What are some drugs in Pathfinder 2e that are both beneficial and relatively safe to use?
Specifically, I'm referring to drugs that have worthwhile positive effects, and low enough DCs that a high Fortitude character that treats successes as crit successes can basically always succeed at a given level.
Awww. You defined what you mean by drugs. That's no fun.
I was going to suggest 'food' and 'soap'.
Curiously the drugs effect strongly down over levels. A level 1 low-con spellcaster with 0 con who drinks a dose of some alcoholic drink has 40% of chance to become drunk. But starting from level 7 it has only 5% of chance to become drunk after level 18 it's becomes impossible to failure in the fortitude check due the fortitude bonus being twice greater than the alcohol DC.
If we consider charaters like kineticist their immunity cames way more earlier.
And most drugs act like this. Only Plasma Hype that have some chance to affect high level and high constitution characters but in general drugs are just a joke in the game.
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Well, that is just a feature of the non-scaling DCs of items.
Plasma Hype is also the only drug with an item level above 10.
Also, in looking at drugs a bit more, the risk is a bit more subtle. The biggest risk is the Addiction. Even if you only fail the save on a nat-1 (5% chance) then using Dreamtime Tea used for a daily Augury effect is going to cause addiction at a fairly rapid rate.
TBH it feels like a pretty good balance between IRL addiction and 'we are just here to play a fun game'.
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I heard fentanyl took off big time recently.
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I really think drugs should stay out of the mechanical part of the game. Having a character hooked on drugs is far too impactful story-wise to be left to chance.
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The problem is that if you put in the game drugs that give any mechanical benefit for their use, you'll inevitably have That One Guy who will attempt to minmax them to his advantage and will come at you with a PC that's essentially intoxicated 24/7 to have +2 to Will saves or whatever and the downside is mitigated through a combination of Feat X, spell Y and magic item B.
This only underscores the importance of session zero and discussing game safety because somebody who just lost their relative or a friend to drugs might not take that well.
Doubly crucial if you're in the US, as you folks seem to have the opioid situation somewhat out of control.
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The problem is that if you put in the game drugs that give any mechanical benefit for their use, you'll inevitably have That One Guy whole will attempt to minmax them to his advantage and will come at you with a PC that's essentially intoxicated 24/7 to have +2 to Will saves or whatever and the downside is mitigated through a combination of Feat X, spell Y and magic item B.
This only underscores the importance of session zero and discussing game safety because somebody who just lost their relative or a friend to drugs might not take that well.
Doubly crucial if you're in the US, as you folks seem to have the opioid situation somewhat out of control.
And there's also the other way around: If I want to play a character who's hooked on drugs having the mechanical part of the game telling me one day that I'm out of the addiction is just ridiculous.
Being addict is a story element not a mechanical one. It should stay a player's choice.
For the purposes of this thread discussion, we'll assume the base drug rules are being used without modification.
The problem is that if you put in the game drugs that give any mechanical benefit for their use, you'll inevitably have That One Guy who will attempt to minmax them to his advantage and will come at you with a PC that's essentially intoxicated 24/7 to have +2 to Will saves or whatever and the downside is mitigated through a combination of Feat X, spell Y and magic item B.
That's not a problem, but rather a feature, and the entire goal of this thread what's more.
In any case, from a balance perspective, the kinds of bonuses that can be had from drugs can usually be gained elsewhere, and more efficiently and with less risk too. Ergo, anyone taking this "min/max" route is likely looking for that kind of story as well as the bonuses (otherwise they would just take the easier combination of abilities/items that doesn't require risky use of drugs).
This only underscores the importance of session zero and discussing game safety because somebody who just lost their relative or a friend to drugs might not take that well.
Doubly crucial if you're in the US, as you folks seem to have the opioid situation somewhat out of control.
I totally agree. Before introducing anything that is potentially controversial or harmful to one's game, it warrants a discussion beforehand.
Are you preparing a campaign in a fallout like setting where everyone is high on mentats and buffouts all the time?
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Are you preparing a campaign in a fallout like setting where everyone is high on mentats and buffouts all the time?
I'm not...
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For the purposes of this thread discussion, we'll assume the base drug rules are being used without modification.
The problem is that if you put in the game drugs that give any mechanical benefit for their use, you'll inevitably have That One Guy who will attempt to minmax them to his advantage and will come at you with a PC that's essentially intoxicated 24/7 to have +2 to Will saves or whatever and the downside is mitigated through a combination of Feat X, spell Y and magic item B.That's not a problem, but rather a feature, and the entire goal of this thread what's more.
Trying to game the system by pulling selected bits of the RAW that have unintended interaction is not a feature of PF2. Doubly so because it is exactly this kind of exercise in unintended (from the authors) powergaming that led to many of the PF1 core issues.
In any case, from a balance perspective, the kinds of bonuses that can be had from drugs can usually be gained elsewhere, and more efficiently and with less risk too. Ergo, anyone taking this "min/max" route is likely looking for that kind of story as well as the bonuses (otherwise they would just take the easier combination of abilities/items that doesn't require risky use of drugs).
I totally agree. Before introducing anything that is potentially controversial or harmful to one's game, it warrants a discussion beforehand.This only underscores the importance of session zero and discussing game safety because somebody who just lost their relative or a friend to drugs might not take that well.
Doubly crucial if you're in the US, as you folks seem to have the opioid situation somewhat out of control.
Just a note that I did take a look at the drugs as a way to minmax some benefit from them, just as I did for other items, consumables ...
And I definitely did not do it with an eye to the "stories about drugs and addiction" that it implies. Pure minmaxing was my impetus.