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I think you mentioned on the forums somewhere that English isn't your first language, so this can be tricky. "With no staff, dates, or outsiders involved," uses the Oxford Comma to include those three items. This means that the feat would allow you to gain entrance to a public event with limited access, but not something like a secret clan meeting, a goblin-only cookout, or a dance that only caters to devils. In these situations, your character may be an outsider that wouldn't be able to gain access despite their best efforts.
If the event/gathering does not involve any staff, dates, or outsiders, then the ability does not apply.
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The feat isn't referencing Outsiders. It is meaning people outside of the small private group that is having the meeting.
This may be better explained with examples.
Events that you can crash with Party Crasher:
* A birthday party where invitations were given out to the local neighborhood.
* A planning meeting for the irrigation managers and operators.
* A party posted about on a news board.
* A homeless shelter's daily dinner service.
Or any other meeting, gathering, or social interaction where announcements have to be posted publicly, no matter how obscure that posting might be.
Events that you can't crash with Party Crasher:
* A private birthday party where only family members are invited.
* An internal board meeting of a company.
* The TTRPG game night of a handful of friends.
Or any other meeting, gathering, or social interaction where announcements are not posted at all or are not posted anywhere publicly accessible.
I rewarded special to having "outsider is not the reason to not apply". Understandable for no staff and no date.
** spoiler omitted **
As breithauptclan noted, "outsider" here does not mean the creature subtype. It means someone who does not belong (like a elf in a dwarven meeting, a Norgorberite in a Desnan prayer group, or Greg from Accounting showing up for my family dinner).
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If [clan name here, equal to Archtype's name] is related to that events or gatherings, outsider is not the reason to not apply.Is this okay to add?(No pun to the word outsider)
I would think this is more requiring GM discussion with player about when their character would be an outsider than needing wording added to the feat. To use your example, if it’s an event where members of the clan would be allowed entry, they would not be an outsider, so if the clan has very good relations with a bunch of otherwise isolationist dwarves, they would not be considered an outsider to those dwarves normally very private dwarf only parties.
I rewarded special to having "outsider is not the reason to not apply". Understandable for no staff and no date.
** spoiler omitted **
Yeah, outsiders doesn't mean the outsider kind of creature.
It means outsider as is someone "outside of the group".
I think this is your key point of confusion.
As to what constitutes you being an outsider...well only your GM an answer that.
Honestly, I would assume at most functions that you would really like to party crash (such as the Legion of Doom's next meeting to discuss their plans for world domination) that the GM can justify you being an outsider and not allow it to work.
I think at best this feat is going to get your entry (more easily) into events that are basically public events that you could get into anyways.
So to be honest, I don't think it's worth it.
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It's also worth mentioning that "outsider" as in the creature type/subtype doesn't actually have a trait/mechanical presence in PF2 at all, it got axed in the move to the second edition, probably because it was so incredibly broad of a category that is encompassed something like a quarter of all creatures.
It's also worth mentioning that "outsider" as in the creature type/subtype doesn't actually have a trait/mechanical presence in PF2 at all, it got axed in the move to the second edition, probably because it was so incredibly broad of a category that is encompassed something like a quarter of all creatures.
I wasn't going to bring this up, but yeah. Outsider isn't even a creature type in PF2.
They got rid of so that there wasn't such an all encompassing type with a million subtypes.
It's also worth mentioning that "outsider" as in the creature type/subtype doesn't actually have a trait/mechanical presence in PF2 at all, it got axed in the move to the second edition, probably because it was so incredibly broad of a category that is encompassed something like a quarter of all creatures.
I noticed that. That is why I had to link to the Starfinder page for Outsider previously.
If [clan name here, equal to Archtype's name] is related to that events or gatherings, outsider is not the reason to not apply.
I don't think you need a special rule addition in order to handle this case. If your character is already part of a group that is having a secret meeting, you wouldn't need to crash it. You would only need to somehow know that the meeting was going on and you would be invited in to it when you arrive. You are an 'insider' to the group at that point.
It's also worth mentioning that "outsider" as in the creature type/subtype doesn't actually have a trait/mechanical presence in PF2 at all, it got axed in the move to the second edition, probably because it was so incredibly broad of a category that is encompassed something like a quarter of all creatures.I noticed that. That is why I had to link to the Starfinder page for Outsider previously.
If [clan name here, equal to Archtype's name] is related to that events or gatherings, outsider is not the reason to not apply.I don't think you need a special rule addition in order to handle this case. If your character is already part of a group that is having a secret meeting, you wouldn't need to crash it. You would only need to somehow know that the meeting was going on and you would be invited in to it when you arrive. You are an 'insider' to the group at that point.
Unless of course the group changes it name to the Ancient Mystic Society of No Homers!
You know, because they don't actually want to be friends with you.
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The question to be answered as to whether this feat works is: Is there anyone at the event or gathering who can identify everyone who is supposed to be there? If the answer is no, you can get the benefit of the doubt as someone who should be there. If the answer is yes, then that person would know as soon as he sees you that you are not supposed to be there.
The question to be answered as to whether this feat works is: Is there anyone at the event or gathering who can identify everyone who is supposed to be there? If the answer is no, you can get the benefit of the doubt as someone who should be there. If the answer is yes, then that person would know as soon as he sees you that you are not supposed to be there.
That's a pretty good way to think of it. If everyone who is supposed to be present should be able to recognize each other then Party Crasher wont work. Otherwise it should.
That's a pretty good way to think of it. If everyone who is supposed to be present should be able to recognize each other then Party Crasher wont work. Otherwise it should.
The question to be answered as to whether this feat works is: Is there anyone at the event or gathering who can identify everyone who is supposed to be there? If the answer is no, you can get the benefit of the doubt as someone who should be there. If the answer is yes, then that person would know as soon as he sees you that you are not supposed to be there.
I like it. I would add to that that Party Crasher also only works if the character has some way of finding out about the meeting in the first place.
So invitations being posted somewhere. Or interrogating someone who knows about it. Finding a meeting reminder scrawled in someone's day planner. Something like that.
Though it does seem somewhat trivial since if the characters have no way of knowing about the meeting, then the GM probably didn't tell the players about it either.
That's a pretty good way to think of it. If everyone who is supposed to be present should be able to recognize each other then Party Crasher wont work. Otherwise it should.
The question to be answered as to whether this feat works is: Is there anyone at the event or gathering who can identify everyone who is supposed to be there? If the answer is no, you can get the benefit of the doubt as someone who should be there. If the answer is yes, then that person would know as soon as he sees you that you are not supposed to be there.
I like it. I would add to that that Party Crasher also only works if the character has some way of finding out about the meeting in the first place.
So invitations being posted somewhere. Or interrogating someone who knows about it. Finding a meeting reminder scrawled in someone's day planner. Something like that.
Though it does seem somewhat trivial since if the characters have no way of knowing about the meeting, then the GM probably didn't tell the players about it either.
I feel like the exception is you stumble into some sort of meeting/party/event. Depending on the scale you might be able to ingratiate yourself. At that point it's really just a matte of the DM saying "Hey you stumble into the cult's secret meeting, no gate crasher isn't going to work" or "You stumble into the prince's late night drugs and "fun" party, everyone is wearing masks".