me and a few friends ares gonna play a game of pathfinder and habe one of us play a warlock from 5e. no conversions, just use it and see how it works. we are doing this to get a deeper appreciation for the math that holds the game together and class design as a whole. i will document results here when we play. (which may be a while we're finishing up our current game first)
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What about short rest mechanics?
Warlocks kinda rely on "short rests" to recover spell slots.
Does the group think hes easily winded?
"Hold on guys. I need 30 min"
"What? That was like 18 seconds of combat"
Can they recover HP by spending HD on a short rest?
Is their race PF or 5e version?
Do they get feats lIke PF or 5e?
Also, what about magic items?
in pathfinder attunement isn't a thing and so none of the pathfinder magic items are flagged as needing it. If you're trying to preserve the math then the 5e character would still be subject to it.
"yo, you can take these bracers since you need them more than anyone else. What do you mean you have to take your ring off 1st? just use both"
armor also works differently. Though as a caster type that's probably less of an issue.
I know that 3.5 to PF1 is all most a direct conversion, but 5e that's gonna be sum wacky math's. This should be interesting.
Just give them a Ring of Sustenance... poof, the 2hr "short rest" now exists in Pathfinder. Lol.
No conversions? That sounds like putting a lawnmower engine into a car and expecting it to run. I don't think it's possible to play a character in a system that does not include that character's statistics.
No conversions? That sounds like putting a lawnmower engine into a car and expecting it to run. I don't think it's possible to play a character in a system that does not include that character's statistics.
Didn't Bo Jackson play baseball and football? Neither of those games utilizes or includes the other game's statistics.
Didn't Bo Jackson play baseball and football? Neither of those games utilizes or includes the other game's statistics.
What OP is suggesting is more in line with playing baseball by hitting a football with a baseball bat.
I know. I was just being difficult.
I don't think it will work very well, either.
Not gonna work too well past the first couple of levels seeing as 5e's bounded accuracy basically translates into having 1/4 bab and save progression. That's worse than a commoner.
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Not gonna work too well past the first couple of levels seeing as 5e's bounded accuracy basically translates into having 1/4 bab and save progression. That's worse than a commoner.
If the warlock gets to hit touch ac, the BAB isnt *that* big of an issue.
Saves are weird. Warlocks are proficient in cha saves, which aren't a thing in PF.
Not gonna work too well past the first couple of levels seeing as 5e's bounded accuracy basically translates into having 1/4 bab and save progression. That's worse than a commoner.If the warlock gets to hit touch ac, the BAB isnt *that* big of an issue.
Saves are weird. Warlocks are proficient in cha saves, which aren't a thing in PF.
IIRC Touch AC isn't a thing in 5e.
sorry for the late replies. short rests arent a thing so my casting is slow. only class abilities are 5e i level and have feats and regular saves and the like. magic items are as pf. it's not so much no conversions as much as it is minimal conversions. sorry for the confusion
Okay, after running a few one-shots by myself at various levels i have discovered that a full-scale conversion will be necessary. it worked better than we thought though, eldritch blast will be 1d8 + a d8 every odd level, a few other things, overall this experiment has been a success and i feel much more comfortable converting between the 2 systems now
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Okay, after running a few one-shots by myself at various levels i have discovered that a full-scale conversion will be necessary. it worked better than we thought though, eldritch blast will be 1d8 + a d8 every odd level, a few other things, overall this experiment has been a success and i feel much more comfortable converting between the 2 systems now
Why not just use either the kineticist (which is basically pf warlock) or the vigilante archetype that gets energy blasts instead?
5e warlock is based around having multiple short rests to reset their very limited uses of spell slots, since that's not a thing in pf you will either need to give them more spell slots or engineer a new system.
I wouldn't reinvent the wheel to make a square peg fit in a round hole
10D8 Eldritch Blast? Lol.
In 5e, Eldritch Blast does 4D10 at 17th level, but ok.
Just be a Kineticist...
There is a very specific reason i want the 5e warlock and not another class. and besides im doing this to better understand the underlying math of the games. if i wanted to play a character like this id use the 3.5 warlock and supe it, i want to deepen my understanding of game design though.
There is a very specific reason i want the 5e warlock and not another class.
I'll bite. What is that very specific reason?
and besides im doing this to better understand the underlying math of the games. if i wanted to play a character like this id use the 3.5 warlock and supe it, i want to deepen my understanding of game design though.
I applaud the curiosity, but I don't think understanding can be gained this way. It's a bit like trying to learn about hydrodynamics and aerodynamics by experimenting with a 747 as a submarine. You're not going to learn anything meaningful about either topic because the tools you're using aren't equivalent. Any observations can't be isolated, as you won't know if what you're seeing is because of the airplane being in the wrong place, or a natural property of water.
Not trying to discourage you just... offer some realism. The best way to understand the design and math is to learn the two systems in their native environments. Once you're fluent in English and Spanish, it's easy to draw conclusions about the language's structures, but just going to Spain and trying to use English there while you're not fluent in either English or Spanish is... going to lead to misunderstandings.
I agree with Anguish.
For one, I am also curious about the very specific reason why you want to be a 5e Warlock.
And also, I don't see how you are going to possibly glean understanding from inserting a 5e character into a PF1 game.
What is it about the math you are trying to figure out/understand?
The comparisons are not going to make any sense, there is no common scale shared by the two systems...
5e caps stats at 20.
PF1 has no cap on stats.
This alone makes me feel that any further comparisons will be moot. The strongest person in all of 5e is as strong as a level one, 20pt buy character in PF1.
At level 20, 5e gives you a +6 Proficiency Bonus.
At level 20, a HALF base attack bonus character in PF1 has a +10 bonus.
So, at level 20, a 5e character is:
60% of a 1/2 BAB class,
40% of a 3/4 BAB class,
30% of a full BAB class.
I don't have to play a 5e character in PF1 to see that it's going to suck.
the reason i want the 5e warlock is it's my cousins favorite class and was sad when the class was nowhere to be found in the game, she didnt like any of the alternatives i usually use. and dont misunderstand i play both systems and am quite familiar with both. im merely trying to figure out the key differences and how the end up affecting play. dont take my sticktoittivness as me being rude or anything. i plan on doing a full conversion after this using what i learn from this to help me understand what about the class translates well (patrons for example) and what doesnt (pact magic)
Using one class out of one system and trying it in another will not give you the base of knowledge needed to make any sound general judgements.
Absolutely glad you are having fun, getting creative and and glad it is working out so far, but don't fool yourself into thinking it'll be the same basics across all classes and races crossing over.
PF PC's will skyrocket past the 5e as you progress in levels, the mechanics & math between the two are just that different.
Even at 1-3rd level, PF allows for so many more options and build synergies that there is not much comparison for a PF player and 5e player with the same overall concept.
Again - glad you are getting creative with it and having fun, though.
oh i dont expect this to be perfect, but i thought it would be a fun project and ill probabbly do the same with other classes later, this is just my first gander because i wanted to learn about what i could do for my cousins fav class first
the reason i want the 5e warlock is it's my cousins favorite class and was sad when the class was nowhere to be found in the game, she didnt like any of the alternatives i usually use. and dont misunderstand i play both systems and am quite familiar with both. im merely trying to figure out the key differences and how the end up affecting play. dont take my sticktoittivness as me being rude or anything. i plan on doing a full conversion after this using what i learn from this to help me understand what about the class translates well (patrons for example) and what doesnt (pact magic)
So, what about the 3.5 warlock class? It's more or less what the 5e version is based on. To be honest it kind of goes in the opposite direction though and it may be a bit too powerful. On the plus side you don't have to worry about converting nearly as much.
Aside from the eldritch blast, the witch class has basically all the flavor of the warlock. More spell slots sure, but you don't have to worry about short rests. Instead of invocations, you get hexes.