HELP!
I am wanting to do some math comparing the DPR of a Spirited Charge 2H Falcata vs the Spirited Charge of a Lance.
What is the formula for working these things out?
i believe lance will almost always come out ahead. even if you keen/crit fish with falcata.
lance will get x3 damage every hit (and x5 on a crit) vs double damage and 3x only on crits.
Oh I am confident Lance will come out on top, what I want to know is by how much, and at what point will using iteratives with the Falcata start to pull it back.
*As I am thinking a 2H Falcata Cavalier could be good as they would still be effective when on foot
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The math is messy. I'm going to post a spoiler below that I'm sure people will pore over, I don't claim it to be perfect. On a charge the lance does about 44% more damage on average. 39% more if both are keen/Improved Critical.
((chance of normal hit + chance of nonconfirmed crit) * noncrit multiplier) + (chance of confirmed crit * crit multiplier) = net multiplier
So lets assume we hit on anything but a 1, and plug in the numbers using the order I just detailed.
Lance: ((0.9 + 0.0025) * 3) + (0.0475 * 5) = 2.945
Falcata: ((0.8 + 0.0075) * 2) + (0.1425 * 3) = 2.0425
The numbers change based on your chance to hit, but the ratio between the two does not. It's always 1.44:1 in favor of the lance.
Thank you
Lance: ((0.9 + 0.0025) * 3) + (0.0475 * 5) = 2.945
Falcata: ((0.8 + 0.0075) * 2) + (0.1425 * 3) = 2.0425
I think that is supposed to be a 3 not a 5 unless I am missing something. Either way it is clear a Lance is still better (on the charge)
Thank you
I think that is supposed to be a 3 not a 5 unless I am missing something. Either way it is clear a Lance is still better (on the charge)Lance: ((0.9 + 0.0025) * 3) + (0.0475 * 5) = 2.945
Falcata: ((0.8 + 0.0075) * 2) + (0.1425 * 3) = 2.0425
You are missing something.
Lance: ((regular-hit) ×3 for Spirited Charge) + (Regular-hit ×5 for a Critical hit)
Lances get ×5 damage on a crit with Spirited Charge
However it does look like that wasn't taken into account for the Falcata. It should read:
Falcata ((regular-hit) ×2 for Spirited Charge) + (Regular-hit×3×4 for a Critical hit)
The Falcata will get a ×4 damage crit on a Spirited Charge .
So it should read
Lance: ((0.9 + 0.0025) * 3) + (0.0475 * 5) = 2.945
Falcata: ((0.8 + 0.0075) * 2) + (0.1425 * 4) = 2.185
So the Falcata does slightly better than we thought , but is still nowhere near the Lance's numbers.
The ratio is about 1.35 : 1
Lance: ((0.9 + 0.0025) * 3) + (0.0475 * 5) = 2.945
Falcata: ((0.8 + 0.0075) * 2) + (0.1425 * 4) = 2.185So the Falcata does slightly better than we thought , but is still nowhere near the Lance's numbers.
The ratio is about 1.35 : 1
I think the Falcata is wrong still.
Falcata: ((0.85 + 0.0050) * 2) + (0.0950 * 4) = 2.09
Then with improved Critical/Keen
Lance: ((0.85 + 0.0050) * 3) + (0.0950 * 5) = 3.04
Falcata: ((0.75 + 0.010) * 2) + (0.19 * 4) = 2.28
So I was just using the numbers provided, and I subbing in the ×4 damage.
When I do the math I'm getting:
Lance: 2.945
Falcata: 2.09
That's a ratio of ~1.41 : 1
Then with Improved Critical:
Lance: 3.04
Falcata: 2.28
That's a ratio of ~1.33 : 1
You know what, I was tired last night. I transposed two weapons in my head.
That’s the math for a falchion, not a falcata. I’ll see if I can redo it, correcting the crit range and crit multipliers. Pretty sure minigiant has it right.
'Sall good. You got us started, and we got to where we wanted to go. It's a group effort =)
Also yes I think he is. I got the same numbers when I ran them.
There is a drawback worth considering, the lance is very much not as good if for some you are forced to dismount.
Of course, if you're playing a mounted charged build, you should start by verifying with your GM if it's actually a reasonable thing to focus on or if you might want to have a contingency plan, or even play something else entirely.
There is a drawback worth considering, the lance is very much not as good if for some you are forced to dismount.
I mean, the Lance is basically a Longspear if you dismout, so it's jot terrible. It's certtainly no Falcata, but it would hold up as it's own backup weapon as long as you're prepared to wield a 2-handed weapon .
If you're spending 90% of your time on foot though it's not really recommended.
Actually that's another thing to consider with the Lance/Falcata - the Lance has reach. Against certain targets or at the limit of your charge range this could make a difference. Also you get AoOs.
My experience having GM'd for a lance focused mounted charger build is that they annihilate whatever is on the receiving end. Typically if the enemy has taken another hit prior to being hit by the lancer, it's going to die.
I've honestly never worried too much about trying to get the mounts damage, because it already deals so much damage.
My experience having GM'd for a lance focused mounted charger build is that they annihilate whatever is on the receiving end. Typically if the enemy has taken another hit prior to being hit by the lancer, it's going to die.
I've honestly never worried too much about trying to get the mounts damage, because it already deals so much damage.
Yeah. A 4th level Calvalier with 18 STR, Spirited Charge and Power Attack is dealing 3d8+36 damage on average with a charge. The average CR:4 enemy has 40 HP .
I feel like the monster HP will scale a little faster than the Cavalier's damage, but if we say a level 12 Cavalier with a +2 Lance, a +4 belt of STR we're looking at 3d8+72 damage, or 3d8+108 when using a challenge. The average CR:12 enemy has 160 HP.
These were just "average damage on a hit", without taking crits or misses into account, and I'm sure you could add more feats or abilities that improve damage if you really wanted to.