
CountMRVHS |
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Say I'm looking at a Samurai build. Order of Vengeance grants Critical Focus as a bonus feat at lvl 8.
Say I stick with that order for a while, eventually taking a feat that is dependent on Critical Focus (Bleeding Critical, Staggering Critical, etc.). But after that point, I switch orders - say to Ronin.
I would lose "all of the benefits from [my] old order", so clearly I'd lose Critical Focus.
But would I also lose Bleeding Critical?

DeathlessOne |
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you wouldn't lose Bleeding Critical... but you would lose access to it, and become unable to benefit from it until you acquire Critical Focus again.
This is 100% correct. If you don't meet the requirements for a feat that you possess, you can't make use of it. No different than having power attack and getting your strength score knocked below 13 due to a penalty, damage or drain.

Derklord |
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Ahh, ok, makes sense. Thanks both!
Relevant rule quote: "A character can’t use a feat if he loses a prerequisite, but he does not lose the feat itself. If, at a later time, he regains the lost prerequisite, he immediately regains full use of the feat that prerequisite enables." CRB pg. 112
Chell Raighn wrote:you wouldn't lose Bleeding Critical... but you would lose access to it, and become unable to benefit from it until you acquire Critical Focus again.This is 100% correct. If you don't meet the requirements for a feat that you possess, you can't make use of it. No different than having power attack and getting your strength score knocked below 13 due to a penalty, damage or drain.
Minor correction: Ability score penalty or damage does not reduce your ability scores, it merely imposes a penalty on things based off strength: "For every 2 points of damage you take to a single ability, apply a –1 penalty to skills and statistics listed with the relevant ability. [...] Some spells and abilities cause you to take an ability penalty for a limited amount of time. While in effect, these penalties function just like ability damage" CRB pg. 555
So if you have 14 strength and 3 points of strength damage, you can still use Power Attack, and get (only) a -1 to attack and damage rolls (and CMD; CMB, climb, and swim; your carrying capacity is not reduced though).
Ability score drain actually reduces your ability score, and thus can make you lose access to stuff.

Temperans |
Also important, when using retraining. If you used a class feature to qualify for something you must first retrain that something before you retrain the feature:
The class feature you wish to retrain can’t be one that you used as a prerequisite for a feat, class feature, archetype, prestige class, or other ability. You must retrain those elements separately before you can retrain this class feature.
So in this case OP would have to retrain Bleeding Critical and then they can retrain into Ronin.

Chell Raighn |

Also important, when using retraining. If you used a class feature to qualify for something you must first retrain that something before you retrain the feature:
Quote:The class feature you wish to retrain can’t be one that you used as a prerequisite for a feat, class feature, archetype, prestige class, or other ability. You must retrain those elements separately before you can retrain this class feature.So in this case OP would have to retrain Bleeding Critical and then they can retrain into Ronin.
If it was retraining, yes… but the Samurai class doesn’t require retraining to become a Ronin.
Becoming Ronin: Normally, when a samurai wishes to change his order, he must undergo a lengthy process that requires him to adhere to the edicts of his new order for a period of time before receiving any benefits. This is not the case with ronin. Once a samurai decides to become a ronin, he immediately loses all of the bonuses, skills, and abilities of his old order and gains those of the ronin order. If he wishes to once again dedicate himself to another order, he must do so using the normal rules.
They can freely at any time decide they are done with their order, immediately lose all abilities granted by it, and become a Ronin. Technically they can even do this in the middle of combat… of course joining a new order is far more involved though.