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I am happy that the Bugul Noz was pilfered from my Breton folklore. And I do not care overmuch that it was not exactly matching the local legend. Also I am not an expert on these creatures anyway.
Just seeing a creature that is really specific to Breton myth in a Paizo book is great for me. It acknowledges that we have a specific culture beyond Celtic.
I was really excited to see the Blodeuwedd feature in a Paizo product.
Then I was disappointed when it was described as living in landscapes which do not exist in Wales.That’s part of the challenge of playing with cultural sources, people are excited to be represented and that makes any disappointments more crushing.
I’ve also always been annoyed by the gorgon. Gorgons in Greek myth are cool, don’t dump the name on something dull.
IIRC, you will have to pin that on the Medieval bestiary scribes, who I think were the first to come up with the DnD style gorgon. That was then the later source of inspiration for Gygax and co.
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It is true that there has been a large outcry for "non-European" settings for adventures.
It is true that there has been a large outcry for "non-European" settings for adventures.
There has been “an” outcry. As to whether it “large” is subjective and the volume potentially amplified relative to actual demand by the nature of people posting on here
The demand is also not for more “non European” settings - or shouldn’t be as this would be unreasonable as they do exist. There is a separate thread where I raised a list in counter to this point
The demand seems to be for more non European APs where you also play as non European characters as well. The majority of the APs with volumes not set in the “not Europe” part of the setting still start in somewhere like Varisia and/or can be argued (or clearly seen) to have PCs engage in colonialist behaviour
I can think of at four APs where you don’t have to start as a character from “not Europe” and they are set outside of central Avistan. One has some unfortunate colonialist aspects in as written (in Book 2) . But as far as I can tell that is utterly irrelevant to the overall plot
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The tropes the OP is complaining about are found in Chinese, Japanese, and other East Asian media. Manga, Anime, film, television, games and more from those countries is filled stories of like the ones likely being presented in FotRP.
As such, I don't see what the problem is with the theme or the trope. I mean are Wutang Clan racist because they love themes from old Japanese Samurai/Ninja films and feature that in their work?
Saying that it is problematic for Paizo to present a set of Wuxia adventures is like calling Record of Loss War (a Japanese anime) problematic because it presented Western European fantasy tropes.
The question lies not in whether exploring these themes is ok (it is) but in making sure to do so in a way that doesn't make the individuals presented into caricatures of ethnic stereotypes. We will have to wait and see there.
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It would be cool to have an Asian consultant who knows martial arts movies. The Chinese Opera and China is where the martial arts movie industry started. Bruce Lee is who led the martial arts craze in the rest of the world. No one could watch a dude that badass and not want to emulate it.
Good time to consult some old Shaw Brothers, Bruce Lee, Jackie Chan, Jet Li, Donnie Yeung, and Takashi Miike films.
What I would have loved even more to be honest is a good Samurai AP. That would be fricking awesome. Watch some Seven Samurai and Yojimbo, make an AP on questing Samurai. I guess Jade Regent is closest to that, but would have been cool to have it start in Tian lands.
There are so many amazing films from Asia, you can go a lot of different directions. They could go more westernized Enter the Dragon or Bloodsport type of film or stick with Chinese tournaments like Ip Man.
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From a 2011 Paizo publication
Furthermore, countless movies helped to guide and isnpire the development of the Dragon Empires--far too many to list here. Instead, presented here are a few mainstays--"required viewing", if you will, for anyone who's looking for more inspiration on running a dragon empires adventure.13 Assassins, dir Takashi Miike
Big Trouble In Little China, dir John Carpenter
Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, dir Ang Lee
Curse of the Golden flower, dir Yimou Zhang
Godzilla, dir Ishiro Honda
The Hidden Fortress, dir Akira Kurosawa
The Host, dir. Joon-ho Bong
House of Flying Daggers, dir Yimou Zhang
The Legend of Drunken Master, dir Chia-Liang Liu and Jackie Chan
Master of the Flying Guillotine, dir Yu Wang
Once Upon A Time in China, dir Hark Tsui
Ong-bak, dir Prachya Pinkaew
Princess Mononoke, dir Hayao Miyazaki
The Ring, dir Hideo Nakata
Seven Samurai, dir Akira Kurosawa
Spirited Away, dir Hayao Miyazaki
The Warrior, dir Sung-su Kim
Yojimbo, dir Akira Kurosawa
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As an Korean-American and someone that enjoys buying adventures from Paizo, I don't normally care who the writer's race is. As long as they do the research, make it fun, and playable.
There is an excellent documentary on Netflix, called Iron Fists and Kung-Fu Kicks, talking about the influence of Hong Kong's martial arts cinema on filmmaking from the Shaw Brothers to modern-day Hollywood blockbusters.
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Here are some other cinema people might be interested in.
Volcano High
Jeon Woo-Chi: The Taoist Wizard
The Pirates (Haejeok: Badaro Gan Sanjeok)
The Good, the Bad, and the Weird by Kim Jee-woon
Arahan
Duelist
the City of Violence
Creative Director
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We're making sure that these concerns folks have about "Ruby Phoenix" are being addressed—it's important to us too. But at the same time, "proving" that we're doing it by offering fully detailed histories on each author's history and personal information isn't something we're eager to do, because that can potentially cause even worse problems for those authors. Not every writer wants their information to be out there on the internet for all to see.
To a certain extent, that does mean you'll need to trust us that we're doing the right thing. I'd hope that our history in taking steps to be diverse and open and seeking the right authors for the right projects over the past several years could help to establish some of that trust. And when we get closer to talking more about Ruby Phoenix (still many months away) we'll hopefully have more to say that won't encroach on author privacy as needed.
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I don't want to know about the personal histories of the Ruby Pheonix writers, I want to know about their favorite martial arts films.
You can tell a lot about a person by whether or not they appreciate Eight Diagram Pole Fighter or the second 36 Chambers movie.
I don't want to know about the personal histories of the Ruby Pheonix writers, I want to know about their favorite martial arts films.
You can tell a lot about a person by whether or not they appreciate Eight Diagram Pole Fighter or the second 36 Chambers movie.
Or Encounters of the Spooky Kind!
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In the nicest way I'm trying to work out how to phrase this: The concerns on this website often seem rooted in perceived problems of unreleased items rather than waiting to see how the material is, giving feedback and letting Paizo improve based on the feedback. I really could be paranoid in thinking it, but it seems it could lead to following a lot of assumed issues based on possible scenarios that are in reality non-issues or very minor issues. Paizo aren't perfect, far from, but I really trust them enough to release good products and take feedback of how to make great adventures even better then rather than randomly chase possible scenarios by posters based on scant details. They're a great publisher that I totally trust for a reason.
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Creative Director
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I don't want to know about the personal histories of the Ruby Pheonix writers, I want to know about their favorite martial arts films.
You can tell a lot about a person by whether or not they appreciate Eight Diagram Pole Fighter or the second 36 Chambers movie.
I can't speak to their favorites, but mine are pretty much the list included in the Dragon Empires Gazetteer (at the time of its publication), which is the list folks cited earlier in this thread.
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Does somebody consider "The Man with Iron Fists" to be problematic? Or "Ghost of Tsushima"?
Would you consider racist if they sanitize an element for western sensibilities? There was a discussion about tanukis, but by that standard male harpies would also be problematic with the Greeks.
What if they add a foreign elements? After all, we would playing in a fantasy facsimile of said cultures and not in the real world. Some people would complain if you place an anachronistic samurai or mix elements from different cultures, but wont bat an eye if you place a potato in a pseudo-medieval setting.
Culturally speaking, I sincerely don't know how could an AP published by Paizo could constitute a problem.
Humbly,
Yawar
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Being respectful and “not using anything outside your own culture ever” are two completely different things.
Also a lot of people don’t point out the potato thing cause people just assume they’ve always been everywhere and weren’t an import.
Unless you’re a racist game developer claiming how “historically accurate” your game is in order to exclude people of color from being in it.
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Being respectful and “not using anything outside your own culture ever” are two completely different things.
My point exactly, thank you.
Also a lot of people don’t point out the potato thing cause people just assume they’ve always been everywhere and weren’t an import.
It's a kind of pet peeve of mine potato diversity is kind of a matter of national pride here in Peru, potatoes save Europe from famine and one of the Incas greatest points of cultural impact.
Unless you’re a racist game developer claiming how “historically accurate” your game is in order to exclude people of color from being in it.
I never got this point. I wouldn't expect Asian people in a game set in ancient Tawantinsuyo.
Humbly,
Yawar