all of the hardness on crystalline objects. Even if that's expected to be the case, it can be good for a spell to state it flat out in some cases so it's certain, at least in its case. Unlike electricity being 'attracted' to metal, it's not the same that sonic or soundwaves are more inclined to 'jump' or arc more readily to such material.

In the case of the intimidate rider, you need to specify when the bonus applies, ie. same round, within 1 round, or auto-demoralize when hit. In that case (where the spell caused the save), there would be a save and the Save listing would say 'see below' and you would describe the save and such where applicable. The same if the target had a chance to resist receiving the (morale, I assume) penalty. I get that penalties don't need types, but in this case it would be logical. I recommend you just avoid it, because then that might make this a [fear] type affect, and that just gets clunky for readers trying to determine whether an undead is affected at a glance and having to read that they are, but then not by the rider. I would just take that out as a general rule, since this is your spell and custom and you and your character have different visions, it's perfectly valid to want to do so, just be aware of how it comes across (but if you're ultimately the only one using it, who cares what others think in other games).

My other note is to remove the words 'malevolent' and 'haunting' from the first line. I get that it's flavor text, and that is fine. It's a custom spell, you want to lay the groundwork and expectations. These two words don't fit. It implies to the reader that their effects are somewhat fear-based and what they're about to read is maybe supernatural and malevolent like a ghost... and then 'haunting' makes it seem like its giving off spooky vibes like ghost sounds (the sound, not the spell). You don't need those two adjectives, but I understand wanting to hype, so consider other alternatives like 'sonic', 'sound-based' etc. in place of 'malevolent' and 'disruptive', 'disrupting', 'damaging', 'harmful', etc. in place of 'haunting'. I get that haunting might work for making the caster more intimidating, but the connection is not really there, you could use 'disheartening' or 'demoralizing' if you decide to keep the intimidate aspect.

If you want to make the spell more powerful (1d6 damage die or extra riders), then you'd need to consider something else, like increased casting time or, more likely, an expensive material component, but I don't think that's the right way to go. Just an option if you do. Only my opinion, though.
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[Craig Irvin]

Missed some suggestions and reworking things again. Removed my reply for now.