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Question. I have bought virtually all of PF1 (and 3.5's) Golarion source material basically for reading material (the fact that some of it gets used when I run an AP is more-or-less icing on the cake), which maks Golarion, like, unique in the annals of history of RPGs, since I've never found any other campaign world be absorbing enough to want to read for the sake of it.
I have picked up dark mutterings the Golarion of PF2 might not quite be the same as PF1 (other than mechanically).
Is this significant to the point of unreconcilable differences? I mean, obviously, aside from events that chnage things based on time, is there any significant what would have to be treated as retrocasual changes to the mythos (as opposed to just stuff that was not expanded upon previous?)
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Honestly a lot less than you think. There are the obvious thing like the change of rulers with the passing of time and coming and going of elections.
There are 3 Major things that I can think of all of which are AP spoliers.
All adventure paths are assumed to have happened and gone well for the PCs. This means quite a few things: the Worldwound is closed, the nation of Ravounel has seceded from Cheliax, the goddesses Casandalee and Nocticula exist, the Technic League in Numeria has been shattered. The other big one is that Sargava no longer exists, having revolted against colonial rule and become Vidrian.
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The timeline for PF2 Golarion accounts for the last decade of progress and adventures in-world. Golarion time is mapped to progress at about the same pace as real-world time, so really old humans in PF1 have likely died or been replaced in the last decade, the resolutions of adventure paths have been canonized (Whispering Tyrant free, Runelords returned, there's a hobgoblin country in the middle of the Inner Sea, a Varki claimed the title of Linnorm King of Icemark, the colony of Sargava was overthrown, etc.)
It's the same Golarion, just with the last 10 years all accounted for in the current lore.
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Some creatures look pretty different (kobolds, hobgoblins).
Otherwise the greatest changes are with the deities. The core 20 have bigger restrictions on their Clerics' alignment (no CG Cleric of Gorum for example) and some channel a different kind of energy (Lamashtu does only positive now and so does Pharasma).
Those are really very small things as far as the consistency of the setting goes. But they might make a big difference as far as specific PCs are concerned.
Also Aeons are now LN and Inevitables are one of their subspecies IIRC.
Right, so not really anything then (I don't consider the progression of history to be "change," as such, just, y'know normal progression of a proper world.)
The change to the dieties really sounds more of a mechanical than flavour issue (if there are any APs in PF2 that come out and I'm like "WOW, I have to run that!", I'd just completely convert them to my hybrid 3.5/PF1 system anyway).
Good to know, can continue to get sourcebooks without worrying too much (since the crunch therein was fairly unlikely to get dug-out anyway.)
...
Actually, speaking of time moving on, has anything officially addressed the Aucturn Engima beyond what was in Occult Mysteries, since it seems to be passed the point the countdown clock was supposed to go off?
I ask mainly, because I am INSANE, I really quite fancy doing a ridiculously big, convoluted Osirion AP and chucking in Mummy's Mask, Pact Stone Pyramid, Entombed with the Pharaohs, any society bits I think might work AND pasting in Desert of Desolation[1] because Awesome.
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[1]Which burned itself into my subconscious when my Dad, shortly after I started roleplaying (with HeroQuest and into Rolemaster and before, even, I think I'd ever played D&D), borrowed a load of quest books from a mate at work for me to read, and Pharoah was one of them. And it burned itself into my hindbrain like none of the others. (I used one of the puzzles in that in the game I wrote for my 18th, and that was 22 years ago...!) (I even snapped up a hard-copy when I saw one in the gaming shop once...) Which is why Mummy's Mask was an aforementioned "WOW, I have to run that!"
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Actually, speaking of time moving on, has anything officially addressed the Aucturn Engima beyond what was in Occult Mysteries, since it seems to be passed the point the countdown clock was supposed to go off?
The Pathfinder Playtest adventure set Doomsday Dawn tells this story.
The Pathfinder Playtest adventure set Doomsday Dawn tells this story.
Actually, speaking of time moving on, has anything officially addressed the Aucturn Engima beyond what was in Occult Mysteries, since it seems to be passed the point the countdown clock was supposed to go off?
Cool.
*looks*
Oh. Um. Okay. That... seems rather disappointing; ouch, that review score. It is apparently not available as a PDF. Which means it's effectively off the table because shipping - well, guess I'll look at Amazon uk, if I can find a second-hand one... *mid post edit* Oh, okay, one for about a fiver, I'll bite at that; I can maybe at least crib *some* use out of it (I mean, I'd be converting it to my house-rules *anyway,* so I can at least use the framework and the maps and what assets are there...)
Ta, anyway.
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The Pathfinder Playtest adventure set Doomsday Dawn tells this story.
Actually, speaking of time moving on, has anything officially addressed the Aucturn Engima beyond what was in Occult Mysteries, since it seems to be passed the point the countdown clock was supposed to go off?
Cool.
*looks*
Oh. Um. Okay. That... seems rather disappointing; ouch, that review score. It is apparently not available as a PDF. Which means it's effectively off the table because shipping - well, guess I'll look at Amazon uk, if I can find a second-hand one... *mid post edit* Oh, okay, one for about a fiver, I'll bite at that; I can maybe at least crib *some* use out of it (I mean, I'd be converting it to my house-rules *anyway,* so I can at least use the framework and the maps and what assets are there...)
Ta, anyway.
I'm doing some poking to see why the PDF isn't available on the product page, but it looks like if you download the Playtest Bundle here it still gives you the Doomsday Dawn PDF and all the playtest files.
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I'm doing some poking to see why the PDF isn't available on the product page, but it looks like if you download the Playtest Bundle here it still gives you the Doomsday Dawn PDF and all the playtest files.The Pathfinder Playtest adventure set Doomsday Dawn tells this story.
Actually, speaking of time moving on, has anything officially addressed the Aucturn Engima beyond what was in Occult Mysteries, since it seems to be passed the point the countdown clock was supposed to go off?
Cool.
*looks*
Oh. Um. Okay. That... seems rather disappointing; ouch, that review score. It is apparently not available as a PDF. Which means it's effectively off the table because shipping - well, guess I'll look at Amazon uk, if I can find a second-hand one... *mid post edit* Oh, okay, one for about a fiver, I'll bite at that; I can maybe at least crib *some* use out of it (I mean, I'd be converting it to my house-rules *anyway,* so I can at least use the framework and the maps and what assets are there...)
Ta, anyway.
Oh, fantastic! Much appreciated! (Seriously, I needed a win in some form today...!)
One thing that no one has brought up is an official move to new names for a lot of things.
Kytons>Velstrac
Troglodyte>Xulgath
Dark Folk>Caligni
They did so for a combination of reasons, as I understand it. Some were for removing stuff focused on an outsider's perspective. Others have to do with IP and wanting to get out from under the D&D terminology. Not to mention that Aboleth and Kytons were expanded out into such bigger and more detailed things than D&D did.
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Also, goblins are no longer all everyone's favourite ADHD psychopathic pyromaniacs, for some reason.
Honestly a lot less than you think. There are the obvious thing like the change of rulers with the passing of time and coming and going of elections.
There are 3 Major things that I can think of all of which are AP spoliers.
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **
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Also, goblins are no longer all everyone's favourite ADHD psychopathic pyromaniacs, for some reason.
Not true at all, 90% of goblins probably still are, at least the Rasp goblins in Varisia, just not 100%. Because they vary. And many many posters here have shown examples of unusual goblins that existed in PF1 so the balance in world hasn't even changed. The weird, non-default as foe are just supported in the core rulebook now. Nothing in world has changed.
Usually people saying this either don't know that and are legit confused, or are deliberately being obtuse. If its the former, now you know. If it's the latter I will not respond to any bad faith responses anyway. So good luck! Have fun!
I guess that changed since the playtest. Which is no bad thing, of course.
I'd say read it for the story if you're into it but I wouldn't really recommend trying to play the playtest adventures. Or if you do, go heavily off book (Which I guess is implied if you plan to convert to 1E).
The intent of testing mechanics definitely hinders the enjoyment of the game, hence the low rating. If you were going to run it I'd probably listen to some of the developer retrospectives on the playtest cause they zero in on what they were trying to test & often the solution to making it more fun is to ease off that.
Having read it, yeah. I can see why people weren't hugely impressed, the metaplot is a little bit tacked-on, it feels. Fortunately, I think the Osirion bits can be yoinked easily, and if, as my nominal intention would be, to include Entombed with the Pharoahs and Pact Stone Pyramid into the sequence, some of the elements could be easily omitted. (I mean, honestly, the real biggy was actually what the Enigma was, in concept, and Darkest Dawn actually did a good job, I think, with that, even if the execution was... What it was.)
Edit: Out of interest, where might these aforementioned developer retrospectives be located? Google seems only interested in waving business nonsense for that search term; seriously google, the frack, when the first five or so results consist of explictly ignoring over half the keywords...
I think a lot of the Doomsday dawn stuff ended up on the youtube channel but is likely buried at this point.
Honestly a lot less than you think. There are the obvious thing like the change of rulers with the passing of time and coming and going of elections.
There are 3 Major things that I can think of all of which are AP spoliers.
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **
** spoiler omitted **** spoiler omitted **
:P everyone gets creaky with age.
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Folks see the word playtest and seem to focus on the word "play" and not notice the word "test." Tests aren't really the type of thing that a lot of people would consider fun, but they're EXTREMELY important to do anyway.
We could and should have been more explicit about that, making sure folks knew that the playtest part is more work then leisure.
That said, I'm still pretty pleased with how Doomsday Dawn worked out overall. It was something of a trick to get the story to shine through even as much as it did when the individual parts had to serve playtest goals first and foremost. If I had all the time in the world, I'd be tempted to do a hard-hitting development/rewrite of the entire thing to shore up the storyline and rebuild it as a 2nd edition adventure... but I don't.
Rest assured that while the story wrapped up the Enigma Clock plotline, it did not wrap up the Dominion of the Black. We'll be doing more with them. PLENTY more.
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I ask mainly, because I am INSANE, I really quite fancy doing a ridiculously big, convoluted Osirion AP and chucking in Mummy's Mask, Pact Stone Pyramid, Entombed with the Pharaohs, any society bits I think might work AND pasting in Desert of Desolation[1] because Awesome.
If you can find an inexpensive copy, Green Ronin's Hamunaptra boxed set is 3.5 AD&D compatible (which makes it a hop, skip and jump away from PF1), and full of interesting ideas to mine for a game set in an Egyptian/Orision/Mulhorand style setting.
Folks see the word playtest and seem to focus on the word "play" and not notice the word "test." Tests aren't really the type of thing that a lot of people would consider fun, but they're EXTREMELY important to do anyway.
We could and should have been more explicit about that, making sure folks knew that the playtest part is more work then leisure.
That said, I'm still pretty pleased with how Doomsday Dawn worked out overall. It was something of a trick to get the story to shine through even as much as it did when the individual parts had to serve playtest goals first and foremost. If I had all the time in the world, I'd be tempted to do a hard-hitting development/rewrite of the entire thing to shore up the storyline and rebuild it as a 2nd edition adventure... but I don't.
Rest assured that while the story wrapped up the Enigma Clock plotline, it did not wrap up the Dominion of the Black. We'll be doing more with them. PLENTY more.
Excellent. The dominion is super creepy and I hate that I love it.