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Hmmmm... As a PFS player that plays nothing but bard archetypes(well over 100 scenarios). I suggest that the appropriate interpretation is...

1. Masterpieces AND weird bard archetype performances that cost extra much to perform but have effects that last after actively using rounds of performance DO NOT have there effects disappear if another performance/masterpiece is performed unless it is the same one.

2. If a masterpiece OR performance has no effect after the rounds of performance are actively being used OR extended by an effect similar to lingering performance, two CANNOT be used at the same time. This rule can be violated by certain archetypes, spells, and such that SPECIFICALLY say so. That is all the proof you should need that that was the developers intent.

As to the question of a bard's power compared to other classes as a reason to allow simultaneous use beyond 1 and 2 above...bards(including most archetypes) are VERY skilled at low levels and VERY powerful in battles at high levels. There is a lot of bad advice about building fun/effective bards out there...that may be the reason you think they are underpowered. If you prioritize doing damage way more than avoiding a battle using skills, do not play a bard. If you do not appreciate that a bard's buffs(spells + performance) at level 11 and beyond will almost always make the bard the one responsible for the most damage, do not play a bard. A bards best spells and best performances are buffs. A bards best class features are all about skills. Lean too far away from that at your own peril.


Claxon wrote:

The DC seems like it would just be the DC 10 Aid Another check.

Seems like the first time another player would attempt a skill check, you could offer advice for 1 minute and they get a +2 bonus to that skill for the rest of the day. So probably you talk to your team and ask them what they'd like a bonus on and you give them some pep talks at the start of the day.

"Oh, you want to be better at hiding? Come over here I have some tips for you. Go try hiding in that corner over there. No, more like this..."

So I can just manufacture an opportunity for an ally to use a skill? If that is so it seems pretty powerful. I am going to be playing a "Chronicler of Worlds" bard archetype that swaps Chr for Int for all bard class features. I could have all(except Craft, Profession, and Perform) skills trained by level 3.

Wouldn't skills that are barred from aiding be off limits like disable device? Would that be situational?


"Benefit: You can attempt a skill check to aid an ally within 30 feet with a skill in which you are trained. This takes 1 minute, and during that time, you need only speak and be heard by your chosen ally to offer this aid. The bonus you grant is +2, regardless of any other effects that would alter your aid another bonus. This bonus applies to all checks the ally attempts with that skill for 1 day and does not stack with any other aid another bonus. Whether you succeed at or fail the skill check to aid another, you can attempt to use this ability only once per day for each ally."

This would be for Society play.

1. In what situation does the aid another check take place? At the start of the scenario or only during a skill attempt by an ally?

2. What is the DC?


Thanks Everyone.


Fire Dancer wrote:

here ya go... a link to my thread where I asked much the same thing.

Any-way-for-a-Bard-to-gain-a-Special-Familiar..

I actually dipped a level of Sorcerer to pull it off - but I think Sparky (pseudodragon) was well worth it. Lots of R.P. at the table, even if maybe I'm not as optimized a PC as I could be.

That is a long thread... What was concluded about MY question?? Does the boon grant access to a familiar?


Scenario #:
8-01(Portent's Peril)
has a
boon:

"You may take a pseudodragon as a familiar with the improved familiar feat as long as you are a spellcaster of at least 5th level(rather than 7th)."

Does this allow a spellcaster without an ability to gain a familiar to get one, or just get one early if the spellcaster already can have a familiar.


GM 7thGate wrote:
That's the thing though, we're not talking about a potion, scroll or wand but a purchased spell in spellcasting services. That doesn't seem to have a CL limit. I'm wondering if I accidentally crossed the two concepts myself when I was thinking back on it.

Ahh, you are correct! from the Guild Guide...

"If a character wants to ensure success with a spell that
requires a caster level check or a specific caster level,
hired spellcasters are able to cast spells at any caster
level as appropriate, such as destroyed magic items
that might require an extremely high caster level for
make whole to repair them and restore their function.
For example, remove curse requires a caster level check
with a difficulty equal to the save DC for the curse; a
caster level of 14 would be required to ensure success
on a curse with a save DC of 15."

Veerryyy interesting... But the first part seems to limit what situations higher CL spells can be purchased for. Was that the intent, I wonder?


I am leaning toward first enchanting the PCs mithral spiked gauntlet into +1 vicious. Vicious should damage any enemy without hardness. That gives me a low cost effective weapon not requiring a high strength, feats, or class feature to do at least some damage.

"This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons. When a vicious weapon strikes an opponent, it creates a flash of disruptive energy that resonates between the opponent and the wielder. This energy deals an extra 2d6 points of damage to the opponent and 1d6 points of damage to the wielder."

The 1d6 damage to the PC could be countered by inspire greatness, soothing performance(at lvl 12), or party member channeling for other PCs anyway. Not a great option but I think OK for limited or emergency situations.

At some point I can add Dispelling to the spiked gauntlet. Now it will almost always do damage as long as it hits.


GM 7thGate wrote:
Huh. For some reason, I was under the impression that you could only buy the minimum CL of a cast spell unless you needed a higher CL for it to succeed, but that looks like it isn't the case. That makes buying CL 20+ dispels pretty effective.

You assume correctly for PFS. I am not sure why Tommi Ketonen posted buying a higher level scroll.

From the guild guide...

"All potions, scrolls, and wands are available only at the
minimum caster level unless found at a higher caster
level on a Chronicle sheet."

Maybe he forgot this thread was in a PFS forum.


Would casting Versatile Weapon at 12th level for a +3 enhancement instead of +1 add three to the dispel check or only one?


Kevin Willis wrote:

Dispelling burst is far more useful than Dispelling, because it can store greater dispel magic. A Spell-Storing weapon can only store spells up to 3rd level.

It’s expensive, but being able to attack, do damage, and also strip a bull’s strength or barkskin or any other buff off can be very efficient. As usual, it depends on your particular build.

I understand that Greater dispelling weapon is a bargain if you simply considerate it an extra 5th level spell. But when you want to dispel multiple effects on a single target(the only way I believe it can be used) it seems likely that one of those things will be a spell effect that keeps you from hitting and/or damaging your target. I might be spending 18,000gp on something that may never be useful for its intended purpose, even throughout seeker levels of up to level 15.

I'm not sure about the above assumptions though, which is why I am asking for advice. What sort of situations do you see a Greater Dispelling weapon being effectively used?


Sebastian Hirsch wrote:

The weapon enhancement seems reasonable, but likely only really useful for characters that focus a bit on dispelling or play at a level where dispelling can make or break a fight.

From the limited number of high-level encounters I have experienced and run, it could be fun, but might only really have an appreciable effect every couple of scenarios.

It really depends on your class/build.

Magician(Bard}: Replaces Inspire courage with Dweamercraft which gives a bonus to magic casting including dispelling. The thought being to use one round of performance while casting "dispel magic" into the weapon. Do it between scenarios to save a spell slot and the round of performance. I have found Dweamercraft underwhelming during battle and seem better off using inspire greatness.


I have a PFS PC that is good at dispelling and is good at hitting enemies in melee. So I am considering a "dispelling" or "greater dispelling" weapon. But they both work per "spell storage" weapons...

"A dispelling weapon functions like a spell storing weapon, but it may only store dispel magic; however, the caster level check to dispel gains an additional bonus equal to the weapon's enhancement bonus. This bonus also applies to a magus's dispelling strike arcana or a barbarian's spell sunder or sunder enchantment combat maneuver check."

And from spell storing..."Anytime the weapon strikes a creature and the creature takes damage from it, the weapon can immediately cast the spell on that creature as a free action if the wielder desires."

So, as I see it, the purpose of the weapon would be to get rid of an enemy's buff and/or protection spells. But if it has mirror images or magical concealment the PC won't hit it often. Even if she does hit, she still has to do hit point damage and isn't built to overcome DR.

I won't be buying the weapon till after level nine. Won't a dispelling weapon be useless most times I want to offensively dispel stuff?....Thoughts?


Any more thoughts anyone?


Talonhawke wrote:

1. Not everyone wants to spend money and use up there neck slot for just a +2 to hit. Especially if they aren't always getting the benefit. I mean that's one item slot and 4000gp.

2. Your assuming that it works by virtue of wearing it and not actually wielding the weapon. And it might but not every GM is going to agree that you can stand there with your sword and shield and grant bonuses to your friends from your foot being menacing.

1. Agreed, not everyone.

2. This is a VERY good reason not to add menacing to any always threatening weapon(spiked gauntlet), not just amulet. But the spiked gauntlet is less likely to be cancelled by a GM in some situations.


willuwontu wrote:
Meager Rolmug wrote:
If the answer is basically yes, then why doesn't every melee martial have a amulet of mighty fists(menacing)? It essentially would stack with another melee weapon or even a touch spell attack.
Amulet of natural armor, necklace of adaptation, talismans, the fact that it's 4k for a minor situational bonus that in theory shouldn't be relevant in most combats as you should be offing the enemies rather quickly without it.

Hmmm.. seems the amulet is priced at 5000gp, but that is still less then 8000gp to put it on a spiked gauntlet. I am unimpressed with all but a few neck slot items. Amulet of natural armor being the best. Plenty of other ways for a PC to get a low natural armor bonus or a better one(barkskin). For those that can, a cheap +2 to hit that stacks with your +1 holy sword, even 20% of the time is worth it. For a bit of extra maneuvering your getting a +4 to hit and a +2 to at least one ally. If you don't have a great "to hit" this could double or more your chance to connect.

My PC casts barkskin, often uses touch attack spells, but needs something useful to do when his useful touch spells run out or when high resource output is not justified.


If the answer is basically yes, then why doesn't every melee martial have a amulet of mighty fists(menacing)? It essentially would stack with another melee weapon or even a touch spell attack.


See subject.


Cevah wrote:
Meager Rolmug wrote:
If that's the case it is close to worthless. Uses up the PC's hands, actions, and rounds of performance??? Doesn't sound right to me.

You don't think imposing shaken is worth it?

I don't think so. Yes it could be better than the alternative performances at low levels, but you can't afford it at low levels. And there are so many other things a PC NEEDS to spend gold on rather than a marginally better bardic performance. It is also a mind-affecting, fear effect that won't work on undead, constructs, swarms, etc. Add that to taking actions to equip, occupying a hand, and possible encumbrance issues(5 lbs). Its not worthless, if as you say, it only takes one hand and only a action to start it, but it sure ain't a bargain. Its seems to be just another magic item which would be cool if you got it for free, but would never pay full price for, not even for my mid level Magician bard archetype. I'd rather cycle greatness on whomever is taking damage or get a masterpiece and spend the gold on a wand of haste(11,250). But thanks for the input.


Soulgear wrote:
Meager Rolmug wrote:

Made from bone and sun-dried sinew, this masterwork harp produces a vague sense of unease in anyone near it. If the owner of this item has the bardic performance class feature he can use it to perform a dirge of doom even if he is not of sufficient level to normally have access to that ability. A bard who can use dirge of doom and who plays the harp as part of his performance increases the effective radius to 60 feet.

1. RAW it seems to give "dirge of doom" to archetypes that don't have it.

2. RAW it seems you only need to "own" it (not hold or play it) to benefit from #1. Though you have to play it to "increases the effective radius to 60 feet."

I am looking for something more than opinions. It is pricey, and per RAW still requires rounds of performance be used. so I don't view it as overpowered if interpreted as I have above.

"If the owner of this item has the bardic performance class feature he can use it to perform"

This line specifically implies it's usage using the perform skill and perform class feature.

You have to use the item in order to benefit from it.

If that's the case it is close to worthless. Uses up the PC's hands, actions, and rounds of performance??? Doesn't sound right to me.


Made from bone and sun-dried sinew, this masterwork harp produces a vague sense of unease in anyone near it. If the owner of this item has the bardic performance class feature he can use it to perform a dirge of doom even if he is not of sufficient level to normally have access to that ability. A bard who can use dirge of doom and who plays the harp as part of his performance increases the effective radius to 60 feet.

1. RAW it seems to give "dirge of doom" to archetypes that don't have it.

2. RAW it seems you only need to "own" it (not hold or play it) to benefit from #1. Though you have to play it to "increases the effective radius to 60 feet."

I am looking for something more than opinions. It is pricey, and per RAW still requires rounds of performance be used. so I don't view it as overpowered if interpreted as I have above.


Cyrad wrote:
Meager Rolmug wrote:
Are Figurines of Wondrous Power normally Ok to buy in PFS??

Each figurine is a separate item that must be legalized in the AR.

The figurine in question comes from a chronicle sheet.

well i can't find the core rule book in the AR, that's why i'm asking. ihave a PFS PC that i want to purchase a regular ebony fly.


Are Figurines of Wondrous Power normally Ok to buy in PFS??


Friendly “heads-up”: you must be exactly level 12 (33 XP) to start Eyes of the Ten.

I know,my referring to level 13 was for when bards can cast greater dispel magic. I should have said "when I am playing eyes of the ten".

thanks anyway.


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RealAlchemy wrote:
I know! Can I really hate casters and buy a full lot of 50 dispelling arrows?

Dispelling is only listed under melee weapon special abilities, so only a melee weapon can be dispelling.


BigNorseWolf wrote:

** spoiler omitted **

You can have 5 of each if you can afford them. And really. really don't like casters apparently...

The PC is good at dispelling(magician bard-dispel focus+eventually greater dispel focus), but it takes extra actions(equip pipes of dissolution-move, activate pipes of dissolution-standard, maintain pipes of dissolution-move, start dweomercraft performance-move, maintain pipes of dissolution-move, cast dispel magic)to be super good at dispelling.

Having the super versions in a weapon would save 2 rounds of actions in combat or make the CL check 2 to 5 higher. I am going with +1 mithral dispelling spiked gauntlet. And at level 13 when i finally play "eyes of the ten", a +1 adamantine vicious dispelling burst rapier. Of course it would also free up a 3rd and fifth level spell and extra spells at full power are always expensive.

The 11th level feat will be destructive dispel, so a fortitude save to stun a caster for 1 round, but the dispel has to work first. So i really want the dispel portion close to automatic. I don't really have a lot of "better" uses for the feats or gold, just similar "meh" type options. So I figure, might as well be really good at a few things than average at a bunch.


Would a spell that increases the enhancement bonus of the weapon also increase the bonus on the dispel caster level check?

"A dispelling weapon functions like a spell storing weapon, but it may only store dispel magic; however, the caster level check to dispel gains an additional bonus equal to the weapon's enhancement bonus. This bonus also applies to a magus's dispelling strike arcana or a barbarian's spell sunder or sunder enchantment combat maneuver check."


For PFS can an a +1 dispelling weapon be up graded to a +1 dispelling burst weapon? Can a PC have one of each?


I really don't see the need for a spellbook...at most you will use the ability twice a day and maybe most times not at all. Consider that "Comparative Arcane Studies" doesn't start till level six and most times your already known bard spells are probably the best alternate during battles. I see it as mostly a way to do some cool out of battle stuff. The scrolls i'd get would be Remove Disease, Remove Curse, Neutralize Poison, Blood Biography, Locate Creature, Locate Object, maybe Scrying,Comprehend Languages. I might buy some protective spells like resist energy communal, wind wall, and a few others. But even this extensive list isn't that expensive. Sometimes you'll hoard the uses of "Comparative Arcane Studies" and a spell level slot, not knowing what you'll need next...and end up not using it at all. That being siad it will be interesting to see how it works out for you. Keep us updated.


Ferious Thune wrote:
The research mechanic does come up in PFS. Not very often, but it is used.

Well than that's a pretty poor trade off.


I like this archetype also, but my question is do you still lose the "dirge of doom" performance in PFS even though its replacement is unuseable in PFS?

"Critical Research Focus (Ex)

At 8th level, the studious librarian threatens a critical hit on a Research check with a roll of 18, 19, or 20. He gains a +4 bonus on Research checks to confirm a critical hit. This ability replaces dirge of doom."


I've finally found the FAQ but still had questions. What i believe is legal...

1.All steps for a ring of protection(bonded item) are the same price as the CRB crafting rules, namely 1/2 of the bought item.

2.Adding evasion or wizardy 2 to the ring at 3/4 price is NOT legal since the FAQ says...."A bonded item that is enhanced must still conform to all the campaign rules for access to and upgrading of magical items."

The rules in PFS have changed over time for boned items...if someone knows how it currently works i'd appreciate that information.


Can "nonbunus cost" special abilities like dueling be enchanted into the amulet?


Gisher wrote:
Meager Rolmug wrote:
Gisher wrote:
It means that if you make an AoMF with a +1 Enhancement Bonus and the Holy Special Ability (which has a +2 Equivalent Bonus) then it costs the same as an AoMF with a +3 Enhancement Bonus.
So what does it cost if you just put holy in it, since that is possible with the amulet?
Holy is a +2 Equivalent so a Holy AoMF would have the cost of a +2 AoMF.

Cool, my build just became worth while.


Nefreet wrote:

When you separate any sentence from a paragraph it loses context. Left in there, it makes sense as is.

I separated it because that was what my question was about, not because i read it by itself. It does not make any more sense in the paragraph or alone. If it works the way you say, there is not a reason to put the word additional in the sentence. In fact the sentence doesn't need to there at all, just adds confusion IMO. That doesn't mean your interpretation is wrong..i assumed it was that way til i read that sentence.


Gisher wrote:
It means that if you make an AoMF with a +1 Enhancement Bonus and the Holy Special Ability (which has a +2 Equivalent Bonus) then it costs the same as an AoMF with a +3 Enhancement Bonus.

So what does it cost if you just put holy in it, since that is possible with the amulet?


This amulet grants an enhancement bonus of +1 to +5 on attack and damage rolls with unarmed attacks and natural weapons.

Alternatively, this amulet can grant melee weapon special abilities, so long as they can be applied to unarmed attacks. See Table: Melee Weapon Special Abilities for a list of abilities. Special abilities count as additional bonuses for determining the market value of the item, but do not modify attack or damage bonuses. An amulet of mighty fists cannot have a modified bonus (enhancement bonus plus special ability bonus equivalents) higher than +5. An amulet of mighty fists does not need to have a +1 enhancement bonus to grant a melee weapon special ability.

What the heck does this mean?? "Special abilities count as additional bonuses for determining the market value of the item,"

The "additional bonuses" seems to indicate something other than pricing a +1 special ability=+1 bonus. If it doesn't why have the word additional in the sentence?


blahpers wrote:
Meager Rolmug wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:
Yes, but the duration doesn't stack, effectively making it the spell's duration +2 rounds.
what do you mean? The spell has a save and can do damage each round it lasts...I would think the target would be dazed for 3 rounds every time it took damage. I know the total rounds of dazing wouldn't add together. The lastest daze would essentially be the only one active, but that still seems really powerful, and i was wondering if there was any developer ruling, FAQ, or such making it not work this way in PFS.
Sounds like you both agree--the target would be dazed until two full rounds after the spell wears off, assuming it failed its saving throw. Seems fine for a 6th-level-equivalent spell to me.

Only if it failed its LAST saving throw. It is perfectly possible to be dazed for part of the spells duration but not all of it, since there is the possibility of damage dealt with a failed save each round.


thelemonache wrote:
I've read a few forums on this very same question, and the consensus seemed to be that shadowbard played it's own music.

considering that these two spells seem to be the ONLY way to have 2 performances going at once, i would guess VP is basically referencing the shadow bard spell when it says "doesn't stack with other ways of maintaining multiple songs". Is written poorly, though if that was the intent of the phrase.


Ravingdork wrote:
Yes, but the duration doesn't stack, effectively making it the spell's duration +2 rounds.

what do you mean? The spell has a save and can do damage each round it lasts...I would think the target would be dazed for 3 rounds every time it took damage. I know the total rounds of dazing wouldn't add together. The lastest daze would essentially be the only one active, but that still seems really powerful, and i was wondering if there was any developer ruling, FAQ, or such making it not work this way in PFS.


Would the target be dazed for 3 rounds EACH time it failed a fort save?

Excruciating Deformation
Your touch attack causes your target to become painfully malformed. Its limbs twist and buckle, while its body contorts uncontrollably, shifting and warping. Each round the target suffers excruciating pain and takes 2d6 points of nonlethal damage, 1 point of Dexterity damage, and 1 point of Constitution damage, and its speed is reduced by 10 feet. Once per round as a free action on its turn, the target can attempt a new Fortitude saving throw to resist the spell for 1 round.

dazing spell metamagic
You can modify a spell to daze a creature damaged by the spell. When a creature takes damage from this spell, they become dazed for a number of rounds equal to the original level of the spell. If the spell allows a saving throw, a successful save negates the daze effect. If the spell does not allow a save, the target can make a Will save to negate the daze effect. If the spell effect also causes the creature to become dazed, the duration of this metamagic effect is added to the duration of the spell. A dazing spell uses up a spell slot three levels higher than the spell's actual level. Spells that do not inflict damage do not benefit from this feat.


Pyrotechnics turns a fire into a burst of blinding fireworks or a thick cloud of choking smoke, depending on your choice. The spell uses one fire source, which is immediately extinguished. A fire so large that it exceeds a 20-foot cube is only partly extinguished. Magical fires are not extinguished, although a fire-based creature used as a source takes 1 point of damage per caster level.

Fireworks: The fireworks are a flashing, fiery, momentary burst of glowing, colored aerial lights. This effect causes creatures within 120 feet of the fire source to become blinded for 1d4+1 rounds (Will negates). These creatures must have line of sight to the fire to be affected. Spell resistance can prevent blindness.

Smoke Cloud: A stream of smoke billows out from the fire, forming a choking cloud that spreads 20 feet in all directions and lasts for 1 round per caster level. All sight, even darkvision, is ineffective in or through the cloud. All within the cloud take –4 penalties to Strength and Dexterity (Fortitude negates). These effects last for 1d4+1 rounds after the cloud dissipates or after the creature leaves the area of the cloud. Spell resistance does not apply.


You spit a stream of venom at a target using a ranged touch attack. If the venom hits, it causes blindness for 1 round. The target must also save or be poisoned by black adder venom; the DC in successive rounds of the poison is equal to the spell's DC.

So is the first save the target makes just DC 12 like black adder poison? Or are all the saves the DC of the spell?


I think I've come up with something workable, but i am going to delay taking the sling flail feat till level 4 and even than will probably only use it for ranged attacks or to bypass DR in melee. At level 7-8th i should have enough gold to make it holy. I will also have weapon focus, weapon specialization and weapon training(fighter feature) by then. Before that time I'll just use a great sword or lucern hammer.

There is also an advantage of being able to use a buckler with the sling without a "to hit" penalty in both melee and ranged, though the PC would not get the shield bonus to AC in a round he reloads. At that level i will be able to start enchanting the buckler making the bonus to AC worth while.

level 1: class=archaeologist(bard), feat=lingering performance
level 2: class=fighter, feat=risky striker
3: monk, lucky halfling, dodge
4: fighter, sling flail
5: crusader(cleric), Weapon Focus-sling and Extra Performance
6: class: All the rest fighter
7: Blundering Defense and Weapon Specialization
9: Crane Style and Uncanny Defense
11: Crane Wing and Crane Riposte
13: Defensive Combat Training and Greater Weapon Focus

Still not totally optimized for offense, notice the lack of power attack and point blank shot and precise shot. But his saves will be pretty dang good and using the lucky halfling feat sounds like fun to me. At higher levels he will fight defensively and have a very good AC and CMD, especially vs. trip and grapple. I will take the halfling favored class option(fighter) to improve CMD and can use a wand to grease up before or during a grapple(+10). Crusader domain will be darkness in order to get the Blindfight feat, don't want to lose the huge dodge bonuses to AC just cause i can't see the enemy!


toastedamphibian wrote:

Trait and potential to bypass DR.... yeah, still not worth it in my opinion.

Warslinger only works with normal slings per FAQ I believe. If a home game, ask your GM if warslinger of even Juggle Load work with a sling staff.

If not, cry, and take quickdraw instead.

It does a d6 damage instead of a d3 damage, and you can use it 2 handed. It is one extra feat for +3 average damage.

Or consider Close Quarters Thrower

Slings are in the thrown weapon group, so arguably it applies. If not, look for some other way to make ranged attacks without provoking. If your specializing in a sling, you probably will have other feats that only work with ranged attacks. If your NOT specializing in slings, then draw a backup weapon if your forced into melee. If you really want to spend a feat to make that more productive, get quickdraw. Or wear spiked gauntlets, cold iron on one hand, silver on the other, etc.

a 1d3 melee attack is really not a good use of your feat.

The PC will be built for melee mostly and only max out at a 14 str(16 with belt of physical perfection). And will by taking risky striker, not power attack. So two handed only adds 1 point of damage and the staff sling only does club damage(1d4) in melee, which is an average of 1/2 point. Being more likely to bypass DR should at least equal that in the long run. Is it poor compared to base damage of other melee weapons, yes. But There is a substantial advantage to being able to benefit in both melee and ranged combat fully with an investment in feats(weapon focus, weapon specialization) and gold(holy). That being said it is not an optimized damage dealing build. But he will hit often, bypass DR often and have enough static bonus damage to be worth while in ranged or melee.

If i build this PC it will be for its uniqueness NOT maximization, i am thinking 5 levels of fighter, 1 of Archaeologist, the rest maybe in rouge or slayer....not sure in exactly what order.


toastedamphibian wrote:
Meager Rolmug wrote:


any more opinions??

Yep: Don't bother, it is not worth a feat. Your better off taking Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Halfling Sling Staff )

(What? He asked for an opinion...)

Plus i am not sure the halfling alternative trait, warslinger, works on sling staffs.


toastedamphibian wrote:
Meager Rolmug wrote:


any more opinions??

Yep: Don't bother, it is not worth a feat. Your better off taking Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Halfling Sling Staff )

(What? He asked for an opinion...)

The sling staff doesn't allow bypassing various material DRs just by swapping bullets. Pretty big advantage as long as the PC can make the knowledge check to know the enemy's DR.


JDLPF wrote:

1. Yes. Cold iron is not masterwork or magical.

2. The same damage bonus as if you'd fired a sling bullet as a ranged weapon. Use the sling's normal statistics. "Your Strength modifier applies to damage rolls when you use a sling, just as it does for thrown weapons." Thus, you don't gain 1.5x strength bonus for two-handed wielding.

3. No. "You can make melee attacks using your loaded sling." This feat simply allows you to make melee attacks using your loaded sling. The weapon is still a sling, not a flail.

4. No. See answer 3.

any more opinions??


Sling Flail (Combat)
You can use your loaded sling to effectively strike at nearby foes.

Prerequisites: Weapon Focus (sling), base attack bonus +1.
Benefit: You can make melee attacks using your loaded sling, using that weapon's normal statistics but treating it as a flail. Using a sling in this way does not expend mundane ammunition, but magical or masterwork ammunition loses its special properties after a single hit.
Special: Any feats you have that apply when you use a flail also apply when you use a loaded sling as a melee weapon.

All questions are ONLY about using the loaded sling in MELEE...
1. Does a cold iron bullet loaded in the sling bypass DR cold iron?

2. What if any damage bonus would apply from having a 14 strength and using 2 hands?

3. Would a PC not proficient with flails take a -4 to hit?

4. Would the sling have the disarm and trip features?


A PC has a way to temporarily increase his caster level checks. So does...

A. It affect only the spells cast during the buff's use, but the spells keep their boost to overcome SR during their entire duration.

B. It only affect spells when an enemy encounters the spell while the buff is being used.

C. It only applies to spells that are both cast AND an enemy encounters it while the buff is in use.

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