Is a Dispelling weapon near useless?


Pathfinder Society


I have a PFS PC that is good at dispelling and is good at hitting enemies in melee. So I am considering a "dispelling" or "greater dispelling" weapon. But they both work per "spell storage" weapons...

"A dispelling weapon functions like a spell storing weapon, but it may only store dispel magic; however, the caster level check to dispel gains an additional bonus equal to the weapon's enhancement bonus. This bonus also applies to a magus's dispelling strike arcana or a barbarian's spell sunder or sunder enchantment combat maneuver check."

And from spell storing..."Anytime the weapon strikes a creature and the creature takes damage from it, the weapon can immediately cast the spell on that creature as a free action if the wielder desires."

So, as I see it, the purpose of the weapon would be to get rid of an enemy's buff and/or protection spells. But if it has mirror images or magical concealment the PC won't hit it often. Even if she does hit, she still has to do hit point damage and isn't built to overcome DR.

I won't be buying the weapon till after level nine. Won't a dispelling weapon be useless most times I want to offensively dispel stuff?....Thoughts?

Dark Archive 4/5 *** Venture-Lieutenant, Finland—Turku

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You should probably get spellstoring instead, because the bonus is relatively small, while spellstoring offers greater variety.
Spellstoring by itself is a pretty fun thing, and I often consider it for my characters (but since most of them lack serious spellcasting capabilities, I rarely do).

Silver Crusade 5/5 5/55/5 **** Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

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The weapon enhancement seems reasonable, but likely only really useful for characters that focus a bit on dispelling or play at a level where dispelling can make or break a fight.

From the limited number of high-level encounters I have experienced and run, it could be fun, but might only really have an appreciable effect every couple of scenarios.

It really depends on your class/build.


Sebastian Hirsch wrote:

The weapon enhancement seems reasonable, but likely only really useful for characters that focus a bit on dispelling or play at a level where dispelling can make or break a fight.

From the limited number of high-level encounters I have experienced and run, it could be fun, but might only really have an appreciable effect every couple of scenarios.

It really depends on your class/build.

Magician(Bard}: Replaces Inspire courage with Dweamercraft which gives a bonus to magic casting including dispelling. The thought being to use one round of performance while casting "dispel magic" into the weapon. Do it between scenarios to save a spell slot and the round of performance. I have found Dweamercraft underwhelming during battle and seem better off using inspire greatness.


Spell storing in general is weird and requires some building around it. Figuring out how useful the ability is first requires determining how it will actually work at the tables you play at, which can make it a little iffy in organized play. It also probably isn't really strong until higher levels, which makes it less of a good fit.

As far as I can tell, there seems to be an open question about how spell storing items work. Spell storing weapons say the item casts the spell on the target; since items that cast spells do so at the item's caster level, that would allow for low level characters to effectively power up spells dependent on caster level in a significant way by putting them into a spell storing weapon, but messes with the save DCs since you don't use the original caster's stats.

The other interpretation is that the ability is not well written and really wants to say that when a spell is cast into a spell storing weapon, the effects are held until the weapon hits something and the spell takes effect like it had been cast on that target by the original caster who put the spell in the weapon. This feels much more like what people expect "spell storing" to mean, and will be a popular interpretation, but it isn't really what the ability says. I was expecting a FAQ clarifying this is the intended behavior when I searched, but instead just ran into a bunch of forum posts and reddit threads of people arguing.

Once you know how it works, there are some nifty tricks you can try with it. If it is operating on the "Weapon Casts Spell" model, you can buy NPC dispels or low level PC casts and get effectively CL 11+ dispels out of it, though you probably want generic spell storing for the higher CL here without additional effort (another hint, in my opinion, that this is likely not the intended way this works). If you instead are treating it as if the spell is cast by the caster, it opens up some different avenues of optimization. It lets you use temporary CL boosting effects to up the Dispel Magic CL for storage.

Best case scenario I could imagine in that case would be a team of a caster optimized for Greater Magic Weapon and Dispel Magic CLs using Karma beads, Allied Spellcaster with himself via Army Across Time, Death Knell etc, etc while a fighter friend runs with a pile of +1 spell storing weapons in a two weapon fighting build with quickdraw to burst a ton of spells in a short time window. Ironically, with the way PFS rules work, you would need to have the fighter own the beads and the caster own the weapons if you wanted to be able to store the dispels across scenarios, but could work if you always play together as a team.

This team would probably want to be running with mostly +1 spell storing weapons, but I could see working a few dispelling ones in there, combined with Greater Magic Weapon to get the dispel check into the mid 20's. You could lead with those against casters and start a cascade failure where getting hit strips their defenses that make it easier to hit them again.

The Exchange 4/5 5/5

Dispelling burst is far more useful than Dispelling, because it can store greater dispel magic. A Spell-Storing weapon can only store spells up to 3rd level.

It’s expensive, but being able to attack, do damage, and also strip a bull’s strength or barkskin or any other buff off can be very efficient. As usual, it depends on your particular build.


Kevin Willis wrote:

Dispelling burst is far more useful than Dispelling, because it can store greater dispel magic. A Spell-Storing weapon can only store spells up to 3rd level.

It’s expensive, but being able to attack, do damage, and also strip a bull’s strength or barkskin or any other buff off can be very efficient. As usual, it depends on your particular build.

I understand that Greater dispelling weapon is a bargain if you simply considerate it an extra 5th level spell. But when you want to dispel multiple effects on a single target(the only way I believe it can be used) it seems likely that one of those things will be a spell effect that keeps you from hitting and/or damaging your target. I might be spending 18,000gp on something that may never be useful for its intended purpose, even throughout seeker levels of up to level 15.

I'm not sure about the above assumptions though, which is why I am asking for advice. What sort of situations do you see a Greater Dispelling weapon being effectively used?


Would casting Versatile Weapon at 12th level for a +3 enhancement instead of +1 add three to the dispel check or only one?

The Exchange 4/5 5/5

Meager Rolmug wrote:
Would casting Versatile Weapon at 12th level for a +3 enhancement instead of +1 add three to the dispel check or only one?

Should be a +3, since the bonus from greater magic weapon is an enhancement bonus.

The Exchange 4/5 5/5

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Meager Rolmug wrote:

I understand that Greater dispelling weapon is a bargain if you simply considerate it an extra 5th level spell. But when you want to dispel multiple effects on a single target(the only way I believe it can be used) it seems likely that one of those things will be a spell effect that keeps you from hitting and/or damaging your target. I might be spending 18,000gp on something that may never be useful for its intended purpose, even throughout seeker levels of up to level 15.

I'm not sure about the above assumptions though, which is why I am asking for advice. What sort of situations do you see a Greater Dispelling weapon being effectively used?

When you say “Greater Dispelling” you mean “Dispelling Burst,” right? I don’t think there is a weapon quality called Greater Dispelling.

Assuming we’re talking about the same weapon quality, my answer is that it would be most effective when you are primarily a physical damage-dealer who also happens to be able to cast greater dispel magic. Like a battle cleric or something similar. When your first instinct is to get in there and swing. Yeah, you may miss because of defensive buffs, but that’s no different than a rogue going in swinging. When you do hit, then you trigger the greater dispel.

If you would rather strip off the buffs first before making any attacks then yeah, Dispelling Burst isn’t useful.

So who’s going to find it most useful? Maybe a 12th level Crusader Cleric of Gorum. Or a 13th level skald. Or a 16th level magus. In other words, not many characters in PFS. Only a very specialized type of character is going to ever buy this enchantment.

Dark Archive 4/5 *** Venture-Lieutenant, Finland—Turku

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Spellstoring armor is very, very good, but mostly with just a couple select spells. Namely, Frostbite or Frigid touch, for a no-save fatigue to interrupt a full attack routine from a creature that could otherwise kill you.

About the spellstoring interpretation - I think the (reasonable and logical) way to interpret is, that it literally "stores" the spell, and thus uses your CL and DC, instead of the weapons own. I fully admit that this isn't the only way to interpret it, and the wording "the weapon cast the spell" implies otherwise.
If the interpretation at your local table(s) is the one where the weapon uses your CL and DC, it becomes immensely more powerful, because you can pay for a dispel magic as a spellcasting service, from a high level caster.
As a 3rd level spell, you could pay 600gp to get a caster level 20 dispel magic placed into your weapon, practically ensuring that it will always succeed in the dispel magic check when you need it to. It persists between adventures too, so while the cost (600gp) may sound steep at lower levels, you'll know that when you need it, it will work.


Huh. For some reason, I was under the impression that you could only buy the minimum CL of a cast spell unless you needed a higher CL for it to succeed, but that looks like it isn't the case. That makes buying CL 20+ dispels pretty effective.


GM 7thGate wrote:
Huh. For some reason, I was under the impression that you could only buy the minimum CL of a cast spell unless you needed a higher CL for it to succeed, but that looks like it isn't the case. That makes buying CL 20+ dispels pretty effective.

You assume correctly for PFS. I am not sure why Tommi Ketonen posted buying a higher level scroll.

From the guild guide...

"All potions, scrolls, and wands are available only at the
minimum caster level unless found at a higher caster
level on a Chronicle sheet."

Maybe he forgot this thread was in a PFS forum.


That's the thing though, we're not talking about a potion, scroll or wand but a purchased spell in spellcasting services. That doesn't seem to have a CL limit. I'm wondering if I accidentally crossed the two concepts myself when I was thinking back on it.


I am leaning toward first enchanting the PCs mithral spiked gauntlet into +1 vicious. Vicious should damage any enemy without hardness. That gives me a low cost effective weapon not requiring a high strength, feats, or class feature to do at least some damage.

"This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons. When a vicious weapon strikes an opponent, it creates a flash of disruptive energy that resonates between the opponent and the wielder. This energy deals an extra 2d6 points of damage to the opponent and 1d6 points of damage to the wielder."

The 1d6 damage to the PC could be countered by inspire greatness, soothing performance(at lvl 12), or party member channeling for other PCs anyway. Not a great option but I think OK for limited or emergency situations.

At some point I can add Dispelling to the spiked gauntlet. Now it will almost always do damage as long as it hits.


GM 7thGate wrote:
That's the thing though, we're not talking about a potion, scroll or wand but a purchased spell in spellcasting services. That doesn't seem to have a CL limit. I'm wondering if I accidentally crossed the two concepts myself when I was thinking back on it.

Ahh, you are correct! from the Guild Guide...

"If a character wants to ensure success with a spell that
requires a caster level check or a specific caster level,
hired spellcasters are able to cast spells at any caster
level as appropriate, such as destroyed magic items
that might require an extremely high caster level for
make whole to repair them and restore their function.
For example, remove curse requires a caster level check
with a difficulty equal to the save DC for the curse; a
caster level of 14 would be required to ensure success
on a curse with a save DC of 15."

Veerryyy interesting... But the first part seems to limit what situations higher CL spells can be purchased for. Was that the intent, I wonder?

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