I always thought this was the case, though I can't find it in the rules anywhere.
That was in 3.5 D&D, which was lifted from Forgotten Realms as I recall. Paizo removed that in the shift to Pathfinder, though I don't remember the full reasoning. Personally, I prefer them sleeping, so I'm okay with it.
The book "Elves of Golarion" goes into more details
Though elves are immune to magical sleep effects, the idea that they never rest is a myth. Instead, though they do not fall unconscious the way other humanoids do, elves may enter a deep trance that has the same refreshing effect on the mind as human sleep. An elf only needs to meditate in this fashion for 4 hours per day, though some prefer longer periods...
Elves are actually aliens to Golarion.
Also, if they don't technically sleep can they still go to the dimension of dreams?
Elves are actually aliens to Golarion.
Really? I thought they were natives that just hid on the moon for a couple hundred years while things went south on Golarion.
Really, really. Before "Earthfall", Elves did not really mark the passage of time as we do now.
When things started to go downhill...
... From across the world, elves used magical gates and vast caravans to travel to Kyonin's capital of Iadara, to step through a portal into the mysterious realm known as Sovyrian, whispered to be a distant continent, planet, or even plane or dimension from which the long-lived race originally sprang.
Some elves stayed behind, became isolated and withdrawn, and woke again to the outside world when the other elves began to come back.
Also, if they don't technically sleep can they still go to the dimension of dreams?
Sure they can. Just because they are immune to Magical sleep does not mean they can't enter a state similar to sleep. They just don't have to in order to become rested. I suggest picking up the book if you really have questions. I don't want to post too much direct material for reasons, but they have "dreams" and "visions" as they "Seek the Brightness" which is described fairly well in the book.
The book "Elves of Golarion" goes into more details
Though elves are immune to magical sleep effects, the idea that they never rest is a myth. Instead, though they do not fall unconscious the way other humanoids do, elves may enter a deep trance that has the same refreshing effect on the mind as human sleep. An elf only needs to meditate in this fashion for 4 hours per day, though some prefer longer periods...Elves are actually aliens to Golarion.
Elves of golarionis a 3.5 book. So this might not be true.
Elves of golarionis a 3.5 book. So this might not be true.
While that may be true, both the Inner Sea Guide and Campaign setting make reference to the same story and destination/origin of the elves. Since Elves of Golarion goes into more detail, and nothing else I have seen conflicts with this information, it is the most reliable source. The book was written to be compatible with the 3.5 system, yet used the Pathfinder game system and world setting. Unless there is newer information, there is no reason to discount or question its accuracy.
Elves of golarionis a 3.5 book. So this might not be true.While that may be true, both the Inner Sea Guide and Campaign setting make reference to the same story and destination/origin of the elves. Since Elves of Golarion goes into more detail, and nothing else I have seen conflicts with this information, it is the most reliable source. The book was written to be compatible with the 3.5 system, yet used the Pathfinder game system and world setting. Unless there is newer information, there is no reason to discount or question its accuracy.
From a different thread
For completion's sake, James Jacobs' response.
That's nice. Perhaps they should put it in print? FAQ response or errata would be preferable to the elf "sleep" issue, rather than isolated in the webs of the internet. Until then, I'll stick to the printed words. Opinions, even the author's (Creative Director), can change over time.
You might note that lots of parts of Elves of Golarian have changed over time. If you look at newer material, they backed off on a lot of things. In fact, it's been said that the book perpetuated several issues (like elves being xenophobic, and them having issues with dwarves) which they didn't want in the setting.
I have the book. I consider it a suggestion, not canon, because it has outdated elements they didn't have time or energy to fix at the time. Like the fact that Second Darkness didn't have any beds in the elven village.
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Like the fact that Second Darkness didn't have any beds in the elven village.
I have seen this rumor on the boards before and have no idea where it came from. There are absolutely beds in elven residences in Second Darkness. They're on the map of the PCs' lodgings in Iadara on p. 12 of A Memory of Darkness, and the drow in Endless Night are explicitly said to sleep in bedrooms. (Beds are depicted in the servant's quarters in the map of House Vonnarc on p. 20, and Alicavniss "sleeps in her den in Tower Solacas" (p. 23) which contains "a huge, ornate bed" (p. 37).)
Not to mention it would be pretty dumb to not at least have beds in the inn since not everyone who visits is going to be an elf. Also you'd think they'd want beds to use for other... activities.
Like the fact that Second Darkness didn't have any beds in the elven village.I have seen this rumor on the boards before and have no idea where it came from. There are absolutely beds in elven residences in Second Darkness. They're on the map of the PCs' lodgings in Iadara on p. 12 of A Memory of Darkness, and the drow in Endless Night are explicitly said to sleep in bedrooms. (Beds are depicted in the servant's quarters in the map of House Vonnarc on p. 20, and Alicavniss "sleeps in her den in Tower Solacas" (p. 23) which contains "a huge, ornate bed" (p. 37).)
I said the elven village. I'm specifically talking about Crying Leaf in The Armageddon Echo, which has, I quote, 'The building to which the PCs are assigned contains three chambers: a central room, a simple bathroom, and a meditation room containing eight woven reed mats for resting.' and 'There are no beds in Crying Leaf, since the elves do not sleep. There are simple reed mats in nearly every home to facilitate their daily meditations.'
These were not fixed at the time, but were fixed in subsequent books. It has been explicitly called out as an error.
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You might note that lots of parts of Elves of Golarian have changed over time. If you look at newer material, they backed off on a lot of things. In fact, it's been said that the book perpetuated several issues (like elves being xenophobic, and them having issues with dwarves) which they didn't want in the setting.
I have the book. I consider it a suggestion, not canon, because it has outdated elements they didn't have time or energy to fix at the time. Like the fact that Second Darkness didn't have any beds in the elven village.
*shrug* People change over time. Elves left behind would change over time, especially as they interact more and more with the human dominate cultures in the world. Trancing and the alien nature of the elves add uniqueness and intrigue to the race, it explains why they have immunity to Magical sleep, and I will consider it cannon until some official print overrides it. It is as simple as that.
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Like the fact that Second Darkness didn't have any beds in the elven village.I have seen this rumor on the boards before and have no idea where it came from. There are absolutely beds in elven residences in Second Darkness. They're on the map of the PCs' lodgings in Iadara on p. 12 of A Memory of Darkness, and the drow in Endless Night are explicitly said to sleep in bedrooms. (Beds are depicted in the servant's quarters in the map of House Vonnarc on p. 20, and Alicavniss "sleeps in her den in Tower Solacas" (p. 23) which contains "a huge, ornate bed" (p. 37).)I said the elven village. I'm specifically talking about Crying Leaf in The Armageddon Echo, which has, I quote, 'The building to which the PCs are assigned contains three chambers: a central room, a simple bathroom, and a meditation room containing eight woven reed mats for resting.' and 'There are no beds in Crying Leaf, since the elves do not sleep. There are simple reed mats in nearly every home to facilitate their daily meditations.'
These were not fixed at the time, but were fixed in subsequent books. It has been explicitly called out as an error.
... because Second Darkness was written under 3.5 DnD rules, where Elves did trance.
Truth.
Elves used to trance. Paizo didnt like it, retooled it. Not before writing books on elves AND an AP on them by 3.5 rules.
Elves of Golarion was written to be compatible with 3.5 but was written WITH the current pathfinder rules in place for the mechanics.
The books we have now don't mention it because they don't get it. That's old rules old system and it's like saying my fighter gets a keep because AD&D said so and paizo didn't say he doesn't.
Pathfinder wasn't a successor to 2nd edition or AD&D, so this is really a false comparison.
They sleep. They dream. There's even a racial trait, dreamspeaker, that grants elves the ability to cast dream once per day, and that would make little sense if the most likely recipients of a dream message (other elves) couldn't ever receive said message.
This is a straight up untruth. Elves of golarion has spot and listen skills. That isn't current pathfinder rules. It's exactly 3.5
It's a 3.5 book with the setting of Golarion.
Thank you for pointing that out. I had overlooked the skills when I made that statement. You appear to be correct. I will keep a closer eye on the mechanics in that book just in case it comes up in game play as an issue.
Thank you for pointing that out. I had overlooked the skills when I made that statement. You appear to be correct. I will keep a closer eye on the mechanics in that book just in case it comes up in game play as an issue.This is a straight up untruth. Elves of golarion has spot and listen skills. That isn't current pathfinder rules. It's exactly 3.5
It's a 3.5 book with the setting of Golarion.
In 3.0 and 3.5, in the Elf racial rules section it describes trancing etc. In Pathfinder it does not.
