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![Green Dragon](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/Green.jpg)
I'm just starting a new game with an elf fighter who has picked up the wizard dedication. I originally planned to work around bespell weapon but found that it took all my feats basically to make that work so now I'm looking for advice or other people's experiences about what directions are fun to go.
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RPGnoremac |
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![Cale the Calistrian](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/7cale.jpg)
There are a lot of options. Right now I am playing a Sorcerer/Champion as a sort of Eldritch knight. My main niche is tripping rather than attacking though.
In general I feel once you get haste the build will function a lot better. My character uses his martial portion to support more than do damage. Ex I demoralize/trip which can give all allies up to +4 chance to hit.
Really there are two basics way to make an eldritch knight.
Pick any martial and grab ALL the spellcasting feats. It think just grabbing the casting feats cost about half your feats.
-Main issue it it takes quite a few levels to get going. But once you get to level 8ish I feel it should really feel good.
Pick any caster and grab whatever feats you like.
-IMO these builds start more complete but their main issue is being too squishy and their first few feats might want to focus on fixing that problem.
You really just have to pick which casting stat you want to go with.
Charisma
-This is my personal favorite since it combines with demoralize/bon mot. Also I just like being a charismatic character.
Intellect
-Having extra skills is nice and being able to be good at arcana/occult is good for recall knowledge checks.
Wisdom
-In general Wisdom is just a great stat and it gives access to medicine/religion/nature which are all great.
I personally like starting caster but if I was starting level 6+ or knew the campaign would be long starting a Martial would be great too.
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![Green Dragon](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/Green.jpg)
The issue with starting caster is that the rest of the party is a witch, wizard and alchemist so we definitely needed something a bit tougher.
I don't need optimal per se (the rest of the party rolled obscenely good stats, the alchemist's lowest stat is only 2 points below my best) I just don't want to end up useless.
There is also potential that my GM will rule I can grab Hand of the Apprentice despite RAW technically saying no. Which reopens the bespell weapon angle for me.
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HumbleGamer |
Fighter is very well rounded as eldritch knight.
I suggest you to go for the bard dedication instead of the wizard one.
This way, you will be able to get Hymn of Healing.
which will give you the best self sustain on a single target.
Eventually, by lvl 12 you might be able to take paragorn's guard, in order to have permanently up your shield ( higher AC and better action management ). Until now, you will probably alternate AoO and reactive shield.
Being able to have the same AC as a champion without shield for free is definitely good.
By taking bard dedication, you will also be able to unlock occult spells, which enhances your gameplay.
A little build
1- Reactive Shield
2- Bard Dedication
4- Hymn of healing
6- Bard Spellcasting
8- Quickblock or knockdown or lunge
9 - Combat Flexibility ( Everything you could need )
10 - Agile Grace or Improved Knockdown ( Depends your weapon )
12 - Paragorn's Stance ( Retrain lvl 1 reactive shield into combat assessment )
14 - Expert Bard Spellcasting
15 - Improved Flexibility
16 - Occult Breadth ( more spells and more known spells )
18 - Master Bard Spellcasting
20 - Ultimate Flexibility
You will be able to tank and help yourself, but also deal good damage. Also, given your high Charisma, you will be able to feint or demoralize with more chances of success.
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Blave |
![Hooded Man](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/templeofzyphus_final.jpg)
Fighter is very well rounded as eldritch knight.
I suggest you to go for the bard dedication instead of the wizard one.
This way, you will be able to get Hymn of Healing.
which will give you the best self sustain on a single target.
Hymn of Healing is killing your action economy. It's already bad on a caster but even worse on a fighter.
I'd go Witch instead. Life boost gets you the same healing for 20% of the actions. You lose the Temp HP but those hardly seem worth the huge extra investment in actions spent.
Witch also allows you to pick your Spellcasting Tradition. Might help you to get access to spells your party lacks (depending on what exactly the witch is casting). The free familiar also doesn't hurt, even if only used for extra cantrips/spells.
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HumbleGamer |
HumbleGamer wrote:Fighter is very well rounded as eldritch knight.
I suggest you to go for the bard dedication instead of the wizard one.
This way, you will be able to get Hymn of Healing.
which will give you the best self sustain on a single target.
Hymn of Healing is killing your action economy. It's already bad on a caster but even worse on a fighter.
I'd go Witch instead. Life boost gets you the same healing for 20% of the actions. You lose the Temp HP but those hardly seem worth the huge extra investment in actions spent.
Witch also allows you to pick your Spellcasting Tradition. Might help you to get access to spells your party lacks (depending on what exactly the witch is casting). The free familiar also doesn't hurt, even if only used for extra cantrips/spells.
It doesn't.
You will be dancing between AoO and Reactive shield ( so you will still have 2 out of 3 actions ) depends the situation.
Also, being in a party with 2 spellcasters and 1 alchemist, the fighter might be able to benefit from haste.
The witch Life Boost is nice because it requires 1 less action to be cast and no sustain cost, but it heals ( considering temp hp ) 1/2 if compared to hymn of Healing.
I'd prefer to have the bardic dedication more than the witch one ( and I'll be fine with 2 attacks per round. The 3rd action won't ever be an attack ).
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Blave |
![Hooded Man](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/templeofzyphus_final.jpg)
You will be dancing between AoO and Reactive shield ( so you will still have 2 out of 3 actions ) depends the situation.
Also, being in a party with 2 spellcasters and 1 alchemist, the fighter might be able to benefit from haste.
The witch Life Boost is nice because it requires 1 less action to be cast and no sustain cost, but it heals ( considering temp hp ) 1/2 if compared to hymn of Healing.
Except you might need to move, leaving you with just one action. Or want to raise your shield to use Shield Block or simply so you can spend your Reaction on an AoO. Or some condition like slowed might prevent you from sustaining the spell. You also mentioned Demoralize and Feint which eat up an action.
And there's always rounds when you don't take any damage, making the Temp HP go to waste. Five times the number of actions for UP TO double the healing is simply a bad trade.
I'd prefer to have the bardic dedication more than the witch one ( and I'll be fine with 2 attacks per round. The 3rd action won't ever be an attack ).
But you don't really use anything from bard that the witch doesn't also get. Ok, being the fourth Int-Based caster in a group of 4 might be a bit overkill and the Bard's Charisma would be nicer. But beyond that? The more flexible prepared casting of the witch plus the familiar seem better than the bard, especially if there's already a Witch for Spell Sharing in the group.
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HumbleGamer |
Blave, your complain goes with any class which uses 1 action to raise shield.
The fighter can avoid the raise shield action and instead use that action to sustain a spell.
A champion, barbarian, swashbuckler, rogue, monk, investigator or any other class which want to always use the raise shield action will find itself with 1 action less.
As a champion, sometimes, i had to use my turn this Way:
Stride, raise shield, attack.
And my reaction was always for the champion one, and not for the use less shield block ( until lvl 8, maybe, depends my feats and equipment).
Same goes with any other class meant to have +2 extra ac.
What changes is that in its specific party Composition the frontline fighter might benefit from haste from wizard, witch and also itself ( not sure if the alchemist might also provider haste through elixirs).
And it will Be able to trade more damage than any shield block.
Imo, apart seeing the fighter as somebody alone without support from the other 2 spellcasters, you Don't really understand what does it means to have double the effects of boost of life for just 1 action, for a class meant to survive by itself.
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RPGnoremac |
![Cale the Calistrian](http://cdn.paizo.com/image/avatar/7cale.jpg)
The issue with starting caster is that the rest of the party is a witch, wizard and alchemist so we definitely needed something a bit tougher.
I don't need optimal per se (the rest of the party rolled obscenely good stats, the alchemist's lowest stat is only 2 points below my best) I just don't want to end up useless.
There is also potential that my GM will rule I can grab Hand of the Apprentice despite RAW technically saying no. Which reopens the bespell weapon angle for me.
I didnt realize your group was so squishy. The interesting thing about starting caster is you could actually just stay with the group and just melee the enemies as they close in on you.
The safer approach would probably start monk/champion/fighter for the higher defense and really there is just crazy amount of options from there.
Having one character taking most the monster focus might be tough though. Even if you do pick Champion. People like to argue what is best but honestly I see merits in all the spellcasting options. Having high int/wis/cha all have their own benefits and that is what I love about 2e.
Bespell weapon is an extra 1d6 when you cast a non cantrip. It is definitely flavorful but requires quite the investment. Earliest you can get it is level 8 as a dedication.
Grabbing caster dedication gets awkward since you need a basic 1/2 feat to qualify for the 4+ feats and at the same time you also want the spellcasting feats. Probably one of the few complaints I have about 2e.