Star Wars: Andor

[Werthead]

Promising start to this one.

A slow burn intro with lots of plot, character and worldbuilding, but it did it really well. It did feel like a HBO drama set in the Star Wars universe, lots of attention to detail and I like the idea that the "bad guy" actually had a really good motive - finding the apparent murderer who killed two of his workers despite other people trying to ignore it - and you can see why he's going to harbour a grudge against Andor and presumably be on his tail for the rest of the season. There's a lot of small groundwork-laying going on for the characters.

Also, good choice for them to release the first three in one go. To be honest, I'm wondering if they should be doing that for the whole show. Releasing three episodes a week every week for four weeks would be quite cool. Apparently the next block of episodes gets heavily into Coruscant and Mon Mothma.

[BigNorseWolf]

I kept drifting off and so far I'm siding with the guards and hope the main character gets shot

[Freehold DM]

Loving it.

[Mark Hoover 330]

Minor spoiler:

Ep 3 ends with Cassian staring out the cockpit of a ship into gathering white light. This mirrors the flashback of the ep, of Marva saving him and Andor staring out of her cockpit as well.

It mirrors another shot though, and folks, I cried! (I know... shocking right?) Remember how Rogue One ends: Cassian and Jin are hugging, but Andor is the one, looking out across the water as the white light of the blast wave overtakes them.

Andor, starting his journey into that part of his life, staring into the white light... knowing where he'll end up as an audience member... and knowing that light symbolizes hope in this universe... dammit if that isn't beautiful to me!

I started watching the Clone Wars b/c I liked space wizards; I KEPT watching b/c of the drama and character growth of Ahsoka, Anakin and Obi Wan. But I ENJOYED the show for those reasons, plus the grittier depictions of life and war in the galaxy.

The Mandalorian gave me a little bit of that too but Andor is really driving it home. Dealing with working class folks, the grit of everyday life under Imperial rule. And Cassian, Ep 1, sets up a conflict just by being a not good guy.

Don't get me wrong, sometimes I WANT a good Solo quip and some campy swashbuckling in my sci-fi, but Andor is that grounded, Cyberpunk/Blade Runner gloom, that emo-sci-fi I didn't know I needed until it projected into my eyeholes.

TL/DR, I'm enjoying the show.

[Aberzombie]

I’ve heard this show is surprisingly not too horrid. Although the reviews I watched said the first two episodes were a little slow and probably could have been made into one.

Since I still don’t particularly trust Disney to put out something worth my time these days, I may wait until the run is done (or at least further along), and then watch it.

[JoelF847]

I thought almost all of the first 3 episodes was a snooze fest. It started really promising with him in the red light district, but quickly got boring after that.

I like character development, but that doesn't have to be full childhood story, especially when no one in that flashback period spoke a language the audience could understand, and not even subtitled, but more importantly, it was not very interesting. I'd have been fine with a simple 4 sentences of dialogue about his past.

Even in the present day, episode 2 in particular was pretty slow, not a lot really happened. Episode 3 was somewhat better because the plot started, except it didn't really. The fight in the warehouse was dumb - why exactly did someone hand 50 engines on chains in an abandoned warehouse in the first place?

ultimately, I wanted a story about Andor the rebel spy in the founding days of the rebel alliance, with lots of cool espionage stuff. Not really looking for how he got there enough to want to invest 3 episodes as a prologue about it, or the next episode or two actually convincing him to want to do it in the first place. Some of that backstory could have been told in dialogue or even in flashbacks of his training, but this isn't the show I had hoped it would be. Maybe it will become it by season 2.

[JoelF847]

Also, even the soundtrack is pretty plodding and boring, which is normally one of the solid bets to be good in any Star Wars project.

[Freehold DM]

JoelF847 wrote:

Even in the present day, episode 2 in particular was pretty slow, not a lot really happened. Episode 3 was somewhat better because the plot started, except it didn't really. The fight in the warehouse was dumb - why exactly did someone hand 50 engines on chains in an abandoned warehouse in the first place?

It's a regular part of star wars- so much technology around that a lot of it goes to rot, we see this a lot in fallen order which outlines what happened to the old republic stuff in the time of the galactic empire.

[JoelF847]

Freehold DM wrote:

JoelF847 wrote:

Even in the present day, episode 2 in particular was pretty slow, not a lot really happened. Episode 3 was somewhat better because the plot started, except it didn't really. The fight in the warehouse was dumb - why exactly did someone hand 50 engines on chains in an abandoned warehouse in the first place?

It's a regular part of star wars- so much technology around that a lot of it goes to rot, we see this a lot in fallen order which outlines what happened to the old republic stuff in the time of the galactic empire.

I had a typo there - I was referring to why 50 engines were HANGING in the warehouse in midair on chains, not why there was a warehouse with 50 rusted engines in it. Seems like a time consuming and dangerous way to store them (as Andor found out). Thought that the fight therefore felt like a nonsensical video game challenge.

[Freehold DM]

JoelF847 wrote:

Freehold DM wrote:

JoelF847 wrote:

Even in the present day, episode 2 in particular was pretty slow, not a lot really happened. Episode 3 was somewhat better because the plot started, except it didn't really. The fight in the warehouse was dumb - why exactly did someone hand 50 engines on chains in an abandoned warehouse in the first place?

It's a regular part of star wars- so much technology around that a lot of it goes to rot, we see this a lot in fallen order which outlines what happened to the old republic stuff in the time of the galactic empire.

I had a typo there - I was referring to why 50 engines were HANGING in the warehouse in midair on chains, not why there was a warehouse with 50 rusted engines in it. Seems like a time consuming and dangerous way to store them (as Andor found out). Thought that the fight therefore felt like a nonsensical video game challenge.

well...how else would you store them? We see them being stored in similar ways as far back as The Old Republic.

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

I was initially going to give this a miss because I conflated Cassian Andor for Poe Dameran. I'm actually quite pleased with this show. It's shaping up to be the best nucanon show. Yes, better than the Mandalorian so far. I like the view of the galaxy from the bottom. I like that the story is taking its time. I love that we've been introduced to the Corporate Sector.

The girl and I keep expecting Kyril Sarn to don a black lounge suit and eat pie and drink coffee.

[Freehold DM]

Bjørn Røyrvik wrote:

I was initially going to give this a miss because I conflated Cassian Andor for Poe Dameran. I'm actually quite pleased with this show. It's shaping up to be the best nucanon show. Yes, better than the Mandalorian so far. I like the view of the galaxy from the bottom. I like that the story is taking its time. I love that we've been introduced to the Corporate Sector.

The girl and I keep expecting Kyril Sarn to don a black lounge suit and eat pie and drink coffee.

I liked what we saw of Poe in Resistance. His comic was okay.

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

I'm happy for you but I hate everything sequel-related so...

[JoelF847]

Freehold DM wrote:

JoelF847 wrote:

Freehold DM wrote:

JoelF847 wrote:

Even in the present day, episode 2 in particular was pretty slow, not a lot really happened. Episode 3 was somewhat better because the plot started, except it didn't really. The fight in the warehouse was dumb - why exactly did someone hand 50 engines on chains in an abandoned warehouse in the first place?

It's a regular part of star wars- so much technology around that a lot of it goes to rot, we see this a lot in fallen order which outlines what happened to the old republic stuff in the time of the galactic empire.

I had a typo there - I was referring to why 50 engines were HANGING in the warehouse in midair on chains, not why there was a warehouse with 50 rusted engines in it. Seems like a time consuming and dangerous way to store them (as Andor found out). Thought that the fight therefore felt like a nonsensical video game challenge.

well...how else would you store them? We see them being stored in similar ways as far back as The Old Republic.

On the ground, not suspended in midair? Hoist only the engine you're working with or installing into a vehicle? OSHA wouldn't approve.

[DungeonmasterCal]

I didn't realize that there would be three episodes dropped at once. So, after watching the first one yesterday then realizing another and then ANOTHER would follow, I actually managed to watch TV for more than 40 minutes (which, for reasons unknown to me, I can rarely, ever do anymore). I loved everything I've seen from the show so far.

[Freehold DM]

Bjørn Røyrvik wrote:

I'm happy for you but I hate everything sequel-related so...

And I hate everything prequel related, so there you go.

[Mark Hoover 330]

Is no one watching this show? Anyway, last night's episode, how Andor resolved thinks with Skeen, THAT'S how I've always pictured Han Solo before he tied on with Luke and Ben. I know Han was always portrayed a bit more soft hearted, but when you're a kid and see the original version of Han shooting first, you get the impression that he's more scoundrel than lovable.

I thought Alex Lawther did an amazing job as Nemik. He really made me care about the character and with the brief shot of what happened to him on the freighter made me jump out of my chair at the TV. This show continues to elevate the tension of the rebellion in a way for me that nothing, except Rogue One, has ever done before.

Like, at every turn the Rebel Alliance has always been patchwork and small, but in every Star Wars movie or show they're always pretty cohesive. You're worried Luke won't make the shot, but there's a sense they can somehow survive losing a single battle.

Rogue One, and now this show? They really drive the point home that everything needed to go PERFECTLY for the Alliance to even happen, let alone for them to take down the Emperor. I am loving the grittier side of the galaxy!

[JoelF847]

I'm watching, but it's dreadfully slow and the narrative goes out of its way to make it slower. In general, I like a slow burn, but they needed to strip this down to Andor's story, and stop with background on Mon Montha (I don't think knowing she has a duechebag husband and a spoiled kid add a lot to much of anything) and Luthien's antique cover, or the religious ceremony sucking all of the pacing and tension from the action scene during the heist. Similarly, I'd be interested in how Andor got to be a bad ass instead of the two bit thief they keep trying to show him being, and could care less about his weird non-subtitled backstory as a kid on a planet abandoned by adults. He clearly learned how to fight, military tactics, pilot ships, and more, but we get him with a blowgun in the woods.

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

Have to disagree with you there. I think the pacing has been excellent and the writing, acting, and world-building has crushed the other SW shows.

[Mark Hoover 330]

I really liked the symbolism of the religious service juxtaposed with the heist. Usually SW likes to shove light and dark metaphors down my throat with Jedis and Sith, but in this you get the fire and the chanting alongside the fire... the hope and promise that the light brings... while the heist is going tensely but as planned. Then the attendants snuff the fire as the base goes dark... right as things go sideways in the heist. Finally, you have the crowd looking up (a key direction in the metaphor), into the light, into the very hope and promise they were praying for... right as Andor hits escape velocity.

As to the backstories... I guess I don't need to know that Mon Mothma had a bratty kid or that Luthien wigged up in Coruscant, but a few minutes of the run time aren't going to break things for me. I like Cassian's though.

In Solo, we get to see Han being a hot rod in a speeder, then he and his girl try to flee off-world, get separated, and he joins the military. We don't get to SEE what he did in service, but when he comes out he's a really good pilot and fighter. Well, with Cassian we see him learning to survive as a kid, learn through inference that the Empire stripped his home world of resources and adults, and that he chose to STAY while the rest of his "tribe" fled the downed ship.

After that, we see him taken into the care of Maarva, we hear stories of the battles he survived, and it's assumed (like with Han) that he earned his Quick Draw feat and other skills from these years offscreen.

Also, Andor isn't just the story of Andor. This is how the Rebel Alliance started to form. Small moments like the banging of metal on Ferrix to warn folks that Imperials are about, or Luthien's shady dealings in coded language. These are good reminders that this wasn't some noble war started by disaffected senators but that common folk drove the rebellion; people on the ground, under the heel of the Empire.

At least, these are my takes anyway. I'm really enjoying it, obviously. I think the pacing and character-driven inclusions have been fine, with maybe a couple exceptions here and there.

[BigNorseWolf]

Someone want to explain why walls are a passe concept or something? Its a galaxy far far away and you have spaceships. The empire has walls. Surely the rebels freezing their butts off and can put up a water proof roof (the hard part of any shelter) can stack some brush up there and keep the heat in?

[Mark Hoover 330]

So, can we talk about the music last episode? Was anyone getting 80's sci-fi vibes or was it just me? Like, at the very end when we pan out over all the cubicles, did it kind of compare a little to Blade Runner themes or just me?

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

The show does an excellent job of looking like the OT, so some 80s vibe is hard to avoid. On a slightly deeper level, the feeling of immense bureaucrasy and soul-crushing pencil pushing does fit in with certain SF movies.

[JoelF847]

I've swapped my watching of the show to focus purely on the enthusiastic and idealistic cop who bungled catching Andor. They're putting so much effort into his failure and home life that they should just make the show all about him 100% of the time. Waiting to see him do data entry into Imperial spreadsheets and figure out a formula in his new job, only to mess it up and embarrass his uncle who got him the job. Then his mom can berate him for being an uppity looser some more.

[BigNorseWolf]

Not sure how much of a bungle it is when space james bond stops in out of nowhere to help your suspect out.

[Werthead]

I think the show's biggest mistake so far has been to release one episode a week. It looks like they've divided the season into four three-episode arcs (with an introductory episode, rising action and then action-packed climax), and the first batch of episodes was all the better for being released in one go. They should have done the same for the whole season.

But as it stands this is easily the best Star Wars TV show they've done. It feels like Star Wars made by HBO. Lots of character focus and development and "all the pieces matter," with everything building up to a logical resolution (so far, they might mess up on that in the last five episodes). The Empire being presented not as a cool-looking dude with a laser sword, but a huge bureaucracy of squabbling middle-managers who can nevertheless kill millions of people if they feel like it is genuinely disturbing, and it's the first time ever - on screen at least - that it feels like genuine "political intrigue" is going on, even if it's fairly limited so far. It's taking as much influence from Brazil (the Gilliam movie) as it is the OG Star Wars trilogy, which I was not expecting.

It's also pleasing they've decided they don't have to have characters showing up from other movies/TV shows and Easter Eggs every five nanoseconds, and the few shout-outs there have been have actually head reasonable points (i.e. telling us that the show is taking place alongside the events at the start of Star Wars: Rebels, for example, by mentioning some of the same events).

[Greylurker]

yeah the references to Ord Mantell had me grinning like a loon so much I actually had to explain it to the people watching with me.

[Werthead]

And Admiral Yularen showing up. He was a ship captain in The Clone Wars who became Anakin's go-to Republic Navy guy, then in Rebels we learned he'd joined the Empire. He finally (timeline-wise) shows up on the Death Star in the OG movie as one of Tarkin's command staff.

That immediately makes sense of how casual he is about the Emperor ("Yeah, me and Emperor Palpatine were just hanging, shooting the breeze, you know how it is,") since he's known him for almost 30 years at this point.

And of course if you don't know any of that stuff it's irrelevant, he's just the ISB commander who gives the other Imperial characters some orders and then moves on.

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

The one real critique I can level at the show is the lack of non-humans. The Mandalorian has tons of them, this show has maybe half a dozen in the background over the episodes. One of the things I like about SW is the variety of aliens and how not all of them are humans with rubber head protheses, but in Andor we get basically nothing but humans.

[Mark Hoover 330]

Maybe they're saving all the non-humans for Ahsoka?

[Freehold DM]

I'm excited for Wednesday.

[Freehold DM]

Tomorrow is Wednesday.

[Mark Hoover 330]

Your enthusiasm is infectious FHDM! I wish it was Wednesday right now!

[Mark Hoover 330]

"No more than 12 per floor..." This show is a masterclass in pacing, in my opinion. I know some folks say the show is slow, but for me it's a good slow. Last night's episode was so much tension! The last 3 eps are going to be massive!

[Greylurker]

This is one of the best shows they have done for Star Wars. It is incredibly gripping. It's pretty much the main reason we held off our regular switch from D+ to Netflix till next month.

[Freehold DM]

Wednesday is only 6 days away.

6 is half of 12.

[Greylurker]

at a guess Syril is going to get himself sent to prison just in time to be a complication in Andor's prison break plan.

[Freehold DM]

It's Monday.

That means it's almost Wednesday.

[Phillip Gastone]

"Made from the screams of alien children."

Peak Empire there..

[Mark Hoover 330]

Hey Freehold, what day is it? *puts on camel costume*

[Mark Hoover 330]

I have only 3 words: "One Way Out!"

[Freehold DM]

ONE WAY OUT

[Greylurker]

"I Can't Swim"

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

DAMN!
The tension in this show is intense. Stellar performances by everyone, excellent writing, excellent everything.

Two more episodes then two years until next season.

Darth Vader wrote:

NOOOOOOOOO!

[Mark Hoover 330]

So, Screencrush on YouTube had a take on "I can't swim." They suggested that this was a kind of doom for Kino Loy. They likened him to biblical Moses; he can go to the promised land but can't enter.

We never actually see what happens to Kino Loy, so I want to have hope. I want to say that he was carried along, buoyed by the people he helped to free, and will be out there in the galaxy, somewhere.

Of course, I'm also the same guy who, when he's struggling with squats, mumbles "I am one with the Force and the Force is with me" over and over again, so take my optimism for what you will.

[Freehold DM]

Bjørn Røyrvik wrote:

DAMN!

The tension in this show is intense. Stellar performances by everyone, excellent writing, excellent everything.

Two more episodes then two years until next season.

Darth Vader wrote:

DO NOT WANT!

[Bjørn Røyrvik]

DO WANT!

[Freehold DM]

It's Monday.

That means it's almost Wednesday.

[Mark Hoover 330]

Its Wednesday. Its 12:45 PM as I'm posting this. It is... difficult, working from home, knowing 14' from my desk is a TV on which the next episode is avail RIGHT NOW. Patience, work will be done soon...

[DungeonmasterCal]

It was a good episode. I don't know how many more episodes are left but I've enjoyed the slow build-up. I just hope the pay off will be as good.